Major Perkins Maintenance, Classic 34' Mainship, Perkins T6.354

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This is a longshot, but I am hoping there is a Perkins expert on there. Does anyone know if anything should bolt up to the opening circled in red in the following picture? The engine pictured is not mine, it is just a picture I was able to find on the web showing the crankcase. This opening appears to connect to the oil gallery on the start board side of the engine. It looks like in some configurations (like the H or something) the oil pump would feed to it via a crossover tube or something. Directly above it on the block is the where the oil feed for the turbo is fed. I didn't take pictures of mine or have a chance to test blowing air though the turbo feed to confirm it connects to the oil gallery but is certainly appears to. This being open would cause low oil pressure but I would expect it would have virtually no oil pressure with an opening this big. This is a contra-rotation model.

I will probably end up calling TAD, I did order my new oil pump from them so I think they would offer some advice. Looks like I should block it off. I see no block off plate for his anywhere in the parts manual.
As I mentioned, my engine is a horizontal and like the block you show, that opening was not used nor was a block off plate shown in the parts book. I could not figure out what it did either. I did not block it b/c as you decided, you would loose ALL your oil pressure is it were meant to be blocked.
 
I removed the connecting rod bearing for cylinder #6. There was one minor scrape through the lower shell. The upper bearing shell, which takes the brunt of the piston thrust had minor wear but not through the bearings material, no copper exposed. This is the bearing that should have the most wear. The part numbers on the bearing halves indicate they are standard size. Crank journal looked good but I have not measured for oblong shape yet, I doubt the crank will need any work. I also removed the oil pump and disassembled it. It is held in place in an odd fashion in my experience. A set screw from the port side of the block is what holds the pump up. The set screws engages a pronounced recess in the oil pump and there is a lock but that secures the set screws in place. No smoking gun yet.
I set the pressure regulator on my air compressor for 50 and with an adapter (I forget what) I blew against the relief valve and found it opened below 50 so I turned it in till it opened at 55.
I recommend you get a package of PlastiGage and check your clearance on the bearing you removed and maybe all of them, rods and mains, one at a time. You may yet find a loose one. My oil pump was secures in the same manner w/ a set screw/bolt.
 
I set the pressure regulator on my air compressor for 50 and with an adapter (I forget what) I blew against the relief valve and found it opened below 50 so I turned it in till it opened at 55.
I recommend you get a package of PlastiGage and check your clearance on the bearing you removed and maybe all of them, rods and mains, one at a time. You may yet find a loose one. My oil pump was secures in the same manner w/ a set screw/bolt.
Checking the clearance with plastigauge is definitely on my list. I intended to do that last night but I couldn't find the plastigauge left over for my last project. I'll pick some up tomorrow.

Thank you for sharing your experience. I thought I was taking crazy pills last night. I saw that.
 
Mystery solved. I got a better look and there's a plug about 4 in up into that recess
 
Progressing along. I did a significant amount of bearing material in the pan. My parts arrived today, I have the transmission and bell housing off. Cleaning, degreasing, wire wheeling and prepping for paint is definitely the most time consuming but will yield in a substantial benefit.
 

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I am keeping my eye out for one. I figure as soon as I get the Perkins dialed in perfectly, a 315 or 330 6BTA will pop up for a bargain and I will jump on it. The option to run 14-16 knots would be nice but I would have to re-shaft, re-prop and replace my transmission too. A velvet drive could support a 210 Cummins but mine is contra rotation and wouldn't work anyway, even for a lower output engine.
Be advised at16 knots the boat will get squirrely. I think it's called "chine walk" where it will go from side to side It is unavoidable, it's what the boat does. Feels like it is going to flip over but it won't.
Drop it back to 15.5 and it stops.
You might be able to put spray rails or something like that to stop it. but I never thought it would be worth the effort.
You will also have to fair the keel to get better water flow to the prop, and gusset the hull above the prop to stop the "oil canning" vibration. (You'll need to do these mods even to go 15 knots).
 
The material in the oil pan is not bearing material, I think it might be chrome flakes, it is slightly ferrous.
 
The material in the oil pan is not bearing material, I think it might be chrome flakes, it is slightly ferrous.
Did you decide what the "flakes" in the oil pan were? They look serious?
 
Did you decide what the "flakes" in the oil pan were? They look serious?
I haven't got a smoking gun yet, there is way too slop in the thrust bearing, the crank may have self clearanced itself against a main bearing cap, I don't see any shiny or full spots from wear. I have cracked all but the first main cap loose, I have only pulled main cap #7 so far, it showed more wear than the connecting rod bearings.

I need to finish removing the oil pan bridge at the front of the engine to access main cap #1. There is one remaining stud going through the timing cover I haven't got out, I might resort to vice grips and replacing it.
I am still working on getting my front crank pulley off so I can access the front main seal. I got the weighted balancer off and the crank bolt loose but the pulley looks like it will be a fight.
 
I haven't got a smoking gun yet, there is way too slop in the thrust bearing, the crank may have self clearanced itself against a main bearing cap, I don't see any shiny or full spots from wear. I have cracked all but the first main cap loose, I have only pulled main cap #7 so far, it showed more wear than the connecting rod bearings.

I need to finish removing the oil pan bridge at the front of the engine to access main cap #1. There is one remaining stud going through the timing cover I haven't got out, I might resort to vice grips and replacing it.
I am still working on getting my front crank pulley off so I can access the front main seal. I got the weighted balancer off and the crank bolt loose but the pulley looks like it will be a fight.
Wicked (as we say in Boston) project especially the way the engine is hanging. Mine, being horizontal, had the crankshaft facing me at least.
 
Slowly chipping away at this project. I ended up having to loosen the timing cover in order to get a socket on the first main bearing cap. Seems a little bit silly, another 1/8" of clearance would be sufficient. I planned on removing the timing cover eventually anyway to re-gasket an repaint it but would prefer to disturb the timing as less as possible. Now I have all the main bolts broken free, still need to pull caps 2-6 off to inspect, I had to take a break and get ready to take my girls to a practice.

I have pretty good access the the bottom of the crankcase by getting down in the engine compartment. It is a little unnerving on windy days but I have the engine well supported and the gantry is still holding it as well. Hopefully I will get the engine block cleaned up this weekend and thoroughly clean the workspace, then next weekend I will install the bearings and start getting everything back together and ready for paint.
 
Things have escalated. Main shaft journals 4, 5 and 6 have some wear. I believe machining 3 1/1000 of material off will yield a usable unit but I am in the research phase. Planning to call TAD tomorrow and talk to some machine shops.
 

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This is the middle (#4) main cap and lower bearing. The thrust bearings are both showing copper and the lower bearing shell took a beating. It was living on borrowed time
 

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Sorry if I missed it earlier, how many hours were on the engine?
I really don't know for sure, my best estimate is between 4500-5000 hours. The hour meter was at 750 when I purchased in 2021, it had clearly been changed. A survey from 2010 (or so, I forget the date) reported the hours to be 3500 at the time.

I believe the damage was misuse versus heavy use. The motor was overheated at some point due to coolant lines coming loose in 2019 or so. I knew this engine wasn't healthy when I bought the boat but figured I would rebuild if need be. I didn't realize it was a contra rotation at the time.

The motor has consistently shown the same low oil pressure under my ownership, not getting worse but no luck in chasing cheap and easy fixes such as fuel dilution or poor oil cooling.

The common wear items have been replaced with the last 10 years, exhaust manifold, turbo, intercooler, exhaust elbow, heat exchanger, expansion tank. I figured, at worse a rebuild won't cost that much, it is a sleeved engine and the Massey Ferguson parts are cheap.

I bought a boat with warts during the pandemic and am paying the price but I have gotten a lot of use along the way.
 
The Perkins blue seems a poor color for a boat engine which sits down in a dark place. Big boy engines are generally white which makes for much easier inspection.
 
The Perkins blue seems a poor color for a boat engine which sits down in a dark place. Big boy engines are generally white which makes for much easier inspection.
I have considered white, and now would be the time to switch it. It is currently a mix of Ford blue and crusader blue which is pretty close to Perkins blue. I think it will be light enough to allow for good inspection. Once I get the bilge painted and some lighting down there, I should be much improved.
 
I found a machine shop to machine my crankshaft. Hopeful to get it dropped off tomorrow, I am proceeding with the painstaking process of de-greasing. Ideally I will get everything done to bare metal and start with fresh primer. Too many years of poorly prepped coats of paint on this dinosaur.

I removed the coolant circulation pump yesterday and it looked horrible inside, the bearings felt smooth and it never leaked but everything appears to have an oily surface finish to it in sprite of the motor being full of relatively fresh coolant. I think this thing experienced at least one head gasket failure in its long life.

The engine runs great and starts well, so aside from a very minor oil seepage, I don't think I need to replace the head gasket right now. That said, it is inexpensive and it would never be easier to access so I think that is getting added to the ever growing scope of this project.

Speaking of scope snowballing, I am replacing the transmission pump seal which is the input shaft seal on a velvet drive. It also needs a speedy sleeve to provide a better sealing surface. Both are readily available.
 
I might've missed it , but since your clutch is off, you are going to replace your damper plate, right? I know it's easy for me to spend your money but there will never be a better time.
 
Also, I never had a problem with the way our engine room area looked with the Perkins blue (well, ACE Hardware safety blue) engine,the color of which I also kind of liked. Like you said. when the entire place gets painted with a fresh coat of white, you'll have no problem with seeing anything down there. Especially if you add a couple of well-placed LED lights.
 
I might've missed it , but since your clutch is off, you are going to replace your damper plate, right? I know it's easy for me to spend your money but there will never be a better time.
I haven’t ordered it yet but will be replacing it. I have a growing list of additional parts to order, most will be through TAD. I am not looking forward to the expense but I need to order new engine mounts as well. That will be around $600 or so. Overall it is a relatively cheap project for the benefit it should provide. Just time consuming.

I had a couple of components on hand already that I hadn’t gotten around to installing like a rebuild water pump (contra rotation), the oil pump and a serpentine pulley kit.
 
Things have escalated. Main shaft journals 4, 5 and 6 have some wear. I believe machining 3 1/1000 of material off will yield a usable unit but I am in the research phase. Planning to call TAD tomorrow and talk to some machine shops.
Be careful grinding a crankshaft. I know of 2 Perkins cranks that broke within a short time after being ground. It has to do with grinding into the heat affected zone on the journals.
One was on an engine a friend of mine had rebuilt by TAD and had just over 100 hours on the rebuild. TAD blamed it on the harmonic balancer, but I had my doubts. That was a range 4 engine.
The other was an original T 6.354. I saw pictures ( not the greatest quality) and to me it looked like it broke in the area of heat affected zone.
Just be careful and ask lots of questions.
 
X2. I believe there are some Perkins crankshafts that can't be turned. They are Tufterized sp?
 
X2. I believe there are some Perkins crankshafts that can't be turned. They are Tufterized sp?
Thank you for pointing this out. The nitrated crankshafts have limitations on being re-ground. Based on the stamped numbers on the crank, I believe mine was induction hardened and not subject to the same limitations. Fortunately I have the shop manual thanks to this forum which includes the casting numbers and treatment of the various cranks used.
 
Im talking about induction hardened shafts.
The heat treated is always shallow especially near the grind reliefs. That is the danger zone.
 
Im talking about induction hardened shafts.
The heat treated is always shallow especially near the grind reliefs. That is the danger zone.
Turns out that I don't know what I am looking at. I dropped the crank off to the machinist this morning who assured me it was a nitrited crank in spite of it not having a casting number that shows up on the workshop manual. He is going to magniflux it for cracks first and believes that 20 thousands will do the be adequate for the damaged main journals. Surprisingly, the thrust surfaces which were riding against the copper base of the thrust bearing looked fine and measured out in specs

Fortunately it is in capable hands now and I should find out more soon
 
My engine has a viscus oil filled damper that I plan on reusing. I had planned on sandwiching the serpentine between the crankshaft pulley and the vibration damper but may not proceed with this plan if the damper effectiveness is diminished
 
.020” seems like a lot.
I had the crank thrust bearing completely wear out on an old (1981) VW diesel. The loud mechanical knock I was hearing was the counterweights hitting the block!! The cylinders were worn oval that was very obvious visually. That engine was toast!! LOL
 
.020” seems like a lot.
I had the crank thrust bearing completely wear out on an old (1981) VW diesel. The loud mechanical knock I was hearing was the counterweights hitting the block!! The cylinders were worn oval that was very obvious visually. That engine was toast!! LOL
The #4 main journal was close to 10 under due to the wear. There was shavings in the oil pan from the crank scraping on something.
 
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