Water Stains

[AllanY]

I am looking at purchasing a boat that appears prior offer being accepted and survey to be in good shape
However there is some cosmetic work to do

The one that the wife is concerned about is water stains in the timber inside where windows and portholes have leaked.
It all seems to be old damage

How would I go about fixing the timber to remove these marks.
I know you will never get rid of all of them all but hopefully most would be good

Allan

 

[coyote454]

Allan,

I'm not sure what you refer to when you say the 'timber' has stains. If you mean the wood surrounding the porthole, windows and such it may be as simple as lightly sanding the wood down to an even color and then re-staining.


I know I had water leaking discoloration around the forward hatch on the inside of my boat and I just lightly sanded and than used Cetol to put color back in. There are several products which work well, and as you'll find, everyone has their own opinion as to what works well for them.


Now if the discoloration is in the teak*paneling, a simple sanding won't work.


If you had pictures to post it may be easier to understand the problem.


Good luck in the purchase.


Mike
Brookings, Oregon


-- Edited by coyote454 on Saturday 1st of May 2010 05:51:35 PM

 

[Piers]

Hi Allan,

I have a feeling that Oxalic acid may be the answer. Here are some refences on the web for you.

http://www.woodfinishsupply.com/OxalicAcid.html

http://www.antiquerestorers.com/Articles/jeff/using_wood_bleach.htm

http://www.ehow.co.uk/how_5939015_use-oxalic-acid-_wood-bleach_.html

Piers

-- Edited by Piers on Saturday 1st of May 2010 11:27:09 PM

 

[AllanY]

The staining is from water caused by leaking portholes not shut properly and windows
The water has stained the teak I think it is

I was hoping a light sanding might do the trick

Thanks

Allan

-- Edited by AllanY on Sunday 2nd of May 2010 12:59:09 AM

-- Edited by AllanY on Sunday 2nd of May 2010 01:02:14 AM

 

[albin43]

its teak veneer, paint it or replace. first rebed the windows or it will keep leaking

 

[coyote454]

Allan,

I believe Albin43 has it diagnosed correctly. *Once the coloring of the teak veneer is gone you can't bring it back.


Mike
Brookings, Oregon

 

[koliver]

Impossible to rehabilitate that teak. The best looking solution is new teak. I have done some of that in my boat, below sliding windows in the main cabin. even just adding a skin of 1/8 inch teak plywood can look like new without a lot of work. Its just a little tricky to get the curve right below the porthole, but if you can get it right on a sacrificial piece of paper or cardboard, then transfer the curve to the teak, you can get it right and the results will be great.
Don't worry about matching the grain. I was unable to find any teak ply that resembled the characterless teak in my boat, so I used what I could find. Within a couple of years the difference isn't noticeable, and unless you really know what you are looking at, you can hardly tell where the old ends and the new begins.
You must remove the porthole and re-bed it, to ensure the stain doesn't come right back in the new teak. When it is out, you can ensure the leak hasn't done serious damage to any of the structure.

 

[AllanY]

Thanks Guys

I was afraid that would be the answer
There are a few of these so a lot of work
Might be a good negotiating lever if I go ahead

I take it that these panels are glued on so the chance of getting it off to use as a pattern would be unlikely??

Allan

-- Edited by AllanY on Sunday 2nd of May 2010 03:32:16 PM

 

[coyote454]

Allan,

It depends on the area whether it's glued on or not. *I had the same problem on the port aft cabin window, where the paneling *(veneer) was badly discolored. *I cut it out and found a space between the veneer and the fiberglass outer cabin. The larger sheet of veneer the damaged piece was part of was most likely glued, but the small area I was concerned with had no bonding.


But as koliver said, if you take out the porthole and check for further water damage, cut a template from thin wood, cardboard, stiff paper or whatever, you can put in the new veneer fairly easily. *Not a deal breaker, but certainly something to use as leverage in*bargaining*for the best price.


Mike
Brookings, Oregon

 

[Piers]

I'm not su sure, Allan. If there's a chance of repairing it rather than have it all replaced, I'd say use the oxalid acid (it's used to remove coffee cup stains from wood....) and then apply a colour stick (one that french polishers use) before the final varnish or whatever.

So, if not to be done by yourself, find a good french polisher and see what they say. Might just save a great amount of cash flying out of the door.

-- Edited by Piers on Sunday 2nd of May 2010 11:06:46 PM

 

[skipperdude]

I'm with albin43 on this one. Rebed the window. It looks like more than just the window left open. You could use FRP. If you can't find teak.*You can find it at most Home depot type stores. Glue it up with liquid nails General purpose construction adheasive. I have used it to attach stainless sheeting behind my galley. The stuff Has been up there for years. Works great for me.
SD*

 

[C lectric]

It is a bargaining point.
I too think you should try the oxalic acid, weak, first to try bleach out the stains. It's better to do it two or three times rather than overdo it. Some darkening may be acceptable, just part of the patina. Some really light sanding, 600 grit W&D paper, may help with some teak oil or similar after the oxalic bleaching too smooth out roughness and work a new oil finish in even if you are going to varnish after. . Just be carefull as the veneer is really thin and aggressive sanding will cut through it quickly. You have nothing to lose if you decide to go ahead with the boat. If it works great, if not then replace the panel or reveneer it, as suggested. And yes, most repairs of this nature will blend in after a couple or so years at least to the point where they don't glare.

And of course pull the window and rebed it.


However, are you sure "someone left the window open"? The problem could be deeper such as the port is leaking and the paneling and the underlying plywood is rotten. That will be a much bigger job. The fact that the stain shows up the side of the port, not just below, indicates to me there may be a bigger problem.

Just an example. I did mine a few years ago. The paneling below the port was ok, oddly the paneling above the port was rotten. The port broke the seal on top first, and thats where most of the damage occured, then spread. I got my teak ply veneer at Windsor Plywood, the better stuff as they had a couple grades. You will likely have someone else depending on where you are, a specialty plywood house.

 

[AllanY]

C lectric

You might be right about the stain but hopefully everything is good behind there.
You can usually smell rot and I was on a boat today and said to the broker I think there is some rot up here in the chain locker and sure enough the whole deck was rotten

Maybe i'll get job as a sniffer dog in a boatyard

Allan

 

[sunchaser]

Leaking windows point towards other things the owner neglected. Keep looking unless you want a project vs a cruising boat.

 

[Peter B]

Actually Allan, apart from that stain, the rest looks very tidy, so if the rest of the boat is similar, you could be onto a good one here. However, like all the others say, that panel is probably cactus, and as the stain has lightened the teak, I suspect no amount of surface retreating would disguise it, so like most of the other advice, (and speaking from personal experience), you would be best to re-bed the port, and get a new sheet of teak ply and once you are sure the rest is sound with no rot, you could liquid nail it over that panel, and as already said, in no time, once varnished, you would hardly know the repair was done. Teak moldings can cover small imperfections in the final finish at the edges, and make it look quite acceptable.* Worked for me. By the way, there is a good 'Mr Ply' here in Parramatta Road, at Underwood. For a time, I was a frequent visitor there, as I had to replace nearly all the teak paneling in my boat.
Is this the Cheoy Lee, or a Clipper, Allan?

-- Edited by Peter B on Tuesday 4th of May 2010 06:12:18 AM

 

[AllanY]

Hi Peter

This is the Cheoy Lee

There is more than one leak however the marks did not look recent so work the owner has done may have fixed the problems
But yes the ports would need rebedding

The rest of the boat looks ok apart from the brightwork outside and the seats on the flybridge need reupholstering (not a problem for me there as I have the gear to do that job)

Allan

 

[Piers]

I called a Wood Finish company yesterday to check on the use Oxalic Acid an talked with one of the tech staff who told me they supply P & O with 25kg tubs of oxalic crystals specifically for where passengers spill drinks on teaks, and for taking out water stains.

For internal use he recommended using the crystals disolved in water, and then applied part oxalic and part meths. Once cleaned, wipe again with meths to neutralise.

http://www.agwoodcare.co.uk/index.php

Contact 00 44 1789 778 628<a></a>



Very helpful indeed.

 

[Peter B]

Well Piers, you are right. If the teak is in otherwise ok condition, and there is no rot under it, certainly worth trying - what's to lose...? If it does not look good, there is stil the option mentioned above.

 

[Baker]

Also you can replace it with formica. Obviously you would only want to do this where it wouldn't cause too much disruption with the aesthetics of the rest of the boat. It is not uncommon to see asian boats that have a lot of formica in them....most likely aftermarket covering up teak stains. Just a suggestion for a much cheaper alternative. Somebody above mentioned FRP but I think he was likely thinking of the same thing. You could probably even find formica that looks like wood(I think GB uses it on their "dashboards" on some of their older boats)....although I would imagine that it would look pretty cheesy.

-- Edited by Baker on Thursday 6th of May 2010 09:15:12 AM

 

[albin43]

tape the edges, fair with west system 105/205/410 and prime and paint, alot easyer then fitting a new peice of anything.

 

[Phil Fill]

On the out side of the ports I use epoxy.* However, I do not total seal the bottom of the windows and ports, leaving weep holes so if there is any moister water it can escape, rather than being absorbed and trapped.* We had some stains like that under the window so I bought some solid stain to match, varnished the whole area, the lightly sand only the discolor area so the stain adhered to the sanded area and worked it with a brush so it looked/matched like area, then re varnished the area.* Sort of like antiquing! No body has noticed as teak wood changes grain and color.* If it does not come out the first time then take the stain off and do over again.* The messy/streakier the stain was the better it looked?*


*

 

[AllanY]

John

I did think of the formica option where possible like the photo in the head there is enough of it not to look out of place.
Elsewhere might work also using white. If you try and match the woodgrain it might look out of place but contrast eg white and it looks as though it belongs

Allan