boats not made in China?

[ksanders]

I find it funny folks making fun of the OP's desire to buy a boat made in America. I say this because although he asked for not made in China, I am thinking he would like an American made boat.

This is not political. Not conservative, or liberal. It is simple wanting to employ his fellow countrymen to build what might be the largerst purchase of his life. Certainly the 2nd largest purchase after a home.

I for one really try to buy things made here in America. No, I am not always successful but I do try.

Why... Well for me I want my fellow Americans to have a job. Hopefully they will spend some of their money at my company.

2nd I want to protect the environment. We have probably the toughest environmental protection laws in the world and I would like to avoid supporting countries that have lower environmental protection standards.

3rd I want to support things like safe work places, and minimum age for workers. We have again some of the toughest workplace safety laws on the planet right here at home, and I want to support safe work places. I also want to not support child labor so prevalent in some countries.

So... When you want to make fun of someone who wants to buy from a "western" country, think for a moment what you really supporting.

 

[Simi 60]

I find it funny folks making fun of the OP's desire to buy a boat made in America. I say this because although he asked for not made in China, I am thinking he would like an American made boat.

He never said American made, he said not made in China
The rest of the world is not America

This is not political. Not conservative, or liberal. It is simple wanting to employ his fellow countrymen to build what might be the largerst purchase of his life. Certainly the 2nd largest purchase after a home

.
If he simply wanted to employ Americans he simply could have asked for an American built boat.
As he didn't........

 

[ksanders]

He never said American made, he said not made in China
The rest of the world is not America

.
If he simply wanted to employ Americans he simply could have asked for an American built boat.
As he didn't........

I agree but many Americans put recreational boats in two categories.

Those made in America and those made in the far east.

I know at this point I am trying to speak for the OP, but that's my opinion as to his intentions with the post.

Oh... and I fully stand by my rational. I DO want to protect the enviroment and I DO want to promote safe workplaces and eliminate child labor.

To do that I try my best to purchase products made in countries that promote those ideals.

For the life of me I cannot understand why others do not hold those things important.

 

[timb7734]

Ummmm Taiwan, where my a Krogen was built, has never been Communist, yet. The dismal human rights of mainland China being the issue as stated.

 

[skyhawk]

OP here....
lots of posts I wanted to reply directly to, but my attempt at setting up a multi-quote failed.... so I'll just gloss over some general thoughts

Yes it is funny how threads like this derail.... almost immediately a few folks tried to prod a negative attitude political discussion....

in large part yes, it is political of course.... it has a lot to do with national security, maintaining a manufacturing capability, promoting a more local economy....or in this case at least that of at least areas that are allies and not enemies to the way of life of my culture......but also all of the mentioned moral and ethical considerations too.
It's pretty much impossible I know to get something that produced in this world that china hasn't touched at least on some raw material or component level...... but I honestly didn't intend to be so micro-level with it all.... There are just so many levels and reasons to this line of thinking.....

The question was mostly...not totally, but mostly grounded in just trying to gain a better perspective of the state of the industry. I'm not a short term shopper, but like the idea of getting into it sometime fairly soon....so I'd like to know wheat to keep an eye out for as a dream and shop.

Anyway, it seems that most of the options mentioned are semi displacement or otherwise not really quite the same idea. I wonder why that is. The old Hatteras boats for example were semi displacement weren't they? Some of these have the range but I wonder how truly they compare in terms of sea kindliness, etc....

 

[alvasurg]

I cannot understand the aversion people have to Volvos. Granted, they are not as easily serviced as Cummins, but almost every new boat that is sold today has Volvo IPS engines (not trawlers, of course). At some point, the need for parts has to catch up with the number of new engines being sold.

I live in Buffalo, NY. Not a metropolis for boatin, and the local Volvo truck dealership just added a marine service unit.

I have Volvos TAMD75's in my boat and have never had problems getting the usual parts for service, Granted, no major overhauls needed (yet)!

 

[pkirkll]

Billy V wrote;
“Why support a country that historically has been very cruel to their own people.”

Because your notion that your shopping habits will change their evil ways is false.
We cherish our freedom but seem to think others shouldn’t have it.
But the notion that if we cease to do business w China such that they have extreme monetary difficulties we may modify their behavior. Not likely.
And China should have the freedoms we do ... or is that just for us?

The reason we’re having this conversation is that China is manufacturing b-zillion products cheaper than we are and the’re not talking about a minimum wage. But wages in their country is not our business. It’s their country. Unless you think we should have freedom and they should not.

He can have a false belief also--- that is his freedom---without being harped on for it.
Just let that part go--someone asked and he answered--- give him answers about the boat he is searching for if there are any.
Carry on.

 

[ksanders]

Well...

I for one am American, and am glad to have a US made boat a Bayliner.

I am glad that the manufacturer of my boat caused as little harm to the environment as possible, because we simply do not allow our environment to be unnecessarily harmed in this country.

Another thing I am glad for is the fact that the workers who built my boat did so in as safe work environment where employers are not allowed to sacrifice the safety of their employees for profits. I also know for a fact that the people that built my boat were all adults because in this country our children are not allowed to work at a young age.

You see, when people tell me that this country or that country are more efficient than our country at doing things like building boats, I have to think... Are the lower costs of production really lower due to efficiency, or are they lower because in those countries businesses do not have to follow the same environmental protection and worker safety rules our country has.

So when you see that thing...That boat, or whatever thing... think for a moment. Did a child make it? Did anybody get hurt making it? Did we unnecessarily harm the environment to make it?

It doesn't matter where things are made, or who makes them, as long as you know they were made in a responsible manner.

Or is it easier to just look the other way and pretend it's not happening.

My opinion is that we should all try to do business with responsible manufacturers , and not look the other way. If you would not put up with it in your country why would you feel good about harming people or the environment in another country.

 

[Woodland Hills]

OP here....
lots of posts I wanted to reply directly to, but my attempt at setting up a multi-quote failed.... so I'll just gloss over some general thoughts

Yes it is funny how threads like this derail.... almost immediately a few folks tried to prod a negative attitude political discussion....

in large part yes, it is political of course.... it has a lot to do with national security, maintaining a manufacturing capability, promoting a more local economy....or in this case at least that of at least areas that are allies and not enemies to the way of life of my culture......but also all of the mentioned moral and ethical considerations too.
It's pretty much impossible I know to get something that produced in this world that china hasn't touched at least on some raw material or component level...... but I honestly didn't intend to be so micro-level with it all.... There are just so many levels and reasons to this line of thinking.....

The question was mostly...not totally, but mostly grounded in just trying to gain a better perspective of the state of the industry. I'm not a short term shopper, but like the idea of getting into it sometime fairly soon....so I'd like to know wheat to keep an eye out for as a dream and shop.

Anyway, it seems that most of the options mentioned are semi displacement or otherwise not really quite the same idea. I wonder why that is. The old Hatteras boats for example were semi displacement weren't they? Some of these have the range but I wonder how truly they compare in terms of sea kindliness, etc....

The Hatteras LRC’s were full displacement hulls, everything else they made were planing hulls.

 

[ronobrien]

Well...

I for one am American, and am glad to have a US made boat a Bayliner.

I am glad that the manufacturer of my boat caused as little harm to the environment as possible, because we simply do not allow our environment to be unnecessarily harmed in this country.

Another thing I am glad for is the fact that the workers who built my boat did so in as safe work environment where employers are not allowed to sacrifice the safety of their employees for profits. I also know for a fact that the people that built my boat were all adults because in this country our children are not allowed to work at a young age.

You see, when people tell me that this country or that country are more efficient than our country at doing things like building boats, I have to think... Are the lower costs of production really lower due to efficiency, or are they lower because in those countries businesses do not have to follow the same environmental protection and worker safety rules our country has.

So when you see that thing...That boat, or whatever thing... think for a moment. Did a child make it? Did anybody get hurt making it? Did we unnecessarily harm the environment to make it?

It doesn't matter where things are made, or who makes them, as long as you know they were made in a responsible manner.

Or is it easier to just look the other way and pretend it's not happening.

My opinion is that we should all try to do business with responsible manufacturers , and not look the other way. If you would not put up with it in your country why would you feel good about harming people or the environment in another country.

Very nicely summarized. I share your sentiments on the subject and appreciate your rational attitude.

 

[stubones99]

I cannot understand the aversion people have to Volvos. Granted, they are not as easily serviced as Cummins, but almost every new boat that is sold today has Volvo IPS engines (not trawlers, of course). At some point, the need for parts has to catch up with the number of new engines being sold.

I live in Buffalo, NY. Not a metropolis for boatin, and the local Volvo truck dealership just added a marine service unit.

I have Volvos TAMD75's in my boat and have never had problems getting the usual parts for service, Granted, no major overhauls needed (yet)!

Unfortunately, my friend has passed away, and I've forgotten which model Volvo engine his boat had, but they were TAMD's and were 6 years old when Volvo stopped supporting them. He showed me a notice telling him that they were reaching end of support status, at 6 years old. Any spare parts he needed should be ordered before date x. He said "How am I supposed to know what spare parts I'll need on here? Just get a spare engine? At their prices?" It seemed that every part had to be shipped from a single warehouse in Atlanta, and a few times, parts had to be shipped from the manufacturer, at his expense. Once he got the boat running smoothly again, he put it on the market and made it someone else's problem.

Sure, it's all second hand info, but I know his boat stayed in the slip a lot, partly because of waiting on repair parts... It may not be the same with their IPS drives, but who wants to find out After the purchase?

 

[firehoser75]

First, I know that "dependability" and "functionality" can vary between models with any manufacturer of engines. They all have had some "poor" models.
However, from first hand experience with one Volvo engine, I can state that I would avoid ever owning another Volvo marine engine (if possible) given almost any other choice.

From my personal experience, I found customer support to be terrible, parts availability (for a relatively new engine) to be awful, and prices for parts to be high. Not a great combination in my book.
To be fair, I did not, in the 11 years I owned the boat from new, have to order parts all that often. However, once I had to wait for a part to be shipped from the south eastern US, and once for a part to be shipped from Sweden. This when the boat (and engine) was less than 6 years old. One time the parts in question were glow plugs and the Swedish example it was for a cast pulley (that had mysteriously split in half) that bolted on to the coolant pump. Also, at the 5 year mark, the engine had a lower end failure that was caused by a manufacturing error. I know the cause of the engine failure with 100% accuracy as the engine was examined by a metallugical engineer, an insurance adjustor, and the mechanic who stripped and repaired the engine. They all agreed (without knowledge of the other's findings) that the failure was caused by one nut on the connecting rod cap not being adequately torqued from the factory. Despite this "proof", Volvo would not stand behind their product. The engineer had electron microscope photos showing conclusive evidence of the torque issue, and I supplied Volvo with a copy of the engineer's report. Volvo Canada's response was that it had to be caused by "user error", and they had zero evidence to support that claim, as they never even examined the engine.
Anyway, due to my experience with this Volvo engine, I would recommend others to "think twice" before buying one, especially if they have another viable option.
Why are they in so many new boats. MARKETING. They provide tremendous deals to boat builders to entice them to use their products. That does not mean they make a great product. Each to their own, but buyer beware.

 

[SteveK]

Tom was your experience back in the 80's. It was from that era that I recall many such stories that left a bad taste for Volvos. Never again and therefore I cannot have an opinion on their engines today.

 

[firehoser75]

"Tom was your experience back in the 80's."
Steve,
No, I owned that boat (with the Volvo engine) from late 2004 to late 2013.

 

[Simi 60]

Well, that was an interesting bit of censorship/book burning
From a land that spouts free speech as one of its rights.

Seems its OK to bag out China but dare not mention anything bad about the US.

A bit sad that but not surprising.

 

[Peter B]

Ok, people, clearly if the original intent has in any way served its purpose, it is now way past its best by date, and most of what has been added is hardly consistent with the Op's intent, so this thread is now closed, and for obvious reasons, I suspect.

On behalf of site team,