Sailor thinking of going to a a trawler

[Tate]

Hi all,

I'm an experienced sailor. I've lived on boats full time for 8 years and have well over 20k miles under my keels. I've lived on a small sailboat and traveled extensively through the Caribe and now live on a mid sized sailing catamaran. Hi from the Exumas. :wave:

I'm at a point where I can finish "refitting" my catamaran and dumping another 100k into her to get her exactly how I want, or I can pick something else.

I'm working while cruising now. Previously I took a sabbatical and I could just go when the weather allowed. Now I find I have to hope a weather window lines up with a weekend or spend my vacation to go when it is time. This isn't ideal and many times it ends with me motoring a lot.

I figure if I'm constrained by time and weather and that results in motoring, I might as well have a boat suited to that. So I've been considering a trawler, I've also considered them in the past.

I come here for advise on which brands to seek out given my preferences.

My price range is probably around 500k. Would prefer less but can go more for the right boat. I'm hoping something between 40-50ft range. I'd like a boat optimized for comfort as a coastal cruiser but something that I can take as far as the San Blas islands (hopping down from US east coast). I'm intrigued by the possibility of "home" furniture instead of built ins when it comes to trawlers. My sailboats have always been less than comfortable due to the built in furniture. And I'd like something that has a nice outdoor space and a lot of room for solar.

I've been looking at Nordhavns, older ones like the N46. I love the ruggedness but I realize these are not setup for comfort given what I want to accomplish with a boat.

It will be a couple's boat with occasional visits by another couple. We both work onboard so two discrete comfy areas of a boat to sit with a laptop would be great.

My "holes" in knowledge when it comes to trawlers comes down to lack of knowledge about brands and quality. Also I don't know anything about stabilizers/paravanes beyond basic concepts. I'm also not that knowledgeable about fuel burn on big engines and how that impacts voyaging. I would also like to learn about how weather effects trawler passagemaking. I'm assuming the "best" is flat calm, but what type of conditions can different boats tolerate within reason.

Insights and advise greatly appreciated.

 

[mvweebles]

Welcome Tate!

I recommend Bumfuzzle blog frequently - they circumnavigated on a small-ish cat, and spent about 6-years traversing the Caribbean in a Grand Banks 42 trawler. Here's a decent blog post comparing sail and trawler. Note emphasis on stabilizers. https://www.bumfuzzle.com/trawler-vs-sail/. I have plans for similar coastal-passagemaking which I define as ability to plan within bail-out options given 3-day weather windows. For that, I consider some manner of stabilization mandatory. I know my wife would make me a cruising bachelor without it.

Hippocampus, a frequent TF poster, transitioned from sail (Offshore 46 if I remember correctly) to trawler seeking similar capabilities with coastal-passagemaking. Seemed to have a similar budget and started his search with Nordhavn. Given the boat market, that proved difficult. Where he landed was a Nordic Tug 42, stabilized with gyro-based "Seakeeper" system. I think the Nordic Tug and American Tug boats are strong candidates for what you're looking. Some of the Kadey Krogen models may be in your budget and are known for having a more spacious interiors than Nordhavn. As you can see from the Bumfuzzle crew, a Grand Banks or similar is capable, though the amount of exterior wood is off-putting in tropics. Plus I think a sedan style or pilothouse style provides better flow to outdoor spaces.

I know the N46 has an appealing look to them. As a guy who delivered a number of Nordhavns of that vitage, and while the N46 is an amazing boat, PAE made decent improvements in subsequent models. I know, they are more expensive and more difficult to find, but I will say that given a choice of a N46 and a N40, no question I'd take the N40.

Good luck -

Peter

 

[ranger58sb]

I come here for advise on which brands to seek out given my preferences.

My price range is probably around 500k. Would prefer less but can go more for the right boat. I'm hoping something between 40-50ft range. I'd like a boat optimized for comfort as a coastal cruiser but something that I can take as far as the San Blas islands (hopping down from US east coast). I'm intrigued by the possibility of "home" furniture instead of built ins when it comes to trawlers.

I've been looking at Nordhavns, older ones like the N46. I love the ruggedness but I realize these are not setup for comfort given what I want to accomplish with a boat.

It will be a couple's boat with occasional visits by another couple. We both work onboard so two discrete comfy areas of a boat to sit with a laptop would be great.

You might start be looking at Flemings, Defevers, Kadey-Krogens, Selenes, Nordhavns, Nordic Tugs, Helmsmans, Grand Banks/Eastbay... and think to yourselves what features attract and which features aren't so great. Somewhere in there you might begin to home in a bit, gain some clarity... and fo course there are actually a boatload of other credible brands that might get your attention as you do that.

-Chris

 

[rgano]

I believe that given your evident desire to use good weather windows to change locations and to possibly remain in places not serviced by capable yards that stabilizers in the 40-50 foot range are likely to be overkill and a needless complication.

Many trawler hulls are built with hard chines which will be a vastly different ride (and "sit" while anchored) than you are used to. You may wish to eliminate these "hard rides" from your shopping list.

 

[dannc]

As a start, read https://www.amazon.com/Voyaging-Und...ocphy=1015254&hvtargid=pla-718373719352&psc=1.

It might be a bit out of date, but there are different brands mentioned as well what one might find important to have on a trawler.

Later,
Dan

 

[2savage]

My price range is probably around 500k. Would prefer less but can go more for the right boat. I'm hoping something between 40-50ft range. I'd like a boat optimized for comfort as a coastal cruiser but something that I can take as far as the San Blas islands (hopping down from US east coast). I'm intrigued by the possibility of "home" furniture instead of built ins when it comes to trawlers. .

There are boats out there that are MUCH less money than $500k and will do what you want.

My own trawler had a regular sofa love seat and a leather recliner chair with foot stool in a salon that had no built ins. BUT, this is not good for offshore passages as the furniture moves around and none of it worked well as a berth in poor weather, So, I'm currently adding a built-in three person sofa that is being designed as the best berth on the boat for a passage.

Seems our goals are different. I'm prepping my boat for a transatlantic expedition but you are planning what I would call extra-coastal trips.

I think this difference highlights what you need to focus on. If you want 'home furniture' then you will be more focused on being at anchor or tied to a dock than being in a fifteen foot beam sea on a thousand mile passage.

 

[mvweebles]

I think this difference highlights what you need to focus on. If you want 'home furniture' then you will be more focused on being at anchor or tied to a dock than being in a fifteen foot beam sea on a thousand mile passage.

Getting to the San Blas Islands is plenty ambitous for my tastes - getting back even more so . The longest hop may only be a few hundred miles, but logistically (and leaving aside fuel concerns), much more difficult than crossing the Atlantic.

I agree with 2savage about built-in furniture, but I think there's another dimension. A LOT of boats have lousy built-ins. My wife likes to say its because they are designed by men vs women. The seat-depth on settees is way too shallow.

Peter

 

[Tate]

Getting to the San Blas Islands is plenty ambitous for my tastes - getting back even more so . The longest hop may only be a few hundred miles, but logistically (and leaving aside fuel concerns), much more difficult than crossing the Atlantic.

I agree with 2savage about built-in furniture, but I think there's another dimension. A LOT of boats have lousy built-ins. My wife likes to say its because they are designed by men vs women. The seat-depth on settees is way too shallow.

Peter

San Blas isn't that bad really. I've been a few times. I think it would be pretty easy on a trawler with a 1500 mile range. Last time I was down there I met and made friends with a couple on a KK42. We had a blast. They didn't have any trouble getting there and back.

 

[mvweebles]

San Blas isn't that bad really. I've been a few times. I think it would be pretty easy on a trawler with a 1500 mile range. Last time I was down there I met and made friends with a couple on a KK42. We had a blast. They didn't have any trouble getting there and back.

How did you like the built-ins on the KK42? I don't remember exactly but would guess it was at the 'better' end of comfort?

I used to deliver trawler yachts and came up the Caribbean twice. Both times it was pretty bumpy. Seems to be a common sentiment though I just checked and timing is good right now. I guess that's the difference between a delivery and cruising. There are also some geo-political challenges in the Caribbean. I look forward to cruising.....

I too peg 1500nm range as a threshold. Can be done with a lot less, but 1500nms really gives breathing room to make decisions.

Peter

 

[Tate]

How did you like the built-ins on the KK42? I don't remember exactly but would guess it was at the 'better' end of comfort?

As I recall, they had two chairs to one side and built ins to the other. I usually sat in the chairs so I don't know about the comfort of built ins. I've looked at the KK42s online and it seems there were quite a few different configurations.

Overall I thought their boat was great. The only thing I didn't like was that it seemed there was a lack of airflow through the main saloon/galley area. I guess I am used to sailboats with big hatches forward that flow air all through the boat. I'm sure I could get around that pretty easy though.

I've considered going look at some KKs. They seem nice and are usually in my "comfortable" price range. Though I didn't like the engine room you had to crawl around in and most of them are older.

 

[Tate]

I used to deliver trawler yachts and came up the Caribbean twice. Both times it was pretty bumpy.

Where did you go in the Caribe? It is a huge place. It can get really nasty, but a lot of people make mistakes down there. I see people trying to head up to Jamaica from Cartagena all the time and get crushed. I see people do weird stuff hopping down island.

For my part, the Caribbean is "home" for me and I've grown pretty familiar with her ways. Sure, I'll still get my ass kicked every now and then like anyone, but once you get the feel, it is a gentle place in the world as far as bodies of water are concerned.

 

[mvweebles]

Where did you go in the Caribe?

Straight from Panama to Florida nonstop; west of Cuba. Last run was 2004 and I kept getting knocked towards Nicuragua. Either it was safer at the time or I didn't know about the security issues along that coast or I was just lucky. But it's clearly not a route I'd do today even if the weather provided passage. I've since talked to another delivery skipper who suggested better to go around Jamaica to Port Antonio and through the Bahamas.

Our current plan is to head south from Ensenada until it stops being fun. I think we will leave the boat here and there for a few months and head home, then continue. But heading up the Caribbean may be foregone with shipping Weebles the last 1500nms being an option. It's entirely possible that once we make it that far that heading up the Caribbean is an easy decision. Time will tell - right now, hardest part of the trip - by far - is simply tossing docklines. You're new here, but I've been in a multi-year do-loop of a refit. Frustrateing - something for you to think about maybe for your possible $100k refit of your cat.

Back to ideas for a trawler. For the most part, powerboats have lousy through-ventilation. Newer ones tend to be worse than older ones. I had my stateroom reconfigured into large-ish v-berths, added ports, and expanded the size of the overhead hatch to provide better sleeping conditions, at least at anchor. But it's tough to be catamarans since the staterooms tend to be in the bows with hatches and ports.

Proper engine rooms are expensive. Let me rephrase: boats with proper engine rooms are expensive. I don't blame you for prioritizing them. You may want to peruse some of the Defevers. I know the 44 and ACMY have very nice engine rooms and assume the other two below do too, but I'm not sure. There are owners of all of these on TF. Perhaps they'll see this and chime in, especially if something like this piques your interest.

• Defever 44 - Sundeck Trawler. Mentioned above. Dinghy at anchor would be more difficult. Example HERE. These were started as the Defever 43 in Taiwan, then made in China into the early 2000s so age and condition vary widely.
• Defever 44+5 (aka ACMY "Aft Cockpit Motor Yacht"). The Sundeck 44 with a 5-foot cockpit extension added. Solves the dinghy access problem. Good for diving and fishing. I believe these were only made when production moved to China around 2000. Fewer out there. Example HERE
• Defever 48 - not sure this is a displacement boat but has nice lines. I like the extended hardtop over the main trunk cabin for the tropics as it provides nice shade (Old listing with a couple nice pictures HERE)
• Defever 49 - Raised Pilothouse. I think these are mostly a bit older so finding one in decent shape may be more difficult. HERE is an example.

Hope this is helpful. There are a ton of other possibilities. As you can see, $300k-$400k gets a pretty nice boat that will take you anywhere in a 1500 mile range.

Peter