Victron Cerbo GX issues (Solved!)

[slowgoesit]

I have a Cerbo GX in my my setup, I haven't had any issues and getting 3 bad units defies the odds. I'd echo DDW to look carefully at the power harness. The wires terminate with ferrules that are clamped with screws in the connecting header. I'd check those and the receiving pins on the GX. It sounds like a connection issue. BTW, I'm at POYC and available if you'd like another set of eyes.
Keith

Keith, I appreciate your response, and willingness to assist. I've been chasing other alligators recently, but will get back to the Cerbo issue, hopefully in the next few days.
Scot

 

[slowgoesit]

@Slowgoesit;
I passed on this thread to Victron. Here is the response from M Vader:

Hi, indeed we’ve had an issue with the power supply design in the Cerbo GX. Which causes a dead unit, usually upon install or quickly thereafter. Very system specific: in some systems one after the other fails; and in other systems no issue it all.
Affected serialnumbers are from HQ2201xxxxx up and including HQ2220xxxx.
The second one, which worked for a while, then suddenly quit is SN: HQ2214R2XXX. The 3rd, and most recent one, which was DOA out of the box is SN: HQ22166DXXX. Both SN's are in the suspect SN range you posted.

So far, both field returns as well as our own analysis didn't point to 12V being affected. But its hard to rule it out completely.

Anyway, we'll get this solved, and do all that's possible to make sure that the fourth (..!) one you'll receive works well. Your distributor, Battleborn / Dragonfly, is a very capable one. We'll get in touch with them and help get this sorted.

All the best and my apologies for the troubles getting to a reliable system!

Matthijs Vader
Victron Energy BV

Charlie, if it’s not betraying a confidence, how did you contact Matthijs Vader direct? When I contacted Victron with the only address I could come up with, their response was less than helpful. If you would care to share your e-mail contact info for Mr. Vader with me via PM, I would really appreciate it!


Also, just to be clear, Ron at Battleborn has been extremely helpful with another issue I had, with the 100/30 smart solar charge controllers. Mine wouldn’t work properly, turned I had to do some gyrations that Ron walked me through with the setup, gyrations which were in no way included in the paperwork that came with the controllers! They have worked flawlessly for me since I installed them in April of last year. I appreciate the validation from Victron that these units have had problems. Frankly, I stopped calling Battleborn because I was having a difficult time believing that three units in a row were bad. I would still appreciate contact info for Mr. Vader, but it looks like I need to contact Battleborn again tomorrow.
Scot
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[slowgoesit]

Matthijs is very helpful if you can get his attention. It would be interesting to know if the serial numbers of the units in question are in that batch.

I have had one issue with the Cerbo: I put in a certain type of LED replacement bulb. Whenever I switched it on, it would reset the Cerbo. I did not try ferrites or whatever in the LED power line, there was a lot of wire between the two, but it does suggest some conducted EM susceptibility of the Cerbo supply. No other equipment on the boat caused it.

Yep, the SN's are apparently in the affected batch per the last post. Let's face it, hooking up the Cerbo GX is pretty simple, at least to the extent I've used it so far. I just couldn't figure out how I could have possibly goofed it up!

Thanks for the input!

 

[slowgoesit]

Just getting caught up. I've had issues with my Victron MPPT controllers. Bluetooth dies, although the indicator lights seem go show they are operational. But I can't validate any settings without Bluetooth or a dedicated monitor as suggested by someone else on another forum.

Victron tech support is non-existent. Someday someone may respond to my Community post, but that's BS to have to wait days for a (maybe) response that may need a followup question.

I'm not sure what direction I'll go - considering replacing the MPPTs with ones that have a basic display screen, perhaps remotely mounted screen. I purposefully avoided Victron for Inverter because Magnum is hardwired, albeit a bit old school with the LCD display. I just don't want multiple networks floating around the boat.

SlowGoesIt - I feel your pain. Very frustrating. Best of luck.

Peter

Peter, I just wish I had documented the steps that Ron had me go through for my Victron MTTP controllers! I'll probably need that info for the two new controllers I purchased recently (adding two more panels).

 

[Insequent]

Peter, I just wish I had documented the steps that Ron had me go through for my Victron MTTP controllers! I'll probably need that info for the two new controllers I purchased recently (adding two more panels).

I think you outlined it on the thread at the time? I know I posted in that thread with the steps I took. I do recall it being important to disconnect power from the device completely (wires out !) and allow some time for internal memory to decay/degrade before re-connecting Those MPPT things are pretty bullet-proof really.....

 

[mvweebles]

I think you outlined it on the thread at the time? I know I posted in that thread with the steps I took. I do recall it being important to disconnect power from the device completely (wires out !) and allow some time for internal memory to decay/degrade before re-connecting Those MPPT things are pretty bullet-proof really.....

i hope you're right. I'll try disconnecting everything in the next day or two and see if it revives.

I'm not always the best at reading manuals, but this manual is pretty short - Troubleshooting is pretty much "Are you in range?" type of questions.

That said, I did some more sleuthing on the Victron Community tech support and found someone with roughly the same issue. A Victron employee was quite responsive and provided this guidance to someone:

When you have a VE.Direct USB cable, you can a laptop (or android phone using USB-OTG/USB-C cable) to the VE.Direct port of the SmartSolar, run VictronConnect on the laptop/phone/tablet (windows/MacOS/Android) and VictronConnect will connect to the SmartSolar via the VE.Direct USB cable. Then in the "Product info" menu of the SmartSolar (Settings->three dots top right corner->Product info), there is a toggle "Bluetooth enabled". With this you can switch the Bluetooth off and on again. I was wondering if this makes the SmartSolar visible via Bluetooth again. But this requires a VE.Direct USB cable.​

Here is the adapter cable. Much as I'm at-risk of throwing good money after bad, I may give this a try. Easier than disconnecting cables when it happens.

I'm sure glad technology has given me back so much time in my life......

Peter

 

[Insequent]

Peter
Before ordering the cable be sure there is somewhere to plug it into. I do have Victron cables as I have had a BluePowerPanel then upgraded to a Colour Control. That was a backward step as there is basically no "control" whereas the old BPP had cascading menus to let you drill down into everything on the device AND change settings. Hence I got the cable. I would gain very little by getting a Cerbo so have not done it.

However, I seem to remember when working on the Smart Solar MPPT's that there was nowhere to plug a cable into. I might be wrong, it was a while ago now. I'v got 4of them. With absolutely no wires connected to them for 10 minutes I started connecting wires according to their instructions, one unit at a time. And voila, all working, put onto same network and talking to each other & my phone.... Slowgoesit's old thread might have more detail.

 

[rslifkin]

Peter
Before ordering the cable be sure there is somewhere to plug it into. I do have Victron cables as I have had a BluePowerPanel then upgraded to a Colour Control. That was a backward step as there is basically no "control" whereas the old BPP had cascading menus to let you drill down into everything on the device AND change settings. Hence I got the cable. I would gain very little by getting a Cerbo so have not done it.

However, I seem to remember when working on the Smart Solar MPPT's that there was nowhere to plug a cable into. I might be wrong, it was a while ago now. I'v got 4of them. With absolutely no wires connected to them for 10 minutes I started connecting wires according to their instructions, one unit at a time. And voila, all working, put onto same network and talking to each other & my phone.... Slowgoesit's old thread might have more detail.

The Smartsolar models I've seen (including my 100/30s) have a VE.Direct port to connect to.



For control, nowadays you gain some control from a GX device. Not directly through the menus, but you can connect the phone app to the GX device (either through bluetooth, being on the same wifi network, or remotely through the VRM portal) and use it to configure the connected devices without having to bluetooth to each one individually.



Another nice thing about combining the MPPTs with a GX device and a SmartShunt (or BMV) is that you can use shared current sense. So then instead of the MPPTs only knowing their own output current, they know the actual current going into the batteries and can use that as the end absorb trigger for better charging. Now if only Victron would update the charging algorithm on the Multiplus to support ending absorb based on amps, I'd be happy.

 

[mvweebles]

I'm hesitant, but am pretty sure I'll go the Cerbo/Touch/SmartShunt route. Based on someone's recommendation (and firmly echoed by others), I gave PKYS in Annapois MD a call to make sure they would support the entire system (including my existing MPPTs) if I purchased the Cerbo system from them. Peter Kennedy (the "PK" in PKYS) assured me they would but if it came to any warranty issues with the MPPTs, I would need to go throught the original dealer. PKYS appears to have a decent support portal.

Moral of the story is choice of Victron is compelling but you have to closely scrutinize who you purchase from. In effect, the warranty is from the provider, not Victron. Not just replacement, but integration - if you purchase multiple Victron components from differing suppliers, you risk having zero support to integrate the system. Victron provides near-zero support directly to the customer and makes great efforts to distance themselves from customer support.

I will say this another way: If you think going all-Victron avoids fingerpointing and can price-shop each component in the system, you are fine as long as everything works. If you need help on any one component, you will need to go to whomever you purchased it from. If you need help diagnosing the entire system, you're at serious risk.

No doubt, bears little resemblance to car warranty model.

Peter

 

[bkcorwin]

PKYS was knowledgable, but in my case, they were the vendor who told me to post on the community forum. Admittedly, its a non standard issue that feels like some kind of a firmware issue. But still, it never went anywhere past, post on community forum.

I'm hesitant, but am pretty sure I'll go the Cerbo/Touch/SmartShunt route. Based on someone's recommendation (and firmly echoed by others), I gave PKYS in Annapois MD a call to make sure they would support the entire system if I purchased the Cerbo system from them. Peter Kennedy (the "PK" in PKYS) assured me they would but if it came to any warranty issues, I would need to go throught the original dealer. PKYS appears to have a decent support portal.

Moral of the story is choice of Victron is compelling but you have to closely scrutinize who you purchase from. In effect, the warranty is from the provider, not Victron. Not just replacement, but integration - if you purchase multiple Victron components from differing suppliers, you risk having zero support to integrate the system. Victron provides near-zero support directly to the customer and makes great efforts to distance themselves from customer support.

No doubt, bears little resemblance to car warranty model.

Peter

 

[mvweebles]

PKYS was knowledgable, but in my case, they were the vendor who told me to post on the community forum. Admittedly, its a non standard issue that feels like some kind of a firmware issue. But still, it never went anywhere past, post on community forum.

Ughhh....

Any suggestions on how to avoid having a bunch of boxes vs an integrated system? My experience with Renogy was even worse as they don't even have a dealer network. Stuff is fine if it works. If it doesn't, you're screwed. Seems like an odd way to do business.

Peter

 

[rslifkin]

If PKYS (or any other dealer) can't figure out an issue, they should be able to escalate to Victron for help. If dealers aren't doing that, I'm not sure why.

 

[bkcorwin]

The benefit of Victron, despite their cs model, is that in general the products work. You're one of the first i've heard of having issues with the mppts.

This is in contrast to say the skylla-I series chargers where I know several people who have had issues with them.

The products are overall good. Its why despite the issues I have cerbo, 2 quattros, two skylla ip65s, bmvs, smart shunts.

That said, I am comfortable doing my own systems integration so the lack of vendor support isn't a huge deal and I accept likely good products with bad CS over bad products.

Ughhh....

Any suggestions on how to avoid having a bunch of boxes vs an integrated system? My experience with Renogy was even worse as they don't even have a dealer network. Stuff is fine if it works. If it doesn't, you're screwed. Seems like an odd way to do business.

Peter

 

[mvweebles]

I'm generally okay doing my own system stuff too. I am familiar with Victron - I've done a couple other systems including a decent sized off-grid system for a friend in Wyoming. All went well. This is however my first encounter with an issue. All is not well.

The online Victron Community has several references to Bluetooth issues including the MPPT. Where there's a response, along the lines of "upgrade the firmware" but no suggestion how to do that if you can't connect. Would be like calling my mechanic to say 'my car won't start' and she (really) responds 'bring it in and we'll have a look.' Most suggestions point to the phone/tablet as the culprit, not Victron.

Rslifkin - I can think of many reasons why a dealer doesn't escalate. Or maybe they do but don't get a response. But you're right - tough to know because it's a Star Chamber conversation without the buyer in the room. As Deepthroat famously said "Follow the Money." My guess is there's a financial reason the dealer/Victron's interests are not aligned with the consumer.

Peter

 

[rslifkin]

On firmware updates, devices connected to a Cerbo (or other GX device) can also get firmware updates pushed that way. You can trigger it remotely from the VRM portal (it's not automatic for good reasons).

 

[mvweebles]

On firmware updates, devices connected to a Cerbo (or other GX device) can also get firmware updates pushed that way. You can trigger it remotely from the VRM portal (it's not automatic for good reasons).

You do understand that the Cerbo + Touch + Cables bundle is in excess of $600? Seems like a steep price to pay just to upgrade firmware. "Have a problem? Easy solution - buy more Victron! That will [probably] solve it!"

BTW - my firmware is no more than 4-months old. Not talking multi-generations of Rev's behind.

Peter

 

[rslifkin]

You do understand that the Cerbo + Touch + Cables bundle is in excess of $600? Seems like a steep price to pay just to upgrade firmware. "Have a problem? Easy solution - buy more Victron! That will [probably] solve it!"

BTW - my firmware is no more than 4-months old.

Peter

Oh yeah, it's not a cheap solution. Definitely not worth it just for firmware updates and such, only if you want to take advantage of the other functionality it gives you. Technically you don't need the display though, pretty much everything can be done via the VRM portal or the phone app talking to the Cerbo. I have the display just because I like having an actual display for battery status and such.

 

[bkcorwin]

Yeah the cerbo gives you a lot of functionality. The real bad one is the victron "canusb" device. It's like 500-600 dollars for a dongle to do firmware upgrades. So the cerbo over that is an absolute bargain....

Oh yeah, it's not a cheap solution. Definitely not worth it just for firmware updates and such, only if you want to take advantage of the other functionality it gives you. Technically you don't need the display though, pretty much everything can be done via the VRM portal or the phone app talking to the Cerbo. I have the display just because I like having an actual display for battery status and such.

 

[slowgoesit]

I e-mailed Mr. Vader the following:

Mr. Vader. I recently posted a query on Trawler Forum regarding some difficulties I have been having with my Victron Cerbo GX. Below is a reply I received from a fellow Trawler Forum member; Charlie Johnson, an ABYC Master Technician on January 9th, who forwarded my predicament to you. Per his posting of your reply, at least two of the Cerbo GX units I've purchased, which failed, one after a short time in use, and the third, and last, which was dead on arrival fall in the Serial Number range of units you state have had problematic power supplies.
Roni at Battleborn Batteries, whom I purchased 6 Victron 100/30 Smart Solar Controllers, the Cerbo GX, Touch Screen 50, and BMV-712 Smart Battery Monitor from (I also have two additional Smart Controllers, a Victron Isolation Transformer, a Victron Quattro 5000, and a Victron 24v Battery Charger, purchased from other sources) was very helpful assisting me in getting my system up and running, but he was apparently at a loss as to why I have had multiple Cerbo GX failures.

I returned the first failed unit to Battleborn, and unfortunately do not have the Serial Number. After the last Cerbo GX Battleborn sent turned out to be non-functional, brand new out of the box, I kind of gave up on the Cerbo GX, relying solely on my phone through the other Victron devices as a source of Battery information. I am now in the process of wanting to hook up other features on my boat, such as bilge high water alarm, temperature alarms, etc. I would like to take one more crack at getting a functioning Cerbo GX before I explore other options. I've attached a link to the thread I started on Trawler Forum below:

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s4/victron-cerbo-gx-issues-66521-2.html

My issue is explained in my original post # 1.
Charlie Johnson's reply, after communicating with you is post # 35.
In post # 62 I posted the Serial Numbers of failed units 2 and 3. The complete serial numbers are as follows: The second one, which worked for a while, then suddenly quit is SN: HQ2214T2DV7. The 3rd, and most recent one, which was DOA out of the box is SN: HQ22166DVNG.

I would really like to get this issue resolved. Would it be possible for you to address this situation? I also attempted to contact Roni at Battleborn again today, leaving him a voicemail, to see if you have been in communication with him, but have not yet received a reply. Thank you for your time.




Me: To all the TF members who have responded in the post, I sincerely appreciate it. With the exception of the Cerbo GX, we have been been very satisfied with the Victron products we've purchased, however, I DO wish that Victron itself would deal directly with the end consumer with regards to warranty issues. Battleborn and PKYS are two reliable vendors selling their equipment, but there are others out there who's knowledge of the equipment they sell is limited to charging your credit card.

I'll update this when if/when I get more information. Take care, Scot

 

[twistedtree]

I see that the last two Cerbos are within the range of defective serial numbers. I suspect to key to fixing this will be to have Battleborn purge their inventory and send you a device outside the defective range.

 

[slowgoesit]

Follow-up:

Based on posts by TwistedTree (# 18) and Charlie Johnson (# 35), this morning I e-mailed Mr. Matthijs Vader at Victron Energy, outlining my predicament. I also called and left a voicemail with Battleborn Batteries.

Mr. Vader called me this afternoon (Pacific Standard Time) from the Netherlands and we spoke for some time.

• Bottom line, Victron has had issues with the Cerbo GX power supply failing either immediately upon install, or shortly after install on SOME BOATS.
• The issue is mostly prevalent on boats with 48v battery systems. The acceptable input voltage for the Cerbo GX, per the Victron manual is 8v to 70v. Apparently, IN SOME BOATS, there may exist certain conditions (not stipulated) which can/will cause the Cerbo GX to immediately fail, or fail after a short time.
• The intermediate "field" fix, as detailed in the video referenced in TT's post # 18, was to install a capacitor of the correct size in the power supply cord which will help to dampen potential problems. This only works if the capacitor is installed prior to the unit ever being connected. It will not correct the problem after the unit has failed.
• Newer Cerbo GX models were redesigned to include the aforementioned capacitor incorporated within the housing of the unit.
• The latest (third generation) Cerbo GX model also had a redesigned circuit board which will hopefully lay to rest al these issues

Problem: All of the Cerbo GX currently in inventory in the US are apparently in the SN range that are problematic.
Battleborn confirmed that all the Cerbo GX they have in the warehouse fall into the problematic SN range.
Battleborn is sending me one of the "problematic" units and I will source and install the capacitor on my own. It appears they are available for as little as $0.83 each . . . plus $12.99 shipping. Whatever, it's a small price to pay if it fixes the problem.
PLUS Rich of Victron US is going to ship me one of the improved models (I believe it will come from overseas, so will take longer) so I will have it on hand in the event the one from Battleborn doesn't correct the problem, or it fails in spite of the capacitor.
Hopefully this will solve the issues I have been having!
Once again, my thanks to all who have responded here on Trawler Forum. I would not have gotten this far without your input! Hopefully I will be writing a follow-up soon saying the problem is behind me.

 

[mvweebles]

Recall, a few hours before Slowgoesit posted, I ordered Cerbo/Touch/Shunt from PKYS. Based on this thread, I reached out to them to see if a capacitor should be proactively installed prior to system start-up.

The Cerbo GX is one of our best selling items. We sold over 130 in the last 6 months of 2022 and not one of them reported this problem. Admittedly very few of them were in 48 volt system​

I'll keep my fingers crossed that all goes well. Given my experience and revelations about Victron support in this thread, I'm a bit nervous.....

Sloegoesit - many, many thanks for transparently working through this. And being patient with my slight thread-tangents. Has been very helpful.

Peter

 

[slowgoesit]

Follow-up:


Roni at Battleborn sent me a new Cerbo GX, but, as discussed, it is one of the "problematic" serial numbers. I purchased the capacitors and soldered them in per the video poster earlier (pic attached). Hooked up the unit, and so far, all's well! Shout out to Charlie Johnson who got me on track, Matthijs Vader of Victron who took his personal time to respond and get the ball rolling, and Roni Ventura at Battleborn who overnighted the replacement unit!

In addition, while Mr. Vader and I were having our phone conversation, he asked in closing, "So are you having any other issues with Victron products?"

Welllllll, I DID have a problem with my Victron Isolation Transformer 3600, which stopped sending power to the cooling fan . . . late last year, but since we weren't the original purchaser I didn't pursue a warranty claim. Mr. Vader stated their products are warrantied for the warranty period, the warranty is NOT specific to the original purchaser! So, I now have a brand new Isolation Transformer waiting for me to pick up at Fisheries Supply. No charge, even though I'm the 2nd owner.

I've got to tall you, my frustration with Victron has taken a complete 180. I just needed to know who to talk to!

Thanks again to all who contributed. Scot K

 

[twistedtree]

Follow-up:


Roni at Battleborn sent me a new Cerbo GX, but, as discussed, it is one of the "problematic" serial numbers. I purchased the capacitors and soldered them in per the video poster earlier (pic attached). Hooked up the unit, and so far, all's well! Shout out to Charlie Johnson who got me on track, Matthijs Vader of Victron who took his personal time to respond and get the ball rolling, and Roni Ventura at Battleborn who overnighted the replacement unit!

In addition, while Mr. Vader and I were having our phone conversation, he asked in closing, "So are you having any other issues with Victron products?"

Welllllll, I DID have a problem with my Victron Isolation Transformer 3600, which stopped sending power to the cooling fan . . . late last year, but since we weren't the original purchaser I didn't pursue a warranty claim. Mr. Vader stated their products are warrantied for the warranty period, the warranty is NOT specific to the original purchaser! So, I now have a brand new Isolation Transformer waiting for me to pick up at Fisheries Supply. No charge, even though I'm the 2nd owner.

I've got to tall you, my frustration with Victron has taken a complete 180. I just needed to know who to talk to!

Thanks again to all who contributed. Scot K

Well, talking to the president of the company will get things done, but it's not very scalable to the rest of us. Hopefully Victron will sort through this and pull together a more sustainable support model.

 

[Barking Sands]

Follow-up:

. Mr. Vader stated their products are warrantied for the warranty period, the warranty is NOT specific to the original purchaser! So, I now have a brand new Isolation Transformer waiting for me to pick up at Fisheries Supply. No charge, even though I'm the 2nd owner.

Great info considering I just bough a bunch of used stuff. Thanks for confirming.

 

[mvweebles]

Great info considering I just bough a bunch of used stuff. Thanks for confirming.

Barking Sands - I don't mean to be a wet blanket, but in my experience the issue isn't whether it's under warranty, the issue is the warranty is only honored via the company who sold the kit in the first place
Same with tech support - the Victron Forum is hit or miss. Without the original reseller, you may need Skowgoesits contact.

Peter

 

[Barking Sands]

Peter,

I saw that. But that support model still doesn't leave me out in the cold. The guy I bought it from apparently is a dealer and stated if I needed help to contact him. I thought nothing of it at the time since in my mind I am accepting all risk of course. But If something was defective...given this new knowledge...I would certainly give it a shot. Ill move forward either way.

 

[bkcorwin]

Well, talking to the president of the company will get things done, but it's not very scalable to the rest of us. Hopefully Victron will sort through this and pull together a more sustainable support model.

This is the most important part of this discussion and I'll be even more blunt.

As a result of this thread Victron has reached out to me with an offer of support dealing with my issues. I am happy that this user has gotten results. I am happy that I may get to the bottom of my issue.

I like their products. I have thousands of dollars of their products on my boat. However the take away shouldn't be Victron is good to go now. The take away should really be that this support model is a total failure. Having to rely on someones personal contact to drive enough churn to get a reaction helps no one and leaves countless people floundering.

It's not just those of us here and it's not just this thread. I've had this discussion several times before and its come up on the Nordhavn Owners Group. There has to be a way to escalate issues to a corporate entity especially when the vendors choose to leave users floundering in the community forum.

 

[twistedtree]

Peter,

I saw that. But that support model still doesn't leave me out in the cold. The guy I bought it from apparently is a dealer and stated if I needed help to contact him. I thought nothing of it at the time since in my mind I am accepting all risk of course. But If something was defective...given this new knowledge...I would certainly give it a shot. Ill move forward either way.

That's great that he's a dealer. And either way, you got a fantastic deal.

 

[twistedtree]

That's great that he's a dealer. And either way, you got a fantastic deal.

Oops, wrong Peter. Regardless, see above