Starlink standard versus Roam / RV

[tiltrider1]

Mobile(Regional). Starts off by saying it can only be used on land and within your Continental Region. It then goes on to say that by toggling the Mobile priority switch you can use it on the Ocean. It does not define if this is all Oceans or only Ocean with in your Region.

It then goes on to say if you leave your Region you will need to switch to Mobile(Global). Then it restates the need for toggling Priority for Ocean use.

I am guessing that both Delfin and Simi 60 are reporting factual information. I am guessing that Starlink has probably grouped New Zeland and possibly PNG into one region.

This could give us two very different results.

 

[Delfin]

Mobile(Regional). Starts off by saying it can only be used on land and within your Continental Region. It then goes on to say that by toggling the Mobile priority switch you can use it on the Ocean. It does not define if this is all Oceans or only Ocean with in your Region.

It then goes on to say if you leave your Region you will need to switch to Mobile(Global). Then it restates the need for toggling Priority for Ocean use.

I am guessing that both Delfin and Simi 60 are reporting factual information. I am guessing that Starlink has probably grouped New Zeland and possibly PNG into one region.

This could give us two very different results.

Based on my experience of two weeks ago the term 'ocean' in the regional plan refers to oceans within territorial waters, i.e. 12 miles. Outside that I needed to switch to the Mobile Priority plan. I can't explain why what Simi insists works down under is not the case in North America. Maybe Elon Musk just likes Aussies, so treats them differently than the rest of the world.

 

[Simi 60]

Based on my experience of two weeks ago the term 'ocean' in the regional plan refers to oceans within territorial waters, i.e. 12 miles. Outside that I needed to switch to the Mobile Priority plan. I can't explain why what Simi insists works down under is not the case in North America. Maybe Elon Musk just likes Aussies, so treats them differently than the rest of the world.

Dude, really?
You need to go back and read again.

I very clearly pointed out several times that we use or need to use mobile priority when in the black but you have the choice whether to toggle PAYG data in 1gb blocks or go on a plan which burns through the 50 GB first even if on land and then leaves you with no data unless buying more again if on the ocean

I even put up a screen cap taken off starlinks page today that says same

Everything I have said I have provided supporting evidence to support it.

 

[Delfin]

Dude, really?
You need to go back and read again.

I very clearly pointed out several times that we use or need to use mobile priority when in the black but you have the choice whether to toggle PAYG data in 1gb blocks or go on a plan which burns through the 50 GB first even if on land and then leaves you with no data unless buying more again if on the ocean

I even put up a screen cap taken off starlinks page today that says same

Everything I have said I have provided supporting evidence to support it.

Try to keep up....actually what you said, over and over and over again is that SL's regional plan works in the 'ocean' if mobile data is toggled on. I am merely pointing out that that is false if you are in North America, so I assume there must be some special program for Aussies. Either that, or perhaps you haven't been actually offshore, out of sight of land since SL changed their plan service level about a month ago. Beats me, and I have to say, I couldn't care less. Cheers, Simi.

 

[Simi 60]

Try to keep up....actually what you said, over and over and over again is that SL's regional plan works in the 'ocean' if mobile data is toggled on..

No, it's you who needs to keep up

Here is the screen cap I put up showing the plan I am on
See where it says mobile regional (roam)?
The same roam you repeatedly claim doesn't exist.
See where it says it can be used in the ocean if toggled on?

How about you provide evidence that this is not the case
Report back when you have something.....anything

 

[Simi 60]

Actually, I give up
You win

 

[Delfin]

No, it's you who needs to keep up

Here is the screen cap I put up showing the plan I am on
See where it says mobile regional (roam)?
The same roam you repeatedly claim doesn't exist.
See where it says it can be used in the ocean if toggled on?

How about you provide evidence that this is not the case
Report back when you have something.....anything

. Well, you remain an interesting anomaly, since even other Aussies are not experiencing what you say you have. Weird they're all talking about 12 miles as a cutoff. Must be confused, although that is what I experienced, so maybe it is not them, or me that is confused.. https://www.cruisersforum.com/forum...does-starlink-rv-receive-a-signal-265611.html

 

[Simi 60]

As a final, read the plan description I am on
Take note of the yellow.

 

[Simi 60]

. Well, you remain an interesting anomaly, since even other Aussies are not experiencing what you say you have. Weird they're all talking about 12 miles as a cutoff. Must be confused, although that is what I experienced, so maybe it is not them, or me that is confused.. https://www.cruisersforum.com/forum...does-starlink-rv-receive-a-signal-265611.html

FFS , I have said the same but my experience is more like 20nm out.
Then toggle on and by data by the GB
No upgrade in plan required

And your thread is a 2022 thread
Hardly relevant given the speed things are changing

 

[Delfin]

Actually, I give up
You win

There's no 'winning,' Simi. Those that stay close to the coast can use their Regional plan, until SL fiddles again. If they venture offshore, then SL will let them know to upgrade to the plan that gives oceanic coverage, as opposed to coastal ocean coverage. So no problem. Cheers.

 

[SteveK]

12 mile cutoff was using a land based RV roam dishy. It was an estimate, not a fixed distance. As I posted in another thread SL support would neither confirm or deny this, but they suggested I zoom into the shoreline to see the land hex go into the ocean as an answer to my question when restricted to land use for RV roam came up. They soon changed the name and progressed into the black zones for fee, but it still works offshore without, just not too far. This has all been said several times. But to work on a boat you have to void your warranty by making the dishy flat. A moving dishy on a moving (heel/pitch) boat keeps searching the sky with loss of signal. Then they offer you the upgrade dishy which comes flat.

 

[twistedtree]

... what you said, over and over and over again is that SL's regional plan works in the 'ocean' if mobile data is toggled on. I am merely pointing out that that is false if you are in North America...

From all I'm seeing, you are the only case where this is true. I have confirmation from a couple of people who have operated more than 15 miles off shore, in all black patches, with Regional Mobile plus opt-in Priority. WildBlue did NOT have Priority turned on, so his connectivity loss was expected and consistent with published policies.



I can't explain your experience, but it seems to be a one-off and not reflective of general operation.

 

[twistedtree]

There's no 'winning,' Simi. Those that stay close to the coast can use their Regional plan, until SL fiddles again. If they venture offshore, then SL will let them know to upgrade to the plan that gives oceanic coverage, as opposed to coastal ocean coverage. So no problem. Cheers.

What I HAVE seen is that when people venture into black patches and get the warning, the SL guides them to the $250 Mobile Priority Plan, and conveniently leaves out that you can opt-in/out at any time for $2/GB. So they are steering people to the more expensive plan, even though you can get Mobile Priority Data via another avenue.

 

[Delfin]

12 mile cutoff was using a land based RV roam dishy. It was an estimate, not a fixed distance. As I posted in another thread SL support would neither confirm or deny this, but they suggested I zoom into the shoreline to see the land hex go into the ocean as an answer to my question when restricted to land use for RV roam came up. They soon changed the name and progressed into the black zones for fee, but it still works offshore without, just not too far. This has all been said several times. But to work on a boat you have to void your warranty by making the dishy flat. A moving dishy on a moving (heel/pitch) boat keeps searching the sky with loss of signal. Then they offer you the upgrade dishy which comes flat.

I have the antenna they sold for roaming, and once I upgraded to restore connectivity offshore, after 4-5 hours my antenna assumed a horizontal position, and there it has stayed for two weeks. I believe I saw someone else say that when they returned closer to land, and changed their plan back to Regional, the antenna starting moving around again. So no, you don't need to spend $2500 for a different antenna, at least based on my and others experience.

You're right about the 'estimate' of the 12 mile boundary. If you look at the shore based cells that are half land and half ocean, it begs the question of where would you do a cutoff if you're programming connectivity to match the plan someone is subscribed to? Seems like the smoothed line on every chart showing the territorial waters might be one way to define a boundary, even though the distance from that line to the shoreline will vary a bit. I have no idea whether that is what they are doing at SL, or whether they are establishing that boundary as the first cell that has no land within it, but I do know that my experience is matched by everyone I know that has gone offshore - that SL works on Regional offshore, but as you say "just not too far" offshore, regardless of whether you have selected 'priority data' or not.



It may be that the distance from shore you can operate Regional is a function of when the SL system hands your signal from a satellite that covers both land and ocean to one that is only ocean. The conditions under which that happens could be impacted by more than one factor, so perhaps that explains the varying claims of connectivity. All I do know is that once you are in the ocean in a cell that is all black, you will not have connectivity until you buy into an upgraded plan. Unless someone has navigated to one of those locations to see what actually happens, I have no idea what their basis for contradicting my experience might be, other than the love of argument.

 

[Delfin]

Incidentally, but this is the communication I received from SL after I got offshore a couple of weeks ago while on the Regional plan, with priority data toggled on:

"Your Starlink has been used in areas that violate the terms and conditions of your service plan: your plan does not include service on the ocean. You will be unable to connect to the internet on the ocean except to access your Starlink account where you can make updates to your account.”

Apparently they meant it, as I lost Internet from that moment until I upgraded.

 

[SteveK]

There are three hex which are black inside a triangle Victoria, port Angeles, port Townsend. A closer look no edge of the hex touches land. (not beach to beach) The distance is about 40 KM or 24 miles. Perhaps just one of the 12 mile quoted loss of signal.
So yes if the hex is 100% over water, it is called ocean (even in fresh water).
There most likely is bleed over of signal, there is a time limit when you are within the black. Suffice to say, unless you want to be offshore more than 12 miles the service is available with the RV roam now Mobile regional.
It is interesting that your dish laid flat after the upgrade like the hundreds modified to do so. Delfin, what did the upgrade include.Was it just a higher monthly cost or hardware change.

 

[Delfin]

There are three hex which are black inside a triangle Victoria, port Angeles, port Townsend. A closer look no edge of the hex touches land. (not beach to beach) The distance is about 40 KM or 24 miles. Perhaps just one of the 12 mile quoted loss of signal.
So yes if the hex is 100% over water, it is called ocean (even in fresh water).
There most likely is bleed over of signal, there is a time limit when you are within the black. Suffice to say, unless you want to be offshore more than 12 miles the service is available with the RV roam now Mobile regional.
It is interesting that your dish laid flat after the upgrade like the hundreds modified to do so. Delfin, what did the upgrade include.Was it just a higher monthly cost or hardware change.

That is correct in my experience.



The upgrade was just software. When I got far enough offshore, I got the warning at the same time Internet disappeared. I selected the Mobile Priority plan after verifying that the priority data switch was on in the then current Regional plan, and that wasn't the problem. At that point the antenna was cocked. After selecting Mobile Priority ($250/mo), the app said "in process for five hours, checking for obstructions", which seemed pretty random. In any case, I kept checking the app and the hours remaining kept ticking down so knew something was occuring. Finally it completed, Internet was back and the antenna is now parked horizontally.

From all this I assume that the guts of the $2500 antenna they want you to buy isn't much different than the $599 Roam model I have.
We'll land in Hilo today, and I'll switch the plan back to Regional. Not sure when the change will take effect, but on returning to the PNW I'll wait to see service drop, then go Mobile Priority to see if the expected behavior recurs.

 

[Simi 60]

From Starlink on a boat FB page
Multiple users with the same experience as me
Some getting 100nm offshore before having to toggle on/GB data
Some crossing oceans
All using the plan I am on, or global roaming if changing countries and simply toggling on data when in the black

Interesting to note the first post from Dean Cropp that in his pic he is using the original ROUND dish.
He is also son of Ben Cropp, a pretty famous diver and film maker in Oz
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Cropp

 

[Simi 60]

What I HAVE seen is that when people venture into black patches and get the warning, the SL guides them to the $250 Mobile Priority Plan, and conveniently leaves out that you can opt-in/out at any time for $2/GB. So they are steering people to the more expensive plan, even though you can get Mobile Priority Data via another avenue.

Exactly right.

 

[Delfin]

Now that we're in Hilo, I switched back to the Regional plan, no priority data. The antenna moved from the locked horizontal position to an incline to the sky position. Also now getting a warning that obstructions will cause an interruption every six minutes....Hmmm.....

 

[Delfin]

More weirdness...when we went ashore to visit a friend, the app acknowledged my change in plan, stating that the switch from Mobile Priority to Regional would take place today - on June 30. NOW, it says the change will be made on July 31, yet the antenna is acting like it is no longer Mobile Priority.



No clue what is going on.....

 

[Delfin]

FWIW, I finally connected with an actual human being at Starlink support after continuing to 'thumbs down' the bot responses to my question - "can you, or can you not use a Roam account on the open ocean with the mobile priority toggle switched on?"


Here is his response, which simply confirms my experience.

Mobile Priority vs Roam with mobile priority


COMMENT FROM AURRASH
Hello Carl,
Regional and Global roam are only intended and work on land in countries we have setup service in.
To use Starlink in the ocean you must use Priority mobile which is purchased on GB's or Terabyte plans.
So to answer your question no, you cannot use Roam in the ocean, Mobile priority is different from those plans and would need to be used to attain service in the water.
Thank you,
-Starlink Support


​

 

[tiltrider1]

A few starlink surprises.

Starlink knew when I was in Canada and announced that to me.

According to starlink I use an average of 25 gigabytes a day.

My antenna goes flat when I travel and then angles it’s self when I stop. However, it sometimes is pointed at 120 degrees and some times at 320 degrees.

I personally haven’t noticed any affects of my lower priority status.

While I don’t use starlink on travel days I do have auto monitoring functions that continue with out disruption which means starlink continues to function while I am in motion. This includes a day that I spent 3 hours at 15 mph.

I am currently In Desolation Sound.

 

[ksanders]

I have starlink mobile priority 50gb plan

I just toggle on the opt in to buy data at $2.00 a gig when going offshore then I toggle it off when I get nearshore.

easypeasy

 

[twistedtree]

FWIW, I finally connected with an actual human being at Starlink support after continuing to 'thumbs down' the bot responses to my question - "can you, or can you not use a Roam account on the open ocean with the mobile priority toggle switched on?"


Here is his response, which simply confirms my experience.

Mobile Priority vs Roam with mobile priority


COMMENT FROM AURRASH
Hello Carl,
Regional and Global roam are only intended and work on land in countries we have setup service in.
To use Starlink in the ocean you must use Priority mobile which is purchased on GB's or Terabyte plans.
So to answer your question no, you cannot use Roam in the ocean, Mobile priority is different from those plans and would need to be used to attain service in the water.
Thank you,
-Starlink Support


​

Very interesting, and thanks for being persistent about this. This is yet another undocumented aspect of their plans, and begs the question of what's an Ocean? The published material says it's defined as the black patches on the map, but this suggests that not all black patches are created equal, and some only require opt-in priority data, where others require an underlying Mobile Priority plan. Your experience suggests that the line is some distance off-shore, but that's a single data point, and there are countless other data points of people operating the same or greater distances off shore with only opt-in Priority Data. So the dividing line would appear to be more complex formula.


And there is one other unknown variable here, which is the accuracy of the answer you got from SL. It may be correct, but I personally wouldn't take it to the bank. In my experience, I'd say that I get correct answers from tech support people no more than 75% of the time, and it may be closer to 50%. I'm not saying the answer is wrong, just cautioning re accuracy of ANY info about SL operation, rules, or plans.

 

[Delfin]

Very interesting, and thanks for being persistent about this. This is yet another undocumented aspect of their plans, and begs the question of what's an Ocean? The published material says it's defined as the black patches on the map, but this suggests that not all black patches are created equal, and some only require opt-in priority data, where others require an underlying Mobile Priority plan. Your experience suggests that the line is some distance off-shore, but that's a single data point, and there are countless other data points of people operating the same or greater distances off shore with only opt-in Priority Data. So the dividing line would appear to be more complex formula.


And there is one other unknown variable here, which is the accuracy of the answer you got from SL. It may be correct, but I personally wouldn't take it to the bank. In my experience, I'd say that I get correct answers from tech support people no more than 75% of the time, and it may be closer to 50%. I'm not saying the answer is wrong, just cautioning re accuracy of ANY info about SL operation, rules, or plans.

Since the answer matches my experience, my son's on the East coast travelling to the Bahamas, and others who are actually out of sight of land, it certainly appears to be accurate.

 

[SteveK]

Out of sight of land? Makes sense. Well that would be the ocean.
In sight of land mine stays online as shown in the past 10 days cruising

 

[twistedtree]

Since the answer matches my experience, my son's on the East coast travelling to the Bahamas, and others who are actually out of sight of land, it certainly appears to be accurate.

But people seem to regularly have service crossing from FL to the Bahamas using Mobile +$2/GB priority, so it's not an "out of sight of land" delineation. And it doesn't seem to follow their coverage map. And it's the first indication that Mobile + the $2/GB Priority isn't the same thing as Mobile Priority.


The piece I still don't understand is that you are the only person I've encountered where Mobile + $2/GB priority hasn't worked off shore, and in all ways appeared to be the same as. This is the first case I've heard where Mobile + $2/GB Priority does not equal Mobile Priority.

 

[Simi 60]

.


The piece I still don't understand is that you are the only person I've encountered where Mobile + $2/GB priority hasn't worked off shore, and in all ways appeared to be the same as. This is the first case I've heard where Mobile + $2/GB Priority does not equal Mobile Priority.

From the Starlink terms and conditions in their writing it very CLEARLY says, it's an either or choice if on global mobile or regional mobile (roam) plans.

I, and I would think most others, chose $$/GB when needed to use it on ocean.

 

[Delfin]

But people seem to regularly have service crossing from FL to the Bahamas using Mobile +$2/GB priority, so it's not an "out of sight of land" delineation. And it doesn't seem to follow their coverage map. And it's the first indication that Mobile + the $2/GB Priority isn't the same thing as Mobile Priority.


The piece I still don't understand is that you are the only person I've encountered where Mobile + $2/GB priority hasn't worked off shore, and in all ways appeared to be the same as. This is the first case I've heard where Mobile + $2/GB Priority does not equal Mobile Priority.

"Mobile Priority" is a service plan that the human from SL says is the only service plan that provides oceanic coverage. Why SL named this service plan the same thing as the toggle switch in Regional/Roam beats me, but this naming confusion seems to be the source of endless dispute, and the support answer I got confirmed that just throwing the mobile priority toggle in Regional isn't going to get you coverage off shore. How faroff shore? No clue, but in my case, about 12 miles.



But anyone who wishes to believe that SL is confused about how their system operates is certainly free to do so. For me, it appears to operate just as they say it does, and if, as you suggest, I am the ONLY Person using SL in the deep blue where the system works as they say it does makes me feel real special.