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Old 01-18-2019, 10:07 AM   #21
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I disagree after 30 or so round trips between NJ and FL.

I would say quite a few say call on 16 or you wind up doing so when not reached on their working.

I would also say many wil not givea slip assignment more than an hour or less out or not till you arrive...Dockwa may be changing that though...or if arriving very late in the day or after hours.
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Old 01-18-2019, 10:52 AM   #22
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After reading the thread below about using CH 13 for passing I wanted to ask a question from a recent experience.

I have always used 16 to hail a marina or another boater, then when they answer move to a different channel.

Recently pulled into an area in South Florida, approaching the fuel dock and hailed the fuel dock on CH16.

Immediately - the response from CG was the message we have heard when someone is inappropriately using CH16. Was not directed at me specific - but the timing - felt like my hailing initiated.

The CG facility is really close to the marina I was going to - but wouldn't think that would matter.

Is my usage of CH 16 correct? or incorrect?

TY

In our area, Marinas are on 68, Bridges on 13 and so on ... I have never been able to get a Marina on 16. I don't think 16 should be used for that purpose (?)



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Old 01-18-2019, 10:57 AM   #23
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In our area, Marinas are on 68, Bridges on 13 and so on ... I have never been able to get a Marina on 16. I don't think 16 should be used for that purpose (?)



fb
sounds like what one 'instructor" posted in this or the other thread....in Canada, the shore stations are prohibited from using Ch 16.
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Old 01-18-2019, 12:22 PM   #24
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On west coast if you use 16 for any of these things other then to hail another boat or distress to contact CG you get a stern warning from CG most of the time. 16 is silent most of the time for a reason. Even on low frequency most of the time the CG picks it up anyways. Its ok to use it to contact a marina as long as it just a quick hailing x marina what channel is x harbor/marina on, but technically its a grey aria and should be avoided. Trip planning should include looking up the harbors you will visit and document their contact info ie vhf number. If its an emergency stop at a marina ext 16 is perfectly OK to use 16.


https://www.boatus.org/marine-communications/basics/


"When hailing other boats for routine communication, you'll need to hail them on 16 or 09, and then move to an available working channel, usually 68, 69, 71 or 72. Always remember to check for channels authorized for use in your area as well as any local restrictions."
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Old 01-18-2019, 12:38 PM   #25
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Interesting responses. Our experience on the East coast has always been instructions from marinas who say Hail us on 16 when you get near.


My practice is if I have business with the Marina to discuss prior to arriving I do that via cell phone.


In the specific situation I referenced, I was sitting right outside the marina and just wanted to have a conversation about where on the fuel dock they wanted to pull in. One boat was there, didn't know if they needed me to wait till that boat cleared, or to come in on the other side.


My expectation when I hailed, was that they would respond with a channel switch.
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Old 01-18-2019, 12:43 PM   #26
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Read and follow the rules. That's it. Know the proper procedure for radio use or stay tied to the dock.

When you don't use proper procedure, you are announcing to every other boater in earshot that you are a moron. Radio use is also a good reason to look closely and consider that cutesy name what you are planning to name your boat - there was a huge kerfuffle here one summer when somebody was calling for "Payday."

Idiotic.

The CG should never have to caution a boater, it proves to all and sundry that you are a moron.

Why is this difficult?
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Old 01-26-2019, 02:59 AM   #27
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IMHO there is a lot of misunderstanding here. Yes, it is expected that channel 16 must be used first. This is for the simple reason that channel 16 initially was set as the channel to be monitored at shore, like the marinas. In that setting boaters would do two and only two things in this channel when not in emergencies: 1) Attempt contact, and 2) When contact made, move to another channel.


The key is someone is monitoring. This is why this channel is useful as the emergency channel. That is, for a short distance radio capability, the chances that a distress call is going to be herd increases with more geographically dispersed monitoring radios, and that includes onitoring boaters.



Now, the historical change comes from radios that can monitor multiple channels and selective calling and now one can see how the confusion got created. Some radio users will follow the old protocol, some will use the new protocol, which is simply to use another channel as first contact channel or use selective calling. Marinas and shore service organizations using radios with new multiple-channel monitoring capability would be able to monitor both, channel 16, and another non-emergency channel.


To conclude then, although channel 16 may continue to be used as a contact channel, this purpose is discouraged. Instead, use any other communication medium to include phones and Family Radio Service (FRS) radios but always continue to monitor channel 16 at all times.



I believe that in the not so distance future, VHF radios will succumb to satellite cell phones and EPIRBs just like LORAN died with GPS.


These are my views but there may be better views by others.
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Old 01-26-2019, 11:06 AM   #28
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Old 01-26-2019, 11:09 AM   #29
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IMHO there is a lot of misunderstanding here. Yes, it is expected that channel 16 must be used first. This is for the simple reason that channel 16 initially was set as the channel to be monitored at shore, like the marinas. In that setting boaters would do two and only two things in this channel when not in emergencies: 1) Attempt contact, and 2) When contact made, move to another channel.


The key is someone is monitoring. This is why this channel is useful as the emergency channel. That is, for a short distance radio capability, the chances that a distress call is going to be herd increases with more geographically dispersed monitoring radios, and that includes onitoring boaters.

Now, the historical change comes from radios that can monitor multiple channels and selective calling and now one can see how the confusion got created. Some radio users will follow the old protocol, some will use the new protocol, which is simply to use another channel as first contact channel or use selective calling. Marinas and shore service organizations using radios with new multiple-channel monitoring capability would be able to monitor both, channel 16, and another non-emergency channel.


To conclude then, although channel 16 may continue to be used as a contact channel, this purpose is discouraged. Instead, use any other communication medium to include phones and Family Radio Service (FRS) radios but always continue to monitor channel 16 at all times.



I believe that in the not so distance future, VHF radios will succumb to satellite cell phones and EPIRBs just like LORAN died with GPS.


These are my views but there may be better views by others.
I still know folks with a CB radio on their boat, I doubt VHF is going away very soon.
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Old 01-26-2019, 11:42 AM   #30
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I still know folks with a CB radio on their boat, I doubt VHF is going away very soon.
I have a 2007 Motorhome. Came with a CB radio. I have actually had it on once in 5 years, to call for a ride in 7 Feathers RV Park, where the Casino provides a bus from the RV sites to their own door. I can't think of any other reason to own a CB, since Burt Reynolds was calling "Breaker, Breaker".
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Old 01-26-2019, 11:54 AM   #31
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I have a 2007 Motorhome. Came with a CB radio. I have actually had it on once in 5 years, to call for a ride in 7 Feathers RV Park, where the Casino provides a bus from the RV sites to their own door. I can't think of any other reason to own a CB, since Burt Reynolds was calling "Breaker, Breaker".
I think they use theirs for communicating, but I could be wrong.
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Old 01-26-2019, 04:19 PM   #32
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I believe that in the not so distance future, VHF radios will succumb to satellite cell phones and EPIRBs just like LORAN died with GPS.

If a vessel is in need of emergency assistance RIGHT NOW, and doesn't know the phone number of "that boat right over there" -- and if hand- and light- and sound-signals don't seem to be working...

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Old 01-26-2019, 04:53 PM   #33
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Old 01-26-2019, 05:09 PM   #34
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After reading the thread below about using CH 13 for passing I wanted to ask a question from a recent experience.

I have always used 16 to hail a marina or another boater, then when they answer move to a different channel.

Recently pulled into an area in South Florida, approaching the fuel dock and hailed the fuel dock on CH16.

Immediately - the response from CG was the message we have heard when someone is inappropriately using CH16. Was not directed at me specific - but the timing - felt like my hailing initiated.

The CG facility is really close to the marina I was going to - but wouldn't think that would matter.

Is my usage of CH 16 correct? or incorrect?

TY
After much discussion I thought we might answer the question with the words from the FCC. "Calling coast stations. Call a coast station on its assigned channel. You may use Channel 16 when you do not know the assigned channel.". This may conflict with many experiences but it's at least what the FCC says on the subject, my two cents.
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Old 01-27-2019, 01:09 AM   #35
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You make a very good point Chris. It is why for short range conditions VHF could survive. But it will not survive simply because that VHF functionality can easily be absorbed by a cell-phone or EPIRB like devices. Upon keying in the 911 button in such devices, signals would automatically go out via every available media including AIS with all the information necessary, to include a distressed vessel skipper's voice message briefing about the emergency situation. The location would be automatically reported. The distressed vessel would be automatically identified and highlighted in chart plotters, AIS devices and Coast Guard Centers. Then, fewer people would be monitoring VHF anymore. Insurance companies would be favoring the new equipment including short-range medium or VHF capability over just VHF radio.



It is simply just the case of progress providing a more reliable medium to communicate when reacting to emergencies. How long before it happens? A lot less than past experience indicates due to the dramatic contraption of time frames in deploying new technology experienced during the last few decades.


If the folks at the vessel close by did not care much to respond to flares and sound signals, what makes one expect that they will even have their VHF radio on, properly squelched to hear you, and loud enough to be herd over the sounds of engines and loud music? How does one prove when using VHF that someone refused to render assistance when they were close by, could do so and were supposed to do so?


Then of course is the fear that the alleged vessel-in-distress is just trying to lure in a wealthy yacht owner to hijack or rob it.


I do not know when but I do know that the replacement of VHF radio will be a superior and safer capability to deal with emergencies. We boaters just have to make sure that the replacement equipment costs approximately what VHF radio costs us. If it costs too much, we'll keep monitoring channel 16!
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Old 01-27-2019, 02:01 AM   #36
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I don't know where to start.
Wow! So many of the respondents to this post need to go and take a maritime radio course.
I'm sorry to have to tell you that you have NO idea how a marine radio and marine radio protocol works in this century.
I'm in Canada but it can't possibly be that much different in the US.
First, you can't raise that commercial vessel on 16 because they aren't there and don't have to monitor it. They monitor their working channels. Dates back over a decade.
Second, GET your MMSI number and program it into your radio. Now you can use your DSC function of your radio.
Three, with DSC you can simply push a single button on your radio and every boat out there in radio land, whether they are on 16 or not, even if they are transmitting, they will get an obnoxious alarm telling them you are having a mayday. Your position shows up as a bright, special marker on their radar, on their chart plotter, on their AIS, on the face of their radio, and the coast guard gets to know about it too. All the above now switch to 16 to rescue you.
Fourth, oops, you have to have your gps wired to your radio so they know your position or your radio transmits the last position you manually set in it. You did enter one within the last 4 hours didn't you?
Fifth, if you have an AIS or a smart phone or computer/tablet with data access, you can look at the screen and read their MMSI number from their AIS signal and you use your DSC feature of your radio to send a radio call to that specific boat. Their radio goes into alarm telling them someone is calling them. They acknowledge the call and their radio clicks itself to the working channel you chose and you chat with them.

That's all I'm going to type tonight. There are a few more steps in some of this but when you RETAKE YOUR RADIO COURSE you should learn more.

Does this sound like a rant? Sorry. Your VHF radio is lightyears ahead of the pipe dreams some of you are suggesting to replace it.
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Old 01-27-2019, 06:36 AM   #37
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rolomart3.... you realize what you describe is exactly how the GMDSS system currently in place is supposed to work?



GregS...lots of your info is how it should be (to a point).


According to studies of small recreational vessels.... most DSC radios are unregistered or are not hooked to GPS. As far as using DSC radios to make specific ship calls...most are so cumbersome to use it either never gets used or very limited to small groups f individuals. Also, there are plenty of boats out there without DSC radios. AIS is also scarce even on small commercial vessels.
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Old 01-27-2019, 08:08 AM   #38
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But it will not survive simply because that VHF functionality can easily be absorbed by a cell-phone or EPIRB like devices. Upon keying in the 911 button in such devices, signals would automatically go out via every available media including AIS with all the information necessary, to include a distressed vessel skipper's voice message briefing about the emergency situation.

Sounds good on paper, but...

Stuffing a VHF radio and an AIS transmitter... maybe even sat xmtr and HF/SSB ... into the size of a smartphone... easily carried in a pocket... probably isn't on the near horizon I guess.

Yes, "that boat right over there" might not have its radio on, or tuned to 16, or may be over-squelched... but that doesn't mean a hail isn't worth trying in an emergency situation. Might be "that other boat around the corner" is the one that really answers...

All those other emergency signals are sort of them same: you're at the mercy of the other guy. Yeah, well, that's kind the way emergencies play out sometimes... so having the ability to signal in many different ways is better than not.

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Old 01-27-2019, 08:14 AM   #39
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Interesting, no 76A.
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Old 01-27-2019, 08:30 AM   #40
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Sounds good on paper, but...

Stuffing a VHF radio and an AIS transmitter... maybe even sat xmtr and HF/SSB ... into the size of a smartphone... easily carried in a pocket... probably isn't on the near horizon I guess.

Yes, "that boat right over there" might not have its radio on, or tuned to 16, or may be over-squelched... but that doesn't mean a hail isn't worth trying in an emergency situation. Might be "that other boat around the corner" is the one that really answers...

All those other emergency signals are sort of them same: you're at the mercy of the other guy. Yeah, well, that's kind the way emergencies play out sometimes... so having the ability to signal in many different ways is better than not.

-Chris
Chris, in populated areas..even the old system of pre-DSC radios worked pretty well.

Out of thousands of SAR cases I was involved with, often a good sam would be the key component in resolving them Either the actual rescue of key info leading to the conclusion.
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