flybridge enclosure

[Dougcole]

You mentioned cruising the Bahamas. Most of the time you will be on a bank that is 15 to 20 feet deep. There are numerous sandbars and coral heads. Height from the flybridge greatly improves visibility. You can drop the curtain when it rains and stay up there. Also the enclosure keeps things cleaner and less salt washed when cruising so electronics and instruments stay less exposed to the elements.

I've found our strataglass to be difficult to keep up, after 5 years ours is already getting hard to see through despite my babying it and following the manufacturer's instructions to the letter using their proprietary cleaning products.



That said, I wouldn't be without an enclosure for the reasons others have stated. I think I've used my lower helm for less than 4 hours in the 8 years we have owned the boat. When I redid our electronics 2 years ago I seriously considered not putting any electronics down there at all. In the end I installed a very basic 5" sounder/gps combo which I bring home and use on my flats boat when not using the big boat.


Our canvas guy said it would be very difficult to put in a "rigid" front panel (ez2cy or similar) that could open on our boat because we have a soft bimini. I think he feels like there would be nothing to attach it to to hold it open since it can't be rolled. Any thoughts on that?

 

[porman]

Dougcole, The front of our 430 enclosure is divided into three sections (Makrolon). The middle section folds up and is held by straps with snaps that are attached to the second bow. Same with both sides and the back section next to the door.

 

[High Wire]

thank you Archie,
a monk 36 is on a short list for me, but I do notice the lower helm is very much a steering position in the salon. I did a cruise on a small Nordic tug and the pilot-house was very much a nice place to be.
sounds like you do not find the Monk lower helm ideal?
i can see the attraction of a fly-bridge , visibility , views etc but the bag part just puts me off. i could see an fly bridge for the right conditions but a good lower helm/ pilot house for everything else .
not sure the flybridge needs the complication of all the extra repeaters too.
cheers warren

Like almost everything on a boat, you have to compromise based on your likes. Every aspect has pluses and minuses. Thats why there are hundreds of different models of boats and you get to choose the one you want.

 

[markpierce]

No flybridge. Less motion. No long ladders/stairs. Less expense. Less distance from galley. Less exposure to the elements. Safer.

 

[Comodave]

I've found our strataglass to be difficult to keep up, after 5 years ours is already getting hard to see through despite my babying it and following the manufacturer's instructions to the letter using their proprietary cleaning products.



That said, I wouldn't be without an enclosure for the reasons others have stated. I think I've used my lower helm for less than 4 hours in the 8 years we have owned the boat. When I redid our electronics 2 years ago I seriously considered not putting any electronics down there at all. In the end I installed a very basic 5" sounder/gps combo which I bring home and use on my flats boat when not using the big boat.


Our canvas guy said it would be very difficult to put in a "rigid" front panel (ez2cy or similar) that could open on our boat because we have a soft bimini. I think he feels like there would be nothing to attach it to to hold it open since it can't be rolled. Any thoughts on that?

It is pretty easy to hinge semi rigid panels up. We had EZ2CY panels made for the front and first side panel on our bridge. I put twist lock fasteners in the bottom of the panels and they hinge up to attach to some straps around the bimini bow. I used 2” Sunbrella facing to make the straps that go around the bimini bow. Works great and is simple to do. We do have a hardtop on the bridge but it would work just as well with a regular bimini top. In the photo you can see the straps hanging from the bimini bow. Also on the left 2 panels you can see the hole side of the snaps on the bottom of the panels. I have the middle 3 panels hinged so they can open or close. The right most panel and the first panel on the side are stationary and do not open. We had the 5 panels across the front and the first panel on each side made out of EZ2CY and the rest of the enclosure is Regalite. The EZ2CY is wonderful to look through, just like glass. We clean and treat it with Sumner 210 spray wax. It helps the water bead up and run off and cleans the panels too. It is what the fabricator of the EZ2CY said to use and it is really easy and fast to use.

 

[ranger58sb]

I had Makrolon that started craze cracking at 3 years and by 5 years had to be replaced. I've read other reviews that said it was good as new after 12 years. I live in South Florida and the boat is parked facing east. I did find one other complaint that mentioned having similar problems in the south. The company was not responsive and there was apparently no warranty for that line of product. When new it was so clear you could hardly tell if it was up or down.

Our first Makrolon panels (front three) went on in 2009, and they were still very good -- but not perfect, toward the end -- until we replaced them in 2019. Over the years they did get some scratches, mostly from cleaning (not me) with inappropriate materials and products. The effect was a bit of hazing that caught sunlight at certain angles (relative to the sun) and could be slightly dazzling for a few minutes at that angle... but otherwise visibility was still as clear as glass.

Makrolon's warranty at the time, for that product, was only 1 year, I think. Or maybe 3, not sure since the issue didn't arise.

The new stuff we put on last was Markolon Marine 5, a newer formulation I guess, better warranty IIRC...

Rain-X is your friend!

Not quite. Depends on the enclosure product. Whatever we've had usually says NO RAINEX.

Many of these come with specific recommendations for cleaning products; Stratoglass for instance recommends micro-fleece rags and only IMAR 301 and 302, and several others say "use what Stratoglass recommends."

IOW, cleaning and care depends on what specific stuff the various see-through panels are made of.

-Chris

 

[Rufus]

The flybridge on our boat is an extension of the sundeck. It's outside space. Bimini only if it's really hot. If we want to be cooped up, we go below (where there is a lower station for inclement weather). For us, boating is not an indoor activity. When in the slip, we enjoy the excellent 360* view from topside. That view is obliterated when (typically looper) boats with (often ratty) bags park in adjacent slips....canvas canyon time. We don't like canvas on our boat (I removed it), and we really don't like it on other people's boats. Of course they could not care less...

 

[Dougcole]

No flybridge. Less motion. No long ladders/stairs. Less expense. Less distance from galley. Less exposure to the elements. Safer.

Staying at home. No motion at all. Zero sun exposure. Huge galley. Probably no ladders or steep stairs. Safer.


I'm mostly kidding, but you get my point. Everything has its risk and reward.

 

[Dougcole]

It is pretty easy to hinge semi rigid panels up. We had EZ2CY panels made for the front and first side panel on our bridge. I put twist lock fasteners in the bottom of the panels and they hinge up to attach to some straps around the bimini bow. I used 2” Sunbrella facing to make the straps that go around the bimini bow. Works great and is simple to do. We do have a hardtop on the bridge but it would work just as well with a regular bimini top. In the photo you can see the straps hanging from the bimini bow. Also on the left 2 panels you can see the hole side of the snaps on the bottom of the panels. I have the middle 3 panels hinged so they can open or close. The right most panel and the first panel on the side are stationary and do not open. We had the 5 panels across the front and the first panel on each side made out of EZ2CY and the rest of the enclosure is Regalite. The EZ2CY is wonderful to look through, just like glass. We clean and treat it with Sumner 210 spray wax. It helps the water bead up and run off and cleans the panels too. It is what the fabricator of the EZ2CY said to use and it is really easy and fast to use.

Thanks Dave. That looks really great and is similar to my plan.


We just replaced the center (of three) front panel on our enclosure with new strataglass as the old one cracked. But the two center side panels are getting cloudy too and look really cloudy adjacent to the new center panel. I'm going to have to do something here in the next 24 months or so. Can of worms.

 

[Moonfish]

Our Cheoy Lee 46 is our first power boat. Previously, I owned two pilothouse sailboats. Like our trawler, each sailboat had two helm stations. The interior helm (for us, anyway) has always been about comfort. They have always been the primary helm, too, with all electronics/navigation close at hand. The exterior stations have always been about being "outside", in nature so to speak. And if it's too hot, wet or windy outside, I go inside. Of course, the visibility from the pilothouse on our trawler is a lot better than it was in the corresponding spaces on my sailboats...

I used to own convertible British roadsters. In the Pacific NW. Hence, I was a fair weather top down driver (although that didn't stop me from driving with the top down on those bright, sunny, yet bone-chillingly cold winter days!) So I guess my experiences driving Triumphs in my 20s and 30s influenced how I drive my boats.

That being said, we have thought about someday installing a retractable bimini top for the flybridge. More often than not it's direct sun that drives back down into the pilothouse.

 

[amapola]

We're with you. We have a pilothouse lower helm only and are quite happy with it. We're not wind and sun loving folks. We got plenty of that while sailing. Plus having 2 helms makes for more stuff to break down.

 

[Capt Ray]

My wife and I boarded 4 different Mainship 390 trawlers (2 helms), and talked with many owners, before we finally landed one for us. All the these owners indicated that fewer than 2% of their operating time at the help was in the lower helm. Typical statement, "If I am single handing and need to do the lines myself, I'll go down below as I approach the inner harbor. Otherwise, I'm always up top." Visibility for helmsman and crew, room for crew, all are plusses. Protection from the elements and insects are key. Canvas lengthens our season here in the northeast when the enclosure adds a month or two to each end of the season.

 

[Bellakins]

We love our flybridge enclosure. We live off the ICW in NC, brought the boat up from FL. We have yet to use our lower helm station. It's VERY comfortable when it's cold or rainy. We see sailboats go by without enclosures in cold weather and feel much sympathy for them. We just roll up the "glass" when it's warm. We see so much better from the flybridge. We don't even have a seat at our lower helm and have never missed it.

 

[Leo Reise]

Interesting question - our came with a fully enclosed flybridge and we have a lower station. Can testify to the added windage and removed the side and front curtains in expected weather.
We only had our boat for one full season but our decision at the end of the year was to leave the biminis in place and put the side curtains in storage for this coming season.
Lake Ontario surface temperature, on a good day might get to be 60F so while underway it is cool at best and seldom helmed from there.
Flybridge does help when docking or leaving.
At dock a great place to sit and relax - and almost always a breeze.

 

[mahal]

Another good reason for enclosing the FB on a dual helm station boat is when a boat is normally driven at planing speeds and the lower station offers limited visibility (not a raised pilothouse) making the FB the main piloting spot. An example of this would be the GB47 Europa.

That said, I enjoy my FB fully open (not even a bimini) on nice days.

 

[Moon]

I usually operate from my enclosed flying bridge because I have comfortable Stidd chairs and great visibility. 90% of the time the windows are rolled up. If it is raining or cold they will be rolled down. Visibility is not as good in the rain but I will slow down under those conditions for safety. I have a hard top that extends from my arch forward. I will always have a hard top or soft top covering my flying bridge to help slow the skin cancer I am prone to. I have a helm in the cabin but have have never used it to operate the vessel.

 

[NCheaven]

My New England prior owner - awesome couple! - used a 3/4 flybridge enclosure, and even in June, I understood why on the early stage of the delivery. But, I found the visibility somewhat compromised, so I eventually zipped open the eisenglass, and later took the enclosure down except the bimini once I started using the boat in North Carolina. We love the open Flybridge, and in adverse weather or sun direction choose the cabin helm station. So, perhaps your question involves weather (I'll take NC!), and personal preference. I totally get the opinion from the NW poster about debris and other matter in the water - it can be everywhere. I even hit an adventurous manattee in North Carolina - hopefully the full keel/skeg kept him/her from serious harm. Dark tannic stained water makes it hard to see even 6 inches down in the water at our blazing speed of 6.8 kts. But, a flybridge, preferably without eisenglass does provide much better visibility.

 

[garychurch]

I have a three quarter enclose with a Bimini top and a fully equipped Flybridge with twin Stidd Captain Chairs. It provide great visibility, flexibility and comfort for cruising the Bahamas and Caribbean. Enclosures can be opened or closed depending on wind, weather and seas.

All the cruising over two years in the Caribbean and Bahamas have been from the flybridge. Only used the helm station in the US when and where the temperatures were too cool or cold to be on top.

After 4 years of cruising I would delete the helm station and move it with full finished cabin enclosure with day head to the flybridge, as long as windows could be opened.

 

[Caballero II]

Flybridge shade

On the Great Lakes i would not be without my flybridge steering station. If we are cruising, 99% of the time we are on top. The Admiral occasionally likes the bimini up but I usually prefer 'full sun". I wouldn't have an enclosure if you offered me one for free. It would be the first thing I got rid of an a boat. Give me LOTS of air and sunshine!

pete

Pete, while I normally concur with your curmudgeonly advice, I beg to differ. I love having a bimini/top here in SoCal. I don't need more sun on my head. I had a full flybridge containment, but got rid of the sides and aft enclosure. Most of the time we are outrunning the relative wind anyway, so most all relative wind is on the nose. Therefore, I just left up the zippered windshield and got rid of the rest. That way, if really an objectional wind in the face, I could drive in comfort from the flybridge. If I want to get rid of as much "sail-effect" as possible, I open up the bow facing glass. There is rarely enough wind from the side or aft to require glass from those quarters (except when I am fixed at the dock/slip) to make me want side or aft protection. The GB 36 I drive is so much easier to con from the flybridge, unless it is really rough and I am wishing I was not there to begin with. Then we go down below to the salon, and drive from there.

 

[mvweebles]

Visibility from lower helm of my Willard 36 Sedan is barely acceptable due to high bow and low sole. For day trips, flybridge. For longer passages where much running is via instruments anyway, lower helm

My best boating friend has a Horizon PC52. It has an enclosed FB with hard top and glass forward windows and soft sides. In theory the panels can be raised. In practice at least a couple zippers are always broken. It's a hot box and the AC barely keeps up even on moderate days in Florida.

I went with a hard top and no enclosure, though adding one would be simple. My friend thinks I'm nuts - that I will cook without AC. Of course, my position is AC is only needed because there is an enclosure

One thing I've noticed is that FB enclosures and biminis are very tall with 7.5' or more of head room. I was worried my boat would look boxy so i designed my hard top with a pronounced camber in the center and about 6.5 ft of headroom, closer to 6 ft at the edges, but there are benches there so no standing anyway. The W36 also has fairly high comings on the flybridge, augmented by 14" high venturi windscreen so its well protected from rain and sun.

Peter

 

[wkearney99]

I love having both stations but generally keep the flybridge enclosure panels stored unless we're really getting an early start/late end to the season. I hate fiddling with the panels. Our EB47 has large ones, probably strataglass or something similar (not labeled). They don't roll. To open them you have to unzip and tilt a panel back up to the ceiling and clip it to the bimini arch.

When the weather's nice we always run from the flybridge, the visibility is just better. I can, and have, run from the lower helm but typically do so only when the weather's miserable. Rain, cold or excessive heat. We had a run back from Baltimore one summer that was over 100F with a tailwind. It was stifling hot, so it was nice to head below with the AC running. The flybridge has no AC of it's own, though the two salon air handlers are situated inside the forward compartment. I could have some take-offs configured but haven't considered it necessary.

As for handling, sure, the added surface when it's enclosed does affect handling but only when there's a lot of wind. The tricky part is adapting your handling when you're not used to the panels being in place. All the little cues/tricks you're use to during docking without them are just slightly 'off' when there's added wind pressure against them.

 

[monti]

Bimini for a Jefferson 53?

Our Jefferson 53 does not have a Bimini installed. We plan to use the boat in the pacific northwest mainly in the Canadian gulf islands. I have read a lot in the forum on Biminis but my question is will a Bimini without the enclosure hold up during the winter rain and snow? I love a Bimini above the fly deck even during light rain. It offers another spaced to enjoy the outdoors and provides some sun protection. If the snow damages the canvas I assume the replacement cost of just the canvas would not be that significant. Any comments on your experience of Biminis during the winter with rain and snow would be appreciate…. Pat

 

[Comodave]

It depends on the actual size of the canvas. But I suspect it would be in the range of $4K for a 50’+ boat.

 

[wkearney99]

Rain isn't typically a problem, high-winds may be though. As for snow, we take our bimini down for the winter. While it uses 1.25" tubing it's not really designed to handle a snow load. The potential for the heavy weight of a shifting snow load seems like it would put high stress on the mounting hardware and into the fiberglass than rain, making it not worth the gamble. But that's with our random winter weather in the Mid-Atlantic. Some years there's next to nothing (like this past winter) while others have been much worse.

 

[koliver]

Our Jefferson 53 does not have a Bimini installed. We plan to use the boat in the pacific northwest mainly in the Canadian gulf islands. I have read a lot in the forum on Biminis but my question is will a Bimini without the enclosure hold up during the winter rain and snow? I love a Bimini above the fly deck even during light rain. It offers another spaced to enjoy the outdoors and provides some sun protection. If the snow damages the canvas I assume the replacement cost of just the canvas would not be that significant. Any comments on your experience of Biminis during the winter with rain and snow would be appreciate…. Pat

I am in the Canadian Gulf Islands.
We typically get little snow. This winter was typical. One snowfall of 10 cm of powder snow, a week later, a snowfall of 25 cm of heavy, wet snow.
I keep an eye on boats at the local YC Outstation. They are there for the winter. Several have unprotected Biminis. None suffered damage from the snow. Nor have I seen any damage from snow in other years. My own boat lives in a shelter in the winter months and I am more concerned about the weight of a heavy snowfall bringing the shelter roof down onto my boat than I would ever be about a Bimini being unable to support the weight of a heavy snowfall.
You should cross that item off your worry list.

 

[Comodave]

Back in about 2004 we had a bimini top damaged by a Gull Sweep. It tipped over a bit and cut a perfect 180 degree arc in the Sunbrella. To replace the canvas was $2100. It was a 46’ but the bimini was large. So I suspect that the canvas for the bimini on a 53’ now would be $4K+.

 

[CharlieO.]

Regarding snow load it is also hard on the stitching.

Our boat came with a three sided enclosure over flybridge helm and I think I have the frame and canvas to extend over the flybridge lounge area. Our boat is small so the additional mostly enclosed space will be nice, whether piloting or lounging. If our boat didn't come with it, probably would have just gone with a hard top for solar panels, and mooring canvas for the flybridge rather than get a canvas enclosure.