Future Liveaboards

[OldDan1943]

Getting a Captain's license sounds like a great ideal. I took the course and passed it but, never got my sea hours. Having a license suggests great responsibility and liability. If you have the license and get t-boned by someone without a license, you sure dont want to hear the review board to say, "You have a captain's license, you should have known better." and then assign more liability because "you should have known better."

 

[Shaunc]

We spent a good time looking at boats and ended up with a 53 Hatteras.


I can not tell you how many people with newer 60ft plus boats can not get over how much space we have.


They are solid boats and we bought right and remodeled the boat from bow to stern and have never been happier with our choice.


Here are links to our sites to see more about the boat and our liveabord life style.


https://www.theboatbabe.com
https://www.weliveonthesea.com

 

[boatpoker]

you sure dont want to hear the review board to say, "You have a captain's license, you should have known better." and then assign more liability because "you should have known better."

I've been hearing this myth for decades. Can anyone provide an example ?

 

[OldDan1943]

I've been hearing this myth for decades. Can anyone provide an example ?

When the review board goes behind closed doors......

I dont know, maybe I am repeating the same ol wives tale you have heard.

 

[Airstream345]

We spent a good time looking at boats and ended up with a 53 Hatteras.


I can not tell you how many people with newer 60ft plus boats can not get over how much space we have.


They are solid boats and we bought right and remodeled the boat from bow to stern and have never been happier with our choice.


Here are links to our sites to see more about the boat and our liveabord life style.


https://www.theboatbabe.com
https://www.weliveonthesea.com

@Shaunc, thanks for posting links your blogs.

Very timely for us as we consider selling the house and moving aboard within the next couple of years. We're also looking closely at Hatteras Yachts; specifically 58 LRCs and are realizing many we are considering will require a refit so to see your before and after is inspiring.

 

[Lollygag1]

Highly recommend working with a quality broker. They can help you with entire process and help you make a good decision. Our broker sent us a list of questions that helped him narrow down the options, he then sent us some boats to consider, from there we were able to narrow down the decision to the brand and model. He was then assisted in finding the boat and helped w negotiation, survey and transport. I am sure folks on the forum can give you suggestions on brokers in your area.

 

[BandB]

What makes a blue water boat?

Wifey B: Blue paint.

 

[ncmaineac]

1 boat

Only buy 1 boat...make a list of must have and need...get rid of need buy the must.

Then after purchase stay with that boat...learn everything you can.....set a price ...then double it.


Good luck

 

[Lollygag1]

Take a class in engine maintenance.

 

[OldDan1943]

Only buy 1 boat...make a list of must have and need...get rid of need buy the must.

Then after purchase stay with that boat...learn everything you can.....set a price ...then double it.


Good luck

LOL, when I walked through the AT34, it had everything I wanted then, I bought the boat and started adding things to make it MY boat. It is about finished and have come to the conclusion, the AT34 is a tuff little boat.

 

[frankholt]

Boats are very specialized machines, not lending themselves well to multiple missions like liveaboard, ocean cruising, tropical and cold water travels. Anything you buy will be a compromise. My advice to plan, on paper your most ambitious adventure, look at the costs associated with it and make a realistic budget. At that point, you will be better equipped to shop for a boat. The majority of people who dream of cruising never leave the dock. Living aboard at a marina is a wonderful lifestyle. Which is what I am doing now on my DeFever 43 LRC. I am old now so dockside living suites me well. As a younger person, I had the fortunate opportunity to spend many years cruising over 150,000 miles on both power and sailboats. Ocean passages on a sailboat were much more fun while living at anchor or at a dock was infinitely better on a trawler.

Cruising is much more fun if you are not a slave to your vessel. Error on the side of simplicity. Complex systems require a big commitment either of your time or your time and energy finding someone to fix them. My largest cruising boat was an Alaskan 55 with two engines two generators, four airconditioning systems, water maker, etc.. It took a minimum of 20 hours a week to keep her systems maintained. All time taken away from the fun aspects of cruising. 45 years ago I did a 22,000-mile cruise on a very simple 35 foot sailboat it was great.

If you are planning to spend a lot time in marinas keep in mind longer boats cost more for dockage. Trawlers are very fuel efficient but fuel is very expensive. A large (80,000 lbs) trawler will use about one gallon per mile, while a 40,000 lbs displacement 43 footer like my DeFever will get two miles per gallon.
If you are just planning to liveaboard at the dock buy one of the old fiberglass, fuel-guzzling planning hull power boats. If you want to make ocean passages, and can afford it, buy a Nordhaven single engine full displacement trawler. You may want to consider an inexpensive "starter boat" to gain some experience and enjoy the marine lifestyle before you retire.

 

[Nightsky]

why not over 50' ?

The OP's budget for purchase is about 100K. What kind of 50 footer or bigger can you buy for that that isn't considered a "project boat"?

 

[Irish Rambler]

macarthur.
We live and tour on the French canals and cruise Europe and the Mediterranean. If you have any interest in that cruising ground I would respectfully suggest you read my blog on here called 'Windmills and Wine' or maybe buy the book off Amazon for future reference. Of course if you need any other info just ask and I'll help if I can.

frankholt has good sound advice as do many others.

If I may pitch in my two cents.
My personal opinion is that a wooden boat is worse than a bad marriage, both take all your money and are a constant nightmare for the tiny amount of pleasure they give you.

Before you buy any boat several basic things have the greatest impact on your future enjoyment, once you've decided on those you can keep narrowing down your search to identify your primary choice.
Open a file and start to build a checklist.

1, Choose the hull shape to suit your future cruising grounds.

2, Check how deep your wallet is for purchase price.

3, Allow for the price of personal updates. In my own example we bought a s/h hire-boat for 49.5k Euro and have spent approx. 8k updating.

4, Running costs, fuels not getting cheaper (twin engines=thirsty) insurance, moorings.

5, Family circumstance change over time and often people buy a boat to cater for children/visitors and find that they drift away over time.

6,Can you live in close proximity with your partner 24/7 in a relatively small area ? It takes a strong loving relationship to survive and prosper.

Good hunting, we look forward to your progress.

 

[mcarthur]

macarthur.
We live and tour on the French canals and cruise Europe and the Mediterranean. If you have any interest in that cruising ground I would respectfully suggest you read my blog on here called 'Windmills and Wine' or maybe buy the book off Amazon for future reference. Of course if you need any other info just ask and I'll help if I can.

frankholt has good sound advice as do many others.

If I may pitch in my two cents.
My personal opinion is that a wooden boat is worse than a bad marriage, both take all your money and are a constant nightmare for the tiny amount of pleasure they give you.
...

Thanks IR. I have been following your exploits for a while. While not the OP, we have some high level similarities, although we already have our boat (aluminium, not wood!).

We definitely have plans for the French canals, Belgium, Netherlands and the Med. Our boat is purposely narrow enough for the French canals. The air height is a slight problem with the targa, but nothing a grinder won't solve (true!). We won't be able to do the Canal du Midi though - Capestang would do us in! We will join the DBA and UK version as well when we're closer.
We like your writing style and how you bring the history in as well, something that's very important and interesting to us.

Back to the OP and their thread...

 

[vtmackey]

If I may reiterate.

1. Charter (get out on the water)
2. Now think of the boat
3. When boating have humility

4. When in doubt follow a bigger boat
5. The other guy has right of way
Like so many things in life the dream is half the fun. Joe

 

[Irish Rambler]

Thank you for your kind comments mccarthur.
I read many accounts of others travels before I started doing blogs on TF and I felt that to dash from place to place without taking in the ambience of the area we were passing through you may as well go by train.
From past experience of canals is that if you don't use it you'll lose it, so I try to encourage others to enjoy it too.

Max boat width is 4.80 metres width (locks are 5 metres).

As for Capestang bridge, Carcassonne, canal du Robine bridges check your height over width before taking out the angle 10 grinder as the bridges are arched.
I pass through (carefully) with 2.45 metres with a bit of room to spare (10 cms).
I also keep the water and fuel tanks full to help.
You can also by pass Capestang by going out to the Med at Grau du Agde and back in at Port La Nouvelle.

 

[DaleP]

That is my plan also. In May I went up to Anacortes WA for training with Anacortes Yachts. Had a wonderful 3 days training on a Grand Banks 36. I highly recommend them. You can train on a single or duel engine boat. Planning to go back next summer and charter a Selene.



Dale

 

[mcarthur]

Thank you for your kind comments mccarthur.
I read many accounts of others travels before I started doing blogs on TF and I felt that to dash from place to place without taking in the ambience of the area we were passing through you may as well go by train.
From past experience of canals is that if you don't use it you'll lose it, so I try to encourage others to enjoy it too.

I totally agree, although while everyone is different and can't always take the time (or have the weather or money or partner or ...), it is lovely to hear about the history whether it is ancient or modern. Even more so for us antipodeans whose written history is short: while appreciating the original custodians of our land, it is extremely surprising personally to see buildings that are "only 600 years old"!

Max boat width is 4.80 metres width (locks are 5 metres).

As for Capestang bridge, Carcassonne, canal du Robine bridges check your height over width before taking out the angle 10 grinder as the bridges are arched.
I pass through (carefully) with 2.45 metres with a bit of room to spare (10 cms).
I also keep the water and fuel tanks full to help.
You can also by pass Capestang by going out to the Med at Grau du Agde and back in at Port La Nouvelle.

We are about 4.8m wide so should fit Freycinet's péniche-sized locks.

We actually need to reduce (vive la grinder!) the air height to get down to the 3.5m in the rest of the main network. 2.45m may need a bandsaw or explosives . I have calculated with full tanks AND the extra gained from fresh water vs salt . Of course the rainfall, or lack, can change all that...

We have started a blog at bluenomads.blog, but we'll be updating it irregularly when we have something to say since we don't live aboard and see new things everyday.

 

[aus996]

Thank you for all the advice. I have been taking boating classes as I am familiar with lake boating and somewhat with ocean boating. I plan on taking the Captains course and getting my Captains Lic. Nothing more than the knowledge, I do not want to rent out or pretend to be something I am not. I have some charts at home that I have been looking at and have been looking at different boats. Lots of choices and with the input from everyone I will be narrowing it down to a few different types, thank you all for the support to a novice. I was looking at a power catamaran, any input here? From what I can see they are pretty good on the gas mileage, True/False? Are the power catamaran's any good for what I am planning, open seas ect? Or are they like a cork on water?

I took the opportunity to get onto a number of new cats at the Sydney show this year, first time actually on one. Aside from the cost differential it just didn't feel right, plenty of room upstairs and very open but down in the hulls it felt a bit cramped. I could see them being a great option but it is a way different feel to a trawler type vessel, you need to get on one before spending too much time contemplating one

 

[dutch-barge]

We won't be able to do the Canal du Midi though - Capestang would do us in! We will join the DBA and UK version as well when we're closer....

The DBA is great to join...we cruise in the US and in Europe....the fun part in Europe is ...much much much more options and more resources. Plus it is fun being moored close to the Eifel tower.
Regarding Capestang......just invite a bunch people for drinks on the stern.go slow, and on the last minute full throttle...lowers the pilot house atleast 4 - 10 inches

 

[Irish Rambler]

Hello dutch-barge. Funny you should mention Capestang I passed under it today in our boat. The weather was good and we thought we'd do what we love most.
If you followed my blogs over the years you'll know we've passed around Europe and when in Amsterdam we stayed in Sixhaven for a while.
Yep we've done the fill her up with fuel and water and get 3 slabs of beer to invite 'ballast' for a free drink thing ourselves.
We did it in Ireland when I first came down with our previous boat a Birchwood where we set pints of Guinness behind the bar (to be served after getting under the bridge), sure you know the Irish. Ach you'll stay for one won't ya, then another arrived and another and we were walking with a stutter on the way back to the boat sometime after midnight

 

[READY]

It is the OPEX and not the CAPEX

Lots of good feedback and suggestions. I may have missed it but if the OP said post retirement income is $5k I would suggest they work up a budget and that will provide a lot of insight into the boat selection or even if this is a workable plan.
I may be viewed as spreading gloom and doom but I prefer to see it as real world considerations. I think most of us in the over 50 age bracket with or without boating experience have known the following to happen.

Example on planning the budget:
I suspect they will need to have slips in many locations (wife, teenage daughter, acuisition (CAPEX) budget of $100k is not going to cover a large luxurious live aboard) so this could easily be $500+
Fuel budget?
Engine maintenance, repairs and replacement budget
Any number of other recurring and one time boat fees
Add in all the normal living costs whether on land or sea and I expect the $5k will not go far.
Need to replace inverter $1-2k, transmission $4k, engine $15k...

I am not saying it is impossible to live on a boat for $100k up front and $5k per year but a reality check is in order to ensure what kind of lifestyle and cruising range that would provide.

After the 4-5 years mentioned the boat will be worth less and inflation will cause your resale dollars to have less buying power so you likely cannot return to what you left.

Finally it takes only 1 life impacting event to evolve into a crisis situation. Health issue requires long land stay, nearby hospital, etc. Now that $100k boat is a very heavy anchor. You still have all of the costs until you can get it sold

If you can make a realistic budget with 20% headroom and be clear with your family about what to expect then perhaps it might work. But personally I would also plan for getting nothing back out of the boat sale and see if that still works.
To start find a friend who will loan you a boat for 2 weeks. Live aboard and don't leave the dock but also don't step off the boat. If it has power or air or heat turn it off in extreme weather. If the family is ok after all that then perhaps you might find the full time lifestyle works for your family.

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
Mr. R. I read (post #28) that his retirement income is to be $5K per month ($60K/yr). I think Mr. ds has quite reasonable expectations given the parameters in his OP. A vessel to accomplish his cruising plans can readily be purchased for ~$100K or so BUT he will have to invest some "sweat equity", keep a VERY close eye on the weather and should not expect...smirk..."turn key". Boat with good bones needing cosmetic repairs should not break the bank.

 

[Texan]

My wife and I are planning on retiring in a little over 4 years. As of yet we do not have a boat and my boating experience is on lakes. I am currently taking different courses on boating and plan on taking the Captains course for the knowledge. My plans:


1) Get boat about 45 to 60 foot
A) Dual Diesel engines, Inboard
B) Generator (Diesel) large enough to run all boats electrical when needed
C) 2 State rooms (teenage daughter will be going with us)
D) Fly Bridge (Looking at Hatteras type of boats)
E) Wife likes the older wooden boats, I like more modern

2) Trips planned
A) Alaska
B) Panama Canal
C) Bahamas
D) Lake Superior (More kids live here)
E) Having fun until health says to stop. Hopefully 3 to 5 years from start.


Any help or advise is greatly appreciated. I am trying to do my research now so we can relax and enjoy later. Broad question I know, that is how much I need to learn, please help me.

My wife and I have been doing a very similar search for a year. We started with looking at Hatteras 58 LRCs.

There are only 42 that were made. We have expanded our search to include Defever POC, Ocean Alexander, Viking, and Gulfstar 49.

We have added requirements to yours.
1. Must be stabilized
2. Prefer bow thruster.
3. Stern thruster a plus.
4. Engine choice DD, then Cat.
5. We want at least 1000 gallon fuel
6. Fuel polisher
7. Minimum 1 knot per gallon

It is really difficult to "normalize" boat value due to condition, engine time, generator time, electronics, water systems, etc.

We would like to keep it below $300k.

Gulfstar 49s currently range in price from $69k to $219k.

Hatteras 58 YF appear to be good value, but have not found one stabilized.

 

[Irish Rambler]

Welcome to Trawler Forum.

In my own experience various things appeal to various people. Before I took up cruising/liveaboard life I had all the bells and whistles, successful business, trophy wife, members of institutions, lodges etc and do you know what ?
When you decide to rid yourself of all the paraphernalia of land its amazing how free you can be after the solicitors have raped you.
Yes there's lots of memories, but that's all they are, memories !
I brought one small suitcase when I moved on board, some mementoes, family bible, army citations, medals, offered the rest to the family and dumped what was left.
I started another business while based on board and its happily paying me to cruise around the South of France and travel. Read my post 'Traditions and Travel'
Don't plan too much for visitors, use the space for your daily living and let them 'bunk up' when they visit because they won't come as often as you think they will when the novelty's worn off.

In my honest opinion buying a wooden boat is worse than a bad marriage, none give you peace,both have to go in the end, the only difference is time.

I fully agree with Old Dan that paper charts are a brilliant way to orientate your brain to coastal cruising or passage making, you maybe don't believe me but your brain will accept and imprint a chart, whereas it will forget a screen shot.
At the expense of being called a boring old fart I still use charts to plot with compass & pencil, I only use a simple Garmin GPS 72 unit because its easier to read than a swinging compass.
My sometime cruising mate has the latest all singing all dancing Garmin, according to it we've been cruising fields, its taken us up a blind alley on canals and once put him 5 miles of a river entrance, apart from that its fine.

Health ? You'll find that with the stress gone and doing what you enjoy with a healthy lifestyle will increase your lifespan.

Just one word of caution, as you and your good lady will be in close proximity 24/7 its probably the number 1 reason for boat sales after health.

Measure twice, cut once, have faith and you'll find your dream baby.

 

[Slowboattochina]

Hello everyone,
We are beginning the search for a retirement liveaboard as well. We are experienced sailors and have owned pretty big boats in the past. We even did two keel up restorations. My admiral has nixed the idea of an Island Packet 41 motorsailer because it does not have enough "living room" space. She showed me a Hatteras 58 Long range motoryacht and said this is more like it. Maybe if I find one with Detroit 160 naturals. I know that engine well. We have time it may take me a couple years to unwind all my businesses, sell houses, boats, motorcycles, etc. I guess we have to start somewhere. We are heading to FL next week to scout marinas we might like to live in.

 

[vtmackey]

Max length in the Country Club Estates basin is 40', There are other venues in Venice with amenities close by. Lots of luck, Joe

 

[READY]

We owned a 1977 Hatteras Extended Deck House Motor Yacht for many years. Their boats are definitely appealing to both husband and wife. Wife will love the walk in engine room and the men live the cabin and saloon.�� Solid fiberglass hulls and I love the pilot house.

 

[ranger58sb]

She showed me a Hatteras 58 Long range motoryacht and said this is more like it. Maybe if I find one with Detroit 160 naturals. I know that engine well. We have time it may take me a couple years to unwind all my businesses, sell houses, boats, motorcycles, etc. I guess we have to start somewhere. We are heading to FL next week to scout marinas we might like to live in.

If you buy a boat now, you can be spending some of your off time learning about it, how to access various systems for maintenance, etc... so I don't think I'd recommend you wait a couple years until after you've got all your business stuff squared away.

Yachtworld, and maybe the Powerboat Guide, can be your friend.

Chances of a big Hatt with 160 naturals might be about slim to zip, but I'm told if you know Detroits you can figure out most of the larger ones too.

FWIW, I've thought about a Hatteras yachtfish for years, but the models I could likely afford are in the 32V/24V/12V era... and they have ladders (not stairs) to the flybridge. I could probably bite the bullet and learn to work with the 32V systems, but I'm not doing ladders. (We took a short ride the other day on our friends' Bertram sportfish, confirming yet again that we're not doing ladders on our own boat.)

-Chris

 

[caltexflanc]

WIW, I've thought about a Hatteras yachtfish for years, but the models I could likely afford are in the 32V/24V/12V era... and they have ladders (not stairs) to the flybridge. I could probably bite the bullet and learn to work with the 32V systems, but I'm not doing ladders. (We took a short ride the other day on our friends' Bertram sportfish, confirming yet again that we're not doing ladders on our own boat.)

That is very fixable