Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 11-23-2020, 08:58 PM   #1
Guru
 
Alaskan Sea-Duction's Avatar
 
City: Inside Passage Summer/Columbia River Winter
Vessel Name: Alaskan Sea-Duction
Vessel Model: 1988 M/Y Camargue YachtFisher
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 6,362
So When Is Enough, Enough

Have a friend with a late 80's 60ft Symbol . He has 4 stations with steering, throttles and tranny controls. He is currently having these stations converted to "fly by wire." The installer says when all is said and done the install will be more that the boat is worth.

So I know there are some here on TF add equipment that really won't add value to the boat. The market is the market.

How many of you have added items that really don't make your boat worth anymore?
__________________
Advertisement

Alaskan Sea-Duction is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2020, 09:10 PM   #2
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Freedom
Vessel Model: Albin 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 22,681
On my boat, pretty much everything...once a boat gets to a certain state....selling it is a crapshoot for what people will pay or how long you are willing to wait for a true sucker.
__________________

psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2020, 09:23 PM   #3
Guru
 
menzies's Avatar
 
City: Jacksonville
Vessel Name: SONAS
Vessel Model: Grand Alaskan 53
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 7,322
Most of my spend is in keeping the boat as close to its original specs as I can.

Of course when a piece of electronics goes bad you will put in the latest, which is arguably better than the original, but it is still an autopilot/chartplotter/radar etc.

I just replaced the swim platform teak. Looks nice but there was teak there before so didn't actually change/improve the boat.

The only thing I added incrementally was the water maker.

I think your friend might be looking at his boat somewhat the same way we do. We are keeping it the way we want to enjoy it - not the way someone will pay more for it!
__________________
I am responsible for what I write, I am not responsible for what you understand.
menzies is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2020, 09:28 PM   #4
Guru
 
Lou_tribal's Avatar
 
City: Quebec
Vessel Name: Bleuvet
Vessel Model: Custom Built
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 4,111
The way I see it is twofold. There is the fix you do to sell, and the upscaling you do for your own pleasure.
My own satisfaction is far different from $ value.
Same apply to my home, I could have done many things far cheaper but this would have not satisfied me and I would not enjoy it. I do not look at how much I would sell it but how much I will enjoy it.
Maybe not a wise investment but if my intend was to make a wise investment I would not have bought a boat

L
Lou_tribal is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2020, 09:31 PM   #5
Guru
 
Ken E.'s Avatar
 
City: Bellingham WA
Vessel Name: Hatt Trick
Vessel Model: 45' Hatteras Convertible
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 1,447
Tom, as a general statement, on an older boat whatever money you throw at it is going to be mostly not recoverable when you sell it or, best case, a small percentage bump. However, a boat with such improvements will probably sell faster than its peers that haven't been so upgraded. This is my opinion, after a repower, genset, paint, interior, electronics and much more.....on an old boat. The value is using the boat with the improvements, not in any possible increase in market value. You don't get the money back.
__________________
Ken on Hatt Trick
Ken E. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2020, 09:44 PM   #6
Guru
 
City: Warwick RI
Vessel Name: Lollygag
Vessel Model: 34 Mainship Pilot Hardtop
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 532
My thought is if this is what the current owner wants then they should do it. Donít be concerned w resale but what makes it most comfortable for you. Unlike a house a boat tends not to appreciate.
Lollygag1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2020, 10:14 PM   #7
TF Site Team
 
City: Ex-Brisbane, now Bribie Island, Qld
Vessel Name: Now boatless - sold 6/2018
Vessel Model: Had a Clipper (CHB) 34
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,384
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou_tribal View Post
The way I see it is twofold. There is the fix you do to sell, and the upscaling you do for your own pleasure.
My own satisfaction is far different from $ value.
Same apply to my home, I could have done many things far cheaper but this would have not satisfied me and I would not enjoy it. I do not look at how much I would sell it but how much I will enjoy it.
Maybe not a wise investment but if my intend was to make a wise investment I would not have bought a boat

L
In my view (and experience of selling after doing a lot to my boat - most done by myself however), this post sums the situation up well. Using similar example of the house, we recently built new and I paid quite a bit to add 12kW of solar to the roof. It won't add much to the house value, but I enjoy being green, and the fact my power bill, as a result, is always in credit - they pay me money. That I enjoy.

That said, if the 4 control stations are all still working ok, but just mechanical links, rather than electronic, one does wonder about the wisdom, as they won't control the boat any better, so it would seem rather like throwing money away for nought in this particular case.
__________________
Pete
Peter B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2020, 10:25 PM   #8
Guru
 
Nomad Willy's Avatar
 
City: Concrete Washington State
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 17,632
I think a lot of the above is true.
However I think return on investment would vary tremendously w respect to what the up-grade was. As a good example mechanical things like generators, anchor windlasses, GPS and new rudders will effect the selling value very little.

But repaint the boat, add new carpets, clean and paint the bilges ect ect will raise the value considerably.

And the boat itself will vary the investment return. If you own arun-of-the mill boring boat investment won’t bump the value much. But a boat w a high level of uniqueness coupled w abilities like seaworthyness such as a DeFever investment is of more value.

So there’s a lot of variables that can but big dents into the “you’re throwing your money away” theory. However that is, admittedly the prevailing situation .. usually.
__________________
Eric

North Western Washington State USA
Nomad Willy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2020, 11:44 PM   #9
Guru
 
Comodave's Avatar
 
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Never Say Never
Vessel Model: President 41 DC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 10,494
I donít really care if the improvements I do to the boat gives me a real payback money wise or not. I love working on the boat so that is my payback. It usually helps me sell the boat much faster than not. The last 3 boats I have sold have sold to the first person that looked at them.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you arenít one, there is no explanation possible.
Comodave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2020, 01:08 AM   #10
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 19,558
The day I bought it I added more than it was worth. I've never added anything that increased it's value as much as the item cost and that's true on every boat I've owned. But then we remodeled our house before we moved in and that added very little to the value. I add things I want and make no decisions thinking of reselling even though I know at some point I will.
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2020, 01:09 AM   #11
Guru
 
Comodave's Avatar
 
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Never Say Never
Vessel Model: President 41 DC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 10,494
Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB View Post
The day I bought it I added more than it was worth. I've never added anything that increased it's value as much as the item cost and that's true on every boat I've owned. But then we remodeled our house before we moved in and that added very little to the value. I add things I want and make no decisions thinking of reselling even though I know at some point I will.
+1.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you arenít one, there is no explanation possible.
Comodave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2020, 07:59 AM   #12
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 21,316
The biggest waste seems to be new electronic gear that is a generation behind when installed weeks after purchase..

A running takeout from an owner that suffers Bestitis can be a fantastic good deal.


Should anyone be interested in a 1970' Sat Nav (not GPS) let me know!
FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2020, 08:30 AM   #13
Guru
 
City: Hampton, va
Vessel Name: Didi Mau
Vessel Model: 2003 Ocean Alexander 456
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,013
Waste is how you define it

I consider all money put into the boat a sunk cost (no pun intended) that I will never see again, including the initial purchase price.
Gordon J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2020, 10:34 AM   #14
Guru
 
OldDan1943's Avatar
 
City: Aventura FL
Vessel Name: Kinja
Vessel Model: American Tug 34 #116
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 6,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lollygag1 View Post
My thought is if this is what the current owner wants then they should do it. Don’t be concerned w resale but what makes it most comfortable for you. Unlike a house a boat tends not to appreciate.
+1
This is called, 'making the boat yours.' or 'for your own comfort.'
I too try to keep most of the boat as 'from the factory'.
If I do make an 'upgrade', I document the changes for the next owner.
__________________
The meek will inherit the earth but, the brave will inherit the seas.
OldDan1943 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2020, 10:47 AM   #15
Guru
 
menzies's Avatar
 
City: Jacksonville
Vessel Name: SONAS
Vessel Model: Grand Alaskan 53
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 7,322
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldDan1943 View Post
+1
This is called, 'making the boat yours.' or 'for your own comfort.'
I too try to keep most of the boat as 'from the factory'.
If I do make an 'upgrade', I document the changes for the next owner.
Similar - I keep the receipts!

Problem is, it could frighten off a potential new owner!
__________________
I am responsible for what I write, I am not responsible for what you understand.
menzies is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2020, 11:04 AM   #16
TF Site Team
 
FlyWright's Avatar
 
City: California Delta
Vessel Name: FlyWright
Vessel Model: Marshall Californian 34 LRC
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 13,126
"How many of you have added items that really don't make your boat worth any more?"

I've modified many systems and added/upgraded many components and accessories over the years but not one has been installed to increase value of my boat. On a boat at 43 years of age, I doubt they will add to my boat's value.

I've also abandoned maintaining boat shine...not worrying about resale price but focusing on simplicity and enjoyment of the vessel. I doubt it will much affect for former but it greatly enhances the latter.

Likewise, my upgrades and additions add significantly to my enjoyment, boat safety and ease of operation of the vessel. When it comes time to sell, I'm confident it will sell fast but not likely priced any higher than other 43 year old 34's on the market.
__________________
My boat is my ark. It's my mobile treehouse and my floating fishing cabin. It's my retreat and my respite. Everyday I thank God I have a boat! -Al

@DeltaBridges - 25 Delta Bridges in 25 Days
FlyWright is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2020, 11:20 AM   #17
Guru
 
menzies's Avatar
 
City: Jacksonville
Vessel Name: SONAS
Vessel Model: Grand Alaskan 53
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 7,322
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyWright View Post
"How many of you have added items that really don't make your boat worth any more?"

I've modified many systems and added/upgraded many components and accessories over the years but not one has been installed to increase value of my boat. On a boat at 43 years of age, I doubt they will add to my boat's value.

I've also abandoned maintaining boat shine...not worrying about resale price but focusing on simplicity and enjoyment of the vessel. I doubt it will much affect for former but it greatly enhances the latter.

Likewise, my upgrades and additions add significantly to my enjoyment, boat safety and ease of operation of the vessel. When it comes time to sell, I'm confident it will sell fast but not likely priced any higher than other 43 year old 34's on the market.

Interesting point. I wonder if you kept the boat as long as you want to then, when you are ready to sell, get a good detailing guy and tell him to bring the coat back to shiny for sale. You may have to pay him twice or more what you might have had to annually, but still have saved a fortune!
__________________
I am responsible for what I write, I am not responsible for what you understand.
menzies is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2020, 11:33 AM   #18
TF Site Team
 
FlyWright's Avatar
 
City: California Delta
Vessel Name: FlyWright
Vessel Model: Marshall Californian 34 LRC
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 13,126
Quote:
Originally Posted by menzies View Post
Interesting point. I wonder if you kept the boat as long as you want to then, when you are ready to sell, get a good detailing guy and tell him to bring the coat back to shiny for sale. You may have to pay him twice or more what you might have had to annually, but still have saved a fortune!
If it goes according to plan, that won't be my decision to make. It'll fall upon he who inherits this fine boat!
__________________
My boat is my ark. It's my mobile treehouse and my floating fishing cabin. It's my retreat and my respite. Everyday I thank God I have a boat! -Al

@DeltaBridges - 25 Delta Bridges in 25 Days
FlyWright is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2020, 11:50 AM   #19
Guru
 
City: Carefree, Arizona
Vessel Name: sunchaser V
Vessel Model: DeFever 48
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 9,036
Fly by wire marine controls -pros and cons- are a major subject by themselves, especially when multiplexed into four areas. As always the quality of the install and the control logics are the key when doing more than simple plug and play many of us are used to.
sunchaser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2020, 11:54 AM   #20
Guru
 
MurrayM's Avatar
 
City: Kitimat, North Coast BC
Vessel Name: Badger
Vessel Model: 30' Sundowner Tug
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 6,942
Badger is our first boat, so we resolved not to buy anything except a larger anchor/rode and a 9.9hp kicker (no tow service around here) for the first year.

This turned out to be a smart choice, because with the help of friendly people here on TF (especially C lectric, who's brother in law used to own Badger and has the kind of brain to remember all manner of small technical details from a boat that wasn't even his) we got to know our boat and even managed to coax some things back to life.
__________________

__________________
"The most interesting path between two points is not a straight line" Murray Minchin
MurrayM is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



» Trawler Port Captains
Port Captains are TF volunteers who can serve as local guides or assist with local arrangements and information. Search below to locate Port Captains near your destination. To learn more about this program read here: TF Port Captain Program





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:05 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012
×