Auto pilot or radar ....

[O C Diver]

As a friend of mine would put it, "when given a choice, take both".

Maybe the OP should get neither. Apparently he hasn't reached the point where either is indispensable. Go spend another season cruising without. If you get fatigued, stop and drop the hook. If you can't see where you're going, pull out of the channel, drop the hook, and practice blowing your whistle.

Maybe next winter you will know what your priorities are.

Ted

 

[jleonard]

Couldn't resist

 

[SteveK]

Before GPS there was Loran.

"If you can't see where you're going, pull out of the channel, drop the hook, and practice blowing your whistle."

WHY? all the other boats still moving in the fog have radar and know exactly where you have dropped the hook, right.

 

[O C Diver]

Before GPS there was Loran.

"If you can't see where you're going, pull out of the channel, drop the hook, and practice blowing your whistle."

WHY? all the other boats still moving in the fog have radar and know exactly where you have dropped the hook, right.

Nope, plenty of idiots without radar continue to run in the fog when they can't see past their anchor. They assume everybody else has radar and will avoid them.

Ted

 

[SteveK]

Nope, plenty of idiots without radar continue to run in the fog when they can't see past their anchor. They assume everybody else has radar and will avoid them.

Ted

Is this the tongue in cheek emoji,

 

[O C Diver]

Is this the tongue in cheek emoji,

Either this or this .

Ted

 

[OldDan1943]

Couldn't resist

Dont laugh too hard. The LE do use RADAR on the ICW south of Ft Lauderdale.

 

[caltexflanc]

Nope, plenty of idiots without radar continue to run in the fog when they can't see past their anchor. They assume everybody else has radar and will avoid them.

Ted

I don't know what the heck they are assuming, but they are still out there and plenty of them. You look at your radar scan on in a dense fog and you see all kinds of chaos. Some are in little fishing boats that won't accomodate a radar, some in cruisers that would but don't have it, and of course apparently we have some right here on TF. What can you do?

Blasting your horn signal , communication (or trying to) on VHF including regular position reports, and lastly taking evasive action when all that fails. Been there, done all of that.

 

[Pdxstriper]

Radar in the unexpected fog

Hi,
About 6 years ago one pretty summer morning I was heading east from the San Juans into Rosario Strait toward Anacortes (about a 15 mile crossing). For those familiar with the area, one enters Rosario thru Thatcher Pass which is often foggy in the morning even when the rest of the PWN has clear blue skys. It was a Sunday morning and Anacortes is home to most of the yacht chartering in this area. So Thatcher comes into view, looking like a ball of thick white cotton candy, and I hit my radar. I swear the radar array must not have made one revolution before I am getting hailed by other vessels. They were charters who had to be back that morning. One asked with angst in his voice if he could follow me across to Anacortes. I said yes, but at your own risk, and I eventually got them home safely. I ended up with 3 vessels in my crossing party.

At least one of the 3 boats had radar but the renter was perhaps unfamiliar with its operation or the area or whatever. One funny note, whilst crossing east to west, the WA State ferry Tacoma was coming right at us. She appears huge on radar and I saw her on radar and gave a wide berth in passing. One of my followers saw her appear out of the fog and almost lost it. Quite funny. But hey we've all been there so I laughed quietly with my wife.

Point is this: Fog can appear at the most unexpected times on the most beautiful of days. Be careful out there. Opinion: Don't travel far without radar and the knowledge on how to use it.
Pete

 

[rslifkin]

Point is this: Fog can appear at the most unexpected times on the most beautiful of days. Be careful out there. Opinion: Don't travel far without radar and the knowledge on how to use it.

I'd say this one is down to knowing your cruising grounds. Some areas are prone to random or suddenly appearing fog. Other areas are not. All depends on local geography and weather patterns.

 

[Mark Myns]

A/p vs radar

Having been on the Great Lakes for 20+ years I would not want to be without my auto pilot, if I had to chose. Most of the time you can wait out the fog and just leave later. We have actually gone out in heavy fog and simply announce our intention on channel 16. Most other boaters with radar will actually advise you of potential problems. Using your charts you set a course that keeps you out of the shipping lane to avoid the big boys.

The a/p is more valuable because it does the exhausting mundane job of steering which allows you to travel more. I have both radar and a/p but have never actually needed the radar.

Another thing you should have is a radar reflector. The reflector does give you a much larger signature on radar.

 

[OldDan1943]

Perhaps one should make a decision between RADAR and AIS

 

[SteveK]

Perhaps one should make a decision between RADAR and AIS

explain please. Radar sees a boat without AIS

 

[thataway]

I wonder how many here that have been boating for more than 20-30 years were so afraid of boating as being unsafe before small boat radar was really available?

Skippering boats for 70 years, and I remember dense fogs, with the fog horn, and then the "whish" "whish" of the great big prop thrashing thru the water 100 feet away...that was frightening...Be we kept on sailing. We timed the distance from Los Angeles light, by the signal co-ordinated on the Morse Code signal, and the actual time we counted until we heard the horn. Our heads on swivels helped to locate both the large ships, and the light.

 

[syjos]

I wonder how many here that have been boating for more than 20-30 years were so afraid of boating as being unsafe before small boat radar was really available?

When I was younger and less cautious, fished in fog with a 17 foot outboard. Puget Sound, Seiku, Neah Bay in fog - no problem.

Back in those days, I worked so fishing trips were planned in advance and fishing wasn't getting curtailed because of weather or seas. Especially when friends were invited.

All I had was a compass, depth sounder and VHF.

And the only vessels with radar back then were commercial. Affordable, recreational boat radar did not become available until the 80's.

With radar, we treat fog as another cruising day but I don't think I would go out now in fog without radar.

Our radar quit while entering Friday Harbor one summer. Last radar image was of many small targets going in and out of the Harbor and one LARGE target coming in - ferry!

After getting the radar repaired, added a second radar.

 

[OldDan1943]

explain please. Radar sees a boat without AIS

AIS is less expensive.

 

[caltexflanc]

AIS is less expensive.

And much less useful.

 

[rslifkin]

And much less useful.

Depends on where you are and what you expect from it. In fog, radar will tell you more, as not everything broadcasts AIS. In good weather on a river, AIS will tell you about the tug around the next bend sooner than radar, as it's not as readily blocked by land.

 

[OldDan1943]

Then, my suggestion is modified. SHRUG

 

[O C Diver]

Depends on where you are and what you expect from it. In fog, radar will tell you more, as not everything broadcasts AIS. In good weather on a river, AIS will tell you about the tug around the next bend sooner than radar, as it's not as readily blocked by land.

While AIS is very good I have encountered tugs and other commercial vessels with inoperative AIS. While it's a very small percentage, it does happen and they don't stop until it's fixed. It's important to remember that AIS requires 2 separate systems working, whereas your radar only requires one, and you can see that it is.

Ted

 

[Lucky Chucky]

Bob,

We recently did a night crossing of 90 nautical miles. It was pitch dark, calm and no fog.

We had a Raymarine 5G as a primary and a Simrad backup radar. We have AIS.

My wife is outstanding navigator.

But there are pongas with long lines that radar just can't pick up!!!

But our FLIR worked like a charm. It's limited in distance of course, but we were able to spot the long line flags and floats going at 7 knots until the sun came up.

Please give it some consideration to augment your array...

~Lucky Chucky
m.v. Ho'okipa
S4326

 

[psneeld]

Just another tool for the nav station tool bag.

Many rec boaters only cruise in fair weather and daylight.

Some get caught in fog, some out after sunset.

Many only get caught so rarely, tools to overcome those issues seem expensive "extras".

Good if you need them? You betcha...they're GREAT!

I think I too often perspective is being disregarded and what one thinks about safety or budget is completely different for others.