Welding expertise

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Seevee

Seevee

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Sep 1, 2016
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Need some welding expertise to get a welding machine. I've got a chance to pick up some rather new (and some old) welding machine fairly reasonable and have a few projects I'd like to do.


One of the projects is reinforcing a boat lift, where welding 3/8 and 7/16 aluminum will be necessary. I'm thinking of TIG because it makes a better weld than MIG. I've had some experience but it's been decades ago.


My question is what size and power of a machine will I need?



The other projects I have are smaller and not much of a critical issue.
 
A big one. Al takes lots of heat and needs some skill. As much as I like my tig welder, heavy aluminum is probably better welded with a mig but you'll need a push-pull gun for aluminum filler and at least 240 volts. You might look at a generator-welder, heavy but portable with a truck unless power access is easy.

If it's a small project, it makes way more sense to hire a pro unless the equipment will be used a lot.

Check out Weldingweb.com, excellent info site. Ask your question there and you'll get a better response than from me. Or Jody's welding tips.
 
Hiring a welder with portable equipment would probably cost less and do a better job, especially on aluminum.
To weld thick aluminum you'd need something to practice on and get your technique right before welding something where you want a nice weld.
I was certified in all major welding types and all positions. Then didn't strike an arc for 30 years. I had to practice to get the skills back.
 
My MIG unit won't weld that thick of a material, but its just a small Miller. The TIG does fine. But, as said, using TIG on aluminum is quite a bit different than steel. I have done a bunch of aluminum that looks more like bird poop when done than actual welding beads. My TIG is an older Miller syncrowave, which is about a 150 amp machine. (Its locked in a storage container at the moment or I'd check) Its certainly big enough for any of my uses, which includes welding up pretty decent size holes in aluminum cylinder heads, so I'd expect it would be more than enough for what you're doing. Good luck.
 
Thanks... all good thoughts.


Agreed on hiring it done IF I can get someone out here, which for now is impossible. Good skilled help is very hard to come by.



Yes, it would take me time to get up to speed again, but not impossible. (probably quicker than just finding someone... IF I can).


Was hoping to get buy with 120v but looks like that will be hard, however, I can easily run a 240v line. Also, I can easily preheat for heavier aluminum.


Just getting ideas for now.
 
I have an older Everlast 225 at home AC/DC Tig/Stick (no mig). Its a good machine for the $$. By no means is this a pro level unit, just an above average home/hobby unit. If you have never done Tig before its going to take a bit of time to get over the learning curve. Best to find someone to show you the ropes, or plan on spending a few hours and $$ playing with it. Consumables are not cheap, so its a costly deal to learn on your own, but it can be done. I would recommend starting out on steel plate, once you can lay down some nice looking/strong welds move over to aluminum.

I can do up to 3/8 single pass with a pre-heat to about 250 or so.
If its been a while since you played with a tig you will love the new features once you start playing with them. If your in it to just learn a new task I say go for it, if your just wanting one thing welded up, pay a pro.


https://www.everlastwelders.ca/powermts-225l-with-tig-package-gmaw-gtaw-smaw-ac-dc-tig.php
 
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Newer welding machines make better welds and welders. Consistent power, arc control, less splatter, way more efficient, and easier to strike an arc.

The skill required to make a stack dimes TIG weld is significantly less than it was 15-20 years ago.

I wouldn't consider an old machine unless you are already a skilled welder. But if you are a skilled welder, you already have a few machines.

I am amazed at the quality of the inverter machines these days. I'd rather have a modern machine with all the bells and whistles even if I have to put up with a low duty cycle.
 
Northern Spy said:
Newer welding machines make better welds and welders. Consistent power, arc control, less splatter, way more efficient, and easier to strike an arc.

The skill required to make a stack dimes TIG weld is significantly less than it was 15-20 years ago.

I wouldn't consider an old machine unless you are already a skilled welder. But if you are a skilled welder, you already have a few machines.

I am amazed at the quality of the inverter machines these days. I'd rather have a modern machine with all the bells and whistles even if I have to put up with a low duty cycle.
Click to expand...

I agree, I use to have a really old miller 250. Then I used one of the shop inverter machines and was amazed on how easy it was to use. So I sold my old miller and bought the Everlast. I have had it for about 4 years no with no issues, its not a machine I would buy to make $$. But for home/hobby use its nice.

And for Mig I bought a little Tweco 3-1 unit that's 110/220 DC only, scratch start only.
 
Would someone explain what the DC side does? Never mess with that an not sure of the uses.
 
For the most part DC is for steel/stainless, AC is for Aluminum/magnesium.

You can weld aluminum with DC if you know what your doing, have some good gas and good luck. I have done it, it looks like crap, but its all I had, you can also stick weld aluminum, Its not easy, it looks like crap, but it will work with the right rod.

When it comes to welding, most high-powered machines are run on DC or have the ability to change from DC to AC current like some professional TIG welders. Most of all metals and metal alloys except aluminum and magnesium are welded with DC, especially when wedding higher strength and low alloy steels. Direct current is the only way to do it.
Alternating current has its own uses with MMA (stick) and TIG welding processes. MIG welders to my knowledge can’t run on AC except some inexpensive ones called “buzz boxes”. There is no decent MIG welding machine out there that can perform well on AC. Some glassless flux core welders can give you a decent beat but then again it will be low penetration and with a lot of splatter.
In the MMA case, using special electrodes alternating current can help when base metal is magnetized and the “arc blow “appears. Switching to AC most often ends the problem.
In a TIG’s case, aluminum is always welded with AC current because of a special property of aluminum alloy that has a problem with melting point. This is a problem that Alternating current solves.
 
Speaking of stick welding, if you just have this one project for reinforcing the aluminum boat lift, I'd just use stick.

I am only a home hobby welder, but have a really nice Everlast 200 amp inverter machine for MIG and stick, and have done a bunch of both on various types of steel, including stainless. I have an aluminum bipod mast on my old fishing boat and wanted to work on it to reconfigure the antenna and light mounts. Rather than invest in a spool gun that would really only be needed once, I just got some aluminum rod and practiced on some scrap.

Is it difficult? Yeah, it's a pain in the ass. But with my little machine I easily got good penetration and some really solid welds. Pro tip: get the grinding disks made for aluminum that don't clog up right away when you finish those horrible hobby welds to make them look presentable.
 
I had a big project a year or two ago rebuilding an aluminum walkway over an old stone pier. Like you, I couldn’t get anyone to show up to work on it, so did the whole project myself.

I bought a Miller 255 mig plus a good push/pull gun. The whole set up was expensive, but still less than paying somone else to come wreck things.

I came into the project with only a tiny bit of welding experience, and zero AL experience. But man that welder made it look like I knew what I was doing. Not all the time. Even I could make crap welds with it. But all in it worked great and I completed the project. The walkway still stands two years and many storms later (it takes direct wave hits in a storm). I have since used it for numerous projects both in AL and steel.

I don’t know if it will matter to you, but one reason I picked Miller over Lincoln is operation from generator power. Much of my use is off grid with only generator power, and Lincoln says to not run many of their units off gen power, or calls for significant derating of the gen. That ruled them out for my needs. Miller is fine running off a generator.
 
Unless you have a lot of jobs or want it as a hobby hire a pro. All education is expensive either in money, time and do overs.
 
bayview said:
Unless you have a lot of jobs or want it as a hobby hire a pro. All education is expensive either in money, time and do overs.
Click to expand...


I agree when:


1) There is a pro who is actually a pro, and not a hack


2) That pro will actually show up in a timely fashion to do the job.


The vast majority of the time when I hire a "pro", they either don't show up, or do such a crappy job that I need to redo it myself anyway. If I have a known-good pro who will show up and do a good job, then I am delighted to hire work out. But I have found those two qualities highly elusive.
 
Greetings,
Mr. (saint) tt.



iu





Unfortunately that seems to be the case with most of the trades...Sigh...
 
A Miller MIG with a 30A spool gun works great for aluminum that thick. The spool gun alone is like 1500 bucks though.
 
Some of the newer mig machines allow newbies to weld with some you tube videos but when working with aluminum that changes .I have a millermatic 350 with a push pull and works ok but for real work my go to is a miller 310hf. For any real work you need power and harbor freight stuff wont work.I am not sure this project would be something to learn on.
 
SeeVee,



I'm in the same boat (no pun intended) sort of. I need a new set of Stainless risers (4 of them, 10k-20k). Too much $$$ for me. Plan B, take a few welding classes at the local community college (Continuing Education), buy the welders (used) and start practicing. Start with steel doing simple projects.




During the refit I'll redo the railings, add a hardtop bimini, and dink crane, etc.



You're also going to need tools to cut, grind, shape, and work with the metal.

For Aluminum you'll need a TiG, MiGing Aluminum is difficult at best, and Stick will look horrible.



Good Luck
 
twistedtree said:
I agree when:


1) There is a pro who is actually a pro, and not a hack


2) That pro will actually show up in a timely fashion to do the job.


The vast majority of the time when I hire a "pro", they either don't show up, or do such a crappy job that I need to redo it myself anyway. If I have a known-good pro who will show up and do a good job, then I am delighted to hire work out. But I have found those two qualities highly elusive.
Click to expand...
Roses Machine shop has welders that know whats what. Also Gloucester Marine railways has some subcontractor mobile welders who are good.
 
One place to check is with commercial mechanical contractors. They almost always have good contacts for guys who do field welding. If your wanting to learn and have the money that new millermatic will let you do almost everything with less talent. It will switch automatically from mig to spool gun with a tank of argon and a tank of 75/25 mounted. You can go straight from steel to aluminum without doing anything but setting voltage. I bought it for the new guys to learn faster. It speeds up the learning curve but i think i spent 3500 on the 350. They have a smaller version but not sure if it comes with spool gun. I still use the bigger machine and tig with a water cooled torch but i am only doing the hard stuff at my age.I have been welding for 50 years and have a dozen machines and they all run different but i am impressed with the new 350. I am a TIG guy so only ran some instructional passes with it. I am trying to teach the young guys to do more aluminum and having them use a throttled high frequency stabilized arc is just to much. I have my 12 year old granddaughter pushing a spool gun and she calls it art
 
Anyone familiar with this Lincoln Square Wave TIG 200 TIG Welder?

I might have a chance to get a new one fairly reasonable. But would like to know some of the limitations with this box.
 

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Been trying to down size... get rid of tools... do less..... goof off more....


But seems like every time I sell a tool I find two more that I just can't live without.:blush:
 
Seevee,

RE: Lincoln Square Wave TIG 200 TIG Welder

Don't waste your $$$. Not enough amperage or enough adjustability to do what you want and get good results.

Hint Harbor Freight sells those and their Mig brother. DAMHIKT


Star.
 
StarChaser said:
.

For Aluminum you'll need a TiG, MiGing Aluminum is difficult at best, and Stick will look horrible.



Good Luck
Click to expand...

Aluminium is piss easy if you know how
I did my time building Aluminium superyachts, can't imagine anyone trying to weld countless miles of boat hull10 and 12 mm thick and engine beds 25mm thick with a TIG
 
Simi,

Agreed, but that particular welding isn't worth buying IMO. Not enough amps or control.
 
Seevee said:
Anyone familiar with this Lincoln Square Wave TIG 200 TIG Welder?

I might have a chance to get a new one fairly reasonable. But would like to know some of the limitations with this box.
Click to expand...


200 amps of TIG won't do much of anything to 3/8" aluminum. MIG with a spool gun is the only way to go with thick aluminum plates, IMO.
 
One point that hasn't been made clearly (or I missed it): TIG welding can be either AC or DC. DC is fine for steel but you need an AC machine to weld aluminum. Typical multiprocess welders, even good ones, DON'T have AC TIG. You'll need a dedicated AC/DC TIG machine that usually cost $1500 and up.
 
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