Cheap sailboaters

[dhays]

Sorry, but that makes you a thief.

Yup. I agree completely.

 

[DPTrainor]

Many years ago there used to be nice anchorage areas in popular harbors. And also public moorings, many which were free to transients passing through - safe harbor in a storm or otherwise. Long standing traditions. We used to sail in and anchor or pick up a mooring. Fast forward to today, for better or worse, anchorage areas are more limited and mooring balls have been "monetized" as a service. I still go by the old rules, anchor or pick up a mooring. If someone comes over to collect money, I gladly pay, otherwise we are out by early morning on to the next harbor, cove or where ever.

 

[BandB]

I still go by the old rules, anchor or pick up a mooring. If someone comes over to collect money, I gladly pay, otherwise we are out by early morning on to the next harbor, cove or where ever.

So you feel it's appropriate for you just to ignore what you know to be the rules today? Does this mean you feel like it's ok to go into a store, get a soft drink out of the refrigerator and leave a nickel behind because that's the way it use to work?

I just don't grasp the philosophy that says it all should be free and especially don't understand what allows one to ignore paying the current rate, as long as they don't get caught.

 

[DPTrainor]

Yes, if the mooring fields expand and limit anchorage areas such that you can't get into harbor at night, I grab one of the 50 mooring balls that are empty in the area where anchoring used to be free.

 

[Bigsfish]

DP

I understand your philosophy and I see your point but I personally would never do so. Kind of like sneaking into a movie or not paying a toll. If you use the product you should be willing to pay for it. To each his own, we all have to live with ourselves.

 

[psneeld]

Yes, if the mooring fields expand and limit anchorage areas such that you can't get into harbor at night, I grab one of the 50 mooring balls that are empty in the area where anchoring used to be free.

I feel the same way about taxes.....you can call the IRS when I call the harbormaster....

Just kidding but people like you ultimately take a bad situation and only make it worse because it give everyone the full taste of the slippery slope.

 

[DHeckrotte]

Most of the mooring 'thieves' I see in Swan Creek Marina's (Rock Hall, MD) mooring field are powerboaters (certainly NOT trawlers!). OTOH, the dummies that anchor in the mooring field are pretty equally split, power and sail.

We use (and pay for) the public moorings in Annapolis. What a treat!

 

[BandB]

Yes, if the mooring fields expand and limit anchorage areas such that you can't get into harbor at night, I grab one of the 50 mooring balls that are empty in the area where anchoring used to be free.

So, am I safe to assume since you have deemed selective stealing to be ok, that if I see something in your yard or home I like and use to have one of, it's fine for me to just help myself? I don't know if you have a garage or not, but assuming you do, is it fine for me to park there.

 

[DPTrainor]

BandB you analogies are off. I was expressing seafaring traditions of the past and unfortunate changes of the present that infringe on the rights of those seeking refuge of harbor. I'm from the old school.

 

[BandB]

BandB you analogies are off. I was expressing seafaring traditions of the past and unfortunate changes of the present that infringe on the rights of those seeking refuge of harbor. I'm from the old school.

You can be from any school you choose, it's still stealing. Just because you think it should be free or it once was, doesn't make it so today. Seeking refuge of harbor? You're not seeking refuge from some horrible storm that swept in. You're seeking to use the harbor as a vacation spot.

I don't get this living in the past routine. You better get off the computer as it wasn't available then.

 

[psneeld]

Well, you are in the part of the country that started usurping traditional rights long ago, like the blanket NDZs, despite one of the birth places of USA freedoms.


Fortunately in most of the USA, legit or municipal anchorages aren't so overreaching to disallow anchoring nearby.

 

[Gmarr]

With the app Dockwa, can't people reserve and pay via the app? That would mean that the late arrival, early departed may have paid without needing any visit?

 

[DPTrainor]

You can be from any school you choose, it's still stealing. Just because you think it should be free or it once was, doesn't make it so today. Seeking refuge of harbor? You're not seeking refuge from some horrible storm that swept in. You're seeking to use the harbor as a vacation spot.

I don't get this living in the past routine. You better get off the computer as it wasn't available then.

I am offended. You presumptions and analogies are off the mark. I was talking about something entirely different. The rights of seaman and the expectations of the same for harbor refuge. As those rights are increasingly infringed upon by ever expanding commercialization of expanding mooring fields where once anchoring for 100's of years was the norm.

 

[BandB]

With the app Dockwa, can't people reserve and pay via the app? That would mean that the late arrival, early departed may have paid without needing any visit?

You possibly could if they had their mooring on Dockwa. Dockwa is still limited in participating marinas. Also, you can often get better rates dealing directly with the marina. We do not use Dockwa except on a limited few that use it as their only payment mechanism.

 

[psneeld]

I am offended. You presumptions and analogies are off the mark. I was talking about something entirely different. The rights of seaman and the expectations of the same for harbor refuge. As those rights are increasingly infringed upon by ever expanding commercialization of expanding mooring fields where once anchoring for 100's of years was the norm.

Actually...he is correct in that a lot of things that were free once aren't any more.

Force majeure is still recognized, but not sure that it incudes free anything but right to enter without permission and prosecution.....but not free of expenses.

 

[BandB]

I am offended. You presumptions and analogies are off the mark. I was talking about something entirely different. The rights of seaman and the expectations of the same for harbor refuge. As those rights are increasingly infringed upon by ever expanding commercialization of expanding mooring fields where once anchoring for 100's of years was the norm.

You're talking about mooring and not paying the required fee. What you could do for 100's of years is irrelevant. You want to argue rights then go to the state legislatures but meanwhile you owe the fee.

It's simple. There's a charge. It's legal. You pay or you're stealing the service.

 

[DPTrainor]

I'll give you the last word. You missed my main point

 

[AusCan]

I get your point DPT. It could be argued that the unwritten law of right of safe refuge is more important than the money grab going on by developing mooring fields.

It may not stand up in court, but I understand your principles. Occasionally, principles are more important than bylaws.

 

[BandB]

I'll give you the last word. You missed my main point

Then I'll take it. You missed my main point.

 

[O C Diver]

BandB you analogies are off. I was expressing seafaring traditions of the past and unfortunate changes of the present that infringe on the rights of those seeking refuge of harbor. I'm from the old school.

It's unlikely at any point in time that anything but a small percentage of moorings were free to use, storm or no storm. Certainly agree that in storm conditions, seeking safe refuge in a harbor would be reasonable. Think most of us here assume when you steal a mooring for the night, it likely has nothing to do with bad weather.

Ted

 

[FlyWright]

A marina neighbor has a blowboat on the East Coast. He recently told me that most moorings in ME are OK to use no questions asked and no fee as long as no one else needs it who has a right to be there!

Seems like he's not the only one with that warped perception.

 

[FF]

The best folks with moorings are in England.

They will put their boats name and tonnage on the ball so visiting boats can select a right sized mooring .

With 10-20ft tides moorings are more common than slips as are "mud berths" moorings that are dry during low tide

In the NE picking up an unused mooring is very common , no hassle , unless the moorings owner returns.

It is most common to thread a line thru the mooring eye , so it is not taken aboard where it could chafe.
Easy to free if the owner returns.

Commercial moorings are marked ,and folks (sail and power) usually only pick them up last.

It is up to the mooring owner to come out and collect , usually at sunset, frequently in a skiff painted to match the commercial moorings.

 

[AusCan]

I've never paid for using a mooring. They aren't overly common in South Australia, and none that I know of are installed for making a profit.

The ones I use most often are in a place called American River. Its an old whaling settlement on Kangaroo Island, and is a 4 knot tidal river reversing every 12 hours, so anchoring is a bit risky.

There is a local old timer who normally comes out in his tinny whenever a boat pulls into the mooring field. He suggests which mooring would be best suited for your boat and gives a hand to hook up. There is no charge. It's just the way things are done over there.

 

[CDreamer]

Imminent Domain

"Pay to Play" (or, "It's getting dark, dear.")

The evening of a perfect day
We pull into a pretty bay
To spend the night
And get some sleep.
The sounder says it's ten feet deep.

But now our hearts are full of rancor.
There simply is no place to anchor!
For, there before our vessel sprawls
An endless sea of mooring balls!

We check our books and quickly see
that none are shown as "use for free".
And yet, a look to either side
Confirms that few are occupied.

This brings us to a clear conundrum:
Is there a fee? A way to fund 'em?
We're leaving here at 0-630...
But would we feel a little dirty

Tying to somebody's sphere
To cook a meal and drink a beer?
Or should we try to drop the hook?
(Avoiding being deemed a crook).

So in the end we both decide
To pony up, and moor dockside.
And dream of how it used to be
When people anchored out...
For free.

 

[Bigsfish]

CD

Well done.

 

[ancora]

While we are on the subject of moorings, here is an ad from this months The Log:
"50' Avalon Harbor (Catalina Island) mooring for sale. Best priced 50' at $460,000."

 

[mbevins]

While we are on the subject of moorings, here is an ad from this months The Log:
"50' Avalon Harbor (Catalina Island) mooring for sale. Best priced 50' at $460,000."

That is the definition of Supply and Demand. I'd hate to see the rental rates.

 

[Gmarr]

While we are on the subject of moorings, here is an ad from this months The Log:
"50' Avalon Harbor (Catalina Island) mooring for sale. Best priced 50' at $460,000."

That view is worth the half mil. I wonder what the fee for the water taxi is nowadays

 

[Bigsfish]

Does the owner have to do the maintenance? LOL
Is it possible to rent the mooring out?

 

[BandB]

That is the definition of Supply and Demand. I'd hate to see the rental rates.

Yes, that area of California has one island to cruise to, Catalina, and it's very restricted in terms of moorings and access. In South Florida we have hundreds of islands both in the Keys and in the Bahamas. Plenty of places to dock, moor or anchor. You can buy an island for what their mooring cost in Avalon.

On the other hand, there are some slips and dockominiums in South Florida that have sold for more than the price of that mooring and then some people buy homes just for the docks.