A question for couples who cruise.

[Bryant]

Couples who cruise

Hi

Were still studying for what boat and another question came up. My wife has concerns that if we get a pilot house then one person will be at the helm and the other in the salon making for a lonely experience. We are active motorhomers and when traveling we are both up front until we reach our destination.
For husband and wife teams where do you hang out when traveling. Does she have a point with the pilot house design? My thought would be that we would both either be in the pilot house or flybridge

Just to clear something up, are you talking about a boat with only a pilot house, as in many tugs, or are you talking about a boat with a steering station in the saloon and a flybridge? For my taste, I would not own a trawler or tug style boat over 27 ft that didn’t have two helm stations, for lots of reasons; protection from weather, visibility in marinas or anchorages, communication while anchoring or docking and so on. If you have two helm stations, you will both naturally gravitate to the one that works best. At anchor, in the morning, my wife loves the flybridge and I generally have coffee and read in the saloon. Evening cocktails find us both on the flybridge and throughout the day will find us all over the boat or off it together or separately. If you are asking for advice, buy a boat with an upper and lower helm station. You will figure it out. Sorry if I’m being dense and this isn’t your question. Good luck.

 

[rjwilliams11741]

Our Pilot House had seating for several people plus a Watch Berth.

 

[Moonfish]

You will probably find, especially moving at trawler speeds, that both of you will move about a bit. Even a passage of 2-3 hours might require a potty break, something to eat, grab a book (for the person NOT driving!), etc. As long as the helm position has space for at the very least the co-captain, you will likely spend the majority of time together while underway.

 

[Irish Rambler]

We have a flybridge which we use full time on canals with both taking equal 'duties' but when we're doing sea passages we take turns to pilot from the lower helm during the day with the other partner making meals, napping, toilet breaks etc.
I've great night vision/vigilance (blame the military) and love night passages
(we chose the weather) so I rest during the day and pilot from the flybridge for night passages.
It works really well for the admiral and I.
Once were safely moored we have a nice meal, crack open a bottle of wine and sorry guys …. but the next bit is censored......

 

[Comodave]

We have a flybridge only helm. We are both up there all the time we are underway except for the occasional head break. When we bought the boat it only had 1 helm seat. For the trip home I made a platform for a deck chair. Bolted the deck chair to the platform so that whoever was using the second seat could see over the side and front of the flybridge. When we got the boat home one of the first jobs was to permanently install a second helm seat. No way are the bench seats comfortable enough for hours underway day after day. When we are doing long distance cruising it will just be the 2 of us and the dog. The dog gets the bench seat to port and he seems to like it.

 

[Ang]

Our pilothouse is set up so ours seats are next to each other and makes it easy to share piloting tasks and awareness. The majority of the time we are both in the pilothouse. If you are new to boating you may want to consider purchasing a wireless headset. Can help communications in close quarters maneuvering.
Enjoy.

 

[Comodave]

We both are on the bridge underway but when one goes below we use the intercom to let the one at the helm know to look for the one coming up. It sure helps to have 2 sets of eyes at the helm to check the MFD, watch for nav aids and general situational awareness.

 

[BandB]

Wifey B: When it's just the two of us, we're together. We split time at the helm. And when I say together, often that's verrrrrrrrrrrrryyyyyyyyyyyyyy close together.

Now, before you get upset, we keep our attention on the water and what's going on around us.

 

[Nepidae]

I wouldn't own a PH trawler. I will admit, they do have a look.

Driving aside, there are other reasons.

1) a PH has all SR in the bow. Has to by function of the design. We like our MSR, in the stern, separated from any company that might be aboard in the fwd v-berth.

2) by design, a PH can't have a sundeck. We spend so much time on our sundeck we couldn't imagine a boat w/o a sundeck. Great for entertaining or just sitting and reading. It offers more room, that a cockpit can't match, even in the rain.

Our trawler has a lower helm station with a seat that 2 could use, but we drive 99.999% of the time from the bridge. She sits about 4' to my left which allows communication, we also wear headsets when moving around the boat, a strong recommendation to get, so we are together while moving. IF I need to go below for any reason, she stays seated and I hand her the autopilot remote so she now controls the boat from her seat.

The bridge also offers a view unparalleled by a PH. Great for a cruising couple to share the sights & sounds of the day.

We also have a 3/4 enclosure so on cool mornings we keep the enclosure closed and as it warms we roll up panels to what is comfortable. PH doesn't allow that kind of adjustment.

The view from the bridge is also better for docking, undocking than you will get from a PH.

IF the weather is iffy, we will generally stay put but we have been caught in a few squalls that tested our endurance, not the boats, and have found that operation from the bridge is still the best place to be. I have found that in certain water conditions it is a good idea to tack, the bridge provides a higher view on the water to facilitate that.

I'd suggest you do your own due diligence to compare a PH to a bridge. Walk the docks and talk to people. Ask to see the views from both locations and make up your own minds.

Good luck.

 

[rslifkin]

1) a PH has all SR in the bow. Has to by function of the design. We like our MSR, in the stern, separated from any company that might be aboard in the fwd v-berth.

2) by design, a PH can't have a sundeck. We spend so much time on our sundeck we couldn't imagine a boat w/o a sundeck. Great for entertaining or just sitting and reading. It offers more room, that a cockpit can't match, even in the rain.

I don't think either of those is true. What prevents a pilothouse from having an aft stateroom or a sundeck on top of that aft stateroom?

 

[Moonfish]

I wouldn't own a PH trawler. I will admit, they do have a look.

Driving aside, there are other reasons.

1) a PH has all SR in the bow. Has to by function of the design. We like our MSR, in the stern, separated from any company that might be aboard in the fwd v-berth.

2) by design, a PH can't have a sundeck. We spend so much time on our sundeck we couldn't imagine a boat w/o a sundeck. Great for entertaining or just sitting and reading. It offers more room, that a cockpit can't match, even in the rain.

Our trawler has a lower helm station with a seat that 2 could use, but we drive 99.999% of the time from the bridge. She sits about 4' to my left which allows communication, we also wear headsets when moving around the boat, a strong recommendation to get, so we are together while moving. IF I need to go below for any reason, she stays seated and I hand her the autopilot remote so she now controls the boat from her seat.

The bridge also offers a view unparalleled by a PH. Great for a cruising couple to share the sights & sounds of the day.

We also have a 3/4 enclosure so on cool mornings we keep the enclosure closed and as it warms we roll up panels to what is comfortable. PH doesn't allow that kind of adjustment.

The view from the bridge is also better for docking, undocking than you will get from a PH.

IF the weather is iffy, we will generally stay put but we have been caught in a few squalls that tested our endurance, not the boats, and have found that operation from the bridge is still the best place to be. I have found that in certain water conditions it is a good idea to tack, the bridge provides a higher view on the water to facilitate that.

I'd suggest you do your own due diligence to compare a PH to a bridge. Walk the docks and talk to people. Ask to see the views from both locations and make up your own minds.

Good luck.

Wow, not sure where to even begin with this post, as there are quite a few incorrect statements, generalizations and assumptions...

 

[Nepidae]

Usually, more often than not and almost always, a PH doesn't by design provide enough space below the saloon to have a SR or MSR. Usually, and most often, that would be taken up by the engines.

Look here https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2004/defever-pilothouse-3614147/ for an example of a PH. Note no portlights below the saloon.

As to a sundeck, look here https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2009/defever-e45-3645617/ and you will see portlights aft of the saloon.

I guess maybe I should have said that there could be a sundeck aft of the bridge on a PH, but it wouldn't be covered therefore losing some of its functionality. Most with a PH design seems to use the bridge as a lounging spot.

I hope this clarifies my point.

Again, look over each design, go onboard each, and make your own judgments.

 

[Codger2]

Wifey B: When it's just the two of us, we're together. We split time at the helm. And when I say together, often that's verrrrrrrrrrrrryyyyyyyyyyyyyy close together.

Now, before you get upset, we keep our attention on the water and what's going on around us. :)

Yeh, I'll bet you do!

 

[firehoser75]

Nepidae
"Again, look over each design, go onboard each, and make your own judgments."
That part I do agree with. Personally, I definitely did not want the kind of boat you have!
I don't mean anything personal with that, I am glad that it sounds like you have the "right" boat for you, just not right for me.
There are many different opinions out there in forum land regarding what are the best boat features. That is a good thing, otherwise all we would ever see is the same thing over and over again, and there are many ways to use your boat.

I always suggest to a "new power boater", to take your time, determine how you plan on using YOUR boat, "look around", and from there determine your list of wants, don't want, and nice to have.

I am sure that there are many very different lists that are used, hopefully to obtain the best boat for them!

 

[BrianSmith]

We're both on the flybridge 99% of the time while underway.

And we tend to concentrate on different things, me mostly focused close in and on engine gauges and so forth, her mostly looking at nav-related info further out... and both of us watching out so as to not hit stuff (crab pots, debris, etc.).

-Chris

That describes our situation to a T!

 

[Airstream345]

When underway we are both up in there. We have a Stidd chair and a bench that converts into a watch berth so everyone has room. (I highly recommend a captains chair for longer trips).

The kids/guests come up and hang out on shorter trips but typically congregate in the salon on long stretches (big sectional couch makes things more comfortable).

One advantage when not underway is the separation it offers. I work from home and the RPH/helm is my office.

 

[markpierce]

Weebies, thank goodness for Dutch doors.

 

[menzies]

I wouldn't own a PH trawler. I will admit, they do have a look.

Driving aside, there are other reasons.

1) a PH has all SR in the bow. Has to by function of the design. We like our MSR, in the stern, separated from any company that might be aboard in the fwd v-berth.

Nope, many have center cabins separated from the guest cabin by a passageway that often contains the second head. I would suggest one downside with your set up is that one of your heads has a very long run to the holding tank meaning much higher maintenance.

2) by design, a PH can't have a sundeck. We spend so much time on our sundeck we couldn't imagine a boat w/o a sundeck. Great for entertaining or just sitting and reading. It offers more room, that a cockpit can't match, even in the rain.

Most have large boat decks behind the FB with plenty of room for socializing, if too much sun either move into the FB sitting area or the cockpit.

Our trawler has a lower helm station with a seat that 2 could use, but we drive 99.999% of the time from the bridge. She sits about 4' to my left which allows communication, we also wear headsets when moving around the boat, a strong recommendation to get, so we are together while moving. IF I need to go below for any reason, she stays seated and I hand her the autopilot remote so she now controls the boat from her seat.

The bridge also offers a view unparalleled by a PH. Great for a cruising couple to share the sights & sounds of the day.

We also have a 3/4 enclosure so on cool mornings we keep the enclosure closed and as it warms we roll up panels to what is comfortable. PH doesn't allow that kind of adjustment.

The view from the bridge is also better for docking, undocking than you will get from a PH.

You seem to be under the impression that boats with a PH do not have a FB? I would say the vast majority do have both. So they have all of this, plus the ability to go below in inclement weather, the best of both worlds.

IF the weather is iffy, we will generally stay put but we have been caught in a few squalls that tested our endurance, not the boats, and have found that operation from the bridge is still the best place to be. I have found that in certain water conditions it is a good idea to tack, the bridge provides a higher view on the water to facilitate that.

Again most PH vessels have both. Those with a PH can switch controls and stay dry. Not sure how being higher helps you tack?

I'd suggest you do your own due diligence to compare a PH to a bridge. Walk the docks and talk to people. Ask to see the views from both locations and make up your own minds.

You will be very frustrated if you narrow your selection to boats with just one of the two setups and miss many great vessels.

Good luck.

My comments in bold.

 

[High Wire]

When we first bought Irish Lady it only had a Sunbrella bimini top on the FB. We split 90/10% FB / lower station. In 2019 we added a full FB enclosure which allows occupation 99% of the running time. My wife rarely drives, except to give me short breaks. She does normally sit on the FB seating wherever the shade is. My wife will go below to make lunch or take a nap if it was a rough night. We have a pair of Motorola Walkabout walkie talkies that have an alarm/call function that she can hear over the engine or from a sound sleep. Plus its portable for wherever she is.
Our lower helm is not a true pilot house. There is only one helm chair. If she wants to look out when running from below that means standing for a long time. Unless we're going through a nasty thunderstorm, standing gets old fast.
I have been eying pilothouse type boats like a Nordic Tug or KK42 because lately our trips to the skin doctor to get stuff frozen off have increased. My wife has light Irish skin and has had several Mhos surgeries in spite of lots of SPF 50 Baby sunscreen use. A master stateroom in the bow is a no-go for her. So are lots of stairs or ladders. Boats with aft cabins and a true pilothouse are in the 42+ feet range and out of our budget.

 

[rslifkin]

Menzies, on the tacking thing in rough seas, a higher helm position can help up to a point, as you can see over the waves better, giving a better view of the sets to choose the best time to turn. Depending on the boat and the height of the pilothouse, it's not necessarily a huge advantage though.

 

[HiDHo]

We take 2 hour watches cruising our Manatee. 99% of the time we are both in the pilothouse. Whomever has the watch traverses locks, docks and has the helm. This system trains us both to handle any situation on their watch but more importantly emergency situations.

 

[Coastal Cruiser]

From Moonfish: "We also have a 3/4 enclosure so on cool mornings we keep the enclosure closed and as it warms we roll up panels to what is comfortable. PH doesn't allow that kind of adjustment."
Well, actually, it does. If it is hot we run the air conditioning. If it is cold we run the heat. What is the enclosed bridge option on a rainy hot day, or a buggy hot day?
We have a fly bridge that, when conditions suit us, is another place drive from without the distortion of traveling in a plastic bubble.
And the fly bridge automatically converts to a nice open sky bar around 5:00 most days.

 

[ranger58sb]

What is the enclosed bridge option on a rainy hot day, or a buggy hot day?

Reverse cycle AC.

We don't have that on our current boat, but it's not uncommon.

-Chris

 

[rgano]

I found the 55-foot pilothouse trawler we delivered last month to have VERY awkward seating arrangement helm-wise. While there was a most adequate sette on a raised platform out of reach of the helm, there was nothing but a creaky wooden director's chair for the helms to to sit at during prolonged AICW running. And for the wife sitting at the settee to access the stbd side stairway down to the salon/galley required me to get up out of the chair and move it so she could pass through - totally unsat.

On our own GB42 which came with a standing-only lower helm, we had a double-wide pilot bench built in.

 

[Codger2]

Reverse cycle AC.

We don't have that on our current boat, but it's not uncommon.

We don't either but it sure would be nice! It wouldn't be that hard to connect with a vent in the salon & pipe some air up there. (Warm & cool)

 

[rslifkin]

On my boat, we've got a single helm that flows right into the aft deck seating area, so anyone aboard is generally near the helm while underway unless they go below to use the head or do something in the galley.

Seating-wise, at the helm we've got a single helm seat, which at least for me puts my eyes at about the same height as if I stand and the control reach from the seat is good. So I normally sit.

We have a sort of nav station next to the helm, which I'd like to add a second captain's chair to at some point. Currently, we have one of the West Marine Kingfish chairs (the heavy stainless version) sitting at that spot. It does a good enough job of not sliding around or anything, but it's a bit too low. It's an ok height for nav duties, but not tall enough to have good sight lines over the bow while running on plane.

The attached picture gives an idea of the basic layout. There's a single sideways bench seat off to the port side next to the companionway, and then an L shaped settee behind where the photo was taken.

 

[Moonfish]

From Moonfish: "We also have a 3/4 enclosure so on cool mornings we keep the enclosure closed and as it warms we roll up panels to what is comfortable. PH doesn't allow that kind of adjustment."
Well, actually, it does. If it is hot we run the air conditioning. If it is cold we run the heat. What is the enclosed bridge option on a rainy hot day, or a buggy hot day?
We have a fly bridge that, when conditions suit us, is another place drive from without the distortion of traveling in a plastic bubble.
And the fly bridge automatically converts to a nice open sky bar around 5:00 most days.

That was not me. Any of the above statements in the quote. We have no enclosure or bimini on the flybridge.

 

[ranger58sb]

We don't either but it sure would be nice! It wouldn't be that hard to connect with a vent in the salon & pipe some air up there. (Warm & cool)

Probably wouldn't be hard to add. You might even have pre-existing ductwork, if it bridge AC was offered as an option. The boats I've looked at with bridge AC have their own dedicated units/ducting... and then some have a separate water pump, some T off existing pumps if there's enough waterflow capacity and if head pressure allows.

-Chris

 

[Codger2]

We don't either but it sure would be nice! It wouldn't be that hard to connect with a vent in the salon & pipe some air up there. (Warm & cool)

What we do have are 2- 4" diameter vents that are mounted in the venturi. (6" would be better) They really help getting cool air into the bridge on a rainy day. (The venturi being slanted down allows the air but not the rain to enter.) Really helps to keep the fog from forming inside the flybridge.

 

[Baker]

To aircondition that space, you need a dedicated unit and not just a "tap" off of another. Granted Walt, being in California helps as it is rarely hot....or humid. But on the Gulf Coast, no way. My salon and galley area have two 16k units that are located on the flybridge. There is a tap off of each one that puts air onto the flybridge. It is basically worthless and I would never declare my flybridge to be airconditioned.