Chinese diesel heater

[Retired. Crabber]

I agree total knock off but I’m broke from buying a boat in my defense lol

 

[Marco Flamingo]

One other thing has anyone tried using the higher end pieces from the exhaust set up from a Wallace to trim out a china heater?

I connected mine to the remains of a similar Webasto heater. I only really used some of the stainless exhaust tubing and the already installed exhaust through hull. The Webasto thermostat and control board were junk. I got some money for them as parts as they are no longer available. My original Webasto install didn't have a muffler and made a howling whine. I fabricated a muffler and it is now basically silent both outside and inside. The Webasto SS exhaust tubing appeared to be 1 or 2mm larger, but that didn't matter as I installed the muffler between the new and old tubing.

My Chinese heater has a feature that neither my Webasto had or my Espar has. When turned off, a sophisticated thermostat turns on the glow plug and increases the fan speed, then shuts off the fuel. This ensures that the burner chamber doesn't soot up, one of the main reasons for issues with the German and Russian designs. Hopefully, they are smart enough to have copied the Chinese.

 

[SteveK]

I connected mine to the remains of a similar Webasto heater. I only really used some of the stainless exhaust tubing and the already installed exhaust through hull. The Webasto thermostat and control board were junk. I got some money for them as parts as they are no longer available. My original Webasto install didn't have a muffler and made a howling whine. I fabricated a muffler and it is now basically silent both outside and inside. The Webasto SS exhaust tubing appeared to be 1 or 2mm larger, but that didn't matter as I installed the muffler between the new and old tubing.

My Chinese heater has a feature that neither my Webasto had or my Espar has. When turned off, a sophisticated thermostat turns on the glow plug and increases the fan speed, then shuts off the fuel. This ensures that the burner chamber doesn't soot up, one of the main reasons for issues with the German and Russian designs. Hopefully, they are smart enough to have copied the Chinese.

My Russian design cycles like that on startup as well as shutdown. sounds like a jet engine throttle up. My old espar did not appear to do that, but been a while.

 

[Rated Aargh]

I just bought a all in one heater tank and heater. My boat has a heat/Ac unit in it but it sure does me no good when the boat is on the hard. This winter i plan on doing some boat repairs so i did a temporary install that half resembles a nasa scene and some well rigged scene. The boat is shrink wrapped and on the hard, I mounted the heater on the bow of the boat and centered the exhaust pipe through the hawse cleat so theres 2-3 inches clearance minimum, got insulated 4" flexible ducting a "Y" pipe and installed one vent in the veebirth port window and one in the aftcabin port window.
This weekend it was about 25F and it kept the entire boat about 70deg F. At night it got cooler but i could have closed the cabin door too keep the heat in the cabin instead of running up too the saloon. Im guessing when its get colder i'll keep the sleeping quarters warmer and let the rest of the area be the best it will be. im curios if putting a vent in the engine bay would help by maybe creating a heated floor effect in the saloon.
Maybe Ill try a ceramic heater in the engine bay before i do any more ducting.
originally i was not going to do a permanent install of this but the more i think of it i would be nice to have the extra heat in the early spring when off the dock and not having to listen to the generator..

 

[Irish Rambler]

In the past I've fitted Webasto and Eberspacher heaters on different boats and they were pretty expensive at the time, when my current boat (a Broom 42 flybridge) Webasto broke down I bought a 8 kw Chinese heater and apart from changing the control from led to a rotary knob controller its never given any trouble at all. There are a couple of things I would recommend and that is to fit a Webasto silencer as they seem to be the most effective and the other is to insulate all the ducting and you'll get a lot more heat at the outlets.
We fuel ours from the main diesel tank, if you find it smokes a little simply put some paraffin in your diesel tank. If you are in cold region you can mix 70/30 diesel/paraffin with absolutely no harm to your motor.
When we were doing deliveries with our trucks up into Northern Norway they use up to 60/40 mix in their trucks to stop the fuel freezing and run cleaner.

 

[ssobol]

The real problem is the technology was stolen from a company who invested in developing a product, someone else stole that R&D and threw out a discount product with no investment in development.

The original developer provided good jobs for its personnel, both in R&D and production, the knock off company "not so much". It makes it pretty hard for the original developer to support their product when their market share declines due to the discounted knock off, and their ability to spread their R&D investment out over a longer period of time with product sales is damaged.

We as buyers of theses pirated technologies are a part of the problem.

Just sayin...

My understanding it that the patent expired making the design fair game.

 

[Mako]

Steamboat Willies's copyright is about to expire. Wonder if there will be Chinese versions hitting the theater soon thereafter

 

[AKDoug]

My understanding it that the patent expired making the design fair game.

Be that as it may, it still makes it hard for the original developer to support the product they designed and built, so product support disappears. It’s on us to support what we have and the only way to do that is to support the original developer.

If you want your children and grand children to have jobs in America, buy American! If you want to support someone else’s kids in another country, it’s on you!

Just sayin’…

 

[Delta Riverat]

Can't even find a webasto dealer in the USA. Eberspacher is $1250 compared to $125 for Chinese.

Yeah, I'll pay more for made in USA, 2 to 3 times easy. But a whole order of magnitude?

Maybe even then. But with all the positive reviews?

It would be different if there were lot's of burned down buildings and boats...

I mean my boat was built in Hong Kong eh?

 

[SteveK]

Can't even find a webasto dealer in the USA. Eberspacher is $1250 compared to $125 for Chinese.

Yeah, I'll pay more for made in USA, 2 to 3 times easy. But a whole order of magnitude?

Maybe even then. But with all the positive reviews?

It would be different if there were lot's of burned down buildings and boats...

I mean my boat was built in Hong Kong eh?

I recall that there was or was to be a surtax on imported products that were also built in the USA in an attempt to level the playing field. Maybe it was just a dream.

 

[Irish Rambler]

I think you'll find the Russians did the first 'knock off' with their Planar heater and the Chinese in turn 'knocked' that off.
Unfortunately industrial espionage, be it from our universities, R&D and production should have been heavily policed which has led to some countries getting to big for their boots.
When I was in China visiting the Yangtse river complex the attractive tourist guide was very subtle in getting friendly to me and searching for information and in particular wanting contacts in the EU as 'they would like to work in the West'.
I just bluffed and said I worked in transport and then she drifted away. So if ever you go there be very cautious as they are very devious.

 

[hollywood8118]

If you want your children and grand children to have jobs in America, buy American! If you want to support someone else’s kids in another country, it’s on you!

Just sayin’…

So you were lead to believe its " made in America" ?



I believe it is German....
Hollywood

 

[CaptTom]

...When I was in China visiting the Yangtse river complex the attractive tourist guide was very subtle in getting friendly to me and searching for information...
So if ever you go there be very cautious as they are very devious.

Maybe I should imply that I work at some secret government installation when talking to those attractive tourist guides...

 

[Irish Rambler]

If you're a bit suggestive you'll certainly be invited to a 'honey trap' and many more incentives.
But remember its a one way street and there's only one way out.
Incidentally many years ago as a young military guy when it was under British jurisdiction long before Hong Kong reverted to Chinese control I did sample the local delights and they were exceptionally pleasing in every way.

 

[ssobol]

Steamboat Willies's copyright is about to expire. Wonder if there will be Chinese versions hitting the theater soon thereafter

Not sure about the Chinese, but ....

https://deadline.com/2023/04/john-oliver-tests-disney-lawyers-staking-claim-mickey-mouse-steamboat-willie-version-entering-public-domain-1235316046/

 

[ssobol]

I recall that there was or was to be a surtax on imported products that were also built in the USA in an attempt to level the playing field. Maybe it was just a dream.

It's Americans who end up paying that tax. Government wins either way.

 

[AKDoug]

So you were lead to believe its " made in America" ?



I believe it is German....
Hollywood

Be that as it may, the philosophy remains. If a support network is built for a product, a product "knocked off" with no product support undermines the original product AND its support network. The work involved in removing and replacing a system vs maintaining it is quite different. SURE marine supports my heater, no one supports the Chinese knock off, and SURE employs American workers.

No point in arguing with people with a different point of view. Just stating my point of view!

 

[Cigatoo]

“My Chinese heater has a feature that neither my Webasto had or my Espar has. When turned off, a sophisticated thermostat turns on the glow plug and increases the fan speed, then shuts off the fuel. This ensures that the burner chamber doesn't soot up, one of the main reasons for issues with the German and Russian designs. Hopefully, they are smart enough to have copied the Chinese.[/QUOTE]

Marco
Can you tell us what brand of heater you have?

 

[Marco Flamingo]

Mine was sold as a Warmtoo brand, but is the common orange and black 8kw 12v model. It has been "rebranded" by many sellers under different names. Which makes the anti-Chinese patent infringement claim even sillier. Chinese made parts can be rebadged in Germany with a name like"Glockenspeil" and some will pay a premium thinking it is a German made part. A scam as old as commercial business. German companies can source parts in China to build their heaters. Not likely that a completed product can be rebadged, but I'm not familiar with EU country of origin (COO) requirements. In the U.S., it is generally that the foreign parts/labor/etc. can't exceed 50% of the value or else the product isn't made in the USA. One way to avoid that is to have a GIGANTIC markup. In German, that's called a Webasto.



Look carefully at the included parts and accessories when shopping for a heater on Ebay. Pick the one that has the most useful items for your installation. As noted over and over, the included muffler isn't for marine application and isn't particularly efficient anyway. You will need a thermally insulated through-hull for the exhaust. It is likely that you will need additional ducting (unless you choose to fabricate a substitute). Check to see if the seller offers additional ductwork as there are several sizes. Likewise, order a rebuild kit (ignitor, gasket, etc.,) at the same time to insure that you get the right kit. If the seller happens to have everything, sometimes it is possible to put together your list and make an offer.

If you feel that the price is too good to be true, send $1,200 off to some company (not Chinese) that you think had a patent on the design.

 

[Cigatoo]

This one seemed to be a little better quality than the typical Chinese heater. If anyone that has a Chinese heater would look this one over and comment it would be appreciated. Maybe just better marketing? Higher price? They claim to include better quality exhaust and other parts.
https://www.rvheater.com/products/vvkb-12v-marine-heater-diesel-heater-for-boat-free-shipping

 

[ssobol]

One thing about the "chinese" heater market is that there are now a lot of 2nd and 3rd parties that make accessories and improvements for them (e.g. controllers, pumps, mounts, mufflers). You can pick and choose what parts and improvements you want based on your use case.

These probably provide a few jobs.

 

[Delta Riverat]

Yeah, as well as SS double wall through hulls, elbows, vents, ducting and louvers.

And after you get it installed (the hard part) if it breaks down just buy another for $100.

 

[Marco Flamingo]

This one seemed to be a little better quality than the typical Chinese heater. If anyone that has a Chinese heater would look this one over and comment it would be appreciated.

Exactly what I was posting. Look at the Chinese manufacturer in the fine print. Same as my $106 heater. They claim that they will answer your questions if you have problems, which might be why they charge the additional $700. Your choice.

 

[Delta Riverat]

If I have a problem I'll watch the 100 youtube videos on how to fix it.

 

[Cigatoo]

Exactly what I was posting. Look at the Chinese manufacturer in the fine print. Same as my $106 heater. They claim that they will answer your questions if you have problems, which might be why they charge the additional $700. Your choice.

I knew it was also Chinese. They do claim to supply better quality exhaust and exhaust thru hull with the marine version. Doubt it’s $700 worth.

 

[ssobol]

So split the difference and get this one:

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256805342119603.html?spm=a2g0o.detail.1000060.2.2fce6c7fuVIPHX&gps-id=pcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller&scm=1007.13339.291025.0&scm_id=1007.13339.291025.0&scm-url=1007.13339.291025.0&pvid=261faf9a-7d1b-428b-9b54-c8ba532f38dc&_t=gps-id%3ApcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller%2Cscm-url%3A1007.13339.291025.0%2Cpvid%3A261faf9a-7d1b-428b-9b54-c8ba532f38dc%2Ctpp_buckets%3A668%232846%238112%231997&pdp_npi=3%40dis%21USD%21418.0%21418.0%21%21%21%21%21%402103011016833937245922020e94e1%2112000033429115441%21rec%21US%21&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa

 

[janice142]

Hello gents... I too have a (HappyBuy branded) 5k diesel heater almost completely installed. I have yet to decide on the fuel source however.

Aboard Seaweed I have two fuel tanks with lines feeding into a fuel pump that fills my Racor 500, and pushes diesel into my Kubota. The auxillary tank that came with my heater absolutely will not fit anywhere.

Top of picture is port side.

My options are to buy a different feeder tank or tap into my tank. The fuel pickup point is below the cockpit -- too far away for the little pump. So I need to purchase a short fat tank. Is there anything I should be aware of before I go shopping?

P.S. - the ten liter tank that came in my kit is available (postage on your dime) if any of you need/want a spare.

 

[Bmarler]

Hello gents... I too have a (HappyBuy branded) 5k diesel heater almost completely installed. I have yet to decide on the fuel source however.

Aboard Seaweed I have two fuel tanks with lines feeding into a fuel pump that fills my Racor 500, and pushes diesel into my Kubota. The auxillary tank that came with my heater absolutely will not fit anywhere.

Top of picture is port side.

My options are to buy a different feeder tank or tap into my tank. The fuel pickup point is below the cockpit -- too far away for the little pump. So I need to purchase a short fat tank. Is there anything I should be aware of before I go shopping?

P.S. - the ten liter tank that came in my kit is available (postage on your dime) if any of you need/want a spare.

Years ago, before they went out of business, boat electric sold a kit that worked great in situations like this. Maybe you can source the parts to do it yourself. They had you put a t in the fuel line at the tank outlet. On the branch of the t, route a line to a small pump like the ones that feed a dickenson stove. Low pressure, low power draw. The outlet from that went to a tiny “day tank”. Essentially just a little float bowl. The metering pump hooked to that. The day tank capacity was really only a cup or so. Easy to fit in small places near the heater. Use a relay to fire the lift pump using a signal from the heater harness.

 

[Bmarler]

To add, I’m sure boat electric used a modified Dickinson stove metering valve. They blocked the metering output and fed the tank from the lift pump into the top fitting ((fuel inlet) and then used the fuel return at the bottom to feed the little metering pump.
https://www.fisheriessupply.com/dickinson-marine-oil-metering-valves-replacement

This little setup works fantastic.

 

[Irish Rambler]

If I may offer some suggestions to several of the questions previously posted.
1, Fuel pump clicking noise, if you look on the site where you bought the heater you will probably see a rubber 'P' mounting bracket for sale, mount the pump in this bracket and the diesel pump clicking noise will be barely audible.
2, You must always fit a silencer in the exhaust line and one of the most effficient exhaust silencers for diesel heaters is made by Webasto. Be a good neighbour and fit one.
3, Carefully route the exhaust pipe from the heater. Here you have a choice, if you wish to take the chill out of the engine room leave it uninsulated, otherwise for quietness insulate the exhaust pipe with flameproof insulation.
4, Mounting the pump at 45 degrees eliminates airlocks.
5, The difference between the 5KW and the 8KW is determined by the diesel pump output, the 5 kW pump is marked as a 25 output and 8KW pump is marked as 28.
6, Fully insulating all the hot air pipes increases the output at the vents by 20%.
7, They all come with a plastic fuel tank, you can use this if you wish, or discard it and take the fuel feed from your mainfuel tank.
Depending where you are moored/cruising your diesel heater may produce smoke, this is normal after a few months of unuse and quickly clears. If you are in cold Northern regions most fuel companies sell 'winter' diesel with a slightly lower flashpoint to aid starting.
Our company operates trucks up into Norway and Sweden and the truck makers handbooks recommend using up to 30% paraffin to stop the fuel freezing and aid cold starting with no detrimental effects on the engine, this also allows the engine to heat quicker and reduce any smoke from the exhaust.