Mastervolt Charger Issue

[markpj23]

I have two 12v Lithium batteries (not LiFePO) in series to power the 24v windlass & bow thruster. The charger and batteries are no more than 5 years old, installed by PO.
The battery charger is a Mastervolt 24/40-3. I have verified AC power to the charger but have dead (reading 8v on the bus) batteries. Since this model charger was designed without Lithium / LiFePO charge profiles, I assume that it was setup to use just the AGM charging profile (I need to verify DIP switch settings but AGM / FLA are the only 2 available per the manual).

The Mastervolt display will flash like the dashboard of a car when you first start it up, then go blank. It will do this about once per second for 10 seconds, then quit altogether. The green power switch light never comes on.
For their cost and reputation, there is not a lot of troubleshooting or repair info available online. And of course you have to call one of their local service dealers for any help.
Wondering if anyone has dealt with this problem before? Tricks to get this thing to reset? Or wondering if I just junk it and get a different unit? The 24/40-3 series is of course no longer sold.
Thanks in advance.

 

[twistedtree]

Not LFP? That surprises me. For me, that's all the reason I would need to get them off the boat, especially if they are malfunctioning.


Unfortunately my experience with MasterVolt is that there is zero support. Victron is just the same, except there is a much larger user community so you are more likely to find a Good Samaritan. But in my opinion, both companies are a complete failure with respect to customer support. Schluffing support off to a dealer just doesn't work, at least is doesn't work in the US. And relying on Good Samaritans is a dereliction of responsibility.

 

[Pascall]

It is indeed true that the support lies with the dealer, the fact that it does not work in the USA says more about the dealer than the manufacturer.
I don't know the problem in the Netherlands, there you get targeted support from Mastervolt/Victron, the dealer also regularly goes on refresher training to keep up, If the dealer can't figure it out, contact is made with the manufacturer.
For questions about Victron, a message on the Dutch water sports forum is worth a try, there is a lot of knowledge specifically about Victron.https://www.watersportforum.eu/portal.php

Greeting

Pascal.

 

[Pascall]

In the early years, you could call the Matervolt helpdesk directly, but back then it was still very small.
In the present time, these companies have become so large that direct assistance is no longer possible, I will not be surprised that they have 50% of the market share, which would amount to perhaps thousands of questions per day worldwide.
On the other hand, you also go to the dealer with questions about your car and not to the manufacturer.

Greetings,

Pascal.

 

[twistedtree]

It is indeed true that the support lies with the dealer, the fact that it does not work in the USA says more about the dealer than the manufacturer.
I don't know the problem in the Netherlands, there you get targeted support from Mastervolt/Victron, the dealer also regularly goes on refresher training to keep up, If the dealer can't figure it out, contact is made with the manufacturer.
For questions about Victron, a message on the Dutch water sports forum is worth a try, there is a lot of knowledge specifically about Victron.https://www.watersportforum.eu/portal.php

Greeting

Pascal.

In many ways it doesn't matter where the breakdown is, if a customer is failing with a product, then the manufacturer is also failing. So in the end, it's up to the manufacturer to put in place a process that works and ensures the success of their customers using their products.


That said, there is a big difference, it seems, between the US and Europe dealers. In the US, dealers sell stuff. That "stuff" is some combination of products and associated services like installation. If you bought from a full service dealer who also designed and installed your system, then you are likely to get some support from them, at least for a while. But support is unbillable hours, so it costs them, and most lose interest very quickly if a problem can't be solved easily.


Then there are other dealers who exclusively sell product. If you ask them a question, they go online and open the manual and start looking - something you have surely already done. They are useless for anything that isn't in the manual, and even then most can't even manage that.


And then, even if you did get everything including installation from a dealer, what happens when you are 1000+ miles away? You walk into some random dealer and ask them to help you, or to handle a product return. Good luck with that. Even if they have agreed to do that with the manufacturer, they will at least drag their feet, and many will just blow you off completely.


On the flip side, I argue that handing customer support directly is the best marketing money a company can spend. There is no better way to hear how your customers are using your products, learn what issues they are having, learn what new product opportunities you might have, and provide direct feedback into product development. It's priceless. And in addition your customers will love you because you showed you care about them instead of doing everything you can to shield yourself and hide from them.


Car dealerships aren't really a good comparison because they have 100 years of practice behind them refining the process, and a huge infrastructure training and supporting the dealers, and are big enough targets that they get sued anytime they step out of line. And I'm not sure about Europe, but in the US there are many states where cars can only be sold through dealers - it's some ancient protectionist crap.

 

[cafesport]

When our series wired lithium bank got out of sync and one of the batteries discharged below the bms floor, both batteries went offline, and they would not accept any current from our solar charge controllers.


Thinking that they were both already toast and not really having anything to lose I took them out of series and then jump started them via a 12 volt charge cycle consisting of a lead acid battery and a standard 12 volt charger. As the battery voltage reached 12 volts I removed the lead acid battery and the charger, then I performed the same procedure on the other battery.


After reconnecting them in series the solar charge controllers did the rest. In the end I wound up wiring in a battery balancer to prevent the balancing issue and all has been good ever since.


If this gets you going you might want to look into setting up the charger via their masteradjust software. It’s user programmable for any type of battery.

 

[Bmarler]

you have 8 volts on the 24 volt buss? i'd say that voltage is below a threshold for low voltage and the charger won't come on.
maybe find a stupid 24 volt charger that doesn't have low voltage cutout and bulk charge to get them in range, or as was mentioned, separate them into two 12 volt and do the same. try to get them to the same voltage before hooking back in series.

 

[markpj23]

Update: No Help From Mastervolt...

Finally well enough to dig in to this problem. Reviewing the POs paid invoices I determined that what were presented to me as Lithium batteries are actually a pair of Northstar Blue 210FT AGM units. Packaging is different from any AGM I'd ever seen so I did not question the surveyor's finding.

https://www.northstarbattery.com/product/nsb-210ft-blue

I then disconnected and removed the Mastervolt charger with the hope that I could save a few bucks by dropping it off at the service center for bench repair. Called the dealer in Sarasota that's listed on the Mastervolt dealer locator website. No service department there, just sales. Hmm... called Mastervolt tech support directly and discovered why there's no service dept.
Turns out that there are NO field replaceable components in this big, pretty, expensive charger. They do not even have part numbers for any of the internals, so even easter-egg hunt board replacement fixes are impossible. I'm gaining a greater understanding of the 'right to repair' movement.....
PO's invoice shows he paid $914 for this thing just 6 years ago. Wonder if he knew that it was a throw-away item when he sprung for the "good stuff." One thing's for sure - I will not be replacing this with another big green box...