Two questions regarding the Great Loop

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moparharn said:
I don't recall where I the post is, but I remember someone saying 19'6" as a max height and 6' as a max draft. What are the consequences for violating this? Four or five open ocean runs of 40 miles or less? Or does it make the loop almost impossible?
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May have been answered, but that 19'6" is absolute - if you can't get under that, the Great Loop becomes the Great U-turn. Its a fixed bridge west of Chicago. (actually was once a movable bridge, but became inoperable many years ago and IL is too broke to repair it)
 
psneeld said:
from..... https://www.greatloop.org/content.aspx?page_id=22&club_id=574480&module_id=185488



About AGLCA (America Great Loop Cruisers Association)
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​

AGLCA's members range from experienced Loopers to boaters in the midst of Looping; from those planning on one day cruising the Great Loop to those simply exhilarated by the process of learning about the journey. Every level of interest is welcome, no restrictions or limitations! Whether you're young or just young at heart, still working or retired, ready to travel full-time or only every-so-often; whether you've got a powerboat, sailboat, trawler, rowboat or no boat; whether you are doing the Great Loop or dreaming, you'll fit right in, come aboard!


Join this group as they have all the resources and info that is up to date....not like most books or cruising guides....
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Sorry for being a bit negative, but you might want to try a semi loop before committing to the entire loop. I did from Columbus Miss to Tarpon Springs. I found the rivers boring and the gulf filled with crab pots which made for a lot of stress. The great lakes, florida and the atlantic coast are much better IMHO. It all depends on what you are looking for. Good luck.
 
Bigsfish said:
For some reason Ted hasn’t made a post on this subject but he would be my go to guy as he did the loop last year singlehanded. I would love to do it but I can’t get under the 20 ft bridge.

Read all you can and just do it.
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19' 6" to do the loop.
17' to go through Chicago as opposed to the Calumet river
15' 6" to go West of the Oswego canal on the Erie canal

Ted
 
Trent Severn depth can vary with seasonal rainfall. If you choose not to do the Canadian canals, 6' draft is reasonable but you may find areas (especially the AICW) that are not navigable within 3 hours of low tide. My boat draws 4.5 ', and I had no deth problems. Without the Canadian canals, 7' is doable at near high tide. Lots of good choices in boats that draw 5' or less. Be flexible with your plans. A 5 to 6' draft may keep you off the Trent Severn after a drought season.

Ted
 
the better half and I have read many of the books and in our humble opinions, the most useful one we thought was "The Loopers Companion Guide" by John Wright. its available on Amazon, either paper of kindle versions.

The AGLCA is defintely worthwhile if you're thinking of doing it. One of the benefits is a near-weekly podcast.
 
Some long term cruisers agree with Capt John on many things, some agree with some of his philosophies.... others though disagree with a lot of what he comments on.


Be careful to pointedly narrow down conclusions to specifics....as anyone who has cruised a lot.... can vary on opinion just by changing one parameter in the discussion.
 
Thanks Ted.

Now a question for those who have done the loop. If some enterprising guy were to buy 100 yards of property on either side of the bridge on the river and bought a 100 ton travelift to move a boat from one side of the bridge to the other, would it be possible?
 
Bigsfish said:
Thanks Ted.

Now a question for those who have done the loop. If some enterprising guy were to buy 100 yards of property on either side of the bridge on the river and bought a 100 ton travelift to move a boat from one side of the bridge to the other, would it be possible?
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I've wondered the exact same idea - even discussed it with some Banker friends in Chicago :thumb:
 
Bigsfish said:
Thanks Ted.

Now a question for those who have done the loop. If some enterprising guy were to buy 100 yards of property on either side of the bridge on the river and bought a 100 ton travelift to move a boat from one side of the bridge to the other, would it be possible?
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Probably not as the bridges are city streets. Don't think they will let you cross city streets with a travel lift. Also, those are the absolute lowest bridges. There are others that are only slightly higher.

Ted
 
The lowest fixed railroad bridge on the South Branch of the Chicago river is 18' 5". That clearance doesn't reflect the water level fluctuations. My guess is that is where the minimum 17' air draft comes from.

Ted
 
psneeld said:
Some long term cruisers agree with Capt John on many things, some agree with some of his philosophies.... others though disagree with a lot of what he comments on.


Be careful to pointedly narrow down conclusions to specifics....as anyone who has cruised a lot.... can vary on opinion just by changing one parameter in the discussion.
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Wifey B: I disagree with a huge part of what he writes but still find him an excellent resource, just don't accept his site as the bible but that's true with any opinion. He has done it many times and loves to prove the boats he can do it in and costs, but most of his choice of boats, I'd never consider doing it in. Of course 99% of loopers would never choose the boat we did it in.

As to the route, there are many areas outside his basic choices I highly recommend, but he gives you an initial feel for what the loop is like.

Read Capt John, read others. There are many books available on Kindle by loopers. The more you read, the more different views. :)
 
No kidding...the point of my post is that he is one of MANY sources for info...not the best.


Usually in boating there is no "best" ..... Just one of many.....advice, materials, products, methods, etc..etc...
 
psneeld said:
No kidding...the point of my post is that he is one of MANY sources for info...not the best.


Usually in boating there is no "best" ..... Just one of many.....advice, materials, products, methods, etc..etc...
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Wifey B: You must figure out what works for you. It's like when people ask "what boat should I buy?" and tell us nothing about themselves.:rofl:
 
Nope, I e got the perfect boat they should buy, the one I’m currently selling. :)
 
Test The Waters...

Here's a suggestion, aimed more for question 2.

My wife and I had always wanted to do the Great Loop once retired. Last year, still in a state of "semi-retirement", we were able to voyage the Triangle Loop, starting and ending in New York on the Hudson River. Once we completed it, we had this to say when asked about our experience: "The experience was great, glad we did it, however we would never do it again". This was the same feel from about 25 % of the other boaters we met on the way. All thought of doing the Great Loop someday, however after experiencing a section of the loop in rivers, thought differently.

We met others as well, who had been on the waters traveling for many months into their Great Loop journey. To many of these, the trip was a natural. So I'm in no way knocking the Great Loop! I am just happy that we did the Triangle Loop, traveled 1500 miles in a few months and found that the Great Loop was not for us. We are indeed "coastal cruisers".

So the suggestion you might consider, as a way to encourage your wife as well, is to try a 2-3 month trip travel on a section of the Great Loop. Just a thought.
 
2-3 months is out of the question as long as I still have a job.:) We could however spend some time on our current boat cruising lakes Huron and Michigan.

I am getting more confused about this bridge height issue. The number seems to be moving around some between 17' and 19'6". Is the South Branch of the Chicago river the only way through? I have my eyes on a boat with a 19' bridge height. If 17' this year is the limit, my grand plans are not possible with that boat I guess. I heard a story about a Hatteras leaving the Marinette River when a littoral battleship was doing sea trials out in the lake. It seems the huge wake from the littoral made its way into the river and sent the Hatteras up into a bridge as it was passing under. This 19' bridge height boat I am looking at could be a real challenge under a 19'6" bridge and impossible if what I am reading here is the only way around the loop.
 
2-3 months is out of the question as long as I still have a job. We could however spend some time on our current boat cruising lakes Huron and Michigan.

Understood. When we completed the Triangle Loop, passing through 100+ locks, we never wanted to see a lock again. Interesting experience for a while (especially up in Canada towards Ottawa), but the experience became old. River cruising is quite different from coastal or lake cruising. If you can try a sample of river cruising, even for a couple of weeks, it may help you decide.

Whatever you do, enjoy!
 
moparharn said:
2-3 months is out of the question as long as I still have a job.:) We could however spend some time on our current boat cruising lakes Huron and Michigan.

I am getting more confused about this bridge height issue. The number seems to be moving around some between 17' and 19'6". Is the South Branch of the Chicago river the only way through? I have my eyes on a boat with a 19' bridge height. If 17' this year is the limit, my grand plans are not possible with that boat I guess. I heard a story about a Hatteras leaving the Marinette River when a littoral battleship was doing sea trials out in the lake. It seems the huge wake from the littoral made its way into the river and sent the Hatteras up into a bridge as it was passing under. This 19' bridge height boat I am looking at could be a real challenge under a 19'6" bridge and impossible if what I am reading here is the only way around the loop.
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The second route off Lake Michigan is the Calumet river. This is the route that commercial traffic mostly uses. The river connects to Lake Michigan about 8 miles South of Chicago. It connects with the Des Plaines river maybe 12 miles outside of Chicago. This gets you past the Chicago river and the South Branch of the Chicago river. The 19' 6" bridge is below the junction of the Calumet and Des Plaines rivers.

Let me know if I didn't make that understandable.

Ted
 
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Thank you. Yes, I believe I have got it. Should I not be looking at boats that have a 19' bridge clearance if I want to do the loop?
Ted- I saw a Cherubini 45 for sale on yacht world recently located in Ohio. Just seeing that boat for sale was inspiring. What an incredibly beautiful boat it was. What is the clearance of your boat? Bill
 
moparharn said:
Thank you. Yes, I believe I have got it. Should I not be looking at boats that have a 19' bridge clearance if I want to do the loop?
Ted- I saw a Cherubini 45 for sale on yacht world recently located in Ohio. Just seeing that boat for sale was inspiring. What an incredibly beautiful boat it was. What is the clearance of your boat? Bill
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As to your first question; if the boat is truly 19' with absolutely no way to reduce it, yes there is some risk. You might look for some that if they have a radar arch or mast or other upper structure, there should be a way to hinge it back to gain some clearance. Some people will go so far as to fill all fuel and water tanks near Chicago in hopes it will sink you down a few inches... plus you have to be aware of how the river is behaving that day...
 
moparharn said:
Thank you. Yes, I believe I have got it. Should I not be looking at boats that have a 19' bridge clearance if I want to do the loop?
Ted- I saw a Cherubini 45 for sale on yacht world recently located in Ohio. Just seeing that boat for sale was inspiring. What an incredibly beautiful boat it was. What is the clearance of your boat? Bill
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Hi Bill, let me help you with bridge clearance or air draft. First, on my boat there is a tall VHF antenna and a light mast on the back of the pilothouse. Both of those fold down easily for a <15' clearance.

On many boats that are too tall some modifications can be made to lower the bridge clearance. Mine originally had an aluminum mast that made the clearance 22'. I moved the radar from the mast to the pilothouse roof and built the current light mast.

When considering boats that are close height wise, look at how easy or difficult it might be to lower the height. A boat with a flybridge and full enclosure might not be realistic to change, but relocating a radar or removing an arch may not be a big issue. Before buying the boat, I would want to get the air draft measured accurately, mine was off by 2' from what the previous owner thought.

Every inch counts. Starting with knowing the real air draft. Remember that full fuel and water tanks can lower your vessel clearance by inches. You will also be going under the bridge at a crawl in common water. So, a 1" clearance has the same result as a 1' clearance. To answer your question, with full fuel, water and a boatload of cruising supplies, a 19' air draft should be fine, maybe a little more if you add water to the bilges. :rolleyes: I'm kidding about water in the bilges....I think.

Ted
 
This is a boat that is for sale in my area and is about 1/3 the price of the Cherubini I fell in love with. He is asking $40,000 more than he paid for it two years ago, but that is his business. I like the Portuguese bridge and twin Cummins. I am not ready to buy until I sell my Bertram, but I am keeping an eye on this one. The owner claims a 19' clearance from windshield. From the pictures I would guess this number is pretty hard.
https://www.boattrader.com/listing/...trawler-103614938/?refSource=enhanced listing
 
moparharn said:
This is a boat that is for sale in my area and is about 1/3 the price of the Cherubini I fell in love with. He is asking $40,000 more than he paid for it two years ago, but that is his business. I like the Portuguese bridge and twin Cummins. I am not ready to buy until I sell my Bertram, but I am keeping an eye on this one. The owner claims a 19' clearance from windshield. From the pictures I would guess this number is pretty hard.
https://www.boattrader.com/listing/1985-custom-lepage-pilothouse-trawler-103614938/?refSource=enhanced%20listing
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IMO,
I can believe it having a 19' air draft with the dinghy crane and radar / light mast down. Although I would verify that with an actual measuring.

There are a few things that I would think about when you're not looking at the boat to be distracted.

Draft at 6' 3" is concerning although not a dealbreaker. There will be parts of the AICW that you will only do at high tide or go out in the ocean. Trent Severn may not be doable except for a high water year.

Couldn't access most of the pictures, but hull is described as full displacement, slow speed. There is an awful lot of HP (420 HP) for a 7 to 8 knot cruise. The engines are 30+ years old with around 75 hours per year on them. I would want a good engine survey done by a mechanic familiar with Cummins engines. Your loop trip could easily exceed 1,200 hours.

The builder only built 4 of these recreational boats. I would enquire about boat insurance for the Great Loop. It's an older boat that most recreational insurance companies may never have heard of, and may not be able to cover. With only 4 built, it's hard to know how it handles seas. What he paid for the boat and has invested in it since, has no bearing on what it's worth. It's rare that a boat of which only 4 were built, has a value anywhere near a boat it resembles.

That might be a reasonable boat for you to do the Loop in, but IMO you have a lot of homework ahead of you. Don't make reservations for the honeymoon yet.

Ted
 
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To what Ted said, i would only echo great concern about the >6' draft. In fact its more than an inconvenience because it could very well keep you away from two of what's considered the best of the loop; as he mentioned, the Trent-Severn waterway, plus the Canadian Georgian Bay. Everyone raves about this bay but much of it might not be possible with such a deep draft...
 
When we went through the TSW they said over 6’ draft was not allowed. Over 5’ draft you had to sign a waiver for damages. I believe that the 6’ was an absolute not depending on water height but rather the limit was on some of the locks would not allow more than 6’ at any height of water per the lockmaster we talked to.
 
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