What would you do?

[Osprey69]

If Lambs is not available, you have plenty of other choices right there in "Marina/Boatyard Mile".

 

[Fletcher500]

I also read elsewhere that, with this engine, if the pump fails completely, it will put metal shaving throughout the entire fuel system, causing the need for a replacement of a lot of parts and many hours of labor. Not something I'd like to chance.

A 60 sec Google Search can support just about any thesis.

Specifically where did you read “with this engine, if the pump fails completely it will put metal shavings throughout the fuel system”? Many of us on this Forum have the specific engine (QSB 6.7) you are referencing so please post a link so we can check it out as well.

Did you go through the Seaboard Marine Website that has a Cummins specific Forum? There are also some good “learning your engine” articles that go through the basics.

Move slow, to move fast.

 

[psneeld]

Found these tidbits interesting... wonder if any apply.

QSB 6.7 Fuel Pump question

An acquaintance of mine made a mistake. He was changing his fuel filters and started his engine without turning the fuel feed and return lines on. He stated he let it run for about 5 seconds, noticed it sounded rough, … Read More

www.sbmar.com

 

[Jklotz]

Found these tidbits interesting... wonder if any apply.

QSB 6.7 Fuel Pump question

An acquaintance of mine made a mistake. He was changing his fuel filters and started his engine without turning the fuel feed and return lines on. He stated he let it run for about 5 seconds, noticed it sounded rough, … Read More

www.sbmar.com

Yup, that's the 1st thing North Pacific told me when we talked about the fuel manifold - Don't EVER, EVER, EVER run the engine, even for 1 second, with both fuel return valves closed. Bad things will happen and cause an expensive repair. When switching tanks, make sure to switch the one that is closed to open BEFORE closing the other one. Fortunately, I got that memo before I started mucking with anything. If that happened on my boat, it was before my watch.

 

[Jklotz]

An update: Went to Lambs this morning, talked to Alex, the service manager. They are booked up, but he got the Cummins guy on the phone (how'd he do that? I've left message after message with no call back! Grrrr!). They are now scheduled for a Monday visit. Alex promised to follow up with them Monday morning. (Nice guy btw, hope to work with him in the future.) Engine is out of warranty period, but depending on what's wrong with it, it may be covered under some sort of emissions warranty, so for that reason, it makes sense to keep waiting on Cummins. Fingers crossed they show up.

 

[Sababa]

It's a tough time of year to get workmen to show up with so many people casting off—wish I were one of them!

 

[Diep]

Recreational boaters are pretty much one-offs. Even the most service-oriented outfits need to prioritize the repeat and high-volume customers. So commercial/industrial accounts, then the marinas and service providers. These are sources of continued and returning business and referrals. Random individuals get whats left when resources are limited.

This is another reason why, even if mostly DIY, it can pay to be a little bit of a customer. The professionals have more pull and can sometimes come through when you are drawing blanks on your own.

 

[Jklotz]

Update: Finally, some good news. Cummins guy came out today. Diagnosed the problem and ran the computer fault codes. Determined I need a new pump and some other hardware along with a full day's labor. Total bill, including today, in the $10-$12k range! Yikes! Turns out he was able to warranty it though. Parts are ordered, hopefully be on my merry way by the end of the week and I'm not going to have to rob my 401K!

 

[Helmsman]

Update: Finally, some good news. Cummins guy came out today. Diagnosed the problem and ran the computer fault codes. Determined I need a new pump and some other hardware along with a full day's labor. Total bill, including today, in the $10-$12k range! Yikes! Turns out he was able to warranty it though. Parts are ordered, hopefully be on my merry way by the end of the week and I'm not going to have to rob my 401K!

Once this is over with, let us know what you find

 

[Mac2]

Great news! Good job Cummins. Any info on why pump had this issue so soon? Was diesel leaking into the interior? Do you neeto change the oil?

 

[Jklotz]

Great news! Good job Cummins. Any info on why pump had this issue so soon? Was diesel leaking into the interior? Do you neeto change the oil?

He didn't think any diesel had gotten into the oil but no way to be certain without pulling samples and sending to the lab. If it got bad, I'd have been "making oil" and I didn't notice that with engine room checks. I'm guessing they'll do an oil change as a precautionary measure once the pump is replaced, although that was not discussed. Any info about why the pump failed would be pure speculation on my part, but like I mentioned in an earlier post, the same year engine had been recalled for faulty hp fuel pumps in Dodge trucks, although that was not the marine engine.

 

[Jklotz]

Once this is over with, let us know what you find

Will do.

 

[DDW]

Hard to beat a free replacement from Cummins. But I'll still say, at $12K, someone is making a very good wage on that job. If you can, keep track of the time they spend.

 

[Diep]

Stick to them like a shadow (if you can... some techs are grumpy). You can learn a lot and pick up practical tips just watching a good tech work. If they are a happy tech maybe you can get a few questions in or pick up more knowledge/tips/tricks through conversation.

I once had the opportunity to help a Cummins tech change injectors. It was in a commercial vessel, in operation, and the ER was about 110 deg and 130 dB. Had to work from a step ladder to reach the work zone so I was tool and part gopher. Couldn't chat but still picked up some good practices.

This guy knew exactly what tool he needed and in what order. Humbling for a shade tree guy who feels a sense of victory guessing the right socket the first time. This tech's frustration was that I didn't know where to find stuff fast in his box. Impressive how fast someone like that can work.

I hope the parts come in and all goes well. Rooting for you!

 

[Jklotz]

Hard to beat a free replacement from Cummins. But I'll still say, at $12K, someone is making a very good wage on that job. If you can, keep track of the time they spend.

He wanted some other parts beyond just the pump replaced as well. Course' that was off the top of his head, not an official quote. Pretty sure those are internal numbers as well, reflecting internal billing between departments - very different than somebody actually writing a check. If I had to pay for it, I doubt it would be that much.

 

[DDW]

I'd still hang around while they did it, if they wouldn't charge you more! You'll get an education if nothing else.

On the Ford truck diesel (same pump I think), when it goes bad you have to replace the pump and everything downstream of it: pressure regulators, lines, injectors. Even so, it is only something like 8 hours and $4-5K in parts. If it has piezo injectors (and maybe the solenoid too, not sure) when they get replaced you have to inform the ECU, that requires the factory proprietary software, so you are stuck with Cummins (or renting the exorbitantly priced software).

 

[proudsailor]

Interesting thread to follow. Thanks for sharing your travails. Have consistently heard/read good things about Lambs so a win for you to reach out to them even if they didn't do the work. That experience will keep them on your list. Wild how your innocent and very affable post of "what would you do" devolved into lawyers, suits, name calling (you bad check writer you!) etc. Yet you clearly described what appeared to be no ill will by any party involved. And in fact, lots of support and sympathy.

You get many more flies with honey than you do with vinegar! Looking forward to learning the outcome. At what Jax Marina are you stranded?

 

[Jklotz]

Interesting thread to follow. Thanks for sharing your travails. Have consistently heard/read good things about Lambs so a win for you to reach out to them even if they didn't do the work. That experience will keep them on your list. Wild how your innocent and very affable post of "what would you do" devolved into lawyers, suits, name calling (you bad check writer you!) etc. Yet you clearly described what appeared to be no ill will by any party involved. And in fact, lots of support and sympathy.

You get many more flies with honey than you do with vinegar! Looking forward to learning the outcome. At what Jax Marina are you stranded?

Thanks. I'm at Port 32

 

[ranger58sb]

At what Jax Marina are you stranded?

Thanks. I'm at Port 32

Not a bad place to be hangin' out...

-Chris

 

[Jklotz]

Not a bad place to be hangin' out...

-Chris

Yea, could be worse. Grocery, West Marine, some restaurants within walking distance, pool and hot tub, place for dogs to go out. Reliable power and water and being on the St John's, it's mostly fresh water. Only downside is it's 30 miles from the ICW. Overall, it's a nice marina.

 

[psneeld]

Yea, could be worse. Grocery, West Marine, some restaurants within walking distance, pool and hot tub, place for dogs to go out. Reliable power and water and being on the St John's, it's mostly fresh water. Only downside is it's 30 miles from the ICW. Overall, it's a nice marina.

Some great cruising up the St Johns.

Have a good friend in Deland and we visit several times a year. Boat with him on the St Johns most visits.

Have even thought about a houseboat rental for a week or so now that I am just a small boat owner.

Some people I Know that have cruised up it said it is a worthwhile cruise between others.

 

[slowgoesit]

He didn't think any diesel had gotten into the oil but no way to be certain without pulling samples and sending to the lab. If it got bad, I'd have been "making oil" and I didn't notice that with engine room checks. I'm guessing they'll do an oil change as a precautionary measure once the pump is replaced, although that was not discussed. Any info about why the pump failed would be pure speculation on my part, but like I mentioned in an earlier post, the same year engine had been recalled for faulty hp fuel pumps in Dodge trucks, although that was not the marine engine.

Glad that you're getting into the home stretch here! Lovely boat too.
Unfortunately, although it would be beneficial to know exactly what actually failed, most likely you will never know. I once sent in a control box for a CnC Plasma Table that had failed. Manufacturer said they ran returned boxes through a rigorous diagnostic procedure, and I would be getting a detailed report of what failed, along with my rebuilt/repaired control box. Received the control box a week later, under reason for failure was the detailed results of their rigorous diagnostic procedure. Two words: Bad box. . . .
Heck, if I'd known that, I would have scolded the box severely, and it would have straightened up and worked, and I'd have saved the cost of the repair!

 

[Jklotz]

Glad that you're getting into the home stretch here! Lovely boat too.
Unfortunately, although it would be beneficial to know exactly what actually failed, most likely you will never know. I once sent in a control box for a CnC Plasma Table that had failed. Manufacturer said they ran returned boxes through a rigorous diagnostic procedure, and I would be getting a detailed report of what failed, along with my rebuilt/repaired control box. Received the control box a week later, under reason for failure was the detailed results of their rigorous diagnostic procedure. Two words: Bad box. . . .
Heck, if I'd known that, I would have scolded the box severely, and it would have straightened up and worked, and I'd have saved the cost of the repair!

Bad box! Don't make me call your parents!!! Ha!

Cummins will be out at 8am tomorrow, so I have been told.

 

[Jklotz]

Guy is here working now. Says he's having to pull the heat exchanger to get to the bolt. It's quite a bit more involved than I'd have thought.

As a side note, I find some of the OSHA rules amusing. He had to put a padlock around my key floaty, take a pic of it and send it back to the office before they gave him the go ahead to start.

 

[SteveK]

But were you tempted to put key in ignition?

 

[Diep]

It only takes one $50,000 mistake...

 

[rslifkin]

I always do a version of lock out / tag out when doing engine work. Keys stowed away from ignitions, and either ignition breaker or battery switch for the engine in question turned off so even if someone grabbed the keys and tried to start it, nothing would happen.

 

[Jklotz]

But were you tempted to put key in ignition?

Nope, not even a little. He's a good guy, although he is cutting into my diet coke stash a little. (joking. I'd buy him a truckload of diet coke if he can get this damned thing fixed!)

 

[Jklotz]

It only takes one $50,000 mistake...

My sense of humor is a bit dry, but honestly, I could see where it would be a really good idea if there were multiple people on board. Especially multiple techs working.

 

[KnotYet]

OSHA in this case codifies what has been standard practice across many industries.
Having the photo also keeps the lawyers and insurance companies happy, too.