Stabilization?

[Jklotz]

How many of you guys have a stabilizer aboard your Helmsman's? How necessary do you consider them? If you don't have them, are you considering getting them? Anybody regret adding them?

 

[KMAL]

I am currently under build with hull 43048 - we have elected to stabilize with a single rotor DMS Magnus Master system. We cruise the pacific north west and have on many occasions experienced less than comfortable water on our current boat (40K LB 41 LOA). We had many objectives with our new build - and increased comfort through stabilization was one of them. We considered all of the usual subjects: Fins (dismissed immediately due to placement considerations); Gyro - compelling for its ability to stabilize at anchor - but required generator to use and 30 +/- minutes to spool up or down; and the DMS system. The DMS system has a deployment time of 12 seconds and can run on 12v. It was a system I was unfamiliar with - so we went through a bit of a due diligence exercise to confirm its effectiveness as well as its "robustness" as I was simply concerned about an appendage that would run at a 90 degree angle to our keel. We satisfied ourselves on all counts through sea-trials on a 41 foot installation and through conversations with others who had installed the system on their H43 PH trawlers.

 

[tiltrider1]

No one needs stabilization like no one needs air conditioning in their car. Just who wants a car with no air conditioning?

With out stabilization you are always picking things up off the floor. With stabilization that glass you forgot about is right where you left it.

 

[chanprr]

The MM twin rotor stabilizers are being installed right now in our H46. I can't think of any other stabilizing system that is as effective, compact and non-hydraulic. Our cruising up North this summer will be more pleasurable, for sure.

 

[ksanders]

I've got bilge keels that work perfectly, have no moving parts that need maintenance, work at anchor, and consume zero power.

Perfect system

 

[Jklotz]

Thanks guys. I was specifically asking about Helmsman's and stabilization, not in stabilizers general.

 

[RedRascal]

If you are mostly going to be in protected waters and mostly cruise when the winds are <12knots I'd consider investing elsewhere. If you are cruising coastal or will go out with winds >15knots then it could make sense. It really depends on how you are going to use the boat and your tolerance for movement.

 

[Mambo42]

I don't think the type or brand of boat makes a big difference. Some roll more than others but all boats roll. The question should be: 'how much roll are you willing to accept' and that is a personal question, which means that only you can answer.
One thing I do know is that stabilizers have quite a few advantanges. Like Tiltrider 1 stated, that glass will still be there, i.o.w. things don't fly through the boat.
Second is that you get less tired when there is some bad weather. You will be able to operate much longer and that may come in handy during a prolonged storm. Storms wear you out.
Third is that the boat is stable in the water if you happen to run into a fishing pod and need to dive below the boat to get that line out of the props.
And the list goes on and on, but again, if you feel totally happy when the boat is violently rolling.................then you won't need stabilization

 

[HeadedToTexas]

With out stabilization you are always picking things up off the floor. With stabilization that glass you forgot about is right where you left it.

Wow, is it really that profound? We don’t have stabilization and rolly anchorages and beam seas suck. I’ve decided to live with it, but if it’s really that effective, well…

 

[gilbertpark]

I have a stabiliser on my boat - its a flopper stopper from SwiTec brilliant piece of kit at anchor. But then its a bit more work than flipping a switch. If you have the money and the room just do it and enjoy it.

 

[Amadeus]

We have a 65' Elling E6 we bought in the Netherlands and then we had a DMS Magnus Master added by the shipyard. The stabilizers are amazing. Last Summer we came across the North Atlantic on the Viking Route Holland - U.K. - Orkey Islands - Faroe Islands - Iceland - Greenland - Canada - U.S. It was a 5600 nm trip in some rough water. Even with 12' beam seas we were comfortable. Far superior to any existing stabilization system

 

[KMAL]

We have a 65' Elling E6 we bought in the Netherlands and then we had a DMS Magnus Master added by the shipyard. The stabilizers are amazing. Last Summer we came across the North Atlantic on the Viking Route Holland - U.K. - Orkey Islands - Faroe Islands - Iceland - Greenland - Canada - U.S. It was a 5600 nm trip in some rough water. Even with 12' beam seas we were comfortable. Far superior to any existing stabilization system

Love the DMS system - for the right application, so many advantages over fin and gyro systems.

 

[Uisce Beo]

Love the DMS system - for the right application, so many advantages over fin and gyro systems.

New to me but interested. What is the “right” application?

Or, asked another way, everything on a boat can be seen as a compromise. What are the drawbacks to a DMS system?

 

[Jklotz]

New to me but interested. What is the “right” application?

Or, asked another way, everything on a boat can be seen as a compromise. What are the drawbacks to a DMS system?

I've heard/read you lose a very small amount of speed when running with them deployed. Seems like a pretty good tradeoff considering there are no hydraulics, they don't draw much power and require little maintenance. But again, that's just from what I've read, no 1st hand knowledge.

 

[KMAL]

New to me but interested. What is the “right” application?

Or, asked another way, everything on a boat can be seen as a compromise. What are the drawbacks to a DMS system?

Runs 12v or 24v so does not require a genset to use, deploys in 12 seconds, its interior footprint is small allowing for easy placement, does not require PTO or hydraulics. Minimal maintenance. Negatives: only applicable up to 12 knots, boat must be underway for system to be effective, does not stabilize at anchor or at the doc.

 

[LegendintheRainforest]

What are the ballpark breakdown costs for the equipment and installation. Do the recommend 1 or 2 stabilizers for a ~42 foot boat for say, inside & outside Southeast Alaska waters?

 

[KMAL]

What are the ballpark breakdown costs for the equipment and installation. Do the recommend 1 or 2 stabilizers for a ~42 foot boat for say, inside & outside Southeast Alaska waters?

For the 43 we are building we have spec’d one unit - this is what DMS recommends as well. Cost for us - unit and install will land mid $60k. Did not fully consider a Gyro - but believe the correct unit would have run closer to $100k and required a genset (which we have - but if you don’t, an additional cost). No clue on the cost of fins as we did not want them for various reasons.

 

[LegendintheRainforest]

For the 43 we are building we have spec’d one unit - this is what DMS recommends as well. Cost for us - unit and install will land mid $60k. Did not fully consider a Gyro - but believe the correct unit would have run closer to $100k and required a genset (which we have - but if you don’t, an additional cost). No clue on the cost of fins as we did not want them for various reasons.

Thanks for the info - are you a 12 volt system? If so, any upgrade requirements, etc.?

 

[klee wyck]

Thanks for the info - are you a 12 volt system? If so, any upgrade requirements, etc.?

Correction! Unless things have changed from two years ago when I installed mine, and I think they have not, these things do not run on 12 or 24 volt, they run on 230v 50hz AC. I get mine from an inverter. They use surprisingly little power and are surprisingly effective. If you are over 25-30 ton, I would go with twin rotors.

 

[KMAL]

Thanks for the info - are you a 12 volt system? If so, any upgrade requirements, etc.?

Yes - we are 12v - no upgrades required - the system includes the stabilizer, a control box, and an inverter. I do have a genset - but this is not required. The system as configured on my boat can run 100% of the time I am cruising with batteries being replenished by the alternator. I will use my genset for the hot water heater, water maker, and replenishing batteries when used for anchorage.

 

[NSM]

I measured a 0.21 knot and 0.06-0.1 gallon per hour penalty with stabilizer deployed at 5-7 knots. For me that’s pretty inconsequential.

 

[Uisce Beo]

I measured a 0.21 knot and 0.06-0.1 gallon per hour penalty with stabilizer deployed at 5-7 knots. For me that’s pretty inconsequential.

That's very interesting. I believe that's in the ballpark for fin stabilisers.
Really getting into the weeds here but what is the thru hull configuration like? Is it just a power lead or are there moving parts like fin stabilisers? Seals on them are quite expensive to replace and they are a wear point.

 

[mvweebles]

In flat water there may be a de minimus speed penalty of fin stabilizers. Under many conditions where stabilizers are needed, I have a hunch the VMG (velocity made good) actually improves with stabilization because less energy is lost to corkscrewing (yawing) and roll. Also de minimus though.

Peter

 

[KMAL]

That's very interesting. I believe that's in the ballpark for fin stabilisers.
Really getting into the weeds here but what is the thru hull configuration like? Is it just a power lead or are there moving parts like fin stabilisers? Seals on them are quite expensive to replace and they are a wear point.

This might be interesting for you - DMS also has an informative website with videos: https://www.passagemaker.com/technical/balance-of-power

 

[KMAL]

Correction! Unless things have changed from two years ago when I installed mine, and I think they have not, these things do not run on 12 or 24 volt, they run on 230v 50hz AC. I get mine from an inverter. They use surprisingly little power and are surprisingly effective. If you are over 25-30 ton, I would go with twin rotors.

You are correct - we feed an inverter through our 12v system. The inverter outputs at the required 240VAC with a max draw of 1500 watts and an average draw of 1000 watts (this is for a single rotor system).

 

[Mambo42]

I was at BOOT 2025 in Dusseldorf two weeks ago and from what I saw is that we can conclude the days of electricity guzzling gyros and hydraulic / pneumatic stabilizers are over. More and more companies are getting in the electric fin business and the main driver for this is stabilization at all time plus low power usage. I saw at least 6 different companies offering electric fins.

DMS (also on the fair) makes a very good system and since last year (if I remember well) it can also function at anchor. Spoke with Patrick and Arnold a few times, very friendly and helpful guys. Would have instantly bought their system if it would have been for use at anchor, but at that time it could not do it. Now they modified the Magnus so that it can stabilize at anchor.
The biggest advantage for me is that the system does not require any maintenance, is strong, sturdy and does deliver. DMS is definitely a professional, trustworthy, company, I know they have done installations in the US already.

Since DMS could not stabilize my boat at anchor I chose the CMC stab 25 electric fins, which work great, never had a failure, they never let us down and they provide full stabilization. However, the system does require maintenance, meaning changing 2 seals every 5000 hours. The electric motors do not require any maintenance. Electricity usage is minimal, around 300 - 400 W (220 V) while underway and the highest draw I have seen was around 800 - 900 W (at 220V). We have been in heavy seas in the Med, where being without stabilization is just uncomfortable. The Med is known for short high waves, especially in the Aegean, not really a lot of fun.

 

[Mambo42]

Wow, is it really that profound? We don’t have stabilization and rolly anchorages and beam seas suck. I’ve decided to live with it, but if it’s really that effective, well…

If you are comfortable with it and you anchor in places where the seas are calm I agree with you that you don't need stabilization. Even if you anchor in spots where it can be rough, but you are still fine with that, you won't need stabilization either.
It is all a personal choice, some want to have it under all conditions, some are fine with no stabilization. Nobody decides for you, it is completely up to you. That is the beauty of having choices.

 

[Srupp9271]

No one needs stabilization like no one needs air conditioning in their car. Just who wants a car with no air conditioning?

With out stabilization you are always picking things up off the floor. With stabilization that glass you forgot about is right where you left it.

Depends on how rough it gets.

 

[KMAL]

What are the ballpark breakdown costs for the equipment and installation. Do the recommend 1 or 2 stabilizers for a ~42 foot boat for say, inside & outside Southeast Alaska waters?

BTW - may not be the right solution for an NT 42 - particularly if you cruise over twelve knots. From my limited experience considering an NT 42 for purchase - I would have likely purchased a Gyro if I required stabilization.

 

[chanprr]

DMS twin rotors were selected for stabilization of our H46 over a gyro or hydraulic fins, mostly because they are compact and electric. Twin rotors are recommended for vessels over 45,000lbs unloaded, and that just happens to be the H46's unloaded weight. Also, each rotor can be operated individually.
Some install photos. The stern view isn't showing the port rotor clearly. A dedicated inverter (3000 watt) was added solely for powering the rotors. Clean and tidy install by CSR, Lake Union, Seattle.