Questions to previous sailboat’s owners

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Current sailboat owner here, looking to buy my first trawler. To those who made the switch already - how does your trawler handle in rough seas compared to your old sailboat? I’m used to a keelboat’s stability and pretty confident in high seas, so I’m curious how a trawler behaves in heavy weather.

Also, in terms of stability, do you find roll mitigation systems (active fins, paravanes, etc.) essential, or are some trawlers naturally stable enough? And lastly, let’s be honest - if a trawler capsizes, is it game over?

Looking forward to hearing your experiences!
 
Power boats go in any direction, sailboats trim to the wind. To answer your question if I were to follow you when under sail it would not be as smooth but it would be bearable in plus 20 knot winds up to where either would quit.
But then, having been under sail in storm force winds with foresail ripping I would rather be in a sailboat.
As you know in our area we seldom have to worry about it for too many days in a row. Yes I remember motoring the sailboat most of the time.
 
Current sailboat owner here, looking to buy my first trawler. To those who made the switch already - how does your trawler handle in rough seas compared to your old sailboat? I’m used to a keelboat’s stability and pretty confident in high seas, so I’m curious how a trawler behaves in heavy weather.

Also, in terms of stability, do you find roll mitigation systems (active fins, paravanes, etc.) essential, or are some trawlers naturally stable enough? And lastly, let’s be honest - if a trawler capsizes, is it game over?

Looking forward to hearing your experiences!
Just a reminder that roll mitigation systems are for comfort, they do not impact the ultimate "stability" of the trawler (i.e. they can't be relied on to prevent a capsize).

There are bluewater trawlers designed to withstand a rollover (Cape Horn, maybe some Nordhavn?) - they are pretty different beasts from most of the trawlers you see out there. It is analogous to sailboat design; most cruising sailboats won't recover from a rollover (or even a knockdown in the case of that recent megayacht sinking), but some of them have that as a design criteria. Horses for courses - pick your cruising ground & the duration of your weather windows & select a boat that is suitable. I think a lot of folks gravitate toward over-spec-ing their vessel, thinking they'll do extensive offshore passage making when mostly they'll do coastal cursing. You can end up with a vessel that's not well suited to the purpose.

I agree with the above poster though - in really rough stuff I'd rather be on a sailboat. But I'd also rather not be out at sea at all in those conditions, and if my family were aboard it'd probably be the last time we'd be on a boat together regardless!
 
I must disagree with that, any well found cruising sailboat (monohull, at least) is self righting, and this has been proven many times.

I've found trawlers to be crap in a seaway, compared to even a small sailboat. We will avoid the Straits of Georgia in more than about 15 knots on the trawler for example, and this would be a lovely sailing day. You location says Vancouver, the normal cruising area there is quite protected overall, unless you go outside. And the wind is quite unreliable if you intend to go anywhere. Which is why I sailed my sailboat home (to SF Bay) and bought a trawler to keep there. If you are expecting to go out in more weather, or outside, then anti-rolling devices or a very strong stomach are required.
 
i charter sailboat captain in last 10 year must with guest sail in wind 60 -120 knots strong. last vis- Split quest couple from GB must go on airplane distance around 30-35 nm big ferry 30000 tonns dont go to windy vave over 5 meeter big. i go with bavaria 38 ft. strongest sailboat in world 2000-2005 year model. havy but super strong. i with 5 squer meter jib sail 10-15 knots rudder can you with your trawler,for that reson today my boat have 1600 hp always before storm i can fast come to safe bay.
 
i charter sailboat captain in last 10 year must with guest sail in wind 60 -120 knots strong. last vis- Split quest couple from GB must go on airplane distance around 30-35 nm big ferry 30000 tonns dont go to windy vave over 5 meeter big. i go with bavaria 38 ft. strongest sailboat in world 2000-2005 year model. havy but super strong. i with 5 squer meter jib sail 10-15 knots rudder can you with your trawler,for that reson today my boat have 1600 hp always before storm i can fast come to safe bay.
I’ve been in 60+ kts wind, not much fun, not at all, but seriously doubt any boat can sustain 120 kts. I also seriously doubt, no, scratch that, I know for sure - Bavaria 38 is not the strongest sailboat in the world. I sailed that boat many times and saw it loosing her seaworthy in much less wind. If you enjoy your speed boat - what are you doing on the trawler’s forum? Or just bragging on being inside hurricane?
 
I’ve been in 60+ kts wind, not much fun, not at all, but seriously doubt any boat can sustain 120 kts. I also seriously doubt, no, scratch that, I know for sure - Bavaria 38 is not the strongest sailboat in the world. I sailed that boat many times and saw it loosing her seaworthy in much less wind. If you enjoy your speed boat - what are you doing on the trawler’s forum? Or just bragging on being inside hurricane?
for me this my now boat is trawler ,if need speed push engine to 1800 rpm.
 
How do you plan to use the boat? Frankly, being in rollover conditions does not sound like a lot of fun so I personally avoid them. Last year we took our 36-foot boat from Ensenada MX 2000 nms to the Guatemala border and saw no more than 4-foot chop and 6-7 foot swells, and even that was less than 5% of the time (way less). We will resume our trek to Florida this fall.

Are some trawlers more stable than others? Yep - sure are. One of my favorite boats is the Defever 44. But it's height means it really, really needs stabilizers. My Willard 36 is low and carries 6000 lbs ballast in a full keel. We rarely run our stabilizers but I sure like them when they're on. But the space and storage of the Defever is undeniable, and the standup engine room which also contributed to it's height and tendency to roll.

But here's the bottom line for us: 95% of the time while underway, we find a powerboat to be more comfortable. It's dry and you can be selective about when you want exposure to the elements. If you expand the comparison to underway and at-anchor/marina, comfort of a trawler compared to sailboat (monohull) exceeds 99%. But I confess - while I enjoy sailing, it's not a burning passion. I just love being on the water so sail or power is okay by me.

We would never buy a boat based on its usefulness 1% of the time for our use case. Most sail-cruisers with means (vs budget cruisers) we've met love sailing so they define usefulness much differently.

All depends on your passion and how you plan to use the boat.

Good luck with your decision.

Peter
 
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As others have said, it would depend on where and what type of cruising you plan to do. As part of the conversation, I would include comfort at anchor. Im not a sailor, but it seems like a sailboat with low profile, weighted keel, and the counter balance of the mast, would be superior for stability at anchor. Im wondering if those that switched from sail to power noticed the difference in stability at anchor.
 
Current sailboat owner here, looking to buy my first trawler. To those who made the switch already - how does your trawler handle in rough seas compared to your old sailboat? I’m used to a keelboat’s stability and pretty confident in high seas, so I’m curious how a trawler behaves in heavy weather.

Also, in terms of stability, do you find roll mitigation systems (active fins, paravanes, etc.) essential, or are some trawlers naturally stable enough? And lastly, let’s be honest - if a trawler capsizes, is it game over?

Looking forward to hearing your experiences!
When you consider stability and capsizing, Im assuming it is in reference to safety. Maybe it’s my imagination, but it seems like the majority of disasters involving a sailboat have to do with de-mastings. Now consider people going overboard, or getting hurt on a sailboat in the conditions you describe. Have you considered this?
 
As others have said, it would depend on where and what type of cruising you plan to do. As part of the conversation, I would include comfort at anchor. Im not a sailor, but it seems like a sailboat with low profile, weighted keel, and the counter balance of the mast, would be superior for stability at anchor. Im wondering if those that switched from sail to power noticed the difference in stability at anchor.

It really depends on the sailboat. Deeper keels can have a pendulum effect. Once put into motion, they are slow to correct. Many of the traditional designs with longer overhangs that are often touted as seaworthy designs hobbyhorse easily ("pitch"). Catamarans or flopper stoppers largely solve these problems.

When you consider stability and capsizing, Im assuming it is in reference to safety. Maybe it’s my imagination, but it seems like the majority of disasters involving a sailboat have to do with de-mastings. Now consider people going overboard, or getting hurt on a sailboat in the conditions you describe. Have you considered this?

This is a large reason I stopped delivering sailboats early in my delivery career. Going to the foredeck in sloppy conditions is inherently dangerous. Sailboats have more stuff on the deck that break and few have well protected spaces - with exception of Amel, lifelines are cable and quite low. And the danger of flying stuff hitting you are elevated on a sailboat. I think it was the recent Sydney/Hobart race where two separate loose-boom accodents claimed two lives. Most lifelong sailors know at least one person who has lost a finger to winch over-rides. Add in the discomfort of spending long hours on an open cockpit resulting in a fatigued crew and the chances for mishap were unacceptable to me. If I didn't work, I didn't pay bills. So I decided to stop delivering sailboats.

Peter
 
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Decades of sailing and ownership before making the move to one of Peter's favorite boats, the DeFever 44. She is solid in crappy seas, and a PITA to dock in any wind. As Peter mentioned, lots of freeboard which gives her a bit of drift in cross winds. My weather tolerance is lower on the trawler than on my sailboats, but I don't intend to do poorly planned long passages. And would not own the boat without stabilizers either. To echo others, it depends on how you intend to use her. Couldn't get my wife of 35 years on any of our sailboats for longer than a couple of hours or an overnight at the dock only. On the DeFever, we've moved aboard and plan to start cruising this summer. I get the best of both worlds- a solid very livable boat and a woman I adore. At the same time.
 
Like the OP, I also went from sail to trawler. At first I felt very insecure with any rolling (beam sea). I knew that the trawler could not take a knockdown like a sailboat and right itself. However, as time passed I have have become more accustomed to the trawler and know now that it would have to really heel over before capsizing. We generally avoid rolling conditions primarily because of comfort rather than safety.

Conditions of winds in excess of 15 knots are definitely to be avoided now. One learns to "tack" to minimise beam sea roll. One learns that one must wait for the weather, regardless of schedule commitments.

The change from sail to trawler usually happens at later years when we have more time and when we are no longer looking for (or ready to accept) extreme adrenalin!
 
In the course of my life, I made a progression to bigger and bigger sailboats- 14’, 17’, 22’, 30’, 37’, 43’.

The 37’er was an Island Packet 37, one of the stoutest built production sailboats. I sailed it in up to 35 kts of wind and 6’ seas on the Chesapeake. It felt strong and stable in those conditions. And once going around Whale Key passage in the Abacos, I hit 10’ seas for a few minutes. It was a bit scary to be looking up at the peaks of the seas from the helm, but no serious rolling.

But I sold that boat, moved to SoCal and bought a 34’ Mainship 34T trawler. We used it mostly for going to Catalina Island, a crossing of 30 or so Nm from Long Beach to Two Harbors.

The seas were mostly in the 4’ range, but once we got into 6’+ seas a bit fore of the beam, After dealing with 30 degree rolls and green water hitting me in the face, I finished the trip from the lower helm. If anything the rolling felt worse from below but at least I was dry.

I swore to myself that I would never make that crossing again in those conditions.

So, unstabilized trawlers have a 5’ sea limit for me, whereas I think I could deal with much more, even 10’ on a solid sailboat. Part of the reason is that the sails stabilize a sailboat, but even with no sails up, a sailboat inherently is more stable due to its heavy ballasted keel.

There are a few trawlers that have significant ballast, Nordhavn and Kady Krogen are a few examples. But even these have a vanishing stability of only 100 degrees, whereas the Island Packet was 120.

They don’t test boats like my Mainship 34T for angle of vanishing stability, but I suspect it is less than 80 degrees.

David
 
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i came from the sailing world, moving from a 26 Balboa to a 1976 Ericson 32. Loved that boat, was out in 5 - 8 footers on the nose for 9 + hours. Not the most pleasant, but we got home. I wouldn't think of it in our current boat, a 1989 Jefferson Sundeck 37.
My wife and I won't travel on days that we deem to windy or the waves have built up. We cruise the Great Lakes and have had following seas of 2 - 3 feet where the boat does a lot of 'yawing' back and forth. Makes for a long day at the helm. The boat is also a little tender with waves on either beam. Not horrible, but not the most pleasant.
So, while we still look at sailboats, and we have a little 16' Compac daysailer as well to get our 'sailing fix' in, we like the amenities of a larger boat and just watch our weather window and forecasts for when we decide to travel. We try not to be in a hurry and run with good weather. Makes the trip more enjoyable.
 
Im wondering if those that switched from sail to power noticed the difference in stability at anchor.
That depends on the sailboat (and powerboat). My sailboat is a yawl, the mizzen is typically left set at anchor, and it sits rock steady into the wind and waves. My powerboat is a typical trawler, and it sails badly at anchor which most seem to. So it spends half of its time at a 30 degree angle to wind and waves. The sailboat also has a lower rolling period, due to the mast and keel increasing the polar moment in roll, also the round bilge shape. Even on crossing wakes, it rolls a lot less, and with a more comfortable period.

Bottom line is in an unprotected, or wake prone anchorage, I'd much rather be on the sailboat. On cruise, in more than about 10-12 knots wind in open water, I'm much rather be on the sailboat. In rainy, foggy, light or variable wind conditions (PNW?) I'd rather be on the trawler.
 
Cruising in 10-15kts in a sailboat is delightful, especially downwind or on a reach. If I had those conditions regularly I'd still have the sailboat. Over 20kts I just won't go out on either. Motoring a trawler in light winds is way way way nicer.

Motion at anchor is a really complex subject. A very stiff sailboat (deep keel, high ballast/displacement ratio) can actually be pretty unpleasant due to a very rapid, harsh motion. We have terrible anchorages here in SoCal generally, and I've found flop stoppers to be almost mandatory on both our old sailboat (Bene First 405) and current trawler (CHB 41).
 
Thank you all for the great comments, lots of valuable information here. To clarify my situation: I’ve been sailing for the last 30+ years, mostly racing with occasional cruising. Over the decades, I’ve developed a deep appreciation for being on the water. However, as I get older, I find myself less inclined to endure an open cockpit in cold rain and strong winds.

We sail year-round here in Vancouver, where winter sailing is often very damp or chilly, with moderate winds. In terms of cruising, our routine includes an annual 3–4 week trip to Desolation Sound, as well as shorter weekend cruises. In reality, much of our inshore cruising is done under power, which is another reason I’m considering a trawler. However, the primary reasons for the switch are comfort and protection from the elements.

When reading through the comments, a common trend emerges that most trawlers are comfortable in winds up to around 15 kts with 5' waves. However, no matter how carefully you plan a trip, the weather can change unexpectedly. A forecasted 15 kts wind can quickly turn into 30+ , especially in coastal areas where local effects can amplify conditions.

This leads me to several important questions:

Which models are known to be safer in rough conditions, and which ones should be avoided?
Should a full-displacement hull be a must?
Some models have already been mentioned - Cape Horn, Nordhavn, and the DeFever 44. The last one is a bit too big; I’m looking for something in the 35–40 ft range.

At this stage, my goal is to find a vessel that allows for more comfortable cruising without sacrificing too much in terms of safety. While I’m willing to adapt my cruising habits and be more cautious about weather windows, I also want to be confident that my boat can handle more than just ideal conditions should the need arise.
 
Thank you all for the great comments, lots of valuable information here. To clarify my situation: I’ve been sailing for the last 30+ years, mostly racing with occasional cruising. Over the decades, I’ve developed a deep appreciation for being on the water. However, as I get older, I find myself less inclined to endure an open cockpit in cold rain and strong winds.

We sail year-round here in Vancouver, where winter sailing is often very damp or chilly, with moderate winds. In terms of cruising, our routine includes an annual 3–4 week trip to Desolation Sound, as well as shorter weekend cruises. In reality, much of our inshore cruising is done under power, which is another reason I’m considering a trawler. However, the primary reasons for the switch are comfort and protection from the elements.

When reading through the comments, a common trend emerges that most trawlers are comfortable in winds up to around 15 kts with 5' waves. However, no matter how carefully you plan a trip, the weather can change unexpectedly. A forecasted 15 kts wind can quickly turn into 30+ , especially in coastal areas where local effects can amplify conditions.

This leads me to several important questions:

Which models are known to be safer in rough conditions, and which ones should be avoided?
Should a full-displacement hull be a must?
Some models have already been mentioned - Cape Horn, Nordhavn, and the DeFever 44. The last one is a bit too big; I’m looking for something in the 35–40 ft range.

At this stage, my goal is to find a vessel that allows for more comfortable cruising without sacrificing too much in terms of safety. While I’m willing to adapt my cruising habits and be more cautious about weather windows, I also want to be confident that my boat can handle more than just ideal conditions should the need arise.
Like most of us, certainly to include me, you might be running the risk of over thinking this in terms of safety. Most boats are safe in the cruising grounds that you have laid out here. Some may be a bit more comfortable under certain conditions if you widen your go- or no-go windows but that is about it.
You expect to be exposed to the Straits of Georgia, Jua de Fuca, Johnstone, and perhaps Queen Charlotte. While I respect your caution, those are three-hour windows and while the modern wind prediction models are not perfect, they are very, very good. It is quite possible to limit your beating with some discipline and bring your family home safely in a canoe.
I own two indestructible beasts that have never seen life threatening conditions under my ownership. I am about to spend considerable money to bring one of them up to the PNW and doing new coatings and a small refit.
It has occurred to me that what I really should do is just buy that sweet little Duffy currently for sale in Seattle and call it a day. That hull would take you anywhere you are talking about going, safely and in style.
The number of people who buy the brands you refer to, based on the need for their perceived capabilities, and then never put them to the test, is vast and perhaps those premiums attached to those vessels having been spent cruising instead would have served them better?

Easy for me to say.....
 
That Duffy looks amazing. You haven't stated a budget; on the (much) lower end, a Willard 36 (see mvweebles above) seems like a good option if you want something with good inherent seaworthiness. Smaller than most 36' trawlers but will still seem luxurious to a sailor like you. Get a PT-11 nesting dinghy to scratch your sailing itch if you still have one.
 
We were enamored w/ the Kadey Kroger 42. May be a tad bigger LOA but relatively simple systems, very seaworthy, lower profile, and long range tankage. Quick internet search uncovers crews that have done transatlantic passages in them. But a boat you want that is stabilized.
 
>You haven't stated a budget

Under $200K CAD
Might be tough to find a stabilized trawler for that price, particularly if it includes a refit budget.

Another option that could be viable in that size range and budget is to get something fast enough that it can quickly get you to where you want to be, reducing your exposure. Most semi-displacement or planing hulls can be slowed down to trawler speeds (say 7.5 kts) and remain pretty efficient (~2nmpg) when you're in no hurry.

Quick search on YW - very few stabilized boats found. Here's one though - someone spent a *ton* of $$ on this vessel. Gyro stabilized.
 
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This leads me to several important questions:

Which models are known to be safer in rough conditions, and which ones should be avoided?
Should a full-displacement hull be a must?
Some models have already been mentioned - Cape Horn, Nordhavn, and the DeFever 44. The last one is a bit too big; I’m looking for something in the 35–40 ft range.

At this stage, my goal is to find a vessel that allows for more comfortable cruising without sacrificing too much in terms of safety. While I’m willing to adapt my cruising habits and be more cautious about weather windows, I also want to be confident that my boat can handle more than just ideal conditions should the need arise.
Full displacement, ballasted trawlers are the safest. But do you need that? It's a bit like asking which trawlers are the fastest.

If you are going to cross oceans in your trawler then I would say that a full displacement hull is a must. But if you are just going to cruise the coastal US with maybe a trip to the Bahamas, virtually any trawler- displacement or semi-displacement will work fine.

If you do plan to cross oceans, then there are a lot more considerations than just hull type.

David
 
Might be tough to find a stabilized trawler for that price, particularly if it includes a refit budget.

Another option that could be viable in that size range and budget is to get something fast enough that it can quickly get you to where you want to be, reducing your exposure. Most semi-displacement or planing hulls can be slowed down to trawler speeds (say 7.5 kts) and remain pretty efficient (~2nmpg) when you're in no hurry.
Would running high RPM engines at low speeds lead to any issues such as carbon buildup or excessive wear?
 
Would running high RPM engines at low speeds lead to any issues such as carbon buildup or excessive wear?
Generally no, but something to confirm for whatever specific engines you end up looking at.
 
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