Stainless Steel Anchor Chain?

[BigJimB]

While impossible, PLEASE SET ASIDE THE COST for this discussion.

What are the benefits and disadvantages of using SS chain on a horizontal windlass?

*Appears it stacks and pays out a whole lot better than galvanized.
*Good SS doesn't rust.

? Is there a difference in physical size with same spec?

? Does the gypsy bite galvanized chain better than SS? Will SS chain have a greater chance of jumping from a gypsy?

Look forward to learning your experiences.

 

[Insequent]

Ordinary 316 etc is at risk of developing cracks and failing. Chromox is the only way to go. And yes, it will stack better and last longer. Dimensions wont be an issue assuming you match chain and gypsy to each other.

Stainless steel chains and components by cromox®

Top-level, cutting-edge stainless steel products. The cromox® stainless steel product range is developed and manufactured by Ketten Wälder GmbH, headquartered in Germany.

www.cromox-us.com

I'm not using this although I wish I was able to.

 

[Comodave]

I have read that it cleans off easier, but have never used it so I don't know for sure.

 

[DavidM]

G4 galvanized chain is lots stronger than 316 SS.

David

 

[twistedtree]

I have 12mm Cromox and love it. The cost was painful, but looking back I consider is $$ well spent. Recapping and adding to what's already been said:

- Cromox WLL is the same if not a bit better than G4 chain of the same size. 316SS is lower strength, so will require larger size, or accepting lower WLL.

- The chain piles much better. My galvi used to spill out of my chain box, and how the SS only half fills it.

- Silt and mud wash off MUCH easier, with much less ending up in your chain locker. That's less mess and less stink.

- No rust on deck, no flakes of rust all over the place, no rusty mess in the chain locker.

- Mine is a good bit quieter through the windless, but I can't say if that's because of the SS or if it's because the link dimensions are different.

- I have not had any issues with skipping on the gypsie.

- If you are ordering the chain, order it with an oversized link in the end. That will allow for a single large shackle to your anchor.

- Pay very careful attention to the link dimensions. There are DIN, ISO and "US" dimensions, and they are not the same. I needed a new chain wheel and it was over $2500 just for the chain wheel. Also, US chain sizes are such that you can fit one size larger shackle pin through a link. So a 1/2" chain can accept a 5/8" shackle pin, and the 5/8" shackle matches the WLL of the 1/2"chain. With many (most from what I saw) DIN and ISO links, you can only fit the same size shackle which creates a significant weak link in the system. This is another reason why that larger end link is so important.

- Don't make the change on a schedule. I ordered directly from Ketten Walder and they took my money and then about 5x the promised time to deliver. The buying experience was among the worst I have ever had. But I do really like the product.

 

[BigJimB]

G4 galvanized chain is lots stronger than 316 SS.

David

I'd like to agree, however in 3/8" Galvanized G4 high test is rated to 16,200# while the Stainless G4 High Test Grade 60 is rated at 22,045#, so just shy of 50% stronger. Just from a quick search, not claiming to have dug into the metallurgy of the two that came up sold for anchoring.

 

[sealandsky]

I have 12mm Cromox and love it. The cost was painful, but looking back I consider is $$ well spent. Recapping and adding to what's already been said:

- Cromox WLL is the same if not a bit better than G4 chain of the same size. 316SS is lower strength, so will require larger size, or accepting lower WLL.

- The chain piles much better. My galvi used to spill out of my chain box, and how the SS only half fills it.

- Silt and mud wash off MUCH easier, with much less ending up in your chain locker. That's less mess and less stink.

- No rust on deck, no flakes of rust all over the place, no rusty mess in the chain locker.

- Mine is a good bit quieter through the windless, but I can't say if that's because of the SS or if it's because the link dimensions are different.

- I have not had any issues with skipping on the gypsie.

- If you are ordering the chain, order it with an oversized link in the end. That will allow for a single large shackle to your anchor.

- Pay very careful attention to the link dimensions. There are DIN, ISO and "US" dimensions, and they are not the same. I needed a new chain wheel and it was over $2500 just for the chain wheel. Also, US chain sizes are such that you can fit one size larger shackle pin through a link. So a 1/2" chain can accept a 5/8" shackle pin, and the 5/8" shackle matches the WLL of the 1/2"chain. With many (most from what I saw) DIN and ISO links, you can only fit the same size shackle which creates a significant weak link in the system. This is another reason why that larger end link is so important.

- Don't make the change on a schedule. I ordered directly from Ketten Walder and they took my money and then about 5x the promised time to deliver. The buying experience was among the worst I have ever had. But I do really like the product.

I'm running the same CROMOX 12MM chain and agree with all said above, except it only took 2 weeks for me to receive my chain.

 

[Mac2]

To those using the cromox: I used a stainless Ultra anchor on my last boat. After a couple years, I noticed the galvanized chain links loosing their galvanizing progressively. The closest shackle to link attachment was the worst, fading as it got to three links down. I’m guessing this was due to galvanic corrosion that was happening during anchoring.
Im mentioning this because someone buying cromox might want to buy more than just one larger link, as TT suggested.

 

[Fleming]

To those using the cromox: I used a stainless Ultra anchor on my last boat. After a couple years, I noticed the galvanized chain links loosing their galvanizing progressively. The closest shackle to link attachment was the worst, fading as it got to three links down. I’m guessing this was due to galvanic corrosion that was happening during anchoring.
Im mentioning this because someone buying cromox might want to buy more than just one larger link, as TT suggested.

It's not going to be an issue. In your case the chain was the anode and the anchor was the cathode so your chain suffered the galvanic corrosion. Even if they were to use a galvanized shackle and galvanized anchor with their new stainless chain (why would you not use a stainless anchor and shackle if you're spending that coin on the chain?), it would be the shackle and anchor that were the anode and the chain would be the cathode so the chain would not suffer.

 

[slowgoesit]

Careful now! If you believe what Nigel Calder and Mr. Cotes stated in their interview with HH, if you don't consistently rinse stainless steel anchor chain off, every time you up anchor, it will rust away within a year . . . or at least that is what they insinuated was the cause of the Wynns anchor and anchor chain failure . . .

 

[twistedtree]

Careful now! If you believe what Nigel Calder and Mr. Cotes stated in their interview with HH, if you don't consistently rinse stainless steel anchor chain off, every time you up anchor, it will rust away within a year . . . or at least that is what they insinuated was the cause of the Wynns anchor and anchor chain failure . . .

Yeah, mine gets rinsed with a mix of salt and fresh water, and no rust. It calls into question what grade of stainless the Wynns chain was. I don’t recall. Anyone know? Lesser grades will get surface corrossion.

 

[Mac2]

Thanks Fleming, that makes total sense now.

 

[motion30]

Careful now! If you believe what Nigel Calder and Mr. Cotes stated in their interview with HH, if you don't consistently rinse stainless steel anchor chain off, every time you up anchor, it will rust away within a year . . . or at least that is what they insinuated was the cause of the Wynns anchor and anchor chain failure . . .

honestly I was embarrassed for those 2 experts.. both were well respected.. It was easy to see they were bought. Sad

 

[cfr]

I have a A5 stainless steel chain, its near to cromox and using it since 15 years but the chain is on the boat since 40 years. 30 years cold water and 15 years the Med, anchoring spprox 120 nights a year. No problems at all but my galvanized spade doesnt like the chain and is rusting, so i galvanize it every 10 years.
The maker told me that they strongly recommend to check your electrical installation of the winch because sonetime the grounding is not good and the chain gets some galvanic voltage thru the winch. I have a hyd winch and aluminium hull so different from frp boats.

 

[Caballero II]

I have 12mm Cromox and love it. The cost was painful, but looking back I consider is $$ well spent. Recapping and adding to what's already been said:

- Cromox WLL is the same if not a bit better than G4 chain of the same size. 316SS is lower strength, so will require larger size, or accepting lower WLL.

- The chain piles much better. My galvi used to spill out of my chain box, and how the SS only half fills it.

- Silt and mud wash off MUCH easier, with much less ending up in your chain locker. That's less mess and less stink.

- No rust on deck, no flakes of rust all over the place, no rusty mess in the chain locker.

- Mine is a good bit quieter through the windless, but I can't say if that's because of the SS or if it's because the link dimensions are different.

- I have not had any issues with skipping on the gypsie.

- If you are ordering the chain, order it with an oversized link in the end. That will allow for a single large shackle to your anchor.

- Pay very careful attention to the link dimensions. There are DIN, ISO and "US" dimensions, and they are not the same. I needed a new chain wheel and it was over $2500 just for the chain wheel. Also, US chain sizes are such that you can fit one size larger shackle pin through a link. So a 1/2" chain can accept a 5/8" shackle pin, and the 5/8" shackle matches the WLL of the 1/2"chain. With many (most from what I saw) DIN and ISO links, you can only fit the same size shackle which creates a significant weak link in the system. This is another reason why that larger end link is so important.

- Don't make the change on a schedule. I ordered directly from Ketten Walder and they took my money and then about 5x the promised time to deliver. The buying experience was among the worst I have ever had. But I do really like the product.

So, what would be the comparable chain gypsy to have on the windlass? I have inherited G3/Proof Coil (PC) chain. Said to to be the 2nd weakest chain and having the most inconsistent chain lengths, therefor jumps the G3/PC chain gypsy sometimes. BBB is said to be weaker still, but more consistent link length and therefor happier with a BBB chain gypsy. Moving up to G4, stronger still but I'm not experienced with its' behavior with the gypsy.
I am tempted (haven't even looked at the price) to move up to the Cromox, even in a BBB compatible size to make happier with the chain gypsy. But which gypsy does it work with. My Lofrans windlass is European (French?), so you'd think there'd be a compatible gypsy for a specific Cromox chain.

 

[twistedtree]

So, what would be the comparable chain gypsy to have on the windlass? I have inherited G3/Proof Coil (PC) chain. Said to to be the 2nd weakest chain and having the most inconsistent chain lengths, therefor jumps the G3/PC chain gypsy sometimes. BBB is said to be weaker still, but more consistent link length and therefor happier with a BBB chain gypsy. Moving up to G4, stronger still but I'm not experienced with its' behavior with the gypsy.
I am tempted (haven't even looked at the price) to move up to the Cromox, even in a BBB compatible size to make happier with the chain gypsy. But which gypsy does it work with. My Lofrans windlass is European (French?), so you'd think there'd be a compatible gypsy for a specific Cromox chain.

Each windless manufacturer offers a variety of chain wheels, and you will need to be sure you end up with a wheel that matches your chain. Check available wheels vs available Cromox sizes, and be sure a match is available before you purchase. Also check cost and lead time for a new wheel. Mine took 3+ months to get and was something like $2500. The wheel I ended up with fits a number of different chains that are all 36mm link length. Also figure out what wheel yo have now. You might get lucky and be able to buy chain at fits it. It sounds like your current chain may actually be incompatible with your wheel.

 

[Mac2]

As TT says, the chain wheel needs to match the chain. First thing would be to check the wheel for the chain size. Should be stamped on there somewhere. Next, check the angle of the chain coming off the wheel. I was having the same problem as you and ended up adding a roller to my anchor pulpit to create a more downward angle so more links were captured in the chain wheel.

 

[Caballero II]

Each windless manufacturer offers a variety of chain wheels, and you will need to be sure you end up with a wheel that matches your chain. Check available wheels vs available Cromox sizes, and be sure a match is available before you purchase. Also check cost and lead time for a new wheel. Mine took 3+ months to get and was something like $2500. The wheel I ended up with fits a number of different chains that are all 36mm link length. Also figure out what wheel yo have now. You might get lucky and be able to buy chain at fits it. It sounds like your current chain may actually be incompatible with your wheel.

I may not have articulated well. I have no trouble with my current gypsy. It's marked PC and handles my PC chain well. I was only mentioning that G3/PC seem to be the most inconsistent as to link length, and therefor are known to skip occasionally.

Otherwise, the long-winded query was about how might the the gypsy be marked for the Cromox chain.

 

[twistedtree]

Otherwise, the long-winded query was about how might the the gypsy be marked for the Cromox chain.

I think you just need to look at the different Cromox sizes and compare to what wheels your windlass manufacturer offers. There are DIN and ISO sizes, and they may now offer US sizes.

 

[cfr]

WASI Duplex Ankerkette nach DIN 766 - SAILTEC - technical equipment for yachts and boats

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hi from germany my chain is A5 from Wasi and they have duplex too, 30 pct cheaper than cromox, i think good enough with the Pren value

 

[Shrew]

SS chain is appealing aesthetically, handling, cleaning. piling, etc. It is very pricey. However here is the key factor for me.

SS is hardened to almost brittle. It won't deform, it will simply snap with little to no obvious warning. Galvanized will give you many visual indicators of its age. Exceeding load will cause deformation long before actual failure.

SS is too expensive, brittle and unpredictable for me. Just my .02.

 

[Mako]

SS is hardened to almost brittle. It won't deform, it will simply snap with little to no obvious warning. Galvanized will give you many visual indicators of its age. Exceeding load will cause deformation long before actual failure.

There is something to be said for this.
On a previous large, heavy boat of mine the very old galvi chain showed deformation in the end links, maybe because of old age or maybe because of some heavy loading I had placed on it. It was easy to identify and then cut off a section, thus renewing its life and giving me assurance.
Certainly if you don't inspect and find the deformation then it could have snapped at the worst time. But with stainless you have no choice.