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Old 06-24-2018, 08:20 AM   #41
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Old 06-24-2018, 09:24 AM   #42
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I once considered buying a case of cheap handheld VHFs and tossing them into the cockpits of electronically "deaf and dumb" sail boats like the Johnny Appleseed of the ICW. Really should have done it. Horn signals seldom worked either with those folks. We finally resorted to using the loud hailer, when Ann got on that thing, there was no playing ostrich!
We have hailers. I always thought of putting one on a car so someone appears about to pull out I can yell at them "Don't you dare" of they make a bad move I can yell some insult. My wife suggested flirt with hot girls beside the street. Do police cars not have them much now or just not use them? I've seen many times they could use them if they had them to communicate what they want better.
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Old 06-24-2018, 09:56 AM   #43
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We have hailers. I always thought of putting one on a car so someone appears about to pull out I can yell at them "Don't you dare" of they make a bad move I can yell some insult. My wife suggested flirt with hot girls beside the street. Do police cars not have them much now or just not use them? I've seen many times they could use them if they had them to communicate what they want better.
I have portable compressed air boat horn in my truck's door pouch. Works great for people just ahead of me at stop lights that are on cell phone texting or similar and paying no attention to new green light. They get the message real quick!!
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Old 06-24-2018, 10:37 AM   #44
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I’ve always had a remote mic in the cockpit, but not every sailboat is equipped with it. Part of it is the nature of a sailboat. The cockpit of a sailboat is not a friendly place for electronics. I know that many are now thinking that they have a radio on their exposed flybridge, but it is different.

A sailboat cockpit is exposed to not only the weather, but also the salt spray. A sailboat cockpit is exposed to abuse by lines, winch handles etc... Inside the cabin is the only safe place for a VHF radio on most smaller sailboats.

It is a problem because it means that it takes a skipper longer to reply to a radio call

Agreed.
The person on any sailboat most likely to need to use the VHF is the person at the helm. The inside Nav station MAY? benefit from a handy VHF, but rarely has an immediate need for one. Most sailboats with no weather protection at the cockpit will still have some good places to mount a VHF that is well enough sheltered but still accessible to the helmsperson. Cruising boats usually have weather protection.
I see no excuse for mounting the VHF where there is no person always beside it.
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Old 06-24-2018, 11:07 AM   #45
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The problem is that if your beam is 18’ and their been is 18’, they are likely to pass you anyway if the channel is 40’ wide.

I also like to attempt to be considerate to others in the hope that they will recognize it and respond in kind. That never works.
If you're in the middle of a 40' wide channel and have an 18' beam, there is only 11' on each side of you.

I refuse to hug the edge of the channel so that so clown with Searay Syndrome can try to wake me out of the channel.

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Old 06-24-2018, 11:27 AM   #46
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One thing that continues to astonish me, and this seems true on all boating forums, is the total disdain and even hatred many boaters hold toward all boats not like theirs. Trawlers vs. Sailboats vs. Yachts vs. Express cruisers vs. Runabouts vs. Bass Boats vs. Sportfish boats vs. High Performance boats vs. Center Consoles vs. Commercial vs. Cruise Ships. It seems everyone wants to peacefully share the water but only if it's by their rules and their likes and dislikes.

This isn't aimed at the OP but is at some of the subsequent postings and more at those that always seem to enter these threads. Then there's the assumption that the other boat did it all intentionally and without any consideration for them.
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Old 06-24-2018, 12:26 PM   #47
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I drive in the middle of the channel and I don't hold a steady course. F 'em.
Yes and that attitude goes a both ways by many unfortunately!
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Old 06-24-2018, 12:48 PM   #48
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If you're in the middle of a 40' wide channel and have an 18' beam, there is only 11' on each side of you.

I refuse to hug the edge of the channel so that so clown with Searay Syndrome can try to wake me out of the channel.

Ted
I absloutely agree. In the situtation I described earlier, I tried to turn into the wake. 40+ Sport Fisher going in excess of 30 Knots. Coming very fast from port rear. Too late, I screamed “ look out”. Two on deck. Back injury here, 3 weeks sleeping in the chair. So needless.
I cannot get away with shooting at em but I can use the radio and phone as a weapon.

Give me a call on the radio, I will cut throttle, move over and wave for any boat that does a slow pass with a reasonable wake, then thank him.
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Old 06-24-2018, 12:55 PM   #49
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One thing that continues to astonish me, and this seems true on all boating forums, is the total disdain and even hatred many boaters hold toward all boats not like theirs. Trawlers vs. Sailboats vs. Yachts vs. Express cruisers vs. Runabouts vs. Bass Boats vs. Sportfish boats vs. High Performance boats vs. Center Consoles vs. Commercial vs. Cruise Ships. It seems everyone wants to peacefully share the water but only if it's by their rules and their likes and dislikes.

This isn't aimed at the OP but is at some of the subsequent postings and more at those that always seem to enter these threads. Then there's the assumption that the other boat did it all intentionally and without any consideration for them.
Truly, I have respect for all boaters that operate their craft courteously and safely, but ya know, after awhile when you see the same brands/types acting like ass/h on the water it is hard not to profile.
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Old 06-24-2018, 01:23 PM   #50
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One thing that continues to astonish me, and this seems true on all boating forums, is the total disdain and even hatred many boaters hold toward all boats not like theirs. Trawlers vs. Sailboats vs. Yachts vs. Express cruisers vs. Runabouts vs. Bass Boats vs. Sportfish boats vs. High Performance boats vs. Center Consoles vs. Commercial vs. Cruise Ships. It seems everyone wants to peacefully share the water but only if it's by their rules and their likes and dislikes.

This isn't aimed at the OP but is at some of the subsequent postings and more at those that always seem to enter these threads. Then there's the assumption that the other boat did it all intentionally and without any consideration for them.
Don't know if any of that's directed at me. As we seem to be at opposite ends of the speed spectrum, let me offer the following observations.

When operating in a channel, the laws are quite specific about reaching or attempting to reach a passing agreement, before passing. The laws make it quite clear that the overtaking vessel is burdened with making the pass safe for both vessels.

These threads all seem to share the same theme of a captain operating a vessel with more speed/power than he seems capable of responsibly handling, and wakes the heck out of a slower boat. While it might not be fair to say they all intentionally do it, there certainly are some.

To your point, I don't remember being waked by a sailboat. Can't remember being waked by a displacement speed trawler. I do remember being waked numerous times by express cruisers and sport fish boats. I have no problem with the last two, it's the inept or inconsiderate (your choice) operators I have a problem with. To your point about them doing it the way I want them to: no, I want them to follow the intent of the law.

Since you appear to be in the go fast category, why don't you explain to us how you overtake a displacement speed boat in a channel where there is no speed restriction. Lets say you want to overtake me between the Port Mayaca lock and the St Lucie lock on the Okeechobee water way. What should I expect when I see your express cruiser coming up behind me?

Ted
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Old 06-24-2018, 01:35 PM   #51
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I don’t have any experience in places like the ICW. What annoys me is when I’m cruising along in a channel a mile wide and overtaking boat decides they need to pass me with a few boat lengths kicking out a huge wake. They often smile and wave as they go by. Most of the time I don’t think they are intentionally trying to be rude, but are simply oblivious.

Bob Hale, the long time former editor of Wagoners Guide wrote once that one of the biggest mistake power boaters make (he was including himself) is never looking behind them to see what affect their wake has.
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Old 06-24-2018, 01:45 PM   #52
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I noodle along at 7+ knots. It doesn't take much to give me a wide berth. I seem to attract morons whom either refuse to move at all when on a collision course, cut me off so I have to take evasive action (5 blasts...) or wake me from behind. I slow for kayakers and fishermen, even the doofi who insist on being in the busy channel and I move over if I am in somebody's (legitimate) way. I am not a paragon of virtue but if I see somebody coming at me at speed and has not contacted me, I need to maneuver. That may make them pause a bit but I am preparing for their wake.

None of this is rocket science, none of it needs to be an issue, courtesy and following the rules are paramount. If I am waked or messed about with then ask me if I will fire up my fire pump or launch a dinghy or offer to tow or...? The securité call is your best weapon, and a video camera. In Canada, I will report you to the police with your vessel name and you get to do a breathalyser.

We are all supposed to fly a flag of our nation and a courtesy flag when we visit, don't forget that; we also have to respect each other's parks and property. Try and be a polite guest.

See you out there this summer, have a super time and don't be a moron.
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Old 06-24-2018, 01:49 PM   #53
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I noodle along at 7+ knots. It doesn't take much to give me a wide berth. I seem to attract morons whom either refuse to move at all when on a collision course, cut me off so I have to take evasive action (5 blasts...) or wake me from behind. I slow for kayakers and fishermen, even the doofi who insist on being in the busy channel and I move over if I am in somebody's (legitimate) way. I am not a paragon of virtue but if I see somebody coming at me at speed and has not contacted me, I need to maneuver. That may make them pause a bit but I am preparing for their wake.

None of this is rocket science, none of it needs to be an issue, courtesy and following the rules are paramount. If I am waked or messed about with then ask me if I will fire up my fire pump or launch a dinghy or offer to tow or...? The securité call is your best weapon, and a video camera. In Canada, I will report you to the police with your vessel name and you get to do a breathalyser.

We are all supposed to fly a flag of our nation and a courtesy flag when we visit, don't forget that; we also have to respect each other's parks and property. Try and be a polite guest.

See you out there this summer, have a super time and don't be a moron.


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Old 06-24-2018, 01:56 PM   #54
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Old 06-24-2018, 02:26 PM   #55
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My boat actually throws a smaller wake if I'm up on plane. But if you'd like me to slow down enough to cause a small tsunami for you, no problem!

I try to be as considerate as I can at all times, but in place like the ICW where there could be a barge coming at you just around the bend, I'd rather pass and get it over with, than put either of us in danger. Your lamp may fall off your shelf, but at least we'll both still have our boats.
That's true, planing boats have to slow below about 5-7 knots or else they throw a bigger wake than if at full plane. When a planing boat starts accelerating to get up on plane, that is it's biggest wake. So they may not be able to pass another boat that's going 7 knots without throwing a big wake.

That's the way my Carver C34 was and my Skipjack 25 - both planing boats.
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Old 06-24-2018, 02:47 PM   #56
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Since you appear to be in the go fast category, why don't you explain to us how you overtake a displacement speed boat in a channel where there is no speed restriction. Lets say you want to overtake me between the Port Mayaca lock and the St Lucie lock on the Okeechobee water way. What should I expect when I see your express cruiser coming up behind me?

Ted
Much depends on the boat and I do know the behavior of each boat at various speeds, have a good picture in my mind of how far the wake extends. Then it depends on the location.

I will always attempt to advise by radio. Between Port Mayaca and St. Lucie is challenging and I would typically attempt to pass at about 3 knots faster than you were running. If I felt that might wake you then I'd encourage you to slow down so we could pass slower. There are several speed zones in that area too for bridges. I have slowly followed when no safe choice was there even when the slower boat was not responding in action or words. I won't double their wrong with one of my own.

Now, more common might be us in my wife's "Baby" and in the ICW in a non restricted area. Again we'd attempt to communicate. If a trawler was running anywhere other than the middle of the channel then we could take a wide sweep and pass at high speed with no wake reaching the trawler. In that boat, the faster we go, the less wake.

Now, in non-restricted areas we do not strive for no wake at all times. We do where possible but most of the time we're striving for a safe, reduced or minimal wake. That's also so much easier when we can reach the boat and they're prepared for it.

We have had boat owners react to appearance rather than reality, thinking we were going too fast when we looked back and saw the wake did not reach them at all.

I agree there are inconsiderate boaters. While sailboaters don't wake you, some do abuse others by acting like they own the waterway. I've on rare occasions encountered them tracking in the ICW.

We observe a lot from the balcony of our home as we live just outside a restricted area and it's amazing what we'll see with boats accelerating like the traffic light just turned green or decelerating like it turned red.

I have followed trawlers that wouldn't respond and would run from one side of the channel to the other. Had they cooperated better, we could have given them more clearance and less wake. Still we gave them a safe wake.

While I'm sure some boaters just don't care, I think many many boaters have no idea the wakes of their boats at different speeds. I've seen boats slow down "to be nice" and actually create their maximum wake as they were just below a planing speed.

An exercise I'd suggest for everyone if they haven't done so is to actually view your wake very carefully at different speeds and distances. 5 knots or 10 ft can change things significantly. Someone mentioned center consoles. Well, we own, although not for our personal use, a high performance center console with triple Yamaha 300's. It creates a horrible wake taking off and slowing down and very little wake at high speed. When a boater wants it to slow down, they probably don't realize that's the one thing that would wake them badly.

We go slow when law or conditions require it. We'll go as slow as needed to be safe for ourselves and others. We don't go slow just because others feel we all should.

Now on the other side, we've been waked just like everyone else. However, we came from a lake which on weekends was just solid wakes from all directions. There was no "no wake" other than specified locations like marinas. What can top a Wake Boat in terms of creating wake. We learned to be aware of our surroundings, to prepare for rough water, and to where possible take the wakes in the best way we could, but we also learned that we were going to get waked on weekends and holidays.
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Old 06-24-2018, 03:16 PM   #57
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We don't go slow just because others feel we all should.
I don't think you will find people in these threads complaining about speed, they're complaining about wake. If all express cruisers passed us like a 25' center console doing 30 knots, I don't think you would hear any complaints.

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Old 06-24-2018, 03:21 PM   #58
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Sailboaters look like they are hogging the channel because many draw 5’ plus and are worried about running aground. They are not just running the middle of the channel to piss everyone else off.
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Old 06-24-2018, 04:08 PM   #59
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I stopped slowing down for the pass. If you slow down, it's like giving them a green light. Then they try to pass as quickly as possible to not inconvenience you. Feeling bad that you slowed down to accomodate them.

They aren't necessarily realizing they're throwing a bigger wake. Besides, they're passing a salty looking trawler that surely is stout enough to handle their little wake. After all, these are boats made for 'offshore' (cough) right??
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Old 06-24-2018, 04:15 PM   #60
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I stopped slowing down for the pass. If you slow down, it's like giving them a green light. Then they try to pass as quickly as possible to not inconvenience you. Feeling bad that you slowed down to accomodate them.

They aren't necessarily realizing they're throwing a bigger wake. Besides, they're passing a salty looking trawler that surely is stout enough to handle their little wake. After all, these are boats made for 'offshore' (cough) right??
Do you talk to them at all? Silence is taken as consent.

We ended up making some pretty good longer term cruising friends a few times as a result of radio conversations that started with a passing request/negotiation.
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