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Old 04-19-2015, 09:35 PM   #21
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I prefer electric. No propane to chase down and much safer, but genny required.
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Old 04-20-2015, 02:12 AM   #22
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I know what Eric means. We don't turn the tank we're using off every time we turn the stove or oven off but we do turn off the manual shutoff valve in the propane locker (valve handle in the galley overhead). We only turn it on when we're actually going to use the stove or oven (or rather my wife does-I don't use the stove or oven) and then the valve gets closed when the stove or oven is turned off.

Whenever we leave the boat itself we turn off the active tank at the tank.
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Old 04-20-2015, 01:01 PM   #23
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I prefer electric. No propane to chase down and much safer, but genny required.

We also use a seaward electric 3 burner/oven stove, cooking breakfast and dinner also keeps the batteries charged and the generator exercised.
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Old 04-20-2015, 01:17 PM   #24
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Marin,
Yup .. keep it simple. We have one connection to possibly leak and minimize the time that it can. I admit there were times in Alaska when I didn't want to go out and shut off the tank. To do that I need to stand on the cap rail and reach to the top of the tank. Kinda tippy toe like .. and hang onto the radar arch stanchion. Sometimes I wonder if maybe I should apply more attention to falling overboard and less attention to propane leakage. Balance. I needed to say that to get the jump on someone else that would.
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Old 04-20-2015, 02:29 PM   #25
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I wonder if you have lower than ideal pressure in your gas delivery system or there is a problem with the stove. We put a Force 10 into our boat when we acquired it in 1998 and the thing has been fantastic from the outset. Tons of heat from all three burners when needed: a big pot to boil crabs in is boiling within just a few minutes. Great range of heat on all the burners (according to my wife). The oven/broiler works just as great as the stove.

My wife has done complete Thanksgiving dinners on the boat out in the islands; turkey and all the rest of it, as well as Christmas prime rib dinners. Her only complaint about the Force 10 is, unsurprisingly, is it does not have the same degree of oven insulation as a home oven. As her prime rib cooking technique requires the oven to hold heat for an hour with the element turned off, she's had to modify her technique for the Force 10.

Were we needing to install a new propane range in a boat today we would get the Force 10 three-burner again above all the competitors, assuming it's the same product that it was in 1998.
I have the 4 burner Force 10 and have had the same experience as SteveD. Three of the burners are of pretty limited use since they are basically simmer-only. And the oven took forever to get hot, so Sure Marine drilled out the orifice a bit to get more BTUs. Now it's useable at least.

I replaced the propane regulator last year thinking it was the problem, but it made no difference.
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Old 04-20-2015, 05:18 PM   #26
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I have the 4 burner Force 10 and have had the same experience as SteveD. Three of the burners are of pretty limited use since they are basically simmer-only. And the oven took forever to get hot....
Interesting.... As I say, our 3-burner stove/oven-broiler Force 10 has been terrific from day one back in 1998. We have never changed the regulator and have not had any reason to. We feed the Force 10 from a 2-1/2 gallon Worthington horizontal marine tank (we have two of them in the propane locker up top so we won't run out of propane in the middle of cooking a meal).

The flame from all three burners when turned up to maximum comes up around the bottom of the pan on the burner. More than enough heat as well as good medium and simmer performance. And we get the same performance from each burner even when all three are being used.

The oven gets plenty hot enough to do everything my wife tries to do in it with the exception of holding heat a long time after the burner has been turned off. This is due to the relatively low amount of insulation around the box.

But for years my wife much preferred cooking with the Force 10 in the boat to cooking with the electric range in our kitchen at home which was (IIRC) a typical GE unit. We finally plumbed the kitchen for gas and got her a proper dual-fuel stove/oven so she really likes that now. But she still likes cooking on the Force 10 and has never had any complaint about it for anything she's done other than the insulation thing.

I have no idea if Force 10 changed the characteristics of their stoves in the years after we bought ours.

We discovered the Magic Chef stove/oven that came in our boat (probably original to the boat) had leaking valves and parts were made of unobtainium. So it had to go.

We asked the big GB dealer/charter outfit we had worked with to find the boat for a recommendation and they said that in their opinions there were only two propane ranges worth getting (this was back in 1998, remember) and they were Force 10 and Princess. Of the two, they felt the Force 10 was the better unit. About half their charter fleet at the time had Force 10 and half had Princess. They'd never had complaints about either one.
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Old 04-29-2015, 10:10 AM   #27
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Greetings,
Along similar lines...We have a Seaward 3374-1001 3 burner propane unit self installed. 2 issues:
1) From day 1, flame seems "weak" and easily blows out at low settings. Brand new regulator, hose and stove. I suspect low gas pressure but why? Faulty regulator? Hose too small? Restriction at the input line on the stove somehow?
2) I would like to lift the top (housing the 3 burners). There appears to be a clip on each outboard side and pins (hinge points?) on each inboard side. Can one release these "clips" and tilt the top upwards? The electronic igniter died shortly after installation and I may try to replace.
The unit DID come with a manual but it is LOB (lost on board). Is there one available on line. A cursory search came up empty.
Thanks in advance...
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Old 04-29-2015, 10:40 AM   #28
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I pieced together my propane system to meet current ABYC suggestions and bought most of the stuff online.


The little old guy from somewhere in the Midwest was extrodinarily helpful in explaining back what I was trying to do and gave many suggestions. He was big on explaining how most installers didn't know squat. His big concern was the hose run distance and diameter. He suggested oversizing everything because of the over 25 foot run.


My 2 year old Force ten 3 burner is spectacular in performance. I did go with the 3 burner because I knew burner crowding would be a concern and while I don't remember for sure, I believe the bigger burner was a larger BTU output than on the 4 burner model..but I could be wrong.


Like Marin's, every burner will boil stuff while on high...only the smallest burner will simmer smaller pots/pans.
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Old 04-29-2015, 10:43 AM   #29
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Does this help?

http://www.suremarineservice.com/man...ove-Repair.pdf
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Old 04-29-2015, 11:23 AM   #30
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Greetings,
Mr. dh. Yes, it does help a bit. It shows that the stovetop appears to be hinged as I suspected but the manual states it's only applicable to units manufactured PRE-2007. The best I can surmise is that our unit is post 2007 so while similar, it still leaves several of my questions unanswered. I appreciate the lead. The Sure Marine site does not appear to list a model specific manual for our unit. Thanks.
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Old 04-29-2015, 06:38 PM   #31
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Regarding stoves for boats, we made a modification to our Force 10 which, as simple as it is, has made a big difference to it's physical impact on the inside of our boat.

The range (stove/oven) position in the galley of a GB36 is right beside the entry to the companionway to the forward cabin. The range is on one side and the port side of the helm station is on the other.

On the Force 10, the controls for the stove, oven, and broiler burners are on the front in a position that makes them very easy to brush or even lean against when passing through to the forward cabin or simply standing beside the helm station. So a burner knob can be inadvertently turned either on or to a different position if it's already on.

The burners have thermocouple protection, and when we're not actually using the range the gas valve in the propane locker is always turned off, but this nevertheless creates a risk that we weren't willing to accept.

Once we figured this out, we came up with the cure as illustrated below. It's a long polished stainless drawer pull that's used on household drawers and cabinets. We ordered it from an on-line cabinet supply catalog and mounted it on the front of the stove just above the burner knobs.

So now people brush or lean against the bar, not the burner knobs. It was an easy thing to do and just required drilling a pair of holes.
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Old 04-29-2015, 07:11 PM   #32
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That's a great low buck mod that makes sense Marin.

I'd caution our Aussie readers to verify it's kosher down under. As silly as it sounds the act of drilling two holes could potentially void the UL listing. Not a big problem on this side of the pond but believe boat gas systems need periodic recertification from a gas fitter there and possibly Europe.
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Old 04-29-2015, 07:38 PM   #33
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As silly as it sounds the act of drilling two holes could potentially void the UL listing.
I suspect that if questioned one could simply say, "That's the way the stove was built," and the inspector would be none the wiser.
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Old 04-30-2015, 05:04 AM   #34
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Marin:
As far as "holding the heat" after turning off the stove, have you looked into a baking stone? Basically, just a thick piece of tile you cut to fit on your oven rack with about an inch clearance from all sides. Helps it hold the heat greatly even if you open the door now and then.


Just a though.
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Old 04-30-2015, 06:18 AM   #35
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The Brits have been using propane (or acetylene) for decades.

The difference is the boat is designed from the start to use the fuel.

Tanks are frequently mounted so a reach rod , thru the overhead , can operate the gas valve.

No going outside , except every couple of months to switch tanks.

Operating a noisemaker at $10.00 per hour to cook vs a $20.00 tank that lasts a couple of months is certainly a choice , but not if you value piece and quiet , or have a budget.

Acetylene is lighter than air , so does not have the claimed horrors of a massive propane leak.

Of course in the USA it is regulated to death , so not practical as a cooking , refrigeration, heat or light fuel.
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Old 05-01-2015, 01:23 PM   #36
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Marin:
As far as "holding the heat" after turning off the stove, have you looked into a baking stone?
Thanks. I'll pass this on to my wife. I don't cook. I despise cooking and will have nothing whatsoever to do with it. My idea of cooking is a can opener, and my idea of gourmet cooking is a platinum can opener.

All I know is that my wife and her best friend have a method of cooking a prime rib that calls for the oven to remain really hot for an hour after the heat is turned off. I don't know that a Force 10 or any small marine oven like it would do this or even reach the initial temperature which, as I understand it, is the same temperature used to make steel. But I can't confirm that because, as I say, my interest in anything having to do with kitchens and cooking is zero.
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Old 06-01-2015, 12:43 PM   #37
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Ok folks! Thanks for all yours thoughts. A few weeks ago I installed the new Dickinson Marine 3-burner model. Pictures attached!
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