Air Cooled, Enclosed, Marine Gen Sets

[Art]

Junk . . . Oh, wait, I thought this was word association . . . . Well, from my experience, it still stands . . .

When I googled Fisher Panda there were little to no good reports.

 

[FF]

Air Cooled?


Leave it afloat in the dink less noise , no heat problem .

 

[Lepke]

Call the cooling what you will, the heat from an air cooled or radiator cooled engine stays where the engine is located. In an enclosed space the air temp will get hotter and can effect the running of the engine. It may even limit the engine life. In my experience, air cooled engines don't last as long as water cooled engines.

 

[Art]

Call the cooling what you will, the heat from an air cooled or radiator cooled engine stays where the engine is located. In an enclosed space the air temp will get hotter and can effect the running of the engine. It may even limit the engine life. In my experience, air cooled engines don't last as long as water cooled engines.

That is true: Until the heat is provided an efficient means and egress channel to be directed otherwise [i.e. overboard].

That is true: Possibly due to in part that air cooled engines' "block" may in general not be built with as heavy duty design as fluid cooled engines??

IMO... being a masonry, concrete and tile contractor for over 40 years: Having used many different sizes and types of air cooled engines [generators, water evacuation pumps, plaster mixers, concrete mixers, ladder material lifts... etc]. It seems apparent to me that a well engineered air cooled marine generator could be developed for use inside enclosed areas of pleasure boats... such as engine compartments/rooms.

Seeing as it appears there is not such a beast currently available I will at this time cease my search. Was fun though!!

 

[rslifkin]

Air cooled engines can never be as durable. Temperature control isn't as good, which leads to higher wear.

 

[Ski in NC]

I ran into one air cooled marine diesel genset. It had a Yanmar or Hatz or Farymann one banger air cooled diesel in a soundbox. There was a big centrifugal fan that circulated the entrapped air through a copper alloy radiator. The radiator was fed sea water from the typical impeller pump, and typical wet exhaust.

I never got to see it run as I found it in a boatyard junk pile. Something did not work out too well.

Deutz makes (or made??) a very successful line of (mostly) industrial diesels that are air cooled. In some descriptions they are called "oil cooled". Apparently they have a lot of oil flow in areas where heat needs to be removed, and use a big oil to air radiator in the air flow. These things have a reputation of being very long lived.

 

[ksanders]

Air cooled engines can never be as durable. Temperature control isn't as good, which leads to higher wear.

That is simply NOT true.

Case in point...

The Lister air cooled diesel engines have been running in prime power applications here in Alaska forever.

These are mountain top microwave sites all over Southeast Alaska. I personally know of engines that were removed from service that were still running with over 75,000 hours on them.

Generator engines generally do not wear out. Something catastrophic happens to them. That "event" is often the root cause of the engine needing a rebuild or replace. (same thing with marine engines BTW)

Liquid cooling systems are a failure point. Hoses can fail, thermostats can fail, pumps can fail.

Remove those components from the equation and their contribution to the Mean Time Between Failure is removed and the MTBF increases.

 

[Lepke]

These are mountain top microwave sites all over Southeast Alaska. I personally know of engines that were removed from service that were still running with over 75,000 hours on them.

Generator engines generally do not wear out. Something catastrophic happens to them. That "event" is often the root cause of the engine needing a rebuild or replace. (same thing with marine engines BTW)

Alaska has a cool climate. I would assume a mountain top in Alaska would be even cooler.
Most generator engines need a rebuild because of ring and cylinder wear. The faster the engine turns, the faster the wear. 3600 rpm engines fail before 1800 rpm engines. 1200 engines go the longest, but the only ones I am aware of are heavy duty diesel and they can go decades.
I originally trained on radial aircraft engines. Old timers from WWII said they preferred being in a squadron of water cooled engines because the engines went much longer in combat flying. Less daily maintenance, fewer repairs and long interval between overhaul. If the water system got hit they didn't have to worry about it because they never saw the plane again. Air cooled radials only went 100+ hours. Every day they were replacing some cylinders from heat damage. Air cooled B-29 engines got so hot engine fires were a common problem.

 

[rslifkin]

A prime power generator is an easy application for air cooled engines. The load is fairly constant, so there's much less temperature variance than most applications.

 

[slowgoesit]

When I googled Fischer Panda there were little to no good reports.

Yep, The only good reports you will see about them are in the Manufacturers sales Brochures! . . . .well, maybe not. I'm sure there are happy Fischer Panda generator owners out there . . . . but:

• I am NOT one
• I have not MET one
• I haven't HEARD of one
• A search of three boat forums (Trawler Forum, MTOA, and Cruiser Forum) has not YIELDED one
• I can't find any cruising blogs that extol Fischer Panda generator virtues

But I'm SURE at least one is out there! . . . .

There are LOTS of Fischer Panda generators out there for sale used. Most say something like "Running take out", one said "Semi Running take out", not sure what THAT means . . .

Try finding a used Northern Lights marine generator under 10kw for a reasonable price, heck for ANY price, I couldn't find any . . . but LOTS of used Fischer Panda's out there . . . I wonder why?

 

[jeffnick]

I run a Honda 3000i on my trailerable houseboat. I'm thinking its over 15 years old now with only plug and oil changes.
While on the road we usually run the generator all night for a/c (in Walmart parking lots). On the water it is fired up before we splash and turned off after she's back on the trailer.
It runs in an enclosure that was built to keep it out of sight while on the travel trailer tongue and again when moved to the roof of the houseboat. It wouldn't take much to use below decks if there was a need.
More here.

 

[Art]

I run a Honda 3000i on my trailerable houseboat. I'm thinking its over 15 years old now with only plug and oil changes.
While on the road we usually run the generator all night for a/c (in Walmart parking lots). On the water it is fired up before we splash and turned off after she's back on the trailer.
It runs in an enclosure that was built to keep it out of sight while on the travel trailer tongue and again when moved to the roof of the houseboat. It wouldn't take much to use below decks if there was a need.
More here.

Hey jeffnick - Thanks for this insight. Watched the video... interesting. I'll google Honda 3000i