Has the cost of fuel slowed you down? (Non-political)

[Portage_Bay]

I agree fuel is the biggest daily cruising cost by far, especially at today's prices. I don't add in restaurant costs because we don't eat out any more often on cruise than we do when at home. We don't frequent expensive marinas but I do add marina costs into total costs. However in total cost of ownership, moorage (home port and out ports), maintenance & repairs, upgrades, insurance and depreciation fuel is a small item. Insurance being the only lesser cost than fuel.

So do you stay at a lot of marinas and restaurants?

On our trips to Alaska and B.C., fuel is our biggest cost. We like anchoring over staying at a marinas. The marinas are also commercial fishing ports and cruise lines.

Nice quiet bays are for us.

 

[MYTraveler]

So do you stay at a lot of marinas and restaurants?

On our trips to Alaska and B.C., fuel is our biggest cost. We like anchoring over staying at a marinas. The marinas are also commercial fishing ports and cruise lines.

Nice quiet bays are for us.

The other costs I am thinking of include insurance, dockage, bottom cleaning, washdowns and maintenance, most of which are unaffected by actual use. In total, over the course of a year, those costs greatly exceed fuel costs (I burn an average of 1 gph, genset included). I don't count restaurants (or provisioning costs) since I figure I am going to eat wherever I am. I don't incur much cost at marinas, but if I did, that would make fuel even less significant. And when I am at a marina, I figure I am saving money as compared to staying at a hotel.

 

[w8n4sun]

...(I burn an average of 1 gph, genset included).

For the size boat in your avatar, do you really only burn 1 gph?

 

[MYTraveler]

For the size boat in your avatar, do you really only burn 1 gph?

Sorry, major typo. I should have said 1 nmpg. But, fuel costs are dwarfed by my other (mostly fixed) costs, even in a year during which I use the boat extensively. BTW, in re-reading my post I see that I also left out property taxes, which are in excess of $20K. That buys a lot of fuel, even at today's prices.

 

[Vashon_Trawler]

The cost of diesel makes me happy that I only burn about 1/2 to 2/3 gallon an hour at 6 knots! I only wish I could get out more often and burn more fuel! Work gets in the way!

 

[w8n4sun]

Sorry, major typo. I should have said 1 nmpg. But, fuel costs are dwarfed by my other (mostly fixed) costs, even in a year during which I use the boat extensively. BTW, in re-reading my post I see that I also left out property taxes, which are in excess of $20K. That buys a lot of fuel, even at today's prices.

Makes more sense, we burn about the same rate as you. 250-300 hrs annually and we have not slowed down in speed or usage this year. Does hurt to pay more for fuel but like others have said, fuel is still less expensive than moorage, maintenance, detailing, etc.

 

[Arc]

If I don’t spend it on fuel , my children will.

 

[DennisB1]

I cruise between 8 to 10 knots with a GB49 classic with 2 cat 3208TA (375hp).
8 knots 2 mpg, 9 knots 1.5 and 10 1 mpg. If I am not in a hurry I like the 8 knot cruise with an auto pilot, it is easy to do and does keep the fuel burn down. The boat is quiter at the lower speed/rpm still faster than my prior life with a sailboat. I do use the ten knot speed on occasion and do run the engines up for a short period daily to burn out carbon on the turbines. So why go faster even though I can afford the addition fuel burn at the faster speeds. I try to avoid running to a schedule like I did when I was working full time.

 

[Hippocampus]

Totally agree schedules kill. But still have outside obstacles that impose increase fuel burn at times. Escaping weather, making best use of favorable conditions, speeding up to pass a bottleneck during favorable times, making a landfall in daylight when you have no local knowledge etc. even in the absence of artificial manmade schedules nature has its own.
There’s also emotion. Most here are lifelong power. But there’s a fair number of ex sailors. Perhaps I’m a bit of a purist but less then 10% of miles traveled was under power. Now I’m no longer a slave to apparent wind. That freedom is liberating. Maybe it will wear off but I will occasionally speed up just for the joy of it.

 

[Prospective]

I have a planning hull boat. I burn 35-40gph at cruise and went thru about 750 gallons of fuel this season. I didn't slow down literally but fuel cost did impact how I boat. I did fewer day trips. I want to maximize my number of hours on the boat per gallon of fuel. If I go somewhere and spend a night or more then it's more time spent on the boat for the given amount of fuel to get there.

The other adjustment was more time on anchor or moorings rather than transient slips. I usually spend money on transient slips but spent very little time in them this season. Avoiding expensive slips in places like Newport, Nantucket, Montauk, and the Vineyard helped "balance the budget" a bit.

 

[SteveK]

I have a planning hull boat. I burn 35-40gph at cruise and went thru about 750 gallons of fuel this season. ...................

I see what you are saying, get there asap and sit back and enjoy.
The math says you did 20 hours underway this season. If you told a weekend warrior ski boat owner this they would say you have not used the boat at all.

I use 24 hour days on the boat in a year not fuel as a measure of whether I am enjoying the boat. To put into perspective how many days did you sleep on the boat?

 

[Alaskan Sea-Duction]

Well fuel bumped up again yesterday by $0.60 a gallon. $6.65 a gallon here now.

 

[Prospective]

I see what you are saying, get there asap and sit back and enjoy.
The math says you did 20 hours underway this season. If you told a weekend warrior ski boat owner this they would say you have not used the boat at all.

I use 24 hour days on the boat in a year not fuel as a measure of whether I am enjoying the boat. To put into perspective how many days did you sleep on the boat?

I probably did about 25 hrs this season as I do most seasons because some of the engine time is slow speed. But I spent over 30 nights on my boat this season. She's not a dock queen either. I only spent one night in my home slip. So, in terms of hours of "use" per gallon of fuel, I do pretty well. For day trips to the sandbar I have a 23ft center console that is much more economical for that use.

Most of my cruising destinations are 1-3hrs away. Then I spend at least one, and often several nights there before moving on. If I was a fisherman or had to cover large distances, fuel would be a much bigger issue.

 

[Hippocampus]

Yes unless on charter the big sportfish are just sitting to what I’ve seen.

 

[long-cours.62]

When we want refueling in France it was 10.52€ for 1 us gallon !!!
We dont fill the tank, after that we put 1100lt at 2.34€ 1 us gallon but we had not already convert our € to local money and don't feel up the tank... and today no more diesel in the country :-(
End of July we bring a friend boat and the price in France was 9€ per galon.
As soon as they got diesel I fill up my tank may be can put 1240 more gallon in them

 

[Simi 60]

So we’ve slowed down from 9.2kn @ 1300 rpm to 8kn @ 1050 rpm.
Fuel burn has gone from 18 lph to 10 lph [emoji846]

A worthwhile and dramatic saving

 

[SteveK]

I probably did about 25 hrs this season as I do most seasons because some of the engine time is slow speed. But I spent over 30 nights on my boat this season. She's not a dock queen either. I only spent one night in my home slip. So, in terms of hours of "use" per gallon of fuel, I do pretty well. For day trips to the sandbar I have a 23ft center console that is much more economical for that use.

Most of my cruising destinations are 1-3hrs away. Then I spend at least one, and often several nights there before moving on. If I was a fisherman or had to cover large distances, fuel would be a much bigger issue.

I burned approx. 1500 litres or 400 US gallons and stayed onboard 40 days since July 18th. Heading out for 7 days tomorrow.

In my case average 10 gallons per day of usage, yours is 25 gallons per day usage. When you look at it this way fuel is not that expensive.

Dock Queen, both our boats are dock queens when we are not there on board.

 

[O C Diver]

I left April 3rd and should be home around November 7th. The summer trip will be about 7,000 miles and around 1,600 gallons. Probably off the boat for about a month between 2 weeks in the boatyard and 2 one week trips to visit people. Very happy with the utilization, but a significant maintenance puch list for the winter.

Ted

 

[Fletcher500]

We covered a lot of miles this season and have another month to go before we head back to our marina in SD. Regardless of the price of fuel, I have always run the boat fairly easy at 7 to 7.5Kn because I am not a rush to get anywhere and enjoy the transits, even the longer ones. Many of our days are just hanging on a mooring ball, at anchor, or visiting a new marina. IE, we are just as happy running the engine, as not. As the Defever 48 across from me says on the transom - "Lazy Daze".

 

[ScottC]

In a word, no. The cost of fuel did not slow us down. We were already going slow ;-)

In another thread, I posted some summary info about our travels this year. I have pasted below an excerpt, as a bit of it is fuel-related. As I posted elsewhere in TF last month, there is clearly an inverse relationship between fuel costs and marina costs -- at least for us. We spent little on fuel, compared to what we spent on marinas (and this was not a surprise -- it was the plan).

Cruise Route for 2022: Toulon, France via the Italian coast to Valletta, Malta (taking in some of Corsica, Capraia, Elba, Capri, Aeolian Islands and most of Sicily)

Days cruising: 140
Marina nights: 136
Anchor nights: 3
Total distance: 1,384 NM
Portion of above running on electric: 350 NM (i.e. 25% of trip)
Diesel engine hours: 149
Diesel fuel consumed: 881 Liters (236 US Gallons)
Diesel cost: 1,850€
Average diesel consumption (NM): 0.64 liters (0.17 US Gallons) / NM (calc. includes distance covered by electric)
Average diesel consumption per hour: 5.9 liters (1.58 US Gallons) per hour
Marina costs: 8,900€
Avg marina cost : 65€/night (we tended toward the higher-end/full service marinas -- and Capri was an eye-popping 215€/night plus electric & water for rather mediocre facilities. Had to do it once, however.)
Marinas stayed at: 46
Average nights per marina: ~3 (almost never less than 2, but some a lot longer than 3)
Diesel engine problems: Zero
Electric motor problems: Zero
Electronics & nav systems problems: Zero
Toilet/flush problems: Multiple. Joker valve, hose blockage, macerator pump leak, 3-way valve failure. Of course, all at different times.
Frozen gin problems: Hmmm… I seem to remember an entire thread dedicated to this. Anyway, troubleshooting is still ongoing.

I was very surprised at the number of nautical miles we were able cover using electric. It was only possible due to the unbelievably outstanding weather we had for the majority of our trip. Only one bad storm (for which we were already in port). Rain seen only on about 5 or so of the 140 days we were cruising. We found ourselves wishing for rain and thunderstorms in order to cool things down. Didn’t happen.

 

[Mambo42]

Prices here in Europe are pretty steep at the moment, paying around 7.8 USD per gallon if I buy it here in Greece. On the other side of the water (Albania) I pay around 5.8 USD per gallon.
The higher fuel cost are not pleasant, but by not going into a marina every night we save a lot of money. Increased the chain on board from 300' to 450', giving up more places to anchor. Prices in the marinas are ridiculous in some locations, so staying on anchor saves us, every month, about 2000 euro. Those savings enable us to pay the extra fuel price.
We will reduce the fuel burn a bit, by running on one engine when we have the opportunity and reducing the need for generator use by installing a lot of solar panels.

In all, the higher fuel cost are not fun, but we can work around it.

 

[Mako]

ScottC, does recharging your boat get taken into account for your decision to nearly-exclusively stay at marinas?

 

[ScottC]

ScottC, does recharging your boat get taken into account for your decision to nearly-exclusively stay at marinas?

No, however it was a nice "side benefit" in that most marinas on our route did not meter and charge separately for electricity. On our 2022 route, we preferred marinas first and foremost because they allowed us fairly easy access to the myriad historical sites Italy has to offer on land.

The other main reason for our marina preference is lack of a decent and easily deployable dinghy. We will not have a dinghy hanging on davits off the stern of the boat, as it blocks the otherwise excellent view from the helm and it adds LOA for dockage. We do not want to put a dinghy on the roof of the salon, as it would kill solar production. We do not want to put a dinghy on the cabin top, as it obstructs view. Have reluctantly considered towing. We DO have an inflatable dinghy stowed for use in situations that merit the rather excessive effort to get it out, inflate it and then clean it, deflate it, dry it and put all back in storage again when finished. We haven't totally given up on a proper dinghy...but we've been waiting a long time for a suitable solution to present itself.

In summary, I think our boat is simply too small for a typical dinghy setup.

 

[darkside]

Cruise Route for 2022: Toulon, France via the Italian coast to Valletta, Malta (taking in some of Corsica, Capraia, Elba, Capri, Aeolian Islands and most of Sicily)

That is some cruise. For the record we anchored out at Capri. The price for a 46' cat was outrageous. Joining friends in Turkey next week to relive some of our Med cruising memories.

We tried to slow down to 16kn but couldn't do it. We are burning a little less now at 2.4l/nm at 18kn so happy enough with that.
Using fuel means we are using the boat so I don't mind at all.

 

[Mambo42]

We will not have a dinghy hanging on davits off the stern of the boat, as it blocks the otherwise excellent view from the helm and it adds LOA for dockage.

If you allow me to throw some ideas around, you can get foldable Davits systems (own designs) that will offer you the opportunity to have the dinghy hanging just above the waterline. Once the dinghy is in the water you just fold the Davits down, so they don't obstruct the view anymore. If you are interested I can send you some pictures of some of these systems I have seen on boats here in the marina where I am.

What many boat owners do in the marina is tie the dinghy to the bow instead of the stern. That way they won't charge you for the extra length of the boat, which in itself would be a silly reason anyway.

It might be an idea to solve your dinghy 'problem' in this way, since a dinghy is quite handy if you want to visit a beach or a small village when all the spots in the port or marina are taken.

 

[BlueRidge]

The cost of diesel makes me happy that I only burn about 1/2 to 2/3 gallon an hour at 6 knots! I only wish I could get out more often and burn more fuel! Work gets in the way!



Hello Vashon, I'm in Sarasota and would like to talk with you about Vashon Trawlers.

If you have time, please call me at 239-537-4359. Thanks, John

 

[ScottC]

If you allow me to throw some ideas around, you can get foldable Davits systems (own designs) that will offer you the opportunity to have the dinghy hanging just above the waterline. Once the dinghy is in the water you just fold the Davits down, so they don't obstruct the view anymore. If you are interested I can send you some pictures of some of these systems I have seen on boats here in the marina where I am.

What many boat owners do in the marina is tie the dinghy to the bow instead of the stern. That way they won't charge you for the extra length of the boat, which in itself would be a silly reason anyway.

It might be an idea to solve your dinghy 'problem' in this way, since a dinghy is quite handy if you want to visit a beach or a small village when all the spots in the port or marina are taken.

Thank you for the tips, Mambo42!

 

[kthoennes]

Well this could put a new perspective on the perennial gas/diesel debate for boats:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...pply-and-surging-demand-are-a-worry-for-biden

As diesel climbs past $5 and toward $6 (or more) here in the heart of ag country, I'm beginning to like my gas engines more and more. But then maybe that's temporary too and I should be shopping for a sailboat -- even if they are caves in the water. No, not there yet. I love to be one with nature but crashing to the sole and whacking my head on a keel-stepped mast after I slip on wet companionway stairs is not my idea of fun.

 

[rslifkin]

Well this could put a new perspective on the perennial gas/diesel debate for boats:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...pply-and-surging-demand-are-a-worry-for-biden

As diesel climbs past $5 and toward $6 (or more) here in the heart of ag country, I'm beginning to like my gas engines more and more. But then maybe that's temporary too and I should be shopping for a sailboat -- even if they are caves in the water. No, not there yet. I love to be one with nature but crashing to the sole and whacking my head on a keel-stepped mast after I slip on wet companionway stairs is not my idea of fun.

Supply issues might be a reason to like the gassers, but even with the recent cost spread between gas and diesel my boat would be significantly cheaper to run with diesels (due to much lower fuel consumption).

 

[kthoennes]

Diesel or gas, it would really stink if we end up in a 1970's supply situation where they hang a "sorry, out of fuel" sign on the marina fuel pumps. One more reason not to own a superyacht lately I suppose. On the other hand I've read some other articles that the current supply crunch on diesel and the headlines about 25 days' supply might be alarmist, there's always seasonal pressure, harvest, stocking heating supplies, etc. We'll see. For now the boat will be on jack stands in a week or two and I'll see what it looks like in April.