Is there price fixing in marine electronics?

[Saba]

Is there price fixing in marine electronics?
I decided to buy a Halo 20 plus. In looking for the best place to purchase it, Everyplace had the exact same price, $2299.
From Simrad USA, West Marine, The GPS store, Amazon, Ebay etc... everywhere the exact same price!
Why is this? I thought price fixing was illegal? Why no competition?

 

[JackConnick]

There are contracts with the manufacturer that specify that the retailers cannot discount less than a certain price called MAP. Otherwise the manufacturer has the ability not to supply the retailer. The idea is to present a level playing field, otherwise big box discounters would destroy smaller stores that offer more service and brick and mortar stores.

From the FTC:
"If a manufacturer, on its own, adopts a policy regarding a desired level of prices, the law allows the manufacturer to deal only with retailers who agree to that policy."

 

[Dawgfan]

Manufacturers are allowed by law, and by the contract that the dealer signs with them, to restrict the price that they advertise the product for to a minimum advertised price. That is called the MAP price. Dealers and distributors are allowed to SELL the product for any price they wish, just not to advertise it for any price they wish. Directly contact a dealer or dealer/distributor that does some reasonable amount of sell through volume with that manufacturer and see if you can get them to quote you a better price. MAP policy has been in effect for decades now, and due to the race to the bottom on electronics pricing, many dealers will not sell below MAP due to the low markup those products have. Best of Luck.

(JackConnick's post was made at the same time. We agree!)

 

[slowgoesit]

I see this a lot with, for instance, Victron products. One way that some retailers can get around it to stick with the set price, but offer "free shipping", or "no sales tax", or sometimes they will bundle some other related item in with it for the same price.
I have some success with calling the retailer directly, and getting to a sales manager (not the person who answered the phone, and saying something like: I'd really to purchase this product from you, but I was wondering, if I bought your XYZ gadget for $2000.00, would you consider including the PDQ whatsnot item you normally sell for $200 at no additional charge? I've seldom had them say no! But I DO ask it with a great deal of charm! Or may a little bit of wheedling . . . . if you want to be crass about it.

There, now that I've given away my all my secrets, YOU try it . . .

 

[jgwinks]

The manufacturers dictate the advertised price but quite often an online retailer will not show the price, but say "add to Cart to see price". That way they get around the MAP price. They can't advertise the lower price but they can show it in the "Cart". Unless they have permission from the manufacturer, if they list lower than the MAP they're done selling that product. Once added to your cart you can always delete it if you're not happy with the price. I do that often.

 

[SteveK]

I see this a lot with, for instance, Victron products. One way that some retailers can get around it to stick with the set price, but offer "free shipping", or "no sales tax", or sometimes they will bundle some other related item in with it for the same price.
I have some success with calling the retailer directly, and getting to a sales manager (not the person who answered the phone, and saying something like: I'd really to purchase this product from you, but I was wondering, if I bought your XYZ gadget for $2000.00, would you consider including the PDQ whatsnot item you normally sell for $200 at no additional charge? I've seldom had them say no! But I DO ask it with a great deal of charm! Or may a little bit of wheedling . . . . if you want to be crass about it.

There, now that I've given away my all my secrets, YOU try it . . .

All I have to say is Scot sent me, don't have to ask. Have to wonder what you actually said to them.

 

[heysteve]

I think your traditional "price fixing" is when sellers with different products agree to sell for a common price thereby eliminating competition. For example, if Simrad and Raymarine agreed to sell their competitive radars for the same price. Markets need competition to drive innovation, quality and price and when it stops happening bad things happen. This is also why monopolies are a problem. Or at least that's the idea

 

[slowgoesit]

All I have to say is Scott sent me, don't have to ask. Have to wonder what you actually said to them.

Steve, Not sure who this ScotT guy is, but if you tell them that SCOT sent them . . . well, that may be another story! Of course, the price could always go UP too!

 

[SteveK]

Steve, Not sure who this ScotT guy is, but if you tell them that SCOT sent them . . . well, that may be another story! Of course, the price could always go UP too!

I stand corrected, post edited.

 

[JackConnick]

The manufacturers dictate the advertised price but quite often an online retailer will not show the price, but say "add to Cart to see price". That way they get around the MAP price. They can't advertise the lower price but they can show it in the "Cart". Unless they have permission from the manufacturer, if they list lower than the MAP they're done selling that product. Once added to your cart you can always delete it if you're not happy with the price. I do that often.

Many manufacturers will enforce this as a MAP violation. They also will not allow sales on EBay or Amazon, etc. I owned a retail store selling underwater photography equipment for 15 years, I can tell you the margins on all electronics is stupid small. We made money on accessories.

Shop local and shop the stores that give you service and support.

 

[SteveK]

Shop local and shop the stores that give you service and support.

I do my best to shop local. But when I can buy for less and free delivery from across the continent, I have to re think supporting the local guy. It is not easy to justify spending more than a few dollars if you can save $100 or more. It may be easier for you in Seattle as those suppliers with an exchange rate included have shipped for less than local.

 

[Shrew]

Is there price fixing in marine electronics?
I decided to buy a Halo 20 plus. In looking for the best place to purchase it, Everyplace had the exact same price, $2299.
From Simrad USA, West Marine, The GPS store, Amazon, Ebay etc... everywhere the exact same price!
Why is this? I thought price fixing was illegal? Why no competition?

What you're describing in not Price Fixing. This is one manufacturer establishing a price. Now if Raymarine, Furuno, and Simrad all agreed that they will all charge a specified minimum price for a certain class or size of device, then that would be price fixing.

 

[jgwinks]

I can tell you the margins on all electronics is stupid small.

Right on that. Back when I worked at West Marine they had the best employee discount I ever saw. 10% over store cost and some of their house branded stuff was marked up 300% so it was a heck of a deal. But electronics, if you ran it as an employee purchase the price came up considerably more than the tag price. We would run them as a public sale and pay the tag price. The store manager didn't like that so we would buy stuff when he wasn't there and pay cash. No paper trail.

 

[Chuck34]

I spent a lot of years in sales with a company in a different market. MAP (minimum advertised price) was a thing in our market as well and that was 25 years ago.

 

[Cortez]

Is there price fixing in marine electronics?
I decided to buy a Halo 20 plus. In looking for the best place to purchase it, Everyplace had the exact same price, $2299.
From Simrad USA, West Marine, The GPS store, Amazon, Ebay etc... everywhere the exact same price!
Why is this? I thought price fixing was illegal? Why no competition?

There are prices set by the manufacturer. Even with commercial accounts from doing upgrades and repairs on yachts, the profit margin on electronics is so small that discounts are very slim. I can expect less than 5% discount on electronics whereas bulk discount on fasteners (stainless screws) can be >50%.
I don't think it is price fixing but it looks like it because there is very little mark-up.

 

[Chuck34]

There are prices set by the manufacturer. Even with commercial accounts from doing upgrades and repairs on yachts, the profit margin on electronics is so small that discounts are very slim. I can expect less than 5% discount on electronics whereas bulk discount on fasteners (stainless screws) can be >50%.
I don't think it is price fixing but it looks like it because there is very little mark-up.

See above posts...we already said that most likely, it is the manufacturer's MAP or Minimum Advertised Price. Resellers can sell for any price they want, but they cannot advertise a product less that the MAP price set by the mfg. That's why the item the OP wants to buy is advertised by everyone for the exact same price.

 

[DC36Monk]

And there are discounts. I bought the Simrad Halo 20+ from a high volume retailer for $2,028. I was surprised and quite pleased.

 

[jo jo]

Is there price fixing in marine electronics?
I decided to buy a Halo 20 plus. In looking for the best place to purchase it, Everyplace had the exact same price, $2299.
From Simrad USA, West Marine, The GPS store, Amazon, Ebay etc... everywhere the exact same price!
Why is this? I thought price fixing was illegal? Why no competition?

I own a retail store. Manufacturers set retail minimum prices. The MAP MSRP prices are designed to protect small businesses from unreasonable competition. These minimums ultimately protect the manufacturer’s business too. Without this sort of pricing requirement business would fail, demand would decrease and the desired products would no longer be available. It’s important. It’s not “price fixing.” I hope this helps.

 

[Bigd]

Is there price fixing in marine electronics?
I decided to buy a Halo 20 plus. In looking for the best place to purchase it, Everyplace had the exact same price, $2299.
From Simrad USA, West Marine, The GPS store, Amazon, Ebay etc... everywhere the exact same price!
Why is this? I thought price fixing was illegal? Why no competition?

Last year I purchased a Halo 20+ to complement my GO12 chart plotter because I had good service with the dated 9" model. After installing it I couldn't get it to fire up with 12.6 vdc. Support confirmed DOA. I paid to ship it back for a replacement. The replacement fired up for about 10 minutes but the image was a 'snow storm'. Support declared the error codes on both units as firmware issues. After having the boat on the hard to remove the old Furuno unit, pull new cables, modify the scanner mount, etc., I did a search on boating sites to find I was not alone. Rather than going through this until my warranty expired, I demanded a refund and asked for a prepaid return postage or courier label which was denied. I was told to take it back to the dealer I bought it from which was 120 miles round trip. That dealer issued a credit for the scanner plus the $120 shipping costs I incurred sending back my first defective scanner, to my credit card. No other choice. Check other reviews on boating sites.