Mounting a step into the lazarette

[HeadedToTexas]

Stepping in to and out of our lazarette is not difficult as it is only 18 inches or so, but the steering cylinder hoses and rudder angle sensor linkage is close and it is only a matter of time until something bad happens. Among this winter's project is a step to both ease access and protect those important components.

The plan is to construct the step out of ¾" plywood with suitable lumber for the step risers. Perpendicular lumber will provide lateral support. Suitable paint or fiberglass will provide extended life for the wood as well as a non-skid surface.

In addition to general thoughts, my question is about the best way to mount the step to the fiberglass deck panel. As it should be removable for access when needed, my idea is to mount stainless channels to the deck such that the step risers fit in the channels to be secured by bolts or pins. The stainless channels can be mounted to the deck with screws and appropriate washers and nuts in holes drilled through the deck.

 

[mvweebles]

I am in the process of having something similar done right now. My off-cuff idea for you is to install riser blocks that are permanently attached to the decking (see markups below). Some angle brackets will secure, perhaps with an end piece across all three blocks to stabilze.

Then a piece of plywood screwed to the top to protect rudder and cylinder (perhaps with a Plexiglas window so you can see rudder post). If you don't need the step, consider making the "shelf" large enough for lightweight storage

Peter

 

[Comodave]

In our last boat I put in removable steps down into the engine room. It has small keyhole brackets that mounted on the side of the deck beam. The steps would hook into the keyholes so you could have them installed or removed if you needed access behind them.

 

[Barrie]

I have the same issue. Plan to install a step on top of the rudder and rudder sending sensor so the will operate freely underneath the step. A couple of U shaped brackets with mounting feet should work. Getting local fabricator to make it. Topped off with a plywood board.
(yes i have stepped on the sensor arm)

 

[FWT]

Two suggestions:

1) I echo Dave. Attaching to a deck beam is how steps into the engine room are handled, that Helmsman installs as original equipment.

2) Alternatively, a simple solution is to have dowel "feet" on the steps. A significant size but need not be too beefy. Maybe half inch diameter should do it. And extend below the body of the step assembly maybe a half inch to an inch. Drill holes in floor plates a slightly larger diameter. The "feet" fit into the holes and the steps won't slide. Just the front or back would also probably do it.

Either way, keep it light as in more of a ladder approach than steps, to make it easier to remove out of the way when down there crawling around.

 

[HeadedToTexas]

(yes i have stepped on the sensor arm)

That is exactly what I am trying to avoid. Not twisting a knee or ankle while stepping down into the lazarette is a side benefit.

I considered a ladder type "step," but the lazarette just is not deep enough to warrant that. Besides, the ladder has to be removed every time access is needed behind the ladder. And the ladder does not protect the steering equipment as well as the step/cover.

The engine room is a different story. My Mariner 37 did not come with a ladder as I see on newer models. For those of you with ladders into the engine room, do you have to remove the ladder to check the oil or access anything on the forward bulkhead?

 

[FWT]

I'm a believer in first doing a temp solution, to find out what works and doesn't work. Then get serious when I know for sure.

Might something like this work as a temp? Its so cheap and easy, nothing's lost when you upgrade.

https://www.amazon.com/Rubbermaid-Roughneck-Stool-Bisque-FG420087BISQU/dp/B000VAZ4AU/ref=zg_bs_1069136_sccl_1/140-1802249-6870005?th=1

 

[HeadedToTexas]

Good idea, FWT. I have a few footstools similar to that and will give one a try.

 

[Comodave]

I used a Garelick step. It is easily removable, maybe 5 seconds. Not cheap but it works well. I think they make them in different number of steps. Nice thing is when you need to work you just lift them out and just the very small brackets are left and they don’t get in the way.

 

[STB]

In my old 42' Californian, there weren't steps but shelfs. Straps were run along the hull at the stern and the bulkhead and pieces of plywood cut to be a manageable size and easily fit in were laid on top of them. Cutouts were made to allow placement around the upper fuel control valves. I loved having that storage area without worrying about anything stored there damaging or entrapment the valves, rudder, etc.

 

[HeadedToTexas]

I used a Garelick step.

I have seen the folding type and considered that for engine room access, but I'm guessing you are talking about the fixed step type from Garelick. Those are slick! Look to be out of production though. Did they come in a variety of lengths (or steps)?

 

[sunchaser]

HTT

Suggest, no matter what you end up with, that the cylinder and fittings be visible at all times. Why? You want to see evidence of any drips ASAP which indicates a problem. On our vessel there is a shelf with a series of teak strips that are designed to allow a hatch lift and quick look see at critical parts either while at the dock or underway.

 

[chanprr]

Collapsible stool about 13" high when extended. Easy to store and very useful.

 

[mvweebles]

HTT

Suggest, no matter what you end up with, that the cylinder and fittings be visible at all times. Why? You want to see evidence of any drips ASAP which indicates a problem. On our vessel there is a shelf with a series of teak strips that are designed to allow a hatch lift and quick look see at critical parts either while at the dock or underway.

I am in the process of having a shelf installed over my rudder and A/P pump and had similar concerns about ease of monitoring. Will install Plexiglass window for ease of inspection.

Peter

 

[HeadedToTexas]

I have that very one, Chan. It is among the test subjects on the docket.

And I know what you mean by leaving the steering gear inspectable. My idea is to leave the rear open so that you can see the rudder, sensor, linkage, and hydraulics. The step will be removable with a few bolts when the need arises.

 

[Pascall]

I made a staircase that is fixed with two locking pins.
The rudder is protected with a stainless steel bracket to prevent problems.

 

[HeadedToTexas]

Slick!

 

[chanprr]

I made a staircase that is fixed with two locking pins.
The rudder is protected with a stainless steel bracket to prevent problems.

Nice setup with the ladder. In the new H46, a removable ladder in the lazarette is included for easy access. I want no cover over the steering gear, since I visually check all of that as part of my normal checklist when getting ready to go.

 

[Comodave]

I have seen the folding type and considered that for engine room access, but I'm guessing you are talking about the fixed step type from Garelick. Those are slick! Look to be out of production though. Did they come in a variety of lengths (or steps)?

I bought a 3 step one. When I looked the other day there were places that had some in stock.

 

[Barrie]

Another thought. I made two of these one for the engine room and one for entrance to the generator.
Get an aluminum ladder (new or old with metal top step) chop down to the desired length, remove the back legs and discard. Install the table hangers with pop rivets under the top step and under the deck where needed. I also reshaped the ladder and took out the slope so it stood straight down and the bottom feet took less space.
Light weight, easy on/off and good visibility of your rudder parts.
Tools: metal grinder/cutter, drill to remove rivets, new pop rivets 2 beers.

 

[HeadedToTexas]

Tools: metal grinder/cutter, drill to remove rivets, new pop rivets 2 beers.

Haha, my kind of job!

We drove up to the boat for the first time this storage season to make some measurements and do recon. Our three hatches, engine room, generator room, and lazarette, have drops of 44", 26" and 23" to their respective floors. Those distances could easily be spanned by a ladder, and especially by your excellent custom cut ladder idea.

Once down in any of those spaces though, I find my stiff knees and sore back struggling to unwind into a position comfortable enough to do whatever I went down there to accomplish, be it check the oil, clean a strainer, or retrieve pool floats. A ladder in the way feels like it would make the task that much more difficult. How do you handle removing or working around the ladder?

 

[Barrie]

Simple: once your down, the ladder in the engine room slips out of the support brackets easily and i store it right in front of the diesel engine where the fan belts are. There is enough space open in the floor boards that the ladder just drips in and the ladder feet sit on the bilge floor. Out of the way. Sometimes i just lift it out and lean against the ships wheel in the pilot house. Lots of options. Its aluminum to no weight.
The one for the generator a rarely remove.
This is the 2nd boat that i have installed engine ladders. I can't believe that so many previous owners climbed down using the engine as a foot rest to do servicing. My legs are too short and the step down it too great. I think the newer Helmsman 38s come with ladders now.
Step ladders come with the legs on a slight angle. I found making the ladder a straight run works well and reduces the need for extra space. I found you a photo

 

[Barrie]

By the way I also installed piano hinges on the hatches of both engine and generator. Again I can't believe people physically lift these heavy floor hatch every time.

 

[chanprr]

Nice job on the ladder. Yes, the 38E's come with an engine compartment ladder. My 46 will have both engine compartment and lazarette removeable ladders.

 

[HeadedToTexas]

Great solution. I lifted those engine room hatches for long enough and am installing piano hinges this winter. What holds them up when open? My plan is a cord or bungee around the pilothouse table "leg."

 

[Barrie]

Bingo!

 

[PaulB.]

I use this protector as a step and the plexiglass is also strong enough to sit on. I use some starboard blocks on the inside and slide toggles to keep it in place. Paul

 

[koliver]

Some very elegant solutions above.
My Laz locker is deep. The stringers from forward run through to the transom and the steering gear mounts to them. A few inches above the steering gear is the Laz floor. This consists of 3/4" plywood panels, each about 3' x 1', laid side by side on cleats glassed to the transom and to the bulkhead that backs the cabin headboard. I have never had one shift. Those floor pieces lift out with finger holes. When in place there is room for two milk crates high storage, with room above them for coils of spare lines, fenders, hoses. I rarely need to go into the Laz myself but when I do, there is no danger of impacting the steering gear. I don't see any need for steps, so there are none.

 

[HeadedToTexas]

Great stuff. That plexiglass cover is slick!