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Old 05-03-2021, 11:02 AM   #21
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Did you send GB a picture of YOUR installation?
That sure might help them.
You may have to blindly disassemble one of the leaking rudders to see what is on the inside.
Order enough parts, seals and bearings to rebuild the leaking rudder.
I did not see a grease fitting or plug in the picture but then, I can only see one side.
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Old 05-03-2021, 04:01 PM   #22
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Following...

Could you provide the GB contact info please.

My 1999 GB 42 Europa has a similar issue, leaking rudder posts.

Mine have hairline cracks in the glass which allows water to infiltrate the lazerette at a slow rate. The posts have zerks and when grease is applied it it squirts out the cracks. I’ve installed some hose clamps which has stopped the water leak and I think helps the grease to go where it belongs.

My hull is semi displacement and I think the design does not include the Rudder Shelf as shown in your 47 EU dwg. Mine does not have prop pockets as well. I’m concerned that the rudder post design in my vessel is a significantly weak design symptoms of which are the hair line crack or could have been caused by a grounding.

I could have the posts reglassed but I would prefer to have a better upstanding of the overall design before embarking on a repair.

Sorry about the picture orientations


Quote:
Originally Posted by kernr View Post
Hi All -

Well I have learned a lot about our GB 47 EU over the past year. One item that I have not checked out though is our rudder posts. A couple of times last year at the higher speeds I noticed water in the bilge of the Lazerette (sp) and I saw the bige pump light come on once or twice while underway. Never an alarming amount of water and never have I observed leakage source while in port or while underway. On this particular boat it seems like the mechanism that secures the rudder posts to the boat is above the waterline except possibly in rough seas or when she is squatting down in the rear. Just never got there at the time it was happening. I have spotted water on the flat surface next to the Starboard post and tried to see any evidence as to its source. So I am guessing I need to look at the packing.

She is on the hard now for about another month and would like any advice as to what needs to get done. Pictures of the port and starboard post are attached. Below the flat surface you see in photos is just fiberglass surrounding the tube that the post comes thru. So where do I start to examine the situation? Do I have it correct to say the packing is most likely under the top bracket with the two bolts clamping it in place and the lower collar is what is securing the rudder post to the top of the tube?

Bob
Attached Thumbnails
Port post with clamps1.jpg   Port Rudder Post1.jpg   Starboard Rudder Post1.jpg   Stbd post with clamps1.jpg  
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Old 05-04-2021, 05:59 AM   #23
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I'm not sure who others were communicating with at GB over there but I have had good responses on several issues from Nazri Abu ( nazri_a@grandbanks.com ).
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Old 05-06-2021, 01:32 PM   #24
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Thanks!

Thanks for posting Nazrís contact info. He replied within a couple of days with the rudder post dwg for my GB.

Dwg attached in case someone else may need it.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf GB 42 Rudder Tube 1.5 inch Dia.pdf (62.0 KB, 27 views)
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Old 05-10-2021, 06:04 AM   #25
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Rudder Posts

Firstbase & Contingensea -

You are both correct - Nazri has been my go to person at GB Malaysia and he has been very prompt in his responses. His last response to me regarding my rudder situation with visuals not matching the drawing was:

Bob
I have forward to my colleague and they will reply shortly.

Meanwhile, there is leak on rudder tube and they suspect the top O-Ring Seal might need replacement.
We donít keep the spare part and you can contact the maker this rudder tube assemble.

Try to contact Teignbridge at UK. They should be able to assist.

Adrian Evans
Sales Support Engineer
Teignbridge Propellers Int. Ltd.
Tel : + 44 1626 324307
Mobile: +44 7712 063057
Fax : +44 1626 360783
Email : adrianevans@teignbridge.co.uk
Web : www.teignbridge.co.uk

Jade Pinder
Sales Executive
Teignbridge Propellers International Ltd
Tel: +44 1626 324320
Mobile: +44 7702 797 973
Fax: +44 1626 360783
jade.pinder@teignbridge.co.uk

Best regards
Nazri

So I have not yet had a chance to write Teignbridge Company but I will.

Thanks for your inputs,
Bob
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Old 05-11-2021, 06:31 AM   #26
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Rudder Post

All -

So this morning I heard back from Teignbridge Company in the UK - very rapid and pleasant response -see below:

"Hi Bob,

We think that the rudder drawing youíve been supplied is correct (as per our records), but the installation manual isnít quite correct Ė as far as what we have recorded goes.

The rudder tube is sealed with 4 O rings, 1 on the lower bearing and 3 on the upper.

The rudder is held in place by a drop collar which you can see in the photos, it is the slightly rusty looking part directly under the tiller arm with 2 socket head screws in it.

To replace the O Rings, you will need to remove the tiller arm, then support the weight of the rudder before removing the drop collar, once the collar is removed the rudder should be able to be lowered out of the tube.

The bearings are held in place with set screws and once these are removed they should be able to knock the bearings out of the tube.

If you are going to replace the O rings, we would recommend replacing the bearings at the same time.

I hope this helps."

So the drawing of the rudder is attached that they say is correct vs the Installation drawing previously sent out above. They are correct in stating that replacing the bearings at the same time is recommended. I have asked them if they have bearings and seals for this designed assembly and awaiting a response. I do not see the three seals on top bearing and one below on lower bearing they are referring to - I only see upper seals on the Installation drawing. More to come I am sure.

Bob
Attached Files
File Type: pdf GB47EU RUDDER BLADE & STOCK.pdf (84.5 KB, 14 views)
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Old 05-11-2021, 03:32 PM   #27
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Rudder Post

All -

So, the good news is that Teignbridge Company in the UK can make these bearings and the o-rings that go with them - not without a small fee - quote is attached. Since there is at least a 50 day lead time I will probably get the parts and install at our fall haul out in October. I am sure the process will be an interesting evolution.

Bob
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Bearings and Seals for posts 5-11-21.pdf (174.0 KB, 24 views)
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Old 06-14-2021, 08:57 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C lectric View Post

It also looks like two screws/bolts are used on top to hold the bearing up in the shaft tube so it cannot slide down and holds a cap in place which is the load support on the top of the rubber shaft tube.
I see a step in the bore of the fibreglass shaft tube which would prevent the upper bearing from sliding downwards.

The "cap" - which carries the load of the weight of the rudder/shaft is probably held from rotating by the two screws (or maybe pins).

Nick
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Old 06-14-2021, 09:23 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kernr View Post
All -

and the o-rings that go with them

Bob
Strange - the quote lists different O-ring sizes for the inside rings in the top and bottom bearings. This implies that the shaft has a step in it (which does not appear in the drawing). If the shaft is 3.0" diameter at both locations, the 337 O-ring would seem to be the correct one. 335 would appear to be for a 2-3/4" shaft.

These are standard O-ring sizes, available anywhere, depending on the material they are made of. (Buna-N - also called nitrile - is the most common and may well be what they use)

Note that you can change the inside rings without removing the bearings. If the shaft is not loose in the bearings you could consider just changing the O-rings for a parts cost of about $1 each.

The outside O-ring is a static seal (no rubbing) and (I believe) there is no reason to need to change this if the bearing is not disturbed.

(https://www.allorings.com/O-Ring-AS5...ard-Size-Chart)

Nick
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Old 06-14-2021, 12:09 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by firstbase View Post
Anyone with an older GB42 know what I should expect to find? Actual packing or a zirc?
My 1972 had standard shaft packing glands at the top of the tube. A bitch to get to with twin packing wrenches.
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Old 08-03-2021, 07:01 PM   #31
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Hi all,

All of this is very helpful. We have a new to us 2001 Europa 52 with a similar situation on the starboard rudder post. I'm going to email Nazri who has been extremely helpful in the past and ask for his assistance. I'll let you know what I find out.

Jim
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Old 08-04-2021, 04:31 PM   #32
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Hi all,

I emailed Nazri and here's what I received back from his email. It was a auto response:Hi, The Malaysia government has declared an LOCKDOWN/MCO since 1st June and don't know when this lockdown will be end.
GB factory will not operate during this peroid.
Sorry for any inconvenience caused.

Best regards
Nazri

So, we wait for now.

Jim
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Old 08-04-2021, 06:24 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimL View Post
Hi all,

I emailed Nazri and here's what I received back from his email. It was a auto response:Hi, The Malaysia government has declared an LOCKDOWN/MCO since 1st June and don't know when this lockdown will be end.
GB factory will not operate during this peroid.
Sorry for any inconvenience caused.

Best regards
Nazri

So, we wait for now.

Jim
and no one is there to answer the phones?
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Old 08-08-2021, 02:42 PM   #34
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I also emailed Mohidin in Malaysia and here's his response:

My apologies for the delay in replying. We are closed due to the lockdown in Malaysia.
Due to the vintage of your boat, we could not find the relevant drawing of the rudder tube and rudder shelf. Typically, the o-ring would be above the rudder shelf, therefore the leak which is under the rudder shelf does not seem to be connected to the o-ring.

I hope that the above helps to shed some light.

Have a nice day.
Best regards,

MOHIDIN PITCHAI ROWTHER | PRODUCTION MANAGER

So my next steps are to take the results of this forum along with the emails from Malaysia and contract the Grand Banks facility near Stuart, FL and will see what they can come up with.

Jim
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Old 08-08-2021, 09:13 PM   #35
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Can you please forward the email contact for GB Malaysia? I have water tank questions.
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Old 08-09-2021, 09:26 PM   #36
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MOHIDIN PITCHAI ROWTHER | PRODUCTION MANAGE

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488 Jalan Suasa
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m: +65-9155-3985 or +60-14-612-5706
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