Multiple anchor roller

[sndog]

I have a bruce anchor (about 120lbs), cqr anchor(about 120lbs) and two fortress fx125s. My windlass is a lofrans titan. Chain gypsies on the sides and a rope spindle one on the top.

Each anchor currently has 3/8" x 300ft of chain. I may upgrade one anchor to either 200ft of 1/2" or 150ft of 5/8" The fortress has 1" nylon twist with a 10ft leader of 3/8" chain. Only the windlass is currently in place.

The anchors are in storage but will be going on the boat late this month to early next month.

I am trying to figure out the best course, or design, to handle the anchors. I want an anchor roller system at least for the bruce and cqr.

Any help would be highly appreciated as always.

photos show what is currently there (not my doing) and the windlass.

 

[O C Diver]

Ok, so what boat do you have and where do you cruise?

While it's hard to tell from the pictures, if you thick you might need 1/2" chain, it's likely you need heavier ground tackle hardware.

Ted

 

[sndog]

Ok, so what boat do you have and where do you cruise?

While it's hard to tell from the pictures, if you thick you might need 1/2" chain, it's likely you need heavier ground tackle hardware.

Ted

It's a degroot. 65 ft, power boat. Semi displacement trawler. Steel hull and steel super-structure.

 

[sndog]

Ok, so what boat do you have and where do you cruise?

While it's hard to tell from the pictures, if you thick you might need 1/2" chain, it'sin likely you need heavier ground tackle hardware.

Ted

Intended cruising grounds is going from houston through the carribean. Through the canal to the west coast. Cruising grounds will then be primarily so cal to vancouver bc.

 

[ranger58sb]

I have a bruce anchor (about 120lbs), cqr anchor(about 120lbs) and two fortress fx125s. My windlass is a lofrans titan. Chain gypsies on the sides and a rope spindle one on the top.

Each anchor currently has 3/8" x 300ft of chain. I may upgrade one anchor to either 200ft of 1/2" or 150ft of 5/8" The fortress has 1" nylon twist with a 10ft leader of 3/8" chain. Only the windlass is currently in place.

I am trying to figure out the best course, or design, to handle the anchors. I want an anchor roller system at least for the bruce and cqr.

I might not choose a CQR these days, but in general it sounds to me like you have OK stuff to start with... including the chain size... and I think I wouldn't make any changes until you have some experience (good, or not) with your current inventory. Especially since upsizing chain might also need upsizing the gypsies. If eventually you decided the CQR isn't cutting it, I suspect changing that would be an easier and more effective swap compared to upsizing chain. (Not that upsizing chain isn't a good idea; I'm just thinking it'd be better to hold off on that until you can decide whether it's really necessary.)

There are rail mounts for Danforth/Fortress-style anchors. If you don't have something like that already, you might look into it. And then if I were storing the Fortress anchors assembled, I think I'd have flukes on one preset for (normal) angle, flukes on the other set to the mud angle.

I can't quite make out how the "davits" work. Do they rotate? And then slot down into those channels?

-Chris

 

[Bmarler]

Those rollers look pretty flimsy for the weight of your boat. The bases are set at a goofy angle too I’d ditch that and start from scratch with a new roller setup that matches up to your chain wheels.
It looks like you have a through the hull option to hang a big navy anchor (or similar) too. What about that?

 

[Diep]

I would run with whatever chain you have if the condition is acceptable. After a while decide what needs upgrade. I wouldn't go through the effort and expense of new gypsies until you are confident you don't need or want a more comprehensive improvement.

Agree completely that those existing rollers look way too weenie for what otherwise must be a very stout boat. It looks like someone abandoned the navy-style anchor and then added something that folds away to save a tiny bit of overall boat length. Probably they never anchored much.

I would have something new welded in. Shouldn't be too costly on a steel boat, relatively speaking. If you do, make sure it can accommodate a modern anchor design of your choosing, in case you want to upgrade in the future.

Or look into restoring the navy style. It would probably look good.

 

[sndog]

I might not choose a CQR these days, but in general it sounds to me like you have OK stuff to start with... including the chain size... and I think I wouldn't make any changes until you have some experience (good, or not) with your current inventory. Especially since upsizing chain might also need upsizing the gypsies. If eventually you decided the CQR isn't cutting it, I suspect changing that would be an easier and more effective swap compared to upsizing chain. (Not that upsizing chain isn't a good idea; I'm just thinking it'd be better to hold off on that until you can decide whether it's really necessary.)

There are rail mounts for Danforth/Fortress-style anchors. If you don't have something like that already, you might look into it. And then if I were storing the Fortress anchors assembled, I think I'd have flukes on one preset for (normal) angle, flukes on the other set to the mud angle.

I can't quite make out how the "davits" work. Do they rotate? And then slot down into those channels?

-Chris

Good call in keep each fortress assembled but set to different uses. For what exists, I cannot figure it out either. So I figured I would just do a setup that handles them all, correctly. And since I have no idea how, I am this forum does help.

 

[sndog]

Those rollers look pretty flimsy for the weight of your boat. The bases are set at a goofy angle too I’d ditch that and start from scratch with a new roller setup that matches up to your chain wheels.
It looks like you have a through the hull option to hang a big navy anchor (or similar) too. What about that?

There was a navy style setup but but for whatever reason the prior owner, and shipyard, removed that option.

 

[sndog]

I would run with whatever chain you have if the condition is acceptable. After a while decide what needs upgrade. I wouldn't go through the effort and expense of new gypsies until you are confident you don't need or want a more comprehensive improvement.

Agree completely that those existing rollers look way too weenie for what otherwise must be a very stout boat. It looks like someone abandoned the navy-style anchor and then added something that folds away to save a tiny bit of overall boat length. Probably they never anchored much.

I would have something new welded in. Shouldn't be too costly on a steel boat, relatively speaking. If you do, make sure it can accommodate a modern anchor design of your choosing, in case you want to upgrade in the future.

Or look into restoring the navy style. It would probably look good.

They actually never used the boat, at all, away from a drinking platform at the docks. Engines have maybe 10 hrs on them.

Was thinking something of a stainless design that would then bolt into the front, rather than welded. As finding a decent welder in kemah has been a disaster, at best. And manufacturing stainless i expect to be worse.

Do you, or anyone else. Have a stainless manufacturing person they would recommend

 

[O C Diver]

You didn't mention tonnage (which I neglected to ask), but based on your pictures I would plan on increasing the bow roller assemblies.

Continuing forward, how much whether will you anchor in, or do you plan to primarily stay underway between docks. As an example: my goal was to be able to anchor in 60 knot winds without seas. So, I'm looking for a bay to protect me from waves but winds could reach 60 knots, worse case.

As mentioned by others, I would consider an alternative to your CQR. My boat came with a Bruce original and a CQR. I gave the CQR away and chose a newer generation anchor as my primary and the Bruce as a backup. Simply, the CQR doesn't have a good reputation for setting. If you anchor where there is a reversing tidal current or you expect a wind change from a frontal boundary, if the anchor pulls out, you want it to reset 99+% of the time.

Next, I would start with the anchor chain requirements. As an example: if you go to the Rocna web page, they do a very good job in the form of a spreadsheet in selecting boat length, then displacement range, to anchor size (weight), and then chain size. The below link can be toggled between pounds and tons for displacement purposes.

Anchor Sizing Guide

rocna.com

Next is the issue of whether the anchor snubber will come over the bow roller or attached on both sides to bow cleats. In storm conditions, your bow rollers would be woefully inadequate, but a double line snubber to two separate bow cleats could be sufficient with heavy chaffing gear. In a storm, you don't want the chain pulling on your windlass.

Hope this helps

Ted

 

[Mac2]

How many ton is your boat? I have a 65 foot steel boat, 90 ton. I have the same windlass. Initially the boat came with two bruce anchors and 500 feet of 1/2 chain on the main and unknown amount of 3/8 chain on the other. The only problem I ever had with a Bruce (previous boat) was anchoring in fresh water with about 15 feet of milfoil weeds-fouled during a wind shift. I opted for a 260 lb Sarca Excel anchor. The Titan handles everything just fine. I took out the center divider of my chain locker and have my 1/2 chain over the top of my secondary chain. I was having issues with the chain pyramiding and I plan on having 600 feet of chain in the future. I use my primary anchor for everything. I don’t understand the “storm” anchor concept. I use my best anchor all the time. I won’t use two anchors at the same time. If I have issues with the primary, I will hook a bunch of fenders to the rode and leave it there and come back for it later. The secondary will then come into play. I have a backup motor for the Titan that can be swapped out fairly quickly. I boat in the PNW and you can count on your rode winding through rocks/boulders. You will shift with the tides and winds. Something to consider with a rope rode dragging around the bottom.

 

[ranger58sb]

I don’t understand the “storm” anchor concept. I use my best anchor all the time.

My best guess, carryover from the days when electric or hydraulic windlasses were uncommon... or at least much less common.

So in that case, you only deal with the heavier weight when weather demands.

Ditto with the lighter weight lunch-hook idea, I think. Use it for quick, monitored stops in calm conditions... easy out and back in, by hand.

Like you, we use our best anchor all the time. With a windlass... 'cause I'm not sure I could lift the thing by hand anymore.

-Chris

 

[Mac2]

Ditto with the lighter weight lunch-hook idea, I think. Use it for quick, monitored stops in calm conditions... easy out and back in.

The Titan is extremely slow due to the gearing (for torque). Unlike the smaller Tigres I had on my previous boat, there is no speed difference between a 5 lb anchor or a 260 lb anchor. My secondary Bruce anchor is 180 lb. No way Im pulling that one up either. Your right about the carry over. I have a Fortress FX 125 (storm anchor) strapped to a bow rail and a Luke 120 (for rocks) in the engine room bilge-both from PO. Will I ever use them? Seriously doubt it. Will I get rid of them? No way. You never know…

 

[Greggnvt]

I have a bruce anchor (about 120lbs), cqr anchor(about 120lbs) and two fortress fx125s. My windlass is a lofrans titan. Chain gypsies on the sides and a rope spindle one on the top.

Each anchor currently has 3/8" x 300ft of chain. I may upgrade one anchor to either 200ft of 1/2" or 150ft of 5/8" The fortress has 1" nylon twist with a 10ft leader of 3/8" chain. Only the windlass is currently in place.

The anchors are in storage but will be going on the boat late this month to early next month.

I am trying to figure out the best course, or design, to handle the anchors. I want an anchor roller system at least for the bruce and cqr.

Any help would be highly appreciated as always.

photos show what is currently there (not my doing) and the windlass.


View attachment 168416View attachment 168417

Here is my dual anchor setup. 85# Mantus and 75# Ultra Windless: Maxwell HWC 2500 48' Chris Craft

 

[rgano]

Let's talk rollers.

A single roller makes for extra heavy strain on the windlass and everything else as the anchor's swivel or shackle hits it while those heavy anchors are hanging directly below. Install pivoting double rollers to make life much simpler.

 

[O C Diver]

Let's talk rollers.

A single roller makes for extra heavy strain on the windlass and everything else as the anchor's swivel or shackle hits it while those heavy anchors are hanging directly below. Install pivoting double rollers to make life much simpler.View attachment 168813

Never foud that to be the case. If you're lifting it off the bottom as opposed to pulling the boat forward, my windlass sounded about the same pulling versus deploying. If you have an issue, make sure the link can't touch both sides of the roller, only the barrel of the roller, and lubricate the shaft through the roller.

Ted

 

[rgano]

Well, it makes a major difference when the windlass is struggling either because of undersized or lack of sufficient/recommended power. And if you ever should have to resort to dragging that anchor in by hand, you will thank me over and over. Been dere, dun dat!

 

[Delta Riverat]

I like the tilter, good engineering. When you are pulling the heavy anchor straight up over the 2 inch roller it's a big strain, I've seen it.

 

[rslifkin]

The ideal roller setup and positioning also varies a bit depending on the anchor. Different shank shapes and lengths behave differently coming over the roller.

With the roller a few inches below the windlass my Vulcan comes up just fine with a single roller. A longer, straighter shank is more likely to benefit from a setup like Rgano showed.