Galley Fuel types increase insurance?

[Porchhound]

Pulling out the old electric/pressurized alcohol stove. Do I need to worry about increased insurance premiums based on the fuel source for the new stove? I "heard" alcohol may make the rates go up. Then I heard propane would do it. Then I took my meds and didn't hear anything for awhile.

Anyone else hearing things about galley fuel?

 

[hmason]

I can’t believe insurance would go up replacing alcohol with propane or electric. I think pressurized alcohol is about the most dangerous fuel you can use in a galley. You should get rid of it and be happy you did.

 

[LN-RTP]

Not sure, but I had all 4 types of stove fuel: Alcohol, kerosene, propane and butane.
Never been asked about either from the insurance companies, but they do of course read the surveys.

 

[Porchhound]

Because we pulled out the old system, unsure of the replacement, we haven't filled out the question pertaining to type of fuel yet. It's on their questionnaire, though.

 

[Comodave]

Not sure, but I had all 4 types of stove fuel: Alcohol, kerosene, propane and butane.
Never been asked about either from the insurance companies, but they do of course read the surveys.

What about electric?

 

[Comodave]

Pulling out the old electric/pressurized alcohol stove. Do I need to worry about increased insurance premiums based on the fuel source for the new stove? I "heard" alcohol may make the rates go up. Then I heard propane would do it. Then I took my meds and didn't hear anything for awhile.

Anyone else hearing things about galley fuel?

Call them and ask. They will certainly know better than we do.

 

[LN-RTP]

What about electric?

What about it?

Not sure I consider electric a stove fuel, but if you do: I never had it on a boat I owned, except the 110 volt microwave, but that is not what you meant?

 

[mvweebles]

What about it?

Not sure I consider electric a stove fuel, but if you do: I never had it on a boat I owned, except the 110 volt microwave, but that is not what you meant?

While I understand the statement, in this context, I would consider electricity a stove fuel. If the OP has a =>2000W inverter and even a modest battery bank, might consider induction. Very efficient and does not much shed heat into the cabin. You can pickup a single hot-plate hob for under $70 and give it a try. You will need induction-ready cookware which would be a fraction of the cost of a propane system install.

There are other electric options such as an Insta-pot. Also very handy and fairly energy efficient.

But if OP is a bread baker or likes long oven-braised meals, propane is the way to go.

Good luck - keeep us posted!

Peter

 

[Comodave]

What about it?

Not sure I consider electric a stove fuel, but if you do: I never had it on a boat I owned, except the 110 volt microwave, but that is not what you meant?

You were listing stove fuels and didn’t include electricity. A large percentage of boats have electric stoves.

 

[Sna]

Pulling out the old electric/pressurized alcohol stove. Do I need to worry about increased insurance premiums based on the fuel source for the new stove? I "heard" alcohol may make the rates go up. Then I heard propane would do it. Then I took my meds and didn't hear anything for awhile.

Anyone else hearing things about galley fuel?

No impact. Boat insurance is quite simple in how it’s rated. Age, value, hurricane risk, and your personal info are the big drivers of cost.

 

[Jarrow Lily]

Just got a quote from a different insurance company over the telephone.


No mention of any cooking fuel or method. We have two, propane and electric.


Propane is a regular 'Force 10 Oven and two ring hob'



The electric is a microwave, two ring halogen hob, electric 'Plancha' flat grill and an 'Instant Pot' computerised pressure cooker.


Five stars for the last item - a very tasty Spag Bol in 15 minutes, cooked in just one pot. Had one last night.

 

[Iggy]

I have propane but don't like having it on board. Something that can go BANG.

So electric is what we have been using and I my wife loves using the gridle and the toaster oven. What can I say.............

 

[tiltrider1]

I am glad you pulled out the pressurized alcohol. I am surprised that those still exist. Evaporative alcohol stoves are very safe but pressurized one’s are probably top of the list for dangerous. Some where in the insurances fine print it probably says something like meets current safety requirements.

 

[NEtrawler58]

I am glad you pulled out the pressurized alcohol. I am surprised that those still exist. Evaporative alcohol stoves are very safe but pressurized one’s are probably top of the list for dangerous. Some where in the insurances fine print it probably says something like meets current safety requirements.

I almost caught a boat on fire with an evaporative alcohol stove. In theory, it's a safe fuel because it's lighter than air and extinguishable with water. What got me in trouble is that it has a very low flash point. When I was cooking and one of the canisters ran dry I tried to refill it, but it was still hot enough to catch fire when the alcohol touched it. It caught the cup full of alcohol in my hand on fire which I reflexively threw to the floor, covering my arm in flaming alcohol along with the carpet on the boat. Luckily I had a gallon of water handy and remembered it would extinguish the alcohol. Lesson learned the hard way. Almost no harm done but still very scary to think about especially since I first tried refueling from a bigger container. Luckily that was too awkward so I filled an 8 oz cup instead.

 

[Blissboat]

I think pressurized alcohol is about the most dangerous fuel you can use in a galley. You should get rid of it and be happy you did.

A hearty Amen to that. My first cruising sailboat came with an alcohol stove / oven, which periodically flared up and scared the living crap out of everyone aboard. I feel safer with an above-deck propane tank equipped with a positive external shut-off. Unless the galley stove is in use, all fuel stays outside of the hull and compartments. Even so, I still examine the tank and components with suspicion once in a while.

 

[Shrew]

I am glad you pulled out the pressurized alcohol. I am surprised that those still exist. Evaporative alcohol stoves are very safe but pressurized one’s are probably top of the list for dangerous. Some where in the insurances fine print it probably says something like meets current safety requirements.

I don't disagree that pressurized alcohol can be dangerous....WHEN IMPROPERLY USED. And that is really the key. I've used pressurized alcohol from many, many years. If you use them properly they are safe. However, they can be very tricky to prime and start safely if you don't know what you're doing.

Ironically, the only boat fire I've ever had is with a Origo non-pressurized alcohol stove. They have an slide that closes the 'sterno-like' aperture. Mine had a small gap. Instead of smothering the flame, it deflected it and caught the electrical and plastic portions of the interior on fire. I removed it and installed a butane stove on that boat.

 

[MYTraveler]

The builder of my current boat warned me against spec'ing propane for the stove, for two primary reasons 1) insurance concerns, and 2) resale concerns. I checked with my broker and he said insurance would be no problem (and so far as I can tell, it wasn't), pointing out that propane is much more common on sail boats. As to resale, I did have the galley stove location subbed with 220v electrical, just in case.

 

[NEtrawler58]

Ironically, the only boat fire I've ever had is with a Origo non-pressurized alcohol stove. They have an slide that closes the 'sterno-like' aperture. Mine had a small gap. Instead of smothering the flame, it deflected it and caught the electrical and plastic portions of the interior on fire. I removed it and installed a butane stove on that boat.

That's the same stove I was referring to in my post above that nearly caused a bad boat fire.

 

[Benthic2]

The beauty of a toaster oven and portable induction cook plate is they can disappear to give you more counter space, can be replaced without carpentry skills, and relocated when entertaining. Then you devote the original oven space to a fridge/freezer/icemaker/humidor/wine rack......whatever suits your fancy. If you haven't looked at toaster ovens in 20 years they have become quite sophisticated and can easily supplant a traditional oven for 1 or 2 people.

 

[Porchhound]

Red Shield Insurance finally got back to me stating there are no premium differences relating to galley fuel used. The reason I wondered is my premium was over $100.00 more for gas vs Diesel engines.

Thanks for all the replies.

 

[boater3]

I have filled out many apps for boat insurance, never once seen a question about galley appliances.

We loved having propane aboard when cruising and not running the generator often (only during hottest weeks of summer, for hot water, recharging).

Our next boat will be much larger with many more systems and we will likely cave and run the generator most of the time so will be a moot point.

A proper installation and maintenance should eliminate most concerns. Make sure propane lines are protected, replaced when useful life expires, do inspections, use your nose, turn off at thank when not using, and install solenoid for backup.

 

[tiltrider1]

I don't disagree that pressurized alcohol can be dangerous....WHEN IMPROPERLY USED. And that is really the key. I've used pressurized alcohol from many, many years. If you use them properly they are safe. However, they can be very tricky to prime and start safely if you don't know what you're doing.

Ironically, the only boat fire I've ever had is with a Origo non-pressurized alcohol stove. They have an slide that closes the 'sterno-like' aperture. Mine had a small gap. Instead of smothering the flame, it deflected it and caught the electrical and plastic portions of the interior on fire. I removed it and installed a butane stove on that boat.

I have to laugh. On average pressurized alcohol is bad and evaporative is good. However there is no exception for improper usage. Even an electric stove left on could become dangerous. Makes it very difficult to judge what is safe and what is not.

 

[HTurner]

Fast forward to 13:20... Alcohol stove (non pressurized)...

 

[Pau Hana]

Not much to worry about- I have't seen any major concerns with any galley fuel type except for bottle storage concerns.

 

[NEtrawler58]

Wow, that video is exactly what happened to me and almost caught my brand new sailboat on fire. I tried filling the stove from a new gallon sized jug of alcohol. Luckily for me it was to awkward to pour so I poured some into a small cup instead and that's what caught on fire. If it had been the big jug, I don't know that I could have put it out. I don't understand the comment above about "not much to worry about". These non-pressurized stoves are touted as being the safest for boats and they can be very dangerous.

 

[Jarrow Lily]

Bottom line is a properly designed and maintained LPG system operated correctly is the most common type in use.

Fire and Explosion happen, but are thankfully rare.

Last year I replaced the whole system from the gas locker to the Force 10 Stove. New regulator, twin HP pipes to the regulator, new solenoid and the pipework to the cooker.

Took a day and the parts cost was less than 200 Dollars US.

We use 3.9KG Calor Propane and have a vented overboard gas locker that takes two bottles. We use 3-4 bottles during our five month cruises.

Electric cookers dont Gimball and often reqire a big genset. Alcohol means storage of a flamable liquid.

I know and apreciate the pro's and con's and am sticking with LPG.

 

[koliver]

As for first hand accounts, I have personally witnessed two separate alcohol stove fires that each burned the boat to the waterline, then sank. I have personally witnessed one gasoline fire with similar results. I have not had personal experience with propane fires. I doubt propane fires occur very often on boats, rather, when involved in a fire, started some other way, a propane bottle can become a concern, as a potential source of explosion hazard.
The biggest problem with alcohol is its invisible flame, so things like curtains, dishcloths and clothing, catch fire due to being too close. Propane is much more visible, so the same failures of attention are much less likely to be a problem.

 

[NEtrawler58]

I agree. It's funny that alcohol is promoted to be safe for boating, an yet in my experience and others, it has caused fires. It doesn't explode, but IMO it's not a great fuel for cooking.

 

[Hook and a screw]

Here in Ontario I spoke to MD Marine Insurance about propane onboard just yesterday. There are indeed insurance concerns with LPG in this jurisdiction and this marine insurance agency.

My agent said bbqs and their bottles are fine. It is the fitted LPG systems which raise concerns. As Absolutely is not fitted with propane and we only carry a small bottle for occasional bbq use at this time I didn’t enquire further. Not sure if an inspection of the system was required or what was needed to meet the insurers needs.

 

[C lectric]

We have, and use regularily, an Origo, NON pressurized alcohol stove. Have done for close to 30 yrs now. We had on previous boats the pressurized variety and did not like those as much.

The Origo has never been a problem. I do not attempt to fill the tank inside the boat. If at anchor I do the refilling on the swimgrid. At dock side I do it on the dock or on the swimgrid.

Never in the boat.

Of course now they are off the market due to Dometic buying them and then shutting them down.