Lostsailor13
Senior Member
What is considered long range these days just out of curiosity
Wild ass guess...Pacific crossing potential.
Maybe I should have been more specific,lemme restate it,for a vessel to be considered a LRC how many miles should she be able to steam on her own fuel reserves
Vessels fall into two categories.
Can cross oceans
Cannot cross oceans.
Beyond that fuel range is frankly unimportant.
Why???
The two farthest places in North America between fuel availability are Yakutat Alaska to Cordova Alaska and Turtle Bay Baja Mexico to Cabo.
Both are in the 300NM range.
So... If you can make 300NM safely you can go anywhere.
.
What ya got for tankage? Fuel burn at cruising speed?
I'd be willing to bet the your Willard is a LOOOONG range cruiser. They took that 30' Willard to Bermuda. That's long range, fer sure!
What ya got for tankage? Fuel burn at cruising speed?
I'd be willing to bet the your Willard is a LOOOONG range cruiser. They took that 30' Willard to Bermuda. That's long range, fer sure!
500 gallons at 7.5 knts burning 2 gph,if I pull her back to 6knts just over 1gph at that speed with 500 gallons in favorable conditions should give me 3000 mile range plus maybe closer to 3500
A funny side note: our boat has about 170 gallons of diesel tankage, giving it an approximately 400 mile range at 12 kt cruising speed in good weather and it says " passage maker" right on the side, from the manufacturer!
Call it what you want! Those Willards are a sweet ride
Beyond that fuel range is frankly unimportant.
Why???
The two farthest places in North America between fuel availability are Yakutat Alaska to Cordova Alaska and Turtle Bay Baja Mexico to Cabo.
Both are in the 300NM range.
So... If you can make 300NM safely you can go anywhere.
Careful here - first, minor correction it's at least 700 nms from Ensenada to Cabo with the leg from Turtle Bay to Cabo just over 400 nms. Second, fuel at Turtle Bay is via a panga (Enrique) famous for being a mixture of 98% diesel and 2% mystery sludge; and for seeking breathtankgly high price for the pleasure. On the plus side, nice guy, nice family, and they'll pickup your trash. I would consider this an emergency or convenience stop only.
As a past delivery skipper out of San Francisco, I played these mind games for keeps for a living. Can a boat with 400 nm range get delivered the 4500 nms from Florida to California? On paper, yes - stretch from Cancun to Key West is just under 400 nms. Can it be done "safely?" Not to my tastes and tolerance - it means total reliance on accuracy of weather forecast, and means you're stopping for fuel ten times in places like Honduras and Nicaragua, neither of which I would consider safe. Best option would be to add barrels or bladder tank to increase range to at least 700 nms and you're still doing a meet-and-greet with Enrique and his family, especially if you're headed north into the prevailing "Baja Bash" weather.
I've long advocated for a term "Coastal Passagemaking" where a boat is equipped for serious weather within a 3-day zone of reasonably reliable weather forecasting, and carries enough fuel so the voyage isn't a tavern-to-tavern run of fuel stops in pretty rough commercial ports. For me, that means 1500 nms of range at normal cruise speed - San Diego to Acapulco is 1500 nms so you can dawdle all you want along the way, avoid the trappings of Cabo for La Paz, or just head to Mazatlan (which is actually about the same distance from Cabo as La Paz).
Peter
Of you need fuel, Enrique in turtle Bay can get it done. Won't be pretty, won't be fast, won't be cheap. And frankly, fuel there has had reports of crud. But if you are in need of fuel, it's doable.There is a Huge difference between need and want. You Need fuel to get to the next fuel stop.
You might want fuel to be able to bypass fuel stops, but you certainly do not need it.
Being a ex delivery captain you will also understand that as a delivery captain your job was to deliver a boat from point A to point B as quickly as possible, in a safe manner. Frankly that is not normal recreational cruising, that is a delivery cruise.
I, my self have made the 1500NM trip multiple times from Washington to Southcentral Alaska, every one being a "delivery" trip. I long for the day whan I can do it as just a cruiser. Take more time, see the sights, decide on weather not based on safety, but the tighter standard of comfort.
That style of cruising makes coastal regions anywhere in at least North America, and yes central America I suppose open to most of our cruising boats. Yes this is not taking into account geopolitical instability that might occur regionally in central America but it's a start.
I have never been to Turtle Bay but hope to in 2022. I have heard that fuel is expensive there but at least it's available, and the organizers of the CUBAR event must recognize it's suitability for use, as it is a fuel stop for them. Actually someone I know did the CUBAR rally last year in pretty much my same model boat.
Of you need fuel, Enrique in turtle Bay can get it done. Won't be pretty, won't be fast, won't be cheap. And frankly, fuel there has had reports of crud. But if you are in need of fuel, it's doable.
If you simply want fuel, bypass and head to the fuel dock in Cabo 400nms further.
Im not saying it can't be done, I'm just saying serious coastal cruising can't be done with 300 nm range without adding tankage. And it's a much different trip with even 400 nm range - constantly searching for the next fuel dock, hoping it's open, has staff, has electricity, and the fuel is relatively clean. And then you have to climb uphill into prevailing weather to go home.
So yea, I kept a delivery pace because I enjoyed it and because that's what I was paid to do. But especially if I were to dawdle and seek out anchorages, I'd especially want the additional range as that gives freedom to go places.
Ksanders, you have a beautiful boat - really a gem. If I had that boat, I'd do the trip too. I knew a guy with a Uniflite 48 CPMY with 500 g diesel (at least 600 nm range at 7.5 kts) and had a great time over a 2 year period headed down as far as Acapulco and back to SF. Worked out fine. But this type of trip was not the use case these boats were built for. So you have to adapt. I personally like long runs and view refueling as a necessary evil, sort of like headed to the dentist. For me, I want (note "want") 1500 nms but my intended cruising grounds are a bit more remote than others (central America and Mexico). But someone else may be fine with less, a lot less. Less than about 600-700 starts to get a little cramped and alters the trip.
Peter
I agree - too many people overthink the boat and it keeps them from heading off. With a small investment in weather tools and some very achievable skills in forecasting, a lot of boats can venture very long distances even without extreme tankage.Thanks Peter! I have a safe range of 600NM, but tend to err on the side of caution, also realizing that every day on the hook takes precious fuel.
I fully agree that my boat was not necessarily designed for extended cruising, but it works, it's what I have, and I am not in a position to buy a higher dollar boat without trading years of my limited lifespan to buy it. So... I will have to make the best of it.
I suppose that is the point I was trying to make, but I'm not too good at wording things.
Folks dreaming need to think realistically about their cruising lifespan. They need to look at their finances realistically, and their age realistically knowing that the clock is ticking. At some point many of us have to make a choice, work longer for a more capable boat, risking never going cruising, or...
Use the boat they have, or can buy, maximizing it's potential through prudent decisions.
We all dream of a new Nordhavn but most of us cannot ever buy one, so if we really want to cruise we do it in a decent boat and make it work.
BTW, I love the Willards and would have bought willard 40 that a friend owned if the wife would have let me.