Compost Head - my take on Natures Head after a month

[Miz Trom]

We went with the Nature's Head on our previous boat, for the exact same reasons Peter did: reliability and simplicity.

During our six months living aboard, I did grow tired of the "ick factor" of emptying the poop compartment, even though it barely smelled.

However, I was also well aware that I was nostalgic for this aspect of land living: flush and it goes away. I had to remind myself that living aboard requires certain sacrifices. Living aboard is not a vacation.

In every way, I found the Nature's Head to be far less maintenance than our former Vacuflush heads on several previous boats. We purchased a second urine container for those situations when it was unseemly to empty the urine.

Before we sold the big boat, I was mulling other options, in particular the Marine Elegance (on Peggy's advice) or the Laveo, a.k.a. the "Jiffy Poop." The Jiffy Poop requires a weekly stop at a marina dumpster, so only workable for coastal cruising. But the Marine Elegance requires finding working pump-out stations.

Now that we are refitting a 24-ft trailerable camper boat, we are going to try the Laveo. It appears to be the toilet with the lightest "ick factor." And since we will only be cruising for short bursts of time, it appears to suit our needs. However, it does require a larger electrical supply than the tiny fan on the Nature's Head, so that adds some complexity and maintenance.

I'd love to see Laveo develop a urine-diverting head. I'm also well aware that we could end up switching out the Laveo for a Nature's Head, if the Laveo ever breaks. Any system on a boat that has reliability and simplicity built in is a big plus in my book.

Cheers,
Mrs. Trombley

 

[mvweebles]

Peter, was your past experience with the ubiquitos Vacuflush? If so, that explains a lot. A Marine Elegance head is truly flush and forget with the added benefit of not needing a macerating overboard pump. Simply use a Dometic TW series pump, almost bullet proof. Lived aboard for six years so daily use and not a single problem.

Yes, I keep hearing rumors of unicorns such as yourself and Comodave who have gleeful relationships with their head systems (and I mean system, not just the head itself).

Kidding aside, my head itself - a Groco Model K - was pretty reliable. But the rest of the head system has some inherrent limitations, the two biggies for me are (1) failures are unpredictable and can be crippling; and (2) constant search for pump-outs, especially for those of us who don't have huge holding tanks. BTW - I suspect there are a lot of people who discharge illegally because chance of getting caught is near zero and going to a pump-out is a PITA. I'm probably one of those types except my wife would castrate me with a dull rusty knife.

I'll use an analogy. I'm of a certain age that when I grew up, Jaguar (cars) roamed the highways. Such beautiful pieces of machinery! Conversation was always "Yea, but they aren't reliable..." To which the response was "Oh, that was the older ones - they are much better now." For 25-model years, the problem was solved with the next one you don't own (slight exaggeration). That mirrors my experience with head systems (Exhibit #1 - I purchased a gremlin-infected ElectroSan treat/release device to avoid pump-outs as a liveaboard - apparently my purchase decision coincided with really lousy devices - I'm told they are much better now).

All I can say is when the dust settled for me, the upside to a compost head was better. Probably the one thing that would have altered the decision is if we thought we'd have a lot of guests aboard like we used to have - compost head would be over-whelmed pretty quickly.

Peter

 

[mvweebles]

We went with the Nature's Head on our previous boat, for the exact same reasons Peter did: reliability and simplicity.

During our six months living aboard, I did grow tired of the "ick factor" of emptying the poop compartment, even though it barely smelled.

However, I was also well aware that I was nostalgic for this aspect of land living: flush and it goes away. I had to remind myself that living aboard requires certain sacrifices. Living aboard is not a vacation.

In every way, I found the Nature's Head to be far less maintenance than our former Vacuflush heads on several previous boats. We purchased a second urine container for those situations when it was unseemly to empty the urine.

Before we sold the big boat, I was mulling other options, in particular the Marine Elegance (on Peggy's advice) or the Laveo, a.k.a. the "Jiffy Poop." The Jiffy Poop requires a weekly stop at a marina dumpster, so only workable for coastal cruising. But the Marine Elegance requires finding working pump-out stations.

Now that we are refitting a 24-ft trailerable camper boat, we are going to try the Laveo. It appears to be the toilet with the lightest "ick factor." And since we will only be cruising for short bursts of time, it appears to suit our needs. However, it does require a larger electrical supply than the tiny fan on the Nature's Head, so that adds some complexity and maintenance.

I'd love to see Laveo develop a urine-diverting head. I'm also well aware that we could end up switching out the Laveo for a Nature's Head, if the Laveo ever breaks. Any system on a boat that has reliability and simplicity built in is a big plus in my book.

Cheers,
Mrs. Trombley

Mrs. Trombley - I believe your previous boat was a new build. Did the Compost Head have any resistance in the resale market? Thoughts?

Peter

 

[rslifkin]

Yes, I keep hearing rumors of unicorns such as yourself and Comodave who have gleeful relationships with their head systems (and I mean system, not just the head itself).

Kidding aside, my head itself - a Groco Model K - was pretty reliable. But the rest of the head system has some inherrent limitations, the two biggies for me are (1) failures are unpredictable and can be crippling; and (2) constant search for pump-outs, especially for those of us who don't have huge holding tanks. BTW - I suspect there are a lot of people who discharge illegally because chance of getting caught is near zero and going to a pump-out is a PITA. I'm probably one of those types except my wife would castrate me with a dull rusty knife.

I think having a large holding tank (and 2 heads) definitely makes the head system much less painful. Pumpouts get less frequent, so inability to find one for a few days or a failure of the macerator for overboard discharge isn't nearly as crippling. And with 2 heads, just about anything else that goes wrong (excluding the tank itself or ability to empty it) isn't a showstopper either.

I'd generally say our head system has been quite reliable, but it's also kept relatively simple compared to some (such as no extra valves and plumbing for direct discharge, everything goes to the tank first).

 

[Bkay]

A good writeup and I have had the same not-unpleasant ("pleasant" doesn't seem the right word) experience with my Nature's Head. I won't go back either. I agree with Tad Robert's comment on Nature's Head when I was planning my boat - they work fine, and it's almost worth doing it just to eliminate a couple holes in the bottom of your boat.

 

[Hippocampus]

Still think an incinerating checks all the boxes except for the electrical draw. No through hull, no plumbing, if it’s burnable it burns it, whatever you throw in is burnt, no mess, no bugs, no possible violations of any regulations. Issue is electrical draw is significant and you have something that gets real hot inside.
If I was spec’ing a new boat it would have two heads. One incinerating. The other a ME with a Y valve that would take fresh or salt. Our habit with two MEs and two holding tanks was once offshore not use one of them at all. The other set to use salt with direct overboard. Given that holding tank never filled no issue with smell. Made for fewer runs of the RO device. When coastal again fill that tank with fresh via the head in order to flush out that system entirely.
If I had a Incinolet I’d shut down the ME when coastal (except if another couple onboard ) When on shore power a non issue. I’d give it its own bank and even use the genset to keep that bank sufficiently charged if necessary when not plugged in.

We have an incinolet user here. Would like to hear about his day to day.

 

[heysteve]

Simply use a Dometic TW series pump, almost bullet proof. Lived aboard for six years so daily use and not a single problem.

One day my TW pump stopped pumping... I could hear it trying but it wasn't emptying the tank. Weird... the thing IS almost bullet proof. So I proceed to take the hoses off the pump and check the duckbill valves and found a single lemon seed stuck and holding the duckbill lips open! I was relieved it was such a simple fix but it's amazing how anything that can go wrong will go wrong

 

[mvweebles]

..... And with 2 heads, just about anything else that goes wrong (excluding the tank itself or ability to empty it) isn't a showstopper either.

I'd generally say our head system has been quite reliable, but it's also kept relatively simple compared to some (such as no extra valves and plumbing for direct discharge, everything goes to the tank first).

That's the type of failure that I really want to avoid - unpredictable and crippling. To my thought process, I wouldn't know I had a problem until I tried to pump-out my tank. Surprise! For some reason, I can't pump-out!!! In my opening post, I was exactly that situation: my macerator died a couple days before heading 500 nms south with me and two crew aboard. I had some options but they were fairly unique to a 50-year old boat with an overboard discharge (which was above waterline....yuck!).

It's rarely discussed, but I think a head system is a mission-critical system. Having fail can really disrupt a trip as much as loss of an autopilot. If I were building a larger boat with two heads, I would have dual systems (two holding tanks), not just two heads. These days, heads are pretty reliable. And I would seriously consider one 'normal' marine head and one compost head (though for a new build, would have the tank installed and thru-hulls/wiring for pump, etc.).

Peter

 

[DavidM]

This has been an interesting discussion.

I am surprised at the number of head plumbing problems that Peter and others have reported. That was not my experience during decades of cruising.

In a larger boat, two heads, one composting and another a conventional sea water head flushing into a decent size holding tank makes a lot of sense.

I am also surprised with the issues mentioned of dumping a salt water based holding tank into a marina’s sewage system. I never saw any restrictions during decades of coastal cruising in salt water. I suspect the concentration of salt in a sewage plant that serves coastal marinas is trivial, probably not measurable.

David

 

[mvweebles]

Still think an incinerating checks all the boxes except for the electrical draw. No through hull, no plumbing, if it’s burnable it burns it, whatever you throw in is burnt, no mess, no bugs, no possible violations of any regulations. Issue is electrical draw is significant and you have something that gets real hot inside.
If I was spec’ing a new boat it would have two heads. One incinerating. The other a ME with a Y valve that would take fresh or salt. Our habit with two MEs and two holding tanks was once offshore not use one of them at all. The other set to use salt with direct overboard. Given that holding tank never filled no issue with smell. Made for fewer runs of the RO device. When coastal again fill that tank with fresh via the head in order to flush out that system entirely.
If I had a Incinolet I’d shut down the ME when coastal (except if another couple onboard ) When on shore power a non issue. I’d give it its own bank and even use the genset to keep that bank sufficiently charged if necessary when not plugged in.

We have an incinolet user here. Would like to hear about his day to day.

Would also like to know venting requirements and whether adaptable to typical boat. Attached screen-grab is from their install manual - 4" vent is a tough nut to crack on most boats.

But I agree with you Hippocampus - having a 2-head/2-tank system provides a lot of redundancy and flexibility.

Peter

 

[Miz Trom]

Mrs. Trombley - I believe your previous boat was a new build. Did the Compost Head have any resistance in the resale market? Thoughts?

Peter

None. (And remarkable memory, Peter!)

Cheers,
Mrs. Trombely

 

[denverd0n]

Make no mistake, it's illegal to dump urine anywhere in US waters, NDZ or not. Peeing off a boat is not illegal. Peeing into a cup and immediately pouring it into the water becomes illegal.

True for pooping, also. That's what makes the federal marine sanitation laws so bizarre.

You can stand on your swim platform and pee or poop directly into the water, and you violate none of the marine sanitation laws. You may be violating OTHER laws, of course (public decency, for instance), but you are NOT violating the federal marine sanitation laws. The moment you pee (or poop) into a cup, though, and then dump that overboard, you HAVE violated the sanitation laws and are subject to severe fines.

I suppose it has to do with the difficulty of writing laws that cover every situation, but it really makes no sense.

 

[mvweebles]

This will sound self-serving (and to some extent, it is), but I distinquish between illegal and irresponsible. Feces is a problem, a big problem. Even in low concentrations it causes issues - even microscopic amounts can get you sick. On the other hand, urine has an extremely low toxicity. In the concentrations I'm talking about - a couple gallons vs accidental discharge of municipal waste treatment (which is legal under some circumstances). I've searched and it just doesn't seem to be irresponsible though I freely admit it's illegal. There are two adverse effects I have found: First, urea dissociates to ammonia which while non-toxic to humans can effect some marine life. Second, residual chemicals from ingesting pharmaceuticals. But both issues seem to be based on massive concentrations - think municipal sewage release. So if someone can cite data from a credible and non-biased source (not conjecture or opinion) that shows even a gallon or two of urine into a large body of water is irresponsible, I'm all ears. It would influence my behavior.

Peter

 

[AdmiralS]

I originally had the Villa and upgraded to the Tiny. In my opinion the best toilet out of them all. Cleanup is a snap and the Tiny is just that, Tiny. Takes up a fraction of the space that the Villa 9200 did.

You can get with Urine container or diverter to suit your needs.

https://separett.com:80/en/en/toilets

 

[Old Sea Dog]

I am following this subject with interest. Our boat came with a "composting" head in aft cabin and raw water head in the forward cabin. I purchased a second manual pump head to replace the aft head. Wife is concerned about not hitting the diverter when when peeing. Curious as to whether this has been an issue for others. Not looking forward to replacing and replumbing the aft head. Already have a full slate of spring projects.

 

[Hippocampus]

The incinolet allows 10’ vertical with two elbows and a rain cap. But needs 1 1/2 - 2 kw for a complete cycle. For healthy high fiber folks like us can see that as a problem. The 4” ID shouldn’t be much of an issue. Have seen flue vents that size on boats.

 

[mvweebles]

I am following this subject with interest. Our boat came with a "composting" head in aft cabin and raw water head in the forward cabin. I purchased a second manual pump head to replace the aft head. Wife is concerned about not hitting the diverter when when peeing. Curious as to whether this has been an issue for others. Not looking forward to replacing and replumbing the aft head. Already have a full slate of spring projects.

There are two primary brands of compost heads - Nature's Head with a somewhat square solids' bin; and AirHead which has a round bin. Operating principle is identical. A Florida based company "C-Head" went dark last year - it had a removable crank handle that slid into the top. It was the most basic of the three, and used 1-gal jugs for urine collection. It was also the smallest of the three - I wanted to buy one for my van to replace a porta-potty but as I said, they seem to be out of business. Owner may have passed away. There are now several new entrants into the compost market, mostly driven by VanLife types so are smaller and more compact which is not necessarily a benefit for a compost head. One of thr things I like about my Natures Head is the height which is close to a standard "comfort height" home toilet (previously known as an ADA height).

I cannot comment on the other options, but would be tough for anyone to "miss" the urine diversion section of the head, at least for a woman. Maybe if she were very large or ver small, might be possible to skew alignment (small children do). Plus, on the Natures Head, the trap door for solids is sloped and there appears to be a small slot to divert small amounts of moisture forward into the urine tank. I have not tested it so can't say for sure. I doubt it would divert a full flow release, but a small miss would likely be workable.

Attached is a pic I grabbed off a Google search. Maybe someone with an airhead can comment. Would help to know what brand of compost head you have.

Peter

 

[Snapdragon III]

One of the incidences that led me to go composting on my last boat was having the outlet of my holding tank plug up. The deck fitting and overboard pump shared the same outlet fitting off the bottom of the tank. I ended up pulling the inspection port on the top of the tank and reaching in bicept deep into the mostly full tank to clear the outlet. It was not a good experience but it worked. It was not clear what had caused the clog, but it worked good after I had poked at it. We were using crappy RV toilet paper that should not have caused any problems, and there were no signs a prohibited item had been flushed.

After this incident we stopped flushing paper all together. It was not nearly as bad as I though it would be. The bonus I haden't seem coming was that once we stopped flushing we could use nice toilet paper, baby wipes, feminine products, whatever.

On this boat the pump to empty the holding tank overboard, was a huge Edison diaphragm pump in the engine room. Pretty reliable set up. I think it was actually faster than the electric pumps on my current boat. I think it was also supposed to serve as an emergency manual bilge pump, but it was not in a great place for that use.

 

[Mako]

I think about what my wife and I have to go through when guests come. Yes, we're the ones who invite them and enjoy their company, but there is cooking, making up beds, washing linens after they leave, cleaning the bathroom, scrubbing the decks down because someone always refuses to follow instructions not to wear street shoes. But to add to that list that we have to clean up their pee-buckets and (literal) crap. There's a limit.

 

[Caballero II]

Urine is hardly inert and is not, as widely believed, sterile. Think about it. If everything else that comes out of a human body is a biohazard, why would urine be any different?

There are metabolites of whatever drugs you are taking, naturally occurring bacteria, and compounds like ammonia and urea. Ammonia is highly reactive with a lot of things. Urea (in DEF) is used to clean the exhaust emissions of diesel engines, can't do that if it is inert.

As an example, the reefs in the vicinity of Key West have been heavily damaged from all the urine released by reef snorkeling trips. Now they tell you not to pee on the reef.

Here's a simple test. Simply pee in your toilet and do not flush (an enclosed head helps). Come back in 12-24 hours. Notice the smell. If urine was inert, it would not smell any different after 24 hours from when it was first "dispensed".

Dude, urine is sterile, unless you've got a urinary tract infection. Not sure why that matters to this conversation. It is chemically reactive in many situations.

 

[Delta Riverat]

What happens if you get "the runs or the trots" you know when the solids are not so solid...

 

[Comodave]

I think about what my wife and I have to go through when guests come. Yes, we're the ones who invite them and enjoy their company, but there is cooking, making up beds, washing linens after they leave, cleaning the bathroom, scrubbing the decks down because someone always refuses to follow instructions not to wear street shoes. But to add to that list that we have to clean up their pee-buckets and (literal) crap. There's a limit.

Agree, it is bad enough cleaning up your own mess, we had a guest that left the head a mess one time. He was never on the boat again although he asked several times. I am not messing with OPW ( other people’s waste).

 

[Cargile]

Whether bacteria is good or bad depends on the situation and environment. E. Coli is a naturally occurring bacteria. In lots of situations it does no harm. Get certain strains of it inside you and you'll have a different opinion.

"Under normal circumstances, your urine in the bladder contains no bacteria or other organisms, but that's not the case when bacteria enter your urine through the urethra."

 

[dannc]

What happens if you get "the runs or the trots" you know when the solids are not so solid...

One will have to empty the bucket sooner.

Later,
Dan

 

[mvweebles]

Agree, it is bad enough cleaning up your own mess, we had a guest that left the head a mess one time. He was never on the boat again although he asked several times. I am not messing with OPW ( other people’s waste).

I think about what my wife and I have to go through when guests come. Yes, we're the ones who invite them and enjoy their company, but there is cooking, making up beds, washing linens after they leave, cleaning the bathroom, scrubbing the decks down because someone always refuses to follow instructions not to wear street shoes. But to add to that list that we have to clean up their pee-buckets and (literal) crap. There's a limit.

As mentioned before, a Compost Head doesn't scale well for many guests so not a good choice for that reason alone.

But let's be fair - head system clogs happen. A good friend used to single-hand his Brewer 45 PH Sailboat. As his two daughters matured into teenage years, they started bringing friends which invariably led to clogs (his telling, not mine). We all have stories of clogs so we all know what's involved in opening-up a holding tank/hoses and the inevitable spills.

I think the "Ick Factor" comes from thinking the stuff in the compost bin is similar sewage - it's not even close. Doesn't smell like sewage, doesn't look like sewage. A head clog is disgusting because the stuff is, well, raw sewage. Routine emptying of a compost head isn't the highlight of the day, but it bears zero resemblance to mucking in raw sewage.

So I also ask, given there's an active thread on dog-poop, why is it few think twice about having raw animal poo/pee on deck where there's a decent chance someone will walk barefoot in the next couple hours? Or why there's little retiscence about picking up a still-warm dog turd with a plastic-bag wrapped hand? Don't get me wrong, to a lessor level, I totally understand the difference between the emotional reaction ('eeeewwww - I can't believe I'm handling Sally/Jim's crap!') and the intellectual reaction ('Bruno's gotta do his business....'). Perception is reality. But intellectually I can't square the box. I can tell you that for me, dealing with a compost head contents is pretty similar to a litter box - not the highlight of the day, but not gut-wrenching either. I'd do it 100-times to avoid dealing with a clogged marine system.

What happens if you get "the runs or the trots" you know when the solids are not so solid...

I've wondered this too. Best I can tell, it could be a problem if a prolonged bout of diarrhea - could lead to having to change the solids bin earlier than expected, though I'll add that on a holding tank system, would mean more flushes and earlier pump-out so somewhat balances out. But for what I call 'travelers diarrhea' where it's sort of a one-and-done event, not a problem. The coco coir is very absorbant; but too much moisture in the solids bin is a problem and to be avoided.

I am a bit surprised folks are so blase about pump-outs. On the Nordhavn 625 thread I posted a link to PAE's European sales which shows the boat has 110g black water; 120g grey water. But carries 600g of fresh water. How long will either last with 4-5 people onboard? A week? The Helmsman 38 has black water capacity of 45g. How long does that last with full-time use? How easy is it for most folks to get to a pumpout, especially if they like hanging out on their boat but don't always go out? For me, just not worth it. If overboard discharge were legal and responsible, I'd go that route. But it's not.

Peter

 

[rslifkin]

I am a bit surprised folks are so blase about pump-outs. On the Nordhavn 625 thread I posted a link to PAE's European sales which shows the boat has 110g black water; 120g grey water. But carries 600g of fresh water. How long will either last with 4-5 people onboard? A week? The Helmsman 38 has black water capacity of 45g. How long does that last with full-time use? How easy is it for most folks to get to a pumpout, especially if they like hanging out on their boat but don't always go out? For me, just not worth it. If overboard discharge were legal and responsible, I'd go that route. But it's not.

That goes back to what I was saying about most boats having too-small holding tanks. A too-small tank makes use of the system more annoying and makes pumpout logistics or problems more of an issue. I've seen mid 30 foot range sailboats where the tank is so tiny they'll fill it in an afternoon with guests aboard.

Our boat is similar in size to the Helmsman 38, but we have a 70 gallon black water tank. I wouldn't mind even a bit bigger, but we don't really need it. With 2 of us on board, the current tank is good for ~10 days without trying to conserve. That's longer than our water tankage is typically good for, and we've never had a time where a pumpout was a problem, we've always come across one before we were in dire need. When we're not traveling and just aboard some during the week and on weekends, we typically end up stopping by the fuel dock for a pumpout every 2 - 3 weeks. I don't think we've ever gone longer than that without leaving the dock for other reasons except maybe right at the start of the season.

That said, I definitely can see some appeal to the composting heads. But I'm not sure I'd want one unless on a boat that couldn't handle a sufficiently large holding tank with a good plumbing layout.

 

[Hippocampus]

Use watched the vid of N625 commissioning. Would note have never seen a substantial ocean cruising boat without a RO unit or two. As you know Peter most folks carry storm provisions of an adequate amount for survival while on passage. That’s food and drink sufficient should the frig/freezers break or the watermaker(s) and can’t be fixed underway.

Passage you fill everything up but coastal you may not. When you have huge tanks like that and are only doing short hops and not crossing oceans you may choose to not run with full tanks. Europe is differently than us as regards grey water. I have a grey water tank. Mostly sees shower water. It’s there due to the level of the sole in the shower pans. It is automatically pumped overboard unless I turn off the breaker. It’s nearly never turned off.

One notes that’s a three cabin boat with freshwater only tecma heads. Add in showers and wash downs and she’s going to be using a lot of water beyond drinking or cooking. Would think an RO to be be pretty much required. There’s a place for panels on the Bimini for the flybridge but would think the NL will see use at anchor. Of interest stock batteries are lead acid AGMs.

She’s drop dead gorgeous and happy to see no balsa anywhere. Surprised a get home isn’t stock as they’ve gone the N41/51 route making most things stock.
Don’t think folks on boats derived from the 60 hull would spec desiccating heads.

 

[mvweebles]

That said, I definitely can see some appeal to the composting heads. But I'm not sure I'd want one unless on a boat that couldn't handle a sufficiently large holding tank with a good plumbing layout.

I agree with you on both counts. A large holding tank makes life easier, and if you have an adequate system with a large tank, case for a compost head reduces. I've tried to be fair - compost head has some limitations beyond Ick Factor. Many people with larger boats have them because they like to have quite a few friends and family with them. Compost is not a good choice. And the Marine Elegance makes a lot of sense because it looks and operates a lot like a traditional house-toilet.

Outside of reliability issues, the biggest hurdle with traditional holding tank systems is the need for pump-out. For many, it's a hassle, especially in areas where pump-outs are scarce or they don't work. Becomes easy to justify flipping-the-switch and dumping as a work-around which I suspect happens quite a bit.

So you pick your poison - neither system is perfect. For me, on a small boat that could barely squeeze-in a 35g black water tank, I decided the Ick Factor was a mind-over-matter thing and to just get over it. If I still hosted many friends for events, a compost head would not be an option. If I had a larger boat with ability to better design a head system, might make a different decision.

Peter

 

[Hippocampus]

Anything is better than a true head. Imagine going out on the bowsprit hanging on in a seaway and taking a dump.

I like a head where you can brace against the closed door, a locker or bulkhead if it’s sporty. Wonder if the diversion in desiccating heads work in such conditions.

 

[mvweebles]

....
I like a head where you can brace against the closed door, a locker or bulkhead if it’s sporty. Wonder if the diversion in desiccating heads work in such conditions.

I don't think there's a material difference. Head is bolted down and feels pretty secure. Not having a bowl of water would help. Its possible the urine bottle would slosh which might be a problem but i doubt it. Less likely than the jack-in-the-box milk & egg launchers (aka fridges) found on almost all boats these days. But I'll let you know if my grand plan to avoid bad weather does not work out.

Peter