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Old 09-20-2019, 06:01 PM   #41
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Nope - just know that slowly but surely Cardinal's are taking over (in Canada)
Not really, you may see more of them marking hazards, but they are "part" of a system, not a replacement.

Until I see ANY confirmation that the Cardinal System is replacing the international I ateral system I would have to say you posts are in error.


And I will acknowledge my error if someone can come up with some sort of proof of the change.
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Old 09-20-2019, 06:04 PM   #42
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The direction of "return" is also the direction of a flooding tide, which is marked on the chart at the Departure Bay end of Newcastle channel. Not confusing at all if you are entering from that end.
It doesn't make them "wrong"...you are supposed to review a chart and if the buoy numbers are increasing, the red is on the right, if decreasing then they will be on the left.

I would NEVER use direction of current to determine buoyage, especially if tidal.
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Old 09-20-2019, 06:09 PM   #43
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Not really, you may see more of them marking hazards, but they are "part" of a system, not a replacement.

Until I see ANY confirmation that the Cardinal System is replacing the international I ateral system I would have to say you posts are in error.


And I will acknowledge my error if someone can come up with some sort of proof of the change.
Wow - amazed at how an anecdotal conversation went sour and polarized. I'm not defending systems, I'm not defining systems, I'm not the one you look for for documentation on anything TC does. I simply entered a conversation and brought with it observation based on my experience, both as a recreational mariner and as a professional mariner. Obviously your mileage varies...

Best of luck boating, stay away from the thin waters no matter how they're marked and hope we can meet over a beer sometime..
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Old 09-20-2019, 06:15 PM   #44
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My mileage doesn't vary, it just focuses on what I know or what I can prove to educate the forum.

Nothing sour, just making sure as much truth surfaces as possible.

I posted relavant links that show why buoyage is the way it is and will remain in the near future.

I also gave a better example of red right returning than the nursery rhyme taught in boating safety classes to help novices remember.

So get upset if you must, I'm not, but I want boaters to understand what is currently going on in their world, not something I believe to be in error.

I will be happy to buy if I am wrong....
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Old 09-20-2019, 06:24 PM   #45
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My mileage doesn't vary, it just focuses on what I know or what I can prove to educate the forum.

Nothing sour, just making sure as much truth surfaces as possible.

I posted relavant links that show why buoyage is the way it is and will remain in the near future.

I also gave a better example of red right returning than the nursery rhyme taught in boating safety classes to help novices remember.

So get upset if you must, I'm not, but I want boaters to understand what is currently going on in their world, not something I believe to be in error.

I will be happy to buy if I am wrong....
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:11 PM   #46
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..........

I will be happy to buy if I am wrong....
Really, is that if anyone proves you are wrong? I got nothing, but will let you know. LOL
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:23 PM   #47
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Canada believes in Darwinism, USA feels they can fix stupid.
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:28 PM   #48
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The direction of "return" is also the direction of a flooding tide, which is marked on the chart at the Departure Bay end of Newcastle channel. Not confusing at all if you are entering from that end.

Wow. Keith, Iíve not known this. You would think after over 50 years I would have stumbled across this (or at least remembered it).

Is this generally true everywhere? (At least in the US and Canada).
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:32 PM   #49
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Wow. Keith, I’ve not known this. You would think after over 50 years I would have stumbled across this (or at least remembered it).

Is this generally true everywhere? (At least in the US and Canada).
Not reliably so....at least not everywhere....

Red, right, numbers increasing is the answer.
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:40 PM   #50
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Not reliably so....at least not everywhere....

Red, right, numbers increasing is the answer.

Iíll have to think about the areas Iím familiar with in Puget Sound. Off the top of my head, the Swinomish Channel doesnít follow that, as the direction of the channel markers change part way through the channel yet the current flows North on the flood and South on the ebb (I think). Of course, the Swinomish is a created channel rather than a natural tidal body of water.
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:50 PM   #51
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Wow. Keith, Iíve not known this. You would think after over 50 years I would have stumbled across this (or at least remembered it).

Is this generally true everywhere? (At least in the US and Canada).
Some places are still difficult, like entering Silva Bay from the east, you have to leave the green mark to port, which suggests you are "returning", but there is nothing on the chart to help you determine which way the tide runs. There are also places where the tide refuses to be rule oriented, like Spanish Banks in English Bay, where the river current sweeping around Point Grey is dominant and both ebb and flood currents tend to set to the east. But as a very general rule, this seems to work around here.
psn's rule of noting the direction of increasing numbers doesn't work here. Flood current sets generally to the north, bouy numbers decrease as you go north, red is generally on your right as you go north, so his rule is flawed here, while the nursery rhyme works.
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Old 09-20-2019, 09:46 PM   #52
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The entrance from the eats to Silva Bay is an enigma. That is a prime location for a cardinal buoy. Just past that port marker is an exit to the west which completes the red right returning. While correct, it has caused a lot of unnecessary groundings.
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