How old is too old for tanks and electrical

[Seevee]

Hi,


In shopping for boats, there comes a time where stuff on the boat just falls apart. The big items are the fuel tanks and the electrical system.


Seems like the aluminum tanks have been popular for what 20 to 30 years? And aluminum can corrode, and often from the bottom of the tank where you can't see it. Especially if the tanks are mounted low and especially if they've been exposed to salt water.


Electrical similar, and if it's not good quality tinned wire, it's worse.


So, at what age should we start to think about things like that.


My current boat is 16 years old and still seems pretty clean from what I can tell. However, been looking at boats a few years earlier, and I do NOT want to rewire or change tanks.

 

[rslifkin]

It's really hard to put a lifespan on that kind of stuff. It all depends on how well the original install was done and what's happened to it since. You can't really tell without poking around the tanks with a camera (and maybe scoping the inside). And for wiring, look behind some outlets, switches, breaker panels, etc. to determine how well the ends of the wiring were sealed, assess connector corrosion, etc.



My boat is 35 years old and most of the original wiring is in good shape. I've replaced a few things and re-terminated a bunch (like all of the helm switches) due to corroded connectors. But even the un-tinned and not overly well sealed wires in most places were fine once the old connectors were cut off and the ends stripped. Aluminum fuel tanks still seem to be in good shape as well, although mine are full of gas rather than diesel, so less risk of water sitting in the bottoms of the tanks.

 

[mvweebles]

I just re-wired my 1970 Willard 36 - and I mean all of the old was removed, new wiring was added. I did it because it had gotten sloppy over the years (my 22-years of DIY ownership did not help the cause). But there was nothing functionally wrong with the wiring - it had just become a maze. See atfached picture of back-plane to the main panel.

Tanks - if the tanks are properly installed and kept dry, there is no reason for them to leak. Problem is validating this. My tanks started weeping a few years ago, call it at 40-years. Fill collars are on the side decks just as most boats in this size and class are. I just had my old steel tanks replaced with fiberglass. Fiberglass are the best material for tanks, but aluminum is good and more cost effective in the US due to high labor costs.

I think many of the Defever 43/44s have fiberglass tanks, as do the Nordhavns. Willard 40s have a thwart tank of aluminum which stays pretty dry and should last a long time.

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1999/willard-marine-40-3617588/

I guess age is less of a determining factor than maintenance and, to an extent, original construction. The Willard 40 above is relatively new (2000-ish), and because it's in Wisconsin, is stored in a large, heated storage facility all winter. It's probably a pretty new-ish boat. (FYI - I know the owner because I moderate the Willard Boat Owners forum, but have never been aboard the boat, so not a recommendation except to say I know the owner - he's a detail-oriented guy).

Best success on whatever you decide!

Peter

 

[Comodave]

Agree on how well the original tanks were installed. A lot of tanks corrode on the top due to bad caulking around the filler. A lot corrode on the bottom due to poor install. Look as best as possible and then roll the dice.

The electrical really doesn’t wear out as much as it gets hacked up by DIYers that don’t know or care what they are doing. Look to see how it looks. Also make sure the surveyor tests that the boat will work on the newly (2011) required ELCI breakers on the docks. It can be pretty expensive to fix that and the newly wired docks are expanding every season.

 

[Seevee]

I just re-wired my 1970 Willard 36 - and I mean all of the old was removed, new wiring was added. I did it because it had gotten sloppy over the years (my 22-years of DIY ownership did not help the cause). But there was nothing functionally wrong with the wiring - it had just become a maze. See atfached picture of back-plane to the main panel.

Tanks - if the tanks are properly installed and kept dry, there is no reason for them to leak. Problem is validating this. My tanks started weeping a few years ago, call it at 40-years. Fill collars are on the side decks just as most boats in this size and class are. I just had my old steel tanks replaced with fiberglass. Fiberglass are the best material for tanks, but aluminum is good and more cost effective in the US due to high labor costs.

I think many of the Defever 43/44s have fiberglass tanks, as do the Nordhavns. Willard 40s have a thwart tank of aluminum which stays pretty dry and should last a long time.

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1999/willard-marine-40-3617588/

I guess age is less of a determining factor than maintenance and, to an extent, original construction. The Willard 40 above is relatively new (2000-ish), and because it's in Wisconsin, is stored in a large, heated storage facility all winter. It's probably a pretty new-ish boat. (FYI - I know the owner because I moderate the Willard Boat Owners forum, but have never been aboard the boat, so not a recommendation except to say I know the owner - he's a detail-oriented guy).

Best success on whatever you decide!

Peter


Wow, that's a clean electrical termination. And the link shows a really clean boat. (off topic, but a pet peeve of mine is the lousy pictures on the ad... non of the cockpit or flybridge seating, of even a wide angle of overall shots of the salon. Way too much close ups. )


Good point about the fill collars... need to get out my boroscope and mirrors.

 

[Lepke]

A good tank coating will make tanks last the life of the boat. Keeping water out of diesel tanks will stop the bottom corrosion/rust. My 1/4" plate steel tanks were built in 1942.

 

[mvweebles]

Curious Seevee - what problem are you trying to solve that's giving you a wandering eye? Standard 7-year itch? Mid-life crisis? You've grown apart over the years? Thrill is gone and looking for that first-kiss magic all over again? Maybe just want to trade your old one in for a younger model that's a bit more spry and more of a snazzy-dresser? You know....if your MS400 has let herself go a bit, you are at least partially responsible

Peter

 

[Seevee]

Curious Seevee - what problem are you trying to solve that's giving you a wondering eye? Standard 7-year itch? Mid-life crisis? You've grown apart over the years? Thrill is gone and looking for that first-kiss magic all over again? Maybe just want to trade your old one in for a younger model that's a bit more spry and more of a snazzy-dresser? You know, if your MS400 has let herself go a bit, you are at least partially responsible

Peter

Peter, All of the above. I absolutely love my boat and it's so simple and reliable, but my GF wants it bigger. (no comments from you dirty minded boaters). And the MS is in perfect shape, so it would be easy to sell. However, I'm not necessarily shopping for a newer boat, thus my question. No, the thrill is not gone... not even close. Hope I'm not making a mistake.

 

[O C Diver]

Some of the above information is good, but a lot depends on how and where the boat was used and ventilation design. When looking at boats for a friend of mine, I was struck by how bad some of the engine rooms looked and how rusted and corroded stuff was. In hindsight, a salt water environment versus freshwater and ventilation designs can lead to a much greater level of corrosion and deterioration in a shorter time frame. Also, boats that get used regularly seem to bake the moisture out of the engine room versus ones that hardly ever move. While nothing lasts for ever, use patterns and ventilation design probably contribute as much to life expectancy.

Ted

 

[mvweebles]

I'll do you a favor. Send me GF's email address, and I'll send here this link. I assume you like sedan layouts -

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1991/fleming-55-3734626/

Of course, for $20 and an open bar tab for an evening, I'll forget I heard of a Fleming.....

Peter

 

[Seevee]

I'll do you a favor. Send me GF's email address, and I'll send here this link. I assume you like sedan layouts -

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1991/fleming-55-3734626/

Of course, for $20 and an open bar tab for an evening, I'll forget I heard of a Fleming.....

Peter

Peter,
Really like that boat, but too much draft. Need less than 4 feet. Open bar tab might work.....

 

[sickatea]

Does it really take 7 years to get the itch to start looking for another boat? I was thinking 3 years is more realistic.

-Rich

 

[AusCan]

Fuel tanks will last for 100 years if built properly. I replaced mine at 35 years because they sat on a flat surface which pooled water. They corroded from the bottom up.

Wiring was simple on pre-1990 boats until numerous owners have "upgraded" it. If it isn't done in a planned manner it turns into a mess, so I've rewired 90% of the wiring.

I'm just passing the 7 year ownership mark and no sign of itchiness, but I still look at boats for sale and dream of big time passagemaking.

 

[C lectric]

If good materials were used, installed properly, not monkeyed by poor mtce. practices and protected from aging problems such as leaks/high dampness then I think I would not turn a boat down if it was like mine at 44 years now. [plug]

Of course I would be very carefull about the condition but if done well and not monkeyed by previous owners then it could be a good boat.

 

[sunchaser]

Regarding fuel tank life; a very if not bone dry bilge is one tell, tank install another, leaky teak decks dropping onto tank tops another and low usage another still. With so many boats on TF exceeding a half century of age on steel tanks as mentioned by Lepke and others, long life is not unusual.

A few years ago I was on one of the first Defevers built, original sound steel tanks after nearly 50 years. Luck or what I don't know but some brand names are definitely bell weathers for leaks or no leaks.