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Old 03-09-2019, 12:34 AM   #1
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N47 vs KK48

I am at Trawlerfest and am trying to make a decision as to these to boats and I KNOW there will be people here that can contribute and help guide me to a decision. This is a lot of money. I am a neophyte to this hobby/life. I am 72 and feel the need to move at a faster pace if I am to do this cruising thing. My mission is to go with my dog and me for now and to have a boat that would still give 2 people the space to not always be all over each other. I will have very little in the world of visiting guests and children on the boat. I intend to do mainly the Carribean as far south as the ABC's. Here are my current thoughts please help me.
The anchor locker in the N47 is cavernous, but there doesn't seem to be a ladder in it as there is in the KK48, why and how do you access and egress? I am also curious as to why in the aft end of the ER (N47) PAE put the ends of the lockdowns protruding into the space at the smallest vertical dimension.These dove into my back today as this is somewhat tight vertically. I am trying to make a nonemotional comparison of the two boats and I would very much appreciate the knowledgable people here helping me with the evaluation. I see the N47 to be better at actively cruising (moving) and then the KK has the potential to be better at rest, mainly in the ergonomics of the salon/galley. I hope this isn't a faux pax for this site. Thanking you for your help in advance.
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Old 03-09-2019, 01:34 AM   #2
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Which way to go - N-47 or KK 48 -- my answer

The personal choice of either the N-47 or the KK - 48 is an interesting question. -- Both can cross oceans & both are Full Displacement hull designs & both have a good reputation. I too looked at both & did a lot of thinking about this myself.

I bought a Kadey-Krogen because it had among many other positives we felt we liked, a big one was the walk around decks for docking & line handling when I was short handed on BOTH sides & that was a big winner for us, -- The Nordhavn had it only on the starboard side for that size vessel, & that was a non starter "deal breaker" for us.

The N-47 has more head room in the engine room & has the wing get home extra little engine which for some is a big deal for them.

That walk around decking cinched the deal for us & over came the engine room less head room issue & no wing engine. So we went with getting the KK & so that was my decision. Happy with that decision & still many years later we still stand by that decision today.


I am sure others will express their opinion on their decisions.


There were a lot of other things & I don't have the time or space to go through it all here, but that was a big deciding factor for us.

Either way - "Current individual boat condition is the key" as both are fine & very capable vessels.

Good luck.

Alfa Mike
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Old 03-09-2019, 04:45 AM   #3
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I've spent time on both, newer models in both cases. I've not been on either's early builds.

Most KK 48s are asymmetrical, meaning they have a walk around on one side only. The N47 anchor locker issue is easily solved by having a decent ladder installed or available. But how often does one climb into an anchor locker? The foredeck on the N47 is much superior with level surfaces and more space.

The port side active stabilizer on the KK 48 can be very difficult to access due to the washer and dryer. ER and machinery spaces on the N are much more accessible than the KK. Lifting a hatch and climbing a ladder on the KK is a show stopper for me. Then no get home engine on most KKs.

The access from the dock on most KKs involves climbing over the rail with a short boarding door. Some have a larger boarding door to partially alleviate this issue but still not as easy access as the N. The aft cockpit on the KK is more usable. Most KKs have AL tanks whereas the N's are FRP. The Ns have a very nice fuel management system with a day tank. They both roll at anchor. A flopper stopper helps to solve this problem and can often be found already added on many N47s.

For offshore work you will most likely have a crew, in fact best you should given your age, PS I'm older. So think of which one can handle a few extra guests. The mid ship master on the N is more comfortable and calmer.

In either case finding the better maintained one can be a challenge, I know, I've looked too. PAE offers superb after market assistance on their vessels. Go into any major harbor and you'll see an N moored there, worldwide.

Pricing seems the same. So do some coin flipping. Lastly, be honest with yourself as to needing either for their expensive blue water capability. You can pick up a new Helmsman or North Pacific for about the same money, albeit somewhat smaller. Lots of choices out there for both your mission and the the boats original build quality.
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Old 03-09-2019, 05:53 AM   #4
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When Leishman wrote his revision to Bebe's book, Voyaging Under Power, he reviewed the KK42 and said it needed window covers for serious blue water use and said nothing along those lines about his own Nordhavn design.


True? Still true of newer models of KKs?


David
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Old 03-09-2019, 05:56 AM   #5
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"My mission is to go with my dog and me for now and to have a boat that would still give 2 people the space to not always be all over each other.:

A smaller size might have easier systems to maintain , or just wash down.

Mere volume is not comfort, function is .


A great spot to sit & read is far better than a large space you can be tossed across.

Single handing & docking at times might be a chore.
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Old 03-09-2019, 06:57 AM   #6
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We've looked extensively at boat boats. Our overall feeling is that the N47 is more of an "inside" boat -- less external spaces for sitting and lounging, tougher access to the flybridge for both man and dog, tighter movement paths (such as between the pilothouse and portuguese bridge). The galley feels a little larger, maybe. Bigger pilothouse (if you want/need the pilot berth there). Midship master.

The KK48 has better outside space, especially the AE models (redesigned flybridge layout and better access). Bigger cockpit. A big plus for us is the setup of the 2nd cabin -- very flexible and useful space. Forward master.

For us, we've ruled out the N47. KK48 is a leading contender though there a few others we need to look at.
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Old 03-09-2019, 07:03 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djmarchand View Post
When Leishman wrote his revision to Bebe's book, Voyaging Under Power, he reviewed the KK42 and said it needed window covers for serious blue water use and said nothing along those lines about his own Nordhavn design.

True? Still true of newer models of KKs?

Not sure if they are standard equipment or an option but the Nordhavns do have window covers or at least provisions for them. See the M/V Dirona blog on how James Hamilton has to use his crane to apply the salon window covers.
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Old 03-10-2019, 07:03 AM   #8
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"(if you want/need the pilot berth there)."


If you will be operating with unskilled crew , a PH bunk is very desirable ,
as well as an operating set of Murphy Gauges
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Old 03-10-2019, 10:20 AM   #9
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I guess that the Nordhavn might be better at sea, so if you want to cross oceans, then that vessel might be a better fit. However the interior space in the KK48 is superior. I haven looked at both recently, but the KK48 Pilothouse is much more spacious. Moving down a notch, we looked at the N40 as compared with the KK42, and there was far more space in in the Krogen.

If I could have any boat, if I won the lottery, it would be the KK48 for me.

Jim
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Old 03-10-2019, 01:28 PM   #10
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Dont think you could go wrong with either. A few suggestions though.
Egress should be easy, a step thru access from the deck to dock is important to us. Our Selene has side doors farther forward than the Nordies, this makes single handeled docking safer and easier. Bow and stern thrusters, a must for single handeled and much safer for crew also. The full walk around is a must for us, but I see the advantage of gaining that extra 2 feet on the Port Salon.
Also, the Dutch doors in the pilot house is a must for us. Fresh air and picture taking made easy.
Either boat are fine example’s of blue water “capable” boats.
Happy hunting!
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Old 03-10-2019, 05:59 PM   #11
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I think you are looking at fine boats, and unless you have a specialized mission they will likely perform well for most of your use.

I feel the KK and N have a different feel inside. We like them both, but decided we wanted both paravanes and active stabilizers, and a wing engine.

I really like the lines of the KKs. The 39 is a favorite of mine. There is a beautiful 48AE for sale in our marina. I donít care for the exterior woodwork on the older ones. The wood looks nice, but I donít want the work. I like their aft decks and flybridges very much.

Which boat makes your heart sing when you are walking down the dock? Have you been underway on either vessel?

Consider some things that will ease your enjoyment of the boat, such as tender stowage, ease of docking, and anchoring.

Consider resale. A wise broker told me the average ownership period is 4 years. Perhaps getting the right boat now will ease your exit strategy.

You mention you are intending to do this sooner rather than later. Perhaps you might keep the aperature open and select based on what you like best instead of brand. In the end they are both good boats.

Best Wishes
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Old 03-10-2019, 06:59 PM   #12
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ďIreneĒ provides good advice. Get on both and have a good look at them.

Will you be building a new vessel? It looks to me that the Krogen 48 is a larger vessel and will have more interior space. You pretty much have to get into a Nordhavn 52 to achieve more similar interior space, but then thatís a bigger boat, still:

Nordhavn 475 specs:
https://www.nordhavn.com/models/475/specs/

Nordhavn 52 specs:
https://www.nordhavn.com/models/52/specs/

Kadey Krogen 48 specs:
http://www.kadeykrogen.com/yachts/krogen-48-ae/

I actually prefer the look of the older KK48ís to the newer ones. And you cannot beat the cockpit of the KK48. We have some good friends that live on theirs and there is some definite envy going on. Mind you heís pretty anal about his brightwork and it shows very well.

Jim
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Old 03-12-2019, 11:17 AM   #13
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You have good feedback on the two vessels, I just wanted to say AWESOME plan and wish you all the best going after it!!
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Old 03-15-2019, 03:54 PM   #14
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They are both solid, proven designs, I've inspected many N47s and KKY48s, and I have a number of clients happily cruising examples of each model for many years.

Naturally, there are differences.

You might find this two part article helpful when comparing the two, including details like tank materials, plumbing, core and electrical systems. I'd also research the background on each engine model, including known weaknesses.

https://stevedmarineconsulting.com/a...uation-part-i/

https://stevedmarineconsulting.com/a...ation-part-ii/

Storm shutters (and their attachment points) are optional on Nordhavns.
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