LED nav lights back to incandescent

[twistedtree]

I would be looking at the wire runs from the lights and the proximity of the coax cable from the AIS antenna. If the coax cable is close or bundled with the running light wiring you should separate the wire runs to the lights from the AIS cable. There could be problems with the shielding grounds on the coax to the AIS antenna. There needs to be a proper low resistance bond at each connection and then to the vessel ground to the antenna housing. Also it would help if the running light/anchor light were twisted pairs to help reduce emi interference or a shielded twisted pair. Check out the runs as it seems to more of a problem than the light bulbs.

I think before chasing and adjusting cable runs, I'd replace the nav lights with tested and certified LED nav lights. The issue here is 99% caused by bootleg replacement LED bulbs with crappy, noisy electronics in them. It's very unlikely there will be an issue using a certified nav light from hella, aquasignal, etc.

 

[DennisB1]

Lunasea is advertising BA15 navigation bulbs with zero EMI. Would suggest to take a look. In your setup with the antenna coax close coupled with the Anchor light wires you are demonstrating that you can pick up EMI interference. If Lunasea's claims are valid the zero EMI should help.

 

[JDCAVE]

I had a similar problem with the LED house lights affecting our VHF reception. We noticed its effect on continuous weather broadcasts and determined that the LED lights were to blame. As AIS is in the VHF frequency, your problem isn't surprising. I think the suggestions above will be useful.

We had issues with our AIS as well. People could not see our AIS signal. That seems to be resolved since we have shut off our LEDs when traveling. I have not determined if there is a problem with our navigation lights, which are also LED. However, these lights are certified Nav lights--i.e. not replacement bulbs.

Jim

 

[Giggitoni]

Why use LEDs for nav lights? The engines are running with alternators when the nav lights are being used. No need for electrical “savings”, IMO. Just use incandescent, as the lights were designed.

 

[rslifkin]

Why use LEDs for nav lights? The engines are running with alternators when the nav lights are being used. No need for electrical “savings”, IMO. Just use incandescent, as the lights were designed.

Better sealed fixtures because you don't need to get in there for bulb replacements is the biggest reason for me. And that (along with LEDs having a much longer life than incandescent bulbs) means more reliable nav lights. But that only applies if you're using dedicated LED fixtures, not a bulb replacement in a standard fixture.

 

[Comodave]

I think before chasing and adjusting cable runs, I'd replace the nav lights with tested and certified LED nav lights. The issue here is 99% caused by bootleg replacement LED bulbs with crappy, noisy electronics in them. It's very unlikely there will be an issue using a certified nav light from hella, aquasignal, etc.

Exactly.

 

[Comodave]

Why use LEDs for nav lights? The engines are running with alternators when the nav lights are being used. No need for electrical “savings”, IMO. Just use incandescent, as the lights were designed.

You will probably never have to change a bulb again with LEDs. On our boat changing a bulb in the anchor or steaming light means taking all the canvas aft of the radar arch down and getting up on a 6’ step ladder to change a bulb. Besides not carrying a 6’ step ladder all the time on the boat, imagine trying to take all the canvas down and climb a ladder in 4’ seas. I have had incandescent bulbs burn out at night while underway in the Pacific Ocean. Fortunately it was in an accessible location. I changed out all the nav light fixtures to LED on that boat and did the same on every boat since. Not just the bulbs to LED but changed out the fixtures so they are actually approved nav lights. Also in looking at the LED nav lights compared to incandescent nav lights, the LED ones looks brighter. Not a scientific test but rather just look brighter, which is a good thing.

 

[Giggitoni]

You will probably never have to change a bulb again with LEDs. On our boat changing a bulb in the anchor or steaming light means taking all the canvas aft of the radar arch down and getting up on a 6’ step ladder to change a bulb. Besides not carrying a 6’ step ladder all the time on the boat, imagine trying to take all the canvas down and climb a ladder in 4’ seas. I have had incandescent bulbs burn out at night while underway in the Pacific Ocean. Fortunately it was in an accessible location. I changed out all the nav light fixtures to LED on that boat and did the same on every boat since. Not just the bulbs to LED but changed out the fixtures so they are actually approved nav lights. Also in looking at the LED nav lights compared to incandescent nav lights, the LED ones looks brighter. Not a scientific test but rather just look brighter, which is a good thing.

Good points, all!

 

[PNK]

LED lights and interference

I recently read this article, which has some useful information about LED's and interference with VHF and AIS:

https://www.imtra.com/learning-center/articleid/30/avoid-interference-vhf-led-lights

It repeats what some TF'ers also noted in their replies, that if the LED's are not in a housing specifically designed for them interference could definitely be a factor.

Hope it helps!

Peter

 

[Alisske]

Wow. I did not know the LED interference. Oddly enough, i installed a new garage door opener yesterday and the bulb socket had a warming that read “LED bulbs can interfere with remote signal”

I agree with your plan to change the bulb. Simplest and easiest solution. That being said, i recently installed an AIS unit and went through a lot of research since i was putting it on a 26 foot downeast and it was vertically challenged.

I read about how much wattage is lost running it long lengths. It sorta stunned me. (Like 50% loss over 25 feet, ill try to find the study and post)

I put in a 3/4 inch coax cable to keep wattage up (not that fun to run that fat a cable) but it really helped the receiving and transponding. It was a higher watt unit (5 watts or whatever thee commercially wattage is)

I could pick up targets 20 miles out and Bermuda radio picked me up 45 miles out.

 

[boomerang]

I'm going to bring this year-old thread to life again and report that I finally got around to replacing the offending LED light(bulbs) with MarineBeam fixtures and from what I've observed at the dock, there is no AIS signal degradation while the nav and/or anchor lights are on. As I indicated in the past, whenever I would switch on the LED anchor light (or LED-replacement bulb running lights), my AIS targets would disappear. I bought ,from Marinebeam, an anchor light assembly and a steaming light/deck light combo fixture, since we've been wanting a way to illuminate the flybridge deck after dark. Neither fixture ,when switched on, even slightly reduces AIS reception on our Coretex AIS. I thought about playing around with other bulbs but I'm glad I went the one-and-done route and our AIS reception dilemma is finally over. We're headed South again in 10 days and I'll be happy knowing I can use our AIS and LED nav lights simultaneously without worry.

 

[SteveK]

WAG. Post 5 picture suggests to me that the radiation from light is directed at the AIS antenna. There is a reason two VHF antenna cannot be that close. If it was me I would test the theory by wrapping tin foil around the turned on LED anchor light on the arch. Raising the AIS ant above light may also work.

 

[boomerang]

WAG. Post 5 picture suggests to me that the radiation from light is directed at the AIS antenna. There is a reason two VHF antenna cannot be that close. If it was me I would test the theory by wrapping tin foil around the turned on LED anchor light on the arch. Raising the AIS ant above light may also work.

The steaming light, which is several feet below the AIS antenna, affected the reception also so rather than apply band-aids to my problem, I just went the no-RFI light route. Something I probably could've done was connect one of the taller VHF antennas to the Cortex built-in antenna splitter but I wanted to keep stuff separate.

 

[psneeld]

Glad you got it sorted out, sorry it was an issue for you.

Hope to see you when South..... where ya headed this year?

 

[boomerang]

Glad you got it sorted out, sorry it was an issue for you.

Hope to see you when South..... where ya headed this year?

Sorry? Scott,all used boats should be as trouble-free as your ex boat! Just every-day boat gremlins coming to nip at me as they do with all boats.
We're heading to Georgetown SC over Liz's Thanksgiving break and then as far as we can get over Christmas break. Doubtful we'll make it any farther than north Florida this go-round. As long as we're cruising & it's below the freeze line, I'll be happy! It sure would be good to catch up with you again though. One year very soon we'll both be retired and be down your way for sure.

 

[psneeld]

Sorry? Scott,all used boats should be as trouble-free as your ex boat! Just every-day boat gremlins coming to nip at me as they do with all boats.
We're heading to Georgetown SC over Liz's Thanksgiving break and then as far as we can get over Christmas break. Doubtful we'll make it any farther than north Florida this go-round. As long as we're cruising & it's below the freeze line, I'll be happy! It sure would be good to catch up with you again though. One year very soon we'll both be retired and be down your way for sure.

Let me know where you make it to.... were are still RVing and headed up into N. Florida the 2nd week in Dec. Ya never know where random travels take me.

Always wanted to take the boat there...but cruising that boat to the Pacific Northwest was a bit much...but headed there this summer in the RV. Got my travel boat in the back of the tow behind truck just in case....