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Old 07-20-2016, 08:14 AM   #21
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Mischief440 - below is from an old post discussing the search of boats from a distance, before I will travel even 30 miles I try and get each of these questions answered in sufficient detail to avoid wasting time and money....




I actually have an initial setof boat questions for when I call a boat for sale myself. YMMV but these haveworked well for me to sift out the ones I was more interested in pursuing...

- Are all those pictures ofyour boat?
- Are the machinery hours TT?
- Do you have a full list ofall items and options that convey with the boat?
- Are there maintenance recordsand are they up to date?
- Do you have a full history ofthe boat? Has it been damaged, partially submerged or seen heavy repairs?
- Can you send me 40-50 hi-resphotos of the boat including all of the machinery?
- What is your cruise and maxspeeds and at what rpm do you see those?
- What currently does not workon the boat?
- Where is the boat currentlyand in what condition is it stored?
- Do you own this boat or maybeis it under an LLC or partnership? Do you have 100% rights to sell the boatunencumbered?
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Old 07-20-2016, 08:16 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by mischief440 View Post
BandB the seller and the non profit are one and the same. The 1000 hr service was done by the seller(non profit). The groundings and damage occured while the seller (non profit) owned it. I'm not surprised to find things wrong on the survey, what I was surprised to find is that the engines failed to perform as they should if they had just been through a proper and complete 1000 hr MAN service as it was represented. The first listing even went on to say next service not due to 2000 hrs.
My first thought is that with the prop damage, I wouldn't be surprise if the engines are now over propped. That would limit the rpm even if the engines were running fine. The overheating is a different issue.

Not to tag on here, but TF is a community. Don't be surprised if you and your posts don't the respect you think they deserve after a single post. Simply put, you have absolutely no credibility. An initial post to complain is seriously suspect, particularly if if you just did the same on another forum.

I wish you luck on finding a boat and am sorry about this sale not going as you had hoped.
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Old 07-20-2016, 09:01 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mischief440 View Post
BandB the seller and the non profit are one and the same. The 1000 hr service was done by the seller(non profit). The groundings and damage occured while the seller (non profit) owned it. I'm not surprised to find things wrong on the survey, what I was surprised to find is that the engines failed to perform as they should if they had just been through a proper and complete 1000 hr MAN service as it was represented. The first listing even went on to say next service not due to 2000 hrs.
AMI Kids doesn't own and operate boats to my knowledge. They simply receive donations and then sell them. Now, they may have done leases like this already on this boat and the one leasing run it aground. Saying 1000 hour MAN service has been done really means nothing in the long run. It's not like a certification that the engines are in good shape. Any engine problems would be addressed in addition to that, not as part of it. It is only routine maintenance. I'd suggest you look at this page.

MAN Maintenance Schedule for Marine Diesel Engines

And if you'd looked up their maintenance schedules you'd know that you don't skip from 1000 to 2000 hours as MAN's schedule is every 200 hours. As to RPM it's turning with all the prop damage and such, it could be very mis-propped. Or it could have serious issues. Did you have the engines surveyed separately? That's what might have given you an indication. Why are you still even talking about or interested in this boat? You knew this was a boat that had been wrecked twice...yes, run aground sounds less ominous I guess.
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Old 07-20-2016, 02:24 PM   #24
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That was interesting, walk away, its no fun starting like this. By the way here is the listing , notice the service date November 1015? All work performed by authorized MAN dealer and completed in Nov. 1015.
https://www.boats.com/power-boats/20.../#.V4_NOI-cG00
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Old 07-20-2016, 06:09 PM   #25
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Lease?

Side issue, it seems odd for the charitable donee/seller to retain ownership for an extended period after lease (?sale). Do they sell on their residual rights as owner to a financier, or do they really retain ownership? I`d have thought they`d be keen to get the boat off their books and get on with something else.
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Old 07-20-2016, 07:35 PM   #26
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Side issue, it seems odd for the charitable donee/seller to retain ownership for an extended period after lease (?sale). Do they sell on their residual rights as owner to a financier, or do they really retain ownership? I`d have thought they`d be keen to get the boat off their books and get on with something else.
All sorts of games being paid. If the charity sold it for less than "market value" then the deduction allowable to the donee would be the sales price, not market value. So picture this. Mr. Sneaky gets an appraisal of the boat of $500k at the time he donates it. He gets a tax deduction of $500k. However, if charity were to turn right around and sell it for $200k, then his deduction would be reduced to $200k. That would cost Mr. Sneaky about $120k in taxes. I still think the lease is constructively a sale and the deduction very much in question.

There are other games they can play. Various types of trusts. There could be some money going back to Mr. Sneaky although that's more common on land.

Charities often set up schemes but that doesn't mean the IRS always goes along with them. People buy hundreds of dollars of raffle tickets and are told they are tax deductible. They aren't. One year the IRS even looked for all donations divisible by 11 made to a specific church. The raffle tickets were $11 each.
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Old 07-20-2016, 08:14 PM   #27
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AMI Kids Bayliner 5288

That's the problem with these kind of sales schemes. Boat owner dumps (donates) a flea infested dog that could never sell for anywhere close to the donation value. The charity means well and operates within the letter of the law but has no practical knowledge of the boat beyond what the previous owner provides on the donation form. Boat buyers looking to maximize their leverage are attracted to these kind of sales and luckily this one got a survey.

Losing $3,500 ain't the end of the world, in my mind it saved the OP hundreds of thousands buying this money pit.
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