Thanks for the reply. Lots of questions. Some I have thought about and didn't include in my first post for whatever reason, and some I hadn't thought about. As I am really hoping for some good advice here, I'll try to answer the concerns as best I can.
Marin wrote:
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syf350 wrote:
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So, with the above info, and a 200K budget, what do you buy?
Rather than write something new I'm going to copy and paste a reply I gave to someone who asked the same basic*question quite awhile ago-- what kind of trawler should I get?* It's long answer*(like most of my crap) so other forum members should skip it.* But you might get something out of it.*
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I suggest you approach selecting a trawler the way you would a computer. Figure out what applications you want to run, then find out which computer will best run them.
So for now, forget about boat brands. First define everything you want to do with a trawler.
Looking to live aboard (fulltiming is the expression us RVers use), travel the ICW and parts or all of the loop getting our sea legs. Then hopefully on to Caribbean, Bahamas, and island hopping.
How many people to you want or need to accommodate? How often will you have guests?* Will there be kids, grandkids, friends' kids involved?*
It will be just us the majority of the time. I have a 14 year old son who lives with his mother. My step son is 21 and just made us grandparents about 6 months ago. We both have siblings with spouses. I am sure between all of these people we will look forward to having them with us for a few days here and there when they can afford the time, but ultimately don't need to plan a boat around having guests. Funny side note. Our second RV was a fifth wheel that had bunks in it. Between the bunks, convertible dinette, and futon style couch, the listing was to sleep 11 people. 11 is kind of ridiculous, but 7 was doable. We found that having the space meant we had more friends wanting to use the space. When we got into our motor home, we only have the fold out couch and less people try to impose in coming along. We have had a couple on the couch and maybe one person on the floor, all with only one bathroom. It seems to work out fine. So if we have to put guests in less that immaculate accommodations, it doesnt break our heart.
Where are you going to cruise?
Answered above. If all works well and we don't want the journey to end, I could see the Panama Canal, Alaska, etc. My wife is leary of the blue water, and to be honest, my biggest fear is being pirated.
Do you want to live aboard full time?
Yes
What kind of galley do you want, electric or propane?
Don't know the pro's and cons of either. We are on our 4th RV and all have been propane.
How many heads do you need?
We have always gotten by with only one, so a second would be a luxury, and not something we would mind having.
Is the climate where you''re going to boat conducive to spending time outside or is it rainy more often than not?
Hopefully the climate will be nice! Another side note. We have a 40' RV now that we absolutely love. With the slides out it is very roomy. I can count on teh fingers of one hand how many times I have actually sat at the dining table, or on the couch to watch TV. We entertain ourselves outside mostly. I tease my wife that we could get a small bumper pull RV that has a kitchen, bathroom and bed and thats all we would need. W basically only sleep and shower inside. The rest of the time we are outside under the awning. Having said that, a nice cockpit is a must, and I really like the large flybridges that have plenty of seating. I also like the cockpits that we can walk out of at dock level, and that are open. I don't want to have to climb a ladder from a swim platform up to the cockpit. Stairs maybe, but I have seen some that literally have a ladder to go up and over the transom.
How is your mobility, and how do you expect it to be in the future? (In other words, how adept are you at climbing stairs or ladders?)
I'm 39 (though I fractured 3 vertebrae a few months ago) but get around fine. Ladders don't scare me, though I'd rather steps. Just personal preference
What are the docks like in the area(s) you anticiapte cruising? Is easy deck access (low freeboard) or a full walkaround deck (or both) important or not?
No Clue
Will you ever be single-handing the boat?
No plan to be on it by myself.
(This can help define the ease of deck and dock access.)* How much time will you have to get from Point A to Point B? Will you need a relatively fast boat or will a slow boat suit you okay?
As much time as it takes. Definitely will not be on anyone's schedule but our own. Slow is just fine.
Are you going to spend most of your nights at docks in marinas and the like, or are you going to be anchoring out most of the time? (This will help determine the boat's electrical needs, like a generator.)* How often will you be using the boat's dinghy?* Will you ever have to launch it by yourself?* (This determines how easy it needs to be to launch it unless you elect to tow it.)
In the RV world we call it dry-docking, when we are without powr and hook ups. Most of what we do is like that. I would imagine we would like to be on the hook more often than not, but also will probably docking till we get comfortable with it all. Definitely do not want to tow the dinghy. Would rather it be up and out of the way.
And on and on and on.
Once you have asked and answered every question you can think of, the answers will largely define what sort of boat you're after.
On top of this, of course, is what sort of boat you like from an aesthetic aspect. Not much point in getting a boat that meets all your requirements but has a design that, to you, sort of sucks. I see a lot of boats in our marina that would fill our requirements, but I look at them and think, "What the hell was the designer thinking? And who in their right mind would buy such an ugly thing?" Actually, I find myself saying that a lot--- I have very specific aesthetic requirements and most production boat brands don't some anywhere near meeting them. In fact there are only four that do.
I am willing to sacrifice some functionality or objective-requirement-meeting for aesthetics. Other people don't seem to care what the boat looks like as long as it meets their objective requirements. For example, they will happily buy what to me is a staggeringly ugly boat that is staggeringly ugly because it has a ton of interior space. But I think it's important that you like whatever boat you choose on a gut level or you'll never be happy with it no matter how well it meets your objective requirements.
I have to admit, the lines and tinted windows of the convertibles and fishing style boats are very attractive to me, but so are the trawlers and full displacement hulls. I could go either way for the right boat.
One last thing.* [The original poster] said in a previous post, ".... maybe up to a 42'."* A piece of boat buying advice I first saw as a little kid in a story in Boy's Life magazine a long, long time ago and never forgotten is..... "Buy the smallest boat you can afford."* This was given by the main character in the story to another fellow who wanted to buy a boat but knew nothing about them.
What this means is that for x-amount of dollars, the smaller a boat you buy, the better shape it will be in, or the newer it will be, which usually amounts to the same thing.* If you have x-amount of dollars and buy the biggest boat you can find for that amount, it will be older or in worse condition than the smaller boat.
This does NOT mean to buy a boat that is too small for your requirements.* Which is why it's important to define all your requirements very carefully and very objectively.* If you find that a 42' boat better meets your boating requirements, then get a 42' boat.* But if you find that a 36' boat, or even a 32' boat, meets your boating requirements, spending your x-amount of dollars on a boat that size will almost always get you a boat in better shape, needs less work, etc. than if you spend that same x-dollars on a larger boat.
Soon after we bought our GB36 we both began wishing we'd bought a GB42 or, even better in our minds, a GB46.* Since we have to walk past the GB dealer's dock every time we go to our boat, it was easy to convince ourselves that bigger was better.* At one point we came very close to trading up to a GB46. Today, having lived with a GB36 for twelve years now, we would not want a boat one inch longer unless money was absolutely no factor whatsoever in which case we'd buy a Fleming.* The GB36 has proved perfect for our needs in the waters that we cruise in.* We have learned that neither of us wants the additional work of maintaining one inch more of boat.* (If we could afford a Fleming we could afford to have someone else maintain it.)
So it can be beneficial to keep that rule in mind---- Buy the smallest boat you can afford.
That has definitely crossed my mind, and I figured newer would be more hassle free. Apparently after doing some reading on this and other forums, that's not always the case. a sound reliable boat is what is needed.
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To the above I will add that you should not forget to take into account ownership cost in your calculations.* By which I mean moorage, insurance, registration fees if*your state has them, fuel, propane if you use it,*electricity, servicing,*maintenance, repairs, modifications, and upgrades.* If you are financing*the boat*your boat payments are not considered to be part of the ownership costs, at least not in discussions I've seen about them.
The VERY rough rule of thumb for calculating ownership cost is ten percent of the purchase price (some people prefer value) of the boat per year for as long as you own the boat.* Some years it will be less, some years it will be more, maybe much more if you have to have major work done--- new prop shaft(s), motor mounts, exhaust systems, major surgery on the structure to fix a leak, whatever.* But over time that ten percent per year figure seems to be pretty accurate.* You can help keep ownership costs as low as possible by doing as much of the work on your boat as you can, but that will depend on your ability, capability, and willingness to take on these kinds of tasks.* Some people like doing it and have a talent for it, other people hire almost everything out.* We do everything we can ourselves but hire out the critical stuff, like engine work (but not routine servicing), exhaust work,*prop shaft replacement, etc.
So don't forget about ownership costs or you could be in for a*nasty surprise when you get the boat and the bills start rolling in.* Trust me, they never stop and the only thing that makes them bearable is the enjoyment you're getting from the boat.* We filled two*of our five fuel tanks*on Saturday and the*bill was $500 and change.* Fuel used to be a minor*component of ownership costs and it still is, but it's not as minor as it used to be.* After 12 years we're not surprised by this sort of thing anymore*but it can rock someone who's new*to power boating back on their heels a bit.
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noted...thanks!
Which is why it's real important to get the right boat for the right reasons.
-- Edited by Marin on Monday 13th of September 2010 10:14:32 PM
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