The Boat Market Today

[Jklotz]

I've been watching the boat market closely for a little over a year now. Problem is I don't have any historical knowledge. Shame you can't look up comps like you can with real estate. A lot of states charge taxes on boats like they were real estate, maybe some of that data should be public? Anyway, I digress. Covid created a huge surge in demand, a decrease in new inventory, which prices obviously reflected. It's supposed to be getting better, but it still feels like we are experiencing a covid hangover. Seems to me today is a hyper inflated market, new and used. What's your take on all this? Do you think now is a terrible time to buy a boat?

 

[Mainship Pilot]

The best time to buy a boat is when you are ready and excited to do so, financially and emotionally. Buying a depreciating asset is not like buying real estate, don't have any expectations of even breaking even, if you do, great, but don't expect to! Buy it, love it, enjoy it........and most importantly Use it! BTW, Everything is inflated by about 20% overall, and affects every part of life!

 

[Delta Riverat]

I bought the one to the left during the "covid times" but the market was high along with the prices. I sold stock and bought the boat. Soon after the market...well you know...

But guess what? The market is up again and I'm richer than ever.

What should I buy next...

If you have the dough and you like the boat...

 

[Mainecoast]

Prices on used boats have come down considerably. Lots of those covid buyers want out. Especially sailboats.

 

[more]

I buy 2012 sailboat bavaria 38 made 2004 , for 30100€ sale october 2024 54000€ . buy neptunus 56 flybridge october 2024 for 110000€ with brooker fee update boat chain,spade anchor,lithium battery, I think I have budget to update 50000€ total,plan selling 250 000€ equivalent 2027-8 or changing for 42-45 2010 and up CATamaran

 

[magna 6882]

I think a lot of folks hold off buying toys having concern's they are buying at the right time as if it were a stock and they want to buy at the absolute lowest price. The risk with that mentality is life is shorter then you think. I have friends that now nearing retirement and are having regrets for not having played more. My problem is i have a boat,a 45ft motorhome and a vacation home in palm springs along with my home and shop buildings. I was diagnosed with cancer last year and am nearing final treatments this week.
I never anticipated how life altering that would be and it put all travel and fun on the back burner.No trips and only a couple of boat runs this summer.
My advise would be to buy a boat if you want one .Post the details on this site and get the advise of those on this site. The folks on this site will not let you down.

 

[ranger58sb]

Shame you can't look up comps like you can with real estate.

There's a way, sorta kinda.

If you engage a buyer's broker, he/she can check soldboats.com and give you some idea. Not sure how historic that database is, but I suspect it's probably current enough for your purposes.

There are pros/cons with buyer's brokers, so you can read other threads about that here. Mostly pros, though, at least in our own cases.

-Chris

 

[NStenger]

There's a way, sorta kinda.

If you engage a buyer's broker, he/she can check soldboats.com and give you some idea. Not sure how historic that database is, but I suspect it's probably current enough for your purposes.

There are pros/cons with buyer's brokers, so you can read other threads about that here. Mostly pros, though, at least in our own cases.

-Chris

I believe they can pull at least several years. When I sold my last boat my broker pulled up comps and we were also able to consider salt v. freshwater in our pricing.

 

[Judy at JWY]

Brokers, and surveyors, who subscribe to YachtWorld can pull up the price for sold boats. The caveat is that the listing broker is the one who enters the price, so you need to know which brokers are reliable in the honesty category. There are some manufacturers who keep their resale value up by not posting the true selling price.

 

[kthoennes]

Yeah, so many online discussions including on here about boat markets but after browsing and sometimes participating for years now, I'm getting to the point where I think -- boats go up and down, markets and portfolios go up and down, inflation rates, interest rates... Meanwhile sand is running through the hourglass and in five minutes my boys won't be kids anymore and so on. I just wrote the check for our 2025 slip fees.

There is one thing I'm wrestling with lately. I'm still a few years from retirement but it's the conflict between DO IT NOW (while you still can) and financial conservatism and preparation for retirement. The tension between clearing/avoiding debt and running the boat for example, or between growing assets and doing that big family trip to Europe before the kids disappear to college. Probably the struggle we all have. Save for a rainy day, I don't want to eat ramen when I'm 90, but I could keel over tomorrow and don't want to wait until I'm too old to run miles through airports chasing a flight to Paris. Imagine how much more I could have in my 401(k) if we didn't have the boat, but then think of the family times we've had. Trade offs trade offs.

 

[Jklotz]

Yeah, so many online discussions including on here about boat markets but after browsing and sometimes participating for years now, I'm getting to the point where I think -- boats go up and down, markets and portfolios go up and down, inflation rates, interest rates... Meanwhile sand is running through the hourglass and in five minutes my boys won't be kids anymore and so on. I just wrote the check for our 2025 slip fees.

There is one thing I'm wrestling with lately. I'm still a few years from retirement but it's the conflict between DO IT NOW (while you still can) and financial conservatism and preparation for retirement. The tension between clearing/avoiding debt and running the boat for example, or between growing assets and doing that big family trip to Europe before the kids disappear to college. Probably the struggle we all have. Save for a rainy day, I don't want to eat ramen when I'm 90, but I could keel over tomorrow and don't want to wait until I'm too old to run miles through airports chasing a flight to Paris. Imagine how much more I could have in my 401(k) if we didn't have the boat, but then think of the family times we've had. Trade offs trade offs.

You seem to have a very good grasp of where we are coming from. I can relate 100%.

 

[tiltrider1]

It’s supply vs demand. If you are in the market for a 10 year or newer boat there is not much supply and prices are high. If you are in the market for a 35 year old boat over 70’ there is almost no demand and those boats are going almost for salvage value.

Now is the time to be shopping for a 80’ 1980’s boat. Not such a good time to be shopping for a boat built in 2020. Recessions are a great time to be shopping for a boat.

 

[FWT]

The time to do it is when the time is right for you. Not the right time with respect to the market.

 

[klee wyck]

The time to do it is when the time is right for you. Not the right time with respect to the market.

This.
There are members here in my geography that have been talking about buying a boat since I joined the forum in 2014 but apparently never the right ‘discount’ or timing or boat.
I am sure I was nervous about it when I bought my first one in 2012 as well. But, when I think about the enjoyment around the boats I have owned over that period, there is no amount of discount that would have made it worth waiting for over that time. If I had walked away from Klee Wyck, which was outside of my price range in 2012, and waited until today for that owner to give her to me for free, I would consider that to have been a bad decision.
Market timers lose out in my view, every time.

 

[drewread]

The listing prices are high, but offers are lower.. Covid pricing only remains in the dreams of the seller.

 

[mvweebles]

I took a slightly different slant on the OPs question, perhaps because I looked at it in context of his other thread expressing frustration with a purchase process where he felt a broker was disingenuous. He has a budget and needs to stay within it.

I don't think the market in general is hyper inflated the way it was during Covid where any piece of crap would sell sight unseen.

Historically, boats have been a buyers market and I sense that's where we are now. But.....even during the most lopsided buyers market, high quality and well cared for examples of production boats sell fairly quickly and for a good price. When one comes up, you'll have to move pretty quickly.

One other tip - if you find a boat you'd like a first hand opinion, consider pinging this forum to see if there's anyone nearby who can see it. You don't have to broadcast the listing, just find someone who can take an hour to go view boat flesh.

Peter.

 

[mmullins]

It’s supply vs demand. If you are in the market for a 10 year or newer boat there is not much supply and prices are high. If you are in the market for a 35 year old boat over 70’ there is almost no demand and those boats are going almost for salvage value.

Now is the time to be shopping for a 80’ 1980’s boat. Not such a good time to be shopping for a boat built in 2020. Recessions are a great time to be shopping for a boat.

I don't want to drift the thread but you are so right. There are several 60'+ old Hatts, Gulfstars, Chris Crafts,etc that I would buy in a heart beat if I could find a slip. In my area slips over 50' are nearly impossible to find. And, every time a marina expands or improves, they get rid of their existing big slips for more smaller (35' and less) slips. They say they can't rent the big slips yet they all have waiting lists for them.

 

[Nick14]

It’s supply vs demand. If you are in the market for a 10 year or newer boat there is not much supply and prices are high. If you are in the market for a 35 year old boat over 70’ there is almost no demand and those boats are going almost for salvage value.

Now is the time to be shopping for a 80’ 1980’s boat. Not such a good time to be shopping for a boat built in 2020. Recessions are a great time to be shopping for a boat.

FWIW I think you nailed it exactly! Older and bigger boats are asking surprisingly low prices and seem to not be able to be given away (probably because the cost of maintenance and upkeep is astronomical). But relatively new boats are always in demand (excepting recessions or other dire financial conditions).

Everyone seems to want the proverbial 'few year old' boat in pristine condition. Unfortunately, the 2008-2009 financial crisis put a lot of boat builders out of business, and the ones that were left built fewer boats than before. Add in the effects of multiple hurricanes down south taking thousands of boats out of existence and it seems to have been a double-whammy of decreased supply with increased demand.

As others have wisely said, a boat is not a rational decision. If you want a boat and can afford one, buy it when you can find one that fits your needs and budget. Being in the situation of having limited remaining time, take it from me - heed the wisdom often offered: time is the most precious resource of all, because no matter what you do or how much money you have, you can never get more of it.

Another piece of wisdom, at the end of life, few people regret the things they did, but much more so regret the things they didn't do.

If you truly want a boat, do it. Don't try to second guess the 'market' and try to time buying at a low. The only way to know when a low point has occurred in any market is when you're looking back at it from a higher point (and conversely, the only way to know when a peak has happened is when you're looking back up at it from a valley). If you're ready to go boating, just go.

 

[Sababa]

Another thing to consider these days is that if you are fortunate enough to be able to work remotely, even part of the year, Starlink means you don’t have to wait for retirement to spend time in remote and exotic places. Being able to make a living on the water for weeks or more at a time changes the value proposition of buying a boat NOW.

 

[Jklotz]

FWIW I think you nailed it exactly! Older and bigger boats are asking surprisingly low prices and seem to not be able to be given away (probably because the cost of maintenance and upkeep is astronomical). But relatively new boats are always in demand (excepting recessions or other dire financial conditions).

Everyone seems to want the proverbial 'few year old' boat in pristine condition. Unfortunately, the 2008-2009 financial crisis put a lot of boat builders out of business, and the ones that were left built fewer boats than before. Add in the effects of multiple hurricanes down south taking thousands of boats out of existence and it seems to have been a double-whammy of decreased supply with increased demand.

As others have wisely said, a boat is not a rational decision. If you want a boat and can afford one, buy it when you can find one that fits your needs and budget. Being in the situation of having limited remaining time, take it from me - heed the wisdom often offered: time is the most precious resource of all, because no matter what you do or how much money you have, you can never get more of it.

Another piece of wisdom, at the end of life, few people regret the things they did, but much more so regret the things they didn't do.

If you truly want a boat, do it. Don't try to second guess the 'market' and try to time buying at a low. The only way to know when a low point has occurred in any market is when you're looking back at it from a higher point (and conversely, the only way to know when a peak has happened is when you're looking back up at it from a valley). If you're ready to go boating, just go.

Good perspective on this IMHO. Hindsight is always 20/20. A member of this forum who was having some health issues sent me some sixpac captains course training material he had after a couple of email exchanges. Very nice guy btw. The note inside said "whatever you want to do, do it now". Can't forget that note.

I've always been the responsible guy, making double car loan payments instead of buying new toys, etc. Even now, facing retirement, knowing all the charts, formulas and graphs say we'll be just fine, I still find it difficult to buy things that are not discounted or priced below market value. I'm used to living well below my means. It's a difficult mindset to shed.

 

[Delta Riverat]

Yes it is, I'm the same way.

Tough habit to break, but as you get older it's easier. You have less time to worry about. I still worry though, that's why I do the stuff I can rather than pay the $150/hr the yard wants. And the yard don't always do the stuff you need to get done. Like the fridge, had to figure that one out myself. Called the yard, "can I come by and you can replace the fridge", "no sorry we don't do fridges call this guy"

Guess he must be busy, guy never called me back. Ordered up the fridge and got my junk guys to remove and put the new one in.

So, even if you have enough dough to have someone do it for you, you may just have to DIY. Wanna get a boat?

Be prepared to get busy - But that's a good thing! I just like time on my boat, cluttered with my tools and junk from whatever project I'm working (even though my wife would be shocked, I always warn her about the "current condition" when she asks)

The one to the left was a 100 grand. And counting. But it's a Delta Rat and has been for a long time. Haven't even spent an overnite on her yet. Guess I should pretty soon eh?

 

[Nick14]

I still find it difficult to buy things that are not discounted or priced below market value. It's a difficult mindset to shed.

A boat, any boat, is worth exactly what someone is willing to pay for it. With many boats being somewhat unique (especially trawlers), what is the 'market' value? It's not like a 3 year old Ford with many thousands for sale at any time for which a market value can be easily determined.

No one likes to pay more than they have to. I can empathize with the 'living below your means' mindset. That's how my wife and I lived our entire lives. But it can mean going without, when someone else is willing to pay more than you are.

Sometimes, waiting for a 'bargain' means waiting forever and never having something. When you get to a point in life where there is less time left than money, those kinds of choices might someday be regretted.

 

[Mac2]

You didn’t mention if you’ve owned a boat before. If not, I would say buy sooner than later. It’s hard to put a price on the experience you can gain owning a boat prior to retiring. Others can comment on their experience, but for me it takes a couple years learning the boat and systems along with upgrades. It will make the full time transition to retirement/cruising much more pleasurable.

 

[chanprr]

Been a boat owner for over 20 years, and for every one I've owned, I've always thought: 'Why didn't I buy this sooner". Don't think about the market too much, just put the cash aside for that boat you believe you can afford. When the one for you arrives, make the offer. Now my H46 is almost ready, and it's going to be a great time on the water.

 

[Judy at JWY]

I may have told this story when it happened, but a story worth repeating. I got a call from Sandy from Texas one night. She said her husband had a heart attack and she wanted to give me the funeral information so I could attend. I replied that I felt so honored, but I had only met them once on a trip they made to Florida to look at boats and our phone/email relationship was so boat focused, I was surprised she thought to call me the day of her husband's death. She replied that boats was their topic of discussion at dinner every night. She said I was their guide to their dream and now that dream is forever gone and I was all that remained of it and she was so sorry that they continued their search for the perfect boat instead of one they could have been using for the last several months.

I have heard more than one "shoulda, coulda" story. My take: if you can, you should.

 

[Diep]

Just closed on a boat yesterday (!). It's easy to wonder if we could have paid less. The seller can also wonder if we might have paid more with a counter.
At the end of the day we wanted to buy, they wanted to sell, and a deal was struck. Looking at all the costs associated, +/- 10 or even 20% will be lost in the wash over the course of ownership and resale.
If you want a boat start shopping because it takes some time. When you find a boat and the deal is "good enough" pull the trigger!

 

[proudsailor]

We bought our boat last year after looking for almost three years. Some of what we looked at remains on the market with prices reduced 10-20% of what they were asking when we bought. We made an offer on a boat and the owner was insulted at it. Over 18 months later, the boat remains on the market, now with a broker who gets a cut, at a 5% lower price than what we offered. We also looked at another older, but well built boat that was overpriced. Two years later, price has reduced by $50k and it is still on the market. Wishing I would've waited a year! I'd be quite comfortable buying now. Very much a buyers market I believe....

 

[DavidU]

What I am taking more and more from this thread and many others, IS, if you ever intend to buy a boat sooner or later, BUY IT NOW! The market of time is consistent and depreciates daily. The boat market fluctuates but time does not. If you love the water, if you love boats, you will never feel you lost by diving in sooner, rather than later. TIME is our MOST valuable asset. Live and enjoy it! This community has influenced me to dive in as soon as possible, water temp be damned.

 

[Nordlund Xpress]

Once you find the boat you want, have your broker pull the sale prices on all the ones sold via the brokers access on Yachtworld. Unfortunately, you can't do it, only a broker can - but I've never had a problem getting the last 10+ years of sales prices on any given model. At least for the boats I look at, we have generally returned to pre-2020 pricing and sales prices may even be a bit better. Lots of late model Covid era purchased boats out there coming on the market - many by folks who paid a high price and are now finding out about significant depreciation.

 

[Jklotz]

What I am taking more and more from this thread and many others, IS, if you ever intend to buy a boat sooner or later, BUY IT NOW! The market of time is consistent and depreciates daily. The boat market fluctuates but time does not. If you love the water, if you love boats, you will never feel you lost by diving in sooner, rather than later. TIME is our MOST valuable asset. Live and enjoy it! This community has influenced me to dive in as soon as possible, water temp be damned.

I was with you until the last part. I'm not jumping into any cold water!