twistedtree
Guru
Does anyone have experience with Intellian satellite antennas, preferably using them for internet data service as opposed to TV service?
Intellian experience?
- Thread starter twistedtree
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If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
READY
Guru
Getting satellite internet requires a totally different antenna and system vs Dish OR DirecTV. It is much more expensive and the data is quite expensive. If you can describe your use case I might be able to provide more detail. Very hard to justify satellite internet unless you can stomach many hundreds or even thousands of dollars per month. If you just need tracking and minimal messaging with emergency options the Garmin Iridium units are great. Cost around $500 and monthly plans under $50. They will work globally.
OP
OP
twistedtree
Guru
OK, let me give some more context. I was trying not to bore people and hoping to seek out people who are using Intellian for data services.
First, I realize that Sat data isn't something most TFers use. Be thankful for that, because it's horrifically expensive. But a few do have a need (or enough of a want) based on cruising grounds, etc.
I previously had a KVH V3-IP. It worked well, but was horrifically expensive to operate, and barely useful because the data plan was so small. But it was better than nothing, and worth it to me for the few months when we were often out of cell range. Other months I would reduce the plan to a more reasonable mini-plan.
Now I need to outfit my boat with similar capabilities, and am considering alternatives. I have found a setup using Intellian hardware plus data service from SatCom Global's Aura plan. I find this combination much more attractive than what KVH has, but I'd like to talk to people who are using it because for some reason, things are never exactly like the marketing literature suggests. Despite all the products I have bought over the years, I'm still not young and attractive, even though I was certain it happen based on the marketing material.
READY
Guru
Sorry I should have looked at your profile and posts. I was on my mobile and just submitted a quick response as it looked like it might be someone without your experience who did not have much technical background. I work in telecom focused on IoT where we provide cellular and satellite wireless to Enterprise and other business customers.
I share your sentiment about the marketing promises vs. reality
The Aura solution using VSAT with C-Band as a fallback option at least appears to be a solid/reliable connection although I would guess that antenna/terminal combination must be quite expensive?
Hopefully over the next couple of years SpaceX-Starlink and similar low earth orbit constellations will be able to deliver a more affordable satellite internet option with low latency. Until then I just tell folks at my office I will be off the grid and somehow they always seem to be able to solve their own problems.
I share your sentiment about the marketing promises vs. reality
The Aura solution using VSAT with C-Band as a fallback option at least appears to be a solid/reliable connection although I would guess that antenna/terminal combination must be quite expensive?
Hopefully over the next couple of years SpaceX-Starlink and similar low earth orbit constellations will be able to deliver a more affordable satellite internet option with low latency. Until then I just tell folks at my office I will be off the grid and somehow they always seem to be able to solve their own problems.
tpbrady
Guru
TT,
The wildcard in this is the development of LEO satellite constellations and the launch of extremely high capacity Ka band satellites in the next few years. What is expensive to buy, install, and operate at slow speeds today will hopefully become much less expensive to operate and much faster in the future. I don't when you launch the new boat, but I am sure you are reserving the highest possible point with the fewest things in the way for any system. In the old days you had an exclusion zone for satellite antennas. You knew that ou would lose connection with a satellite when you steered a specific heading at this lat/long. With the LEO satellites everything is moving, the boat, the satellites and the ground station the satellite is talking to also changes periodically meaning interruption of service due to ship structure at any time not just on a specific course. In addition, without intersatellite links a LEO provider will probably not be able to support vessels in the open ocean more than 350-500 miles from land with a fiber optic connection to the world. Intersatellite links are in their infancy.
There aren't any good answers at this point other than wherever you plan to put the terminal outside, install power, a couple of ethernet cables, and two runs of RG-11.
The wildcard in this is the development of LEO satellite constellations and the launch of extremely high capacity Ka band satellites in the next few years. What is expensive to buy, install, and operate at slow speeds today will hopefully become much less expensive to operate and much faster in the future. I don't when you launch the new boat, but I am sure you are reserving the highest possible point with the fewest things in the way for any system. In the old days you had an exclusion zone for satellite antennas. You knew that ou would lose connection with a satellite when you steered a specific heading at this lat/long. With the LEO satellites everything is moving, the boat, the satellites and the ground station the satellite is talking to also changes periodically meaning interruption of service due to ship structure at any time not just on a specific course. In addition, without intersatellite links a LEO provider will probably not be able to support vessels in the open ocean more than 350-500 miles from land with a fiber optic connection to the world. Intersatellite links are in their infancy.
There aren't any good answers at this point other than wherever you plan to put the terminal outside, install power, a couple of ethernet cables, and two runs of RG-11.
sbman
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Still an interesting topic, and I'm curious what the options are. I have only had exposure to satellite based internet services from living in the back-woods where cable wasn't run. The service was slow, one-way (uplink was through a dial-up modem), latency was high and prices very expensive, that was 15 years ago.
SV Delos on Youtube put a ViaSat system on their boat, I believe it was sponsored and they didn't give much information about the specific hardware that was used.
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tpbrady
Guru
I am pretty sure this is a Viasat Ka band system using a Cobham 600 antenna (65cm), that uses the Viasat 1 and Viasat 2 satellites in US eastern coastal waters and over the great circle route to Europe. This shows the coverage with this terminal: https://maritime.viasat.com/coverage.html. The maritime plans are expensive (https://maritime.viasat.com/resources/Maritime_LeisureYachts_Brochure.pdf). But it is fast 25x3 Mbps up to 100 Mbps. Hopefully the trend is down. I know on the hardware everyone in the satellite industry is looking for flat panel electronically steered antennas which if priced low enough will help make Starlink, One Web, and a few others have a higher probability of succeeding.
OP
OP
twistedtree
Guru
A friend suggest ViaSat as well and it looks pretty good, but doesn’t cover up into Alaska. So it’s not a candidate.
I’m looking at probably a 3-5 year horizon. I don’t think spacex will be viable for boats and off shore for probably 5 years, which is one Musk-year. And I don’t know what other LEO systems are even viable at this point, much less functional. I expect long term they will be great, but still a ways off for us.
Ka also seems good, but is more subject to weather which makes it not so good for the PNW. And again, reality is that Ku is here and running world wide where Ka is up and coming. If I were on the east coast or in Europe I would be looking seriously at it.
But Ka does raise the question about whether to spend the extra $$ to get an antenna that is Ku but can be converted to Ka.
Right now you pay for data, or you pay for speed. Given what I’m willing to pay, that mostly means a crippled system capable of only email, texting, weather, and generally low data and/or asynchronous use. But the Aura plan is unlimited data at 1 or 2 mbps which is pathetic, yet enough to have for functional browsing, and the possibility of SD streaming. So suddenly a slow, yet fully functional service. I start to be more willing to pay for such a service, especially when you can also suspend it when not needed. It’s still stupid expensive, but I might actually get something in exchange.
In many ways my biggest concern is dealing with whatever companies are involved. In my experience, sat companies have taken customer torture to a whole new level. If you think you hate dealing with your cable company, you ain’t seen nothing yet! I just stopped having TV because I couldn’t take it any more. The exception has been KVH who have been very good. They answer the phone, know what they are talking about, listen to you rather than follow a script, and actually solve problems. Switching to SatCom or anyone else frankly scares the hell out of me. That’s why I’m looking for customer references.
I’m looking at probably a 3-5 year horizon. I don’t think spacex will be viable for boats and off shore for probably 5 years, which is one Musk-year. And I don’t know what other LEO systems are even viable at this point, much less functional. I expect long term they will be great, but still a ways off for us.
Ka also seems good, but is more subject to weather which makes it not so good for the PNW. And again, reality is that Ku is here and running world wide where Ka is up and coming. If I were on the east coast or in Europe I would be looking seriously at it.
But Ka does raise the question about whether to spend the extra $$ to get an antenna that is Ku but can be converted to Ka.
Right now you pay for data, or you pay for speed. Given what I’m willing to pay, that mostly means a crippled system capable of only email, texting, weather, and generally low data and/or asynchronous use. But the Aura plan is unlimited data at 1 or 2 mbps which is pathetic, yet enough to have for functional browsing, and the possibility of SD streaming. So suddenly a slow, yet fully functional service. I start to be more willing to pay for such a service, especially when you can also suspend it when not needed. It’s still stupid expensive, but I might actually get something in exchange.
In many ways my biggest concern is dealing with whatever companies are involved. In my experience, sat companies have taken customer torture to a whole new level. If you think you hate dealing with your cable company, you ain’t seen nothing yet! I just stopped having TV because I couldn’t take it any more. The exception has been KVH who have been very good. They answer the phone, know what they are talking about, listen to you rather than follow a script, and actually solve problems. Switching to SatCom or anyone else frankly scares the hell out of me. That’s why I’m looking for customer references.
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tiltrider1
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I wish I could help you but I have never cracked this nut. A friend of mine who managed Paul Allen’s Satellite communications on his boat, once told me that their data system cost $15,000 a month.
I have managed to survive using “In Reach” as my satellite message and email system but it’s not close to providing your needs. I have been watching Starlink as it looks like the first system that might be in my budget. I keep searching but inevitably the dollars keep coming up bigger than I am comfortable with.
I have managed to survive using “In Reach” as my satellite message and email system but it’s not close to providing your needs. I have been watching Starlink as it looks like the first system that might be in my budget. I keep searching but inevitably the dollars keep coming up bigger than I am comfortable with.
guy with a boat
Guru
I also have the KVH V3-IP and my experience is similar to yours. Customer service has been excellent and functionality is very good. Data is so expensive that I rarely use it for that, which sort of defeats the purpose. The result for me is I have some expensive equipment on the mast that provides excellent sat phone service and emergency/critical-need internet capability.
I’ll be interested to see what you find in your search. I look forward to the day that reliable, reasonably cost-effective satellite internet is available.
FWIW, I do have an Intellian sat-TV setup. I’d like to say its been as easy and trouble-free as the KVH data system, but its been somewhat of a struggle to make it work consistently. Not sure if the Intellian hardware should share the blame, but it seems when I cross borders each provider tells my out of their area. That happened from Florida to Bahamas and between US and Canada. Intellian blames the providers and vice versa and eventually I get it back online until the next time. I’m not sure this has any relevance to your topic so I only mention it reluctantly
Good luck sorting out a new data system.
I’ll be interested to see what you find in your search. I look forward to the day that reliable, reasonably cost-effective satellite internet is available.
FWIW, I do have an Intellian sat-TV setup. I’d like to say its been as easy and trouble-free as the KVH data system, but its been somewhat of a struggle to make it work consistently. Not sure if the Intellian hardware should share the blame, but it seems when I cross borders each provider tells my out of their area. That happened from Florida to Bahamas and between US and Canada. Intellian blames the providers and vice versa and eventually I get it back online until the next time. I’m not sure this has any relevance to your topic so I only mention it reluctantly
Good luck sorting out a new data system.
