Help understanding basic Victron set up

[jtdums]

Currently our 12v Saberline has no inverter and a single 4d house bank.
I have decided to add both capacity and an inverter at the same time so this was a good opportunity to purchase an inverter/ charger that could be configured for LiFePO4. Currently run a Pronautics 60amp, three bank charger to tend the two start batteries and the house which are all AGM.

I am now the proud owner of a 460AH Epoch Marine battery with Victron coms thanks to black Friday discount. (Buyers remorse, I probably could have done the essentials, but the built in 500amp T class fuse and coms swayed me.)

I've been trying to read/ learn as much as possible, but very much still a rookie with these set ups. I am a competent DIY owner.

Our use case in the near future is starting the loop in April. Traveling with a dog so likely a majority number of nights with access to power. We are equipped with a 4kw generator in good working order. Twin 30amp shore cords.

We have added some bells and whistles as comfort items like Starlink (on a 12v converter) and 12v USB chargers. The fridge is AC/DC. I anticipate our off grid usage would have quickly exceeded our usable 100ah (estimated) of capacity without regular charging. Yes, we could fire up the generator to recharge house, but that doesn't solve the lack of inverter issue. (Keurig coffee maker powers us) Furthermore, we should have active engine time of about 5 hours at least every other day. Twin 135amp alternators from two Yanmar 4LV250 engines.

I am working on a full electrical audit of the boat systems, but it is slow going and honestly I'm getting stuck in the weeds a bit.

I have not purchased any other components at this time, but I have purchased a schematic designed for primarily van conversion to aid me in compiling a list of likely components and fusing with location. I can't share it here due to copyright protection, but I plan to use it as a base as I design my own system.
I am following with interest every thread here as well as the AGLCA forum and MTOA forum that is addressing this issue. Lots of very knowledgeable folks giving of their time.

My plan is to install a victron based system with victron components so as to hopefully avoid issues with compatibility and allow for integrated future expansion like solar at a later date. I am not unaware of the possible cost savings afforded by going with other brands and looked hard at the LiTime setup, but ultimately convinced myself that by spending a few extra boat bucks I can end up with both trouble free reliability and perhaps an easier resale down the road.

I do have questions and thought I would try to begin with broad issues first...

1) I have a functioning 4d house battery and don't want to throw the baby out with the bath water. Further, in the event of a BMS shut down it could provide redundancy with capacity to "get me home". (Realistically, the essential systems are tied to the start batteries, but "going dark" does seem ominous.). Is there an issue leaving the AGM 4d house battery in place as is (charged by pronautic charger and alternators), but running it through a Blue Sea 6008 battery switch (on-off-on) with the Epoch on the other leg to the existing 12v house distribution panel? They would not be combined at any point. Charging systems would remain separate. (Charge system for the new battery to be discussed briefly)

2) Assuming I go with the Victron Multiplus-II 12/3000 120-50 120v as the inverter/charger, can my new Epoch battery (12V 460Ah | Heated & Bluetooth & Victron Comms | LiFePO4 Battery) "talk" directly to the inverter from its BMS using CANBUS or does it have to go through a Victron Cerbo product to enable this feature. The battery has a basic state of charge wired monitor as well as Bluetooth communication to monitor the state of the battery. (Note: I am aware of the issue with the BMS not accounting for less than 1amp drain and over time and losing accuracy, but assuming time with power to recharge fully at the dock and regularly balance do I need a second shunt going to a Cerbo?

2.2) The supplier of the multiplus offers a service to configure the multiplus specifically to Epoch batteries for a small fee which seems beneficial since I no longer own a PC to use the Victron software to configure on my own. I also know that the Epoch Marine battery was initially having issues triggering charge warnings until some smart folks figured out to reduce the bulk and float voltages. I'm not sure exactly what the supplier does to configure the multiplus, but before purchasing and configuring I would ask more questions. Am I "safe" having the multiplus configured before delivery and are there settings that I want to ensure are toggled one way or the other by supplier?

3) If the above answer allows me to skip the Cerbo and shunt, can I still add a Victron Orion XS 12/12-50 DC to DC Charger which is "smart" and bluetooth controllable without issue? I plan on using the 50amp charger from the old house bank (or a start battery) to charge the new Epoch while underway.

I know these questions are pretty rudimentary for many on this forum, but finding concise answers pertaining to LiFePO4 conversion and the use of Victron components is surprisingly difficult.
I appreciate any responses as I plan for our new system.

 

[ranger58sb]

2.2) The supplier of the multiplus offers a service to configure the multiplus specifically to Epoch batteries for a small fee which seems beneficial since I no longer own a PC to use the Victron software to configure on my own.

We have a MultiPlus 24/3000/70-50/120V... along with Multi-Control and BMV-712 remotes. We re-purposed our thruster bank to also service the inverter function... so the Victron unit replaced (and mounted in the same place as) the thruster bank's original charger.

FWIW, I found it best to just have the local Victron dealer do the install too. Partly because it was way more complicated than I could pay attention to, at the time. (Had other chores in progress.) Partly because I couldn't easily get into places where stuff (and wiring) needed to go... and our cable runs for both AC and DC were about as short as you could imagine anyway. And partly for all the warranty service possibility.

Labor was 20½ hours at $115/hour, $2358. Turnkey. I would not have known about the remote units, had they not schooled me about those.

-Chris

 

[jtdums]

Thanks for the feedback/ info Chris.
How much capacity was available from your thruster bank? You feed the thruster with LiFePO? Any issues?

 

[ranger58sb]

Capacity is 255-Ah @ 24VDC.

Not LFP; near as I could tell, no LPF solutions would have been great for the thruster's current requirements (560A @ 24VDC for 4.5 mins). I used Lifeline GPL-8DLs.

All of our DC house/nav functions are serviced by the two main starter banks.

-Chris

 

[tpbrady]

I think you will need the Cerbo because Victron uses 2 different network architectures for its various components (VE bus and VE direct). The Cerbo brings the two networks together for display information on the Touch 50. While a lot of the components have Bluetooth, their Bluetooth implementation is not very good as its range is very limited, by that I mean 10 ft or less. Another thing to consider is Victron doesn’t give you complete configuration capability through the Cerbo/Touch 50 or the Victron Connect app using the USB dongle. You can do some on one and some on the other. The hard core settings are through Victron Connect for things like charge profile. Once set there is very little need to deal with them.

Victron still seems to be the best out there, but they really need to settle on a single network architecture, do some work on software, the human interface, and documentation.

 

[jtdums]

Chris,
That's an elegant solution. You have more capacity than me and sounds like you used the existing infrastructure to accomplish it. Do you have a way to charge the thruster bank while under way? DC12-DC24 charger maybe? If not, any concern that you might run the thruster bank down too low before needing it?

 

[jtdums]

I think you will need the Cerbo because Victron uses 2 different network architectures for its various components (VE bus and VE direct). The Cerbo brings the two networks together for display information on the Touch 50. While a lot of the components have Bluetooth, their Bluetooth implementation is not very good as its range is very limited, by that I mean 10 ft or less. Another thing to consider is Victron doesn’t give you complete configuration capability through the Cerbo/Touch 50 or the Victron Connect app using the USB dongle. You can do some on one and some on the other. The hard core settings are through Victron Connect for things like charge profile. Once set there is very little need to deal with them.

Victron still seems to be the best out there, but they really need to settle on a single network architecture, do some work on software, the human interface, and documentation.

Thanks Tpbrady,
I suspect the cerbo is going to be necessary, and not really problematic. I think I saw at one point that you can get the cerbo to join the local wifi network in lieu of the bluetooth for greater range. I'm trying to learn more about that possibility.

Also, I don't want to use their touch screen if I can avoid it since I believe all functions can be done via app too. Getting definitive answers on Victron issues is so difficult.

Good information about the charge profile settings. Thank you.

 

[amxr39]

Ross Lukeman has several YouTube videos. He’s very good at what he does. If you buy products from him, you get free support. Rosslukeman.com

 

[jtdums]

Ross Lukeman has several YouTube videos. He’s very good at what he does. If you buy products from him, you get free support. Rosslukeman.com

Thank you. I'll check this out. Appreciated

Edit: Actually I've gone through his series of videos already and found them to be very helpful.

 

[jtdums]

Here is a link to a video tutorial to get the cerbo on wifi to use with remote app monitoring. Maybe helps someone down the road.
Cerbo on wifi

 

[jtdums]

I think further poking around has for the most part answered my question in #1 above.
This video does an excellent job demonstrating the use of DVCC to control the battery charging through the use of a Cerbo GX.
DVCC for Victron

Since my Epoch battery BMS is on a CANBUS network talking to the Cerbo it can use DVCC to direct charging and "control" the system like I was hoping. I need to limit the charge/ discharge current to 100amps as dictated by my use of a single Epoch battery.
...at least as far as I understand it. Sound correct? Love input here...

 

[ranger58sb]

Chris,
That's an elegant solution. You have more capacity than me and sounds like you used the existing infrastructure to accomplish it. Do you have a way to charge the thruster bank while under way? DC12-DC24 charger maybe? If not, any concern that you might run the thruster bank down too low before needing it?

It was the most streamlined I could come up with. And seemed to me to be a way to make use of an otherwise under-utilized resource.

Charging underway only when we have the genset on too, as for AC/heat when appropriate. We tend to not really need the thruster often, even then mostly only to get wifey close enough to piles to get a line on... so no worries (so far) about arrivals and a depleted thruster bank.

-Chris

 

[ranger58sb]

Just saw Jeff's post about these in another thread:

12V 300Ah - Group 8D - Cranking & Deep Cycle Lithium Battery (Dual Purpose)

www.epochbatteries.com

Don't remember seeing anything like that available when I was shopping for replacement thruster (and inverter) batteries in mid 2022. Looks like these could meet our thrusters current requirements. Presumably able to be wired in series to 24V.

Probably not particularly relevant for OP, but nice to know it's out there...

-Chris

 

[READY]

Another good primer:

 

[jtdums]

Yes. I think I have gone through all of the Will Prowse videos. He has a great way of breaking down concepts and his reviews of batteries are great.

 

[tpbrady]

Not using the video display is a reasonable approach. I use it at the helm while underway to monitor voltage and battery status. The Touch display is simply an HDMI output from the Cerbo. The wireless interface is a web page that shows what you see on the Touch. If you are smart enough to do some HTML programming which I’m not, you can create custom pages.

Tom

 

[jtdums]

I believe there is a way to connect the cerbo to the NMEA2k network to view some limited info on the MFD while underway. Still working on figuring that one out...

Edit: apparently it is as easy (at least from a hardware standpoint) as adding this victon VE bus to NMEA cable.
Cerbo to NMEA cable

 

[Barking Sands]

I have a pair of the Epoch 460 Marine batteries and a full Victron system. I have done a few videos regarding the Epoch/Victron set up.

Your system will be very much like mine. I have a 31ft Trawler with single diesel and smallish 4.4kw generator.
Your choice of the Multiplus II 12/3000/120 is probably perfect. The items you will likely want are:

Multiplus II 12/3000/120 - inverter charger
Cerbo GX- the central brains of the operation
Touch 50 or 70 touch screen for daily monitoring
MK3- to program your multiplus easily vie either USB and your phone or laptop
500 amp smart shunt- will report details such as voltage and battery SOC to your touch 50/70 and will allow trend tracking etc.
New Orion 50 AMP DC2DC charger to take 50 amps off your alternator while underway- when hooked up to cerbo it will show up on the touch 50 as "alternator".

I would leave your lead acid bank in place, or enough of it to start your engine and to direct the alternator output towards. I would use the DC2DC charger from the lead acid start bank to send up to 50 amps to the Epoch 460.
I would actually not use the Epoch Comms for charge control but just for comm reporting of warnings and details to the touch 50. I leave DVCC off but you can use DVCC as long as you set BMS control to "none". I actually prefer using the Victron programming for charge control with setting the 500amp smart shunt as the "Battery Monitor" (youll have to choose what you want as battery monitor). You would use the MK3 interface to program the Multiplus II, especially the "charger" tab to set absorption voltage to 13.9 and float to 13.5 plus some other basic settings.

The Lynx distributor, if you have space, is a pretty good way to combine all the wiring.

The only thing I might do different would be to look at the Quattro VS Multiplus. The main reason is I believe the Quattro has dual inputs so you can have separate inputs for Shore Power and Generator. My SP/GEN is done with a manual rotary selector.

There is a good Epoch Marine Facebook group with lots of support.

 

[jtdums]

I have a pair of the Epoch 460 Marine batteries and a full Victron system. I have done a few videos regarding the Epoch/Victron set up.

Your system will be very much like mine. I have a 31ft Trawler with single diesel and smallish 4.4kw generator.
Your choice of the Multiplus II 12/3000/120 is probably perfect. The items you will likely want are:

Multiplus II 12/3000/120 - inverter charger
Cerbo GX- the central brains of the operation
Touch 50 or 70 touch screen for daily monitoring
MK3- to program your multiplus easily vie either USB and your phone or laptop
500 amp smart shunt- will report details such as voltage and battery SOC to your touch 50/70 and will allow trend tracking etc.
New Orion 50 AMP DC2DC charger to take 50 amps off your alternator while underway- when hooked up to cerbo it will show up on the touch 50 as "alternator".

I would leave your lead acid bank in place, or enough of it to start your engine and to direct the alternator output towards. I would use the DC2DC charger from the lead acid start bank to send up to 50 amps to the Epoch 460.
I would actually not use the Epoch Comms for charge control but just for comm reporting of warnings and details to the touch 50. I leave DVCC off but you can use DVCC as long as you set BMS control to "none". I actually prefer using the Victron programming for charge control with setting the 500amp smart shunt as the "Battery Monitor" (youll have to choose what you want as battery monitor). You would use the MK3 interface to program the Multiplus II, especially the "charger" tab to set absorption voltage to 13.9 and float to 13.5 plus some other basic settings.

The Lynx distributor, if you have space, is a pretty good way to combine all the wiring.

The only thing I might do different would be to look at the Quattro VS Multiplus. The main reason is I believe the Quattro has dual inputs so you can have separate inputs for Shore Power and Generator. My SP/GEN is done with a manual rotary selector.

There is a good Epoch Marine Facebook group with lots of support.

I want you to know watching your videos was probably the main thing that gave me the confidence to go down this road to begin with. I appreciate the time you spent documenting your project and I learned a ton watching your efforts.

I have also read, and reread, your postings here regarding some of the trouble you and others experienced with the frequent alarms initially and how that was solved by lowering the bulk/float voltages.

Do you know if the cerbo were DVCC enabled if the battery would override those settings and increase the voltage based on the Epoch BMS demand or can those voltages be set by the programing of the multiplus initially? I like the idea of the BMS controlling via DVCC since that seems like it is approaching a "set and forget" setup that would require less fiddling on my end. I am not as proficient as you and feel like leaving too much monitoring and changing on the fly might be my downfall.

I am trying to keep the set up as simple as possible, and honestly I think I'm going to go without the touch monitor and use the app and my Simrad MFD to track. I'm not against installing the smart shunt, but in the videos referenced above (DVCC for Victron) when they were using DVCC they relied on the BMS to monitor. I am aware of the issues of the discrepancy between actual state of charge and that reported by the BMS, but I wonder if regular use of shore power to "top off" will allow the BMS to reset and retain sufficient accuracy. Maybe Epoch will roll out an update to address this in the near future?

I thought that once the Cerbo GX was wifi linked this allowed access to VRM control locally and settings could be manipulated without the MK3? Regrettably, I no longer own a PC so I think the MK3 won't work for my needs? I am planning to purchase the Multiplus through Explorist Life electrical (great videos also) and they are now offering to preprogram the inverter/charger to specific battery brands that have all been approved by Victron including Epoch. I have yet to see if they have adapted the charging voltages that you recommend as part of that programing.

Thanks for chiming in and I hope you don't mind the questions. I've found your contributions and others to be invaluable.

 

[Barking Sands]

I want you to know watching your videos was probably the main thing that gave me the confidence to go down this road to begin with. I appreciate the time you spent documenting your project and I learned a ton watching your efforts.

I have also read, and reread, your postings here regarding some of the trouble you and others experienced with the frequent alarms initially and how that was solved by lowering the bulk/float voltages.

Do you know if the cerbo were DVCC enabled if the battery would override those settings and increase the voltage based on the Epoch BMS demand or can those voltages be set by the programing of the multiplus initially? I like the idea of the BMS controlling via DVCC since that seems like it is approaching a "set and forget" setup that would require less fiddling on my end. I am not as proficient as you and feel like leaving too much monitoring and changing on the fly might be my downfall.

First let me say I am not an expert. I am simply about 1 year ahead of you...lol. So take everything I say with a grain of salt please.

Enabling DVCC and selecting the Epoch as "controlling BMS" will override anything programmed into the Multiplus. (On the control panel the Victron will say "Ext Control") .But it will import a CVL (charged voltage limit) of 14.6, which is too high. We then go to the DVCC page and set "Limit max charged voltage" manually to 13.8 or 13.9. That sets absorption voltage. The problem with this is that's where the voltage will remain. There is no float stage. This is how many older Victron comms worked like the early Pylontech and others. If you are using solar mostly this works fine since the system will only hold the voltage at 13.8 or 13.9 once the batteries get topped off and it rarely stays that way for long and 13.8 isnt too high of a voltage. Some manufacturers like SOK actually float their batteries at 13.8. IMO that's a bit high.

If you use the Victron side for control you will simply program the charger tab in the multiplus via MK3 or remote VE configure through VRM and input 13.9 absorbtion and 13.5 float as well as a few other things. its very very easy and should not be considered difficult at all. It may seem that way, but when you get to it, its really about 10 minutes. I can run you through them if needed when the time comes. For the cost I would get the MK3 and a usb c adapter so you can program through your phone or tablet. No need for laptop. I think it must be android though..not sure. But I do believe you can use remote VE configure as well.

I am trying to keep the set up as simple as possible, and honestly I think I'm going to go without the touch monitor and use the app and my Simrad MFD to track. I'm not against installing the smart shunt, but in the videos referenced above (DVCC for Victron) when they were using DVCC they relied on the BMS to monitor. I am aware of the issues of the discrepancy between actual state of charge and that reported by the BMS, but I wonder if regular use of shore power to "top off" will allow the BMS to reset and retain sufficient accuracy. Maybe Epoch will roll out an update to address this in the near future?

I had mine hooked up to my Garmin via ethenet. IIRC you can get the same screen that you would through the touch 50/70. If thats the case then no need for a screen. You can also get the "remote console" on VRM that is a copy of the touch 50.
I would again highly recommend the smart shunt at $100. It is a better SOC meter by a factor of 10. I can pretty much guarantee you will be caught off gaurd one day by solely using any drop in lifepo4 battery SOC gauge. You will think you have 52% SOC remaining and the next thing you know the battery will shut down. Accumulated SOC drift over time is prevalent for all drop in lifepo4 batteries with apps. Its worse when operating with solar only due to the reversal of current in and out on cloudy days and not getting to full full full to resync the SOC meter. But yes..if you are careful and learn to monitor voltage as well as your SOC% then you can certainly do without a Victron shunt. Many people solely look at the SOC% in an app. But after any length of time and cycles it begins to become inaccurate if not routinely making it to the shunt resync point. Its also nice to have 2 sources of SOC and other info to compare. Especially if you get into a troubleshooting situation.

I thought that once the Cerbo GX was wifi linked this allowed access to VRM control locally and settings could be manipulated without the MK3? Regrettably, I no longer own a PC so I think the MK3 won't work for my needs? I am planning to purchase the Multiplus through Explorist Life electrical (great videos also) and they are now offering to preprogram the inverter/charger to specific battery brands that have all been approved by Victron including Epoch. I have yet to see if they have adapted the charging voltages that you recommend as part of that programing.

Thanks for chiming in and I hope you don't mind the questions. I've found your contributions and others to be invaluable.

Once the Cerbo is linked via wifi you can go to the VRM and then go to your Multiplus and I just checked...go to device list and at the ottom it has "remote VE configure". Ibelieve you can do everything in there that you can do with the MK3. But I generally use the MK3 in real time when at the boat.

 

[jtdums]

First let me say I am not an expert. I am simply about 1 year ahead of you...lol. So take everything I say with a grain of salt please.

Enabling DVCC and selecting the Epoch as "controlling BMS" will override anything programmed into the Multiplus. (On the control panel the Victron will say "Ext Control") .But it will import a CVL (charged voltage limit) of 14.6, which is too high. We then go to the DVCC page and set "Limit max charged voltage" manually to 13.8 or 13.9. That sets absorption voltage. The problem with this is that's where the voltage will remain. There is no float stage. This is how many older Victron comms worked like the early Pylontech and others. If you are using solar mostly this works fine since the system will only hold the voltage at 13.8 or 13.9 once the batteries get topped off and it rarely stays that way for long and 13.8 isnt too high of a voltage. Some manufacturers like SOK actually float their batteries at 13.8. IMO that's a bit high.

If you use the Victron side for control you will simply program the charger tab in the multiplus via MK3 or remote VE configure through VRM and input 13.9 absorbtion and 13.5 float as well as a few other things. its very very easy and should not be considered difficult at all. It may seem that way, but when you get to it, its really about 10 minutes. I can run you through them if needed when the time comes. For the cost I would get the MK3 and a usb c adapter so you can program through your phone or tablet. No need for laptop. I think it must be android though..not sure. But I do believe you can use remote VE configure as well.


I had mine hooked up to my Garmin via ethenet. IIRC you can get the same screen that you would through the touch 50/70. If thats the case then no need for a screen. You can also get the "remote console" on VRM that is a copy of the touch 50.
I would again highly recommend the smart shunt at $100. It is a better SOC meter by a factor of 10. I can pretty much guarantee you will be caught off gaurd one day by solely using any drop in lifepo4 battery SOC gauge. You will think you have 52% SOC remaining and the next thing you know the battery will shut down. Accumulated SOC drift over time is prevalent for all drop in lifepo4 batteries with apps. Its worse when operating with solar only due to the reversal of current in and out on cloudy days and not getting to full full full to resync the SOC meter. But yes..if you are careful and learn to monitor voltage as well as your SOC% then you can certainly do without a Victron shunt. Many people solely look at the SOC% in an app. But after any length of time and cycles it begins to become inaccurate if not routinely making it to the shunt resync point. Its also nice to have 2 sources of SOC and other info to compare. Especially if you get into a troubleshooting situation.

Once the Cerbo is linked via wifi you can go to the VRM and then go to your Multiplus and I just checked...go to device list and at the ottom it has "remote VE configure". Ibelieve you can do everything in there that you can do with the MK3. But I generally use the MK3 in real time when at the boat.

Thank you for the thoughtful responses and the offer of programing help.

It seems like Epoch would want to resolve this via the BMS either through an update or allowing access to the BMS itself. I see that the Epoch app has access to the BMS on the app blocked by password.

Did you find the Epoch customer service responsive? Do you think its possible to get access and set the "better" absorption and float voltages directly on the BMS?

I will try to see if my Simrad MFD NSS Evo3 will allow the direct connection via Ethernet. It specifically mentions in the Cerbo manual that the newer model will, but there is a note that mine will work as well. I guess we will find out.

If I see some worthwhile deal on black Friday I'll be springing for the Multiplus and cerbo, but otherwise likely wait for the new year to spread out some of the holiday spending pain. I've followed your advise and I'm tracking some of the ancillary parts and wires to try and hit a deal. I'm shooting for having everything installed January/February so I can test it out before starting the loop in April.

 

[Barking Sands]

Thank you for the thoughtful responses and the offer of programing help.

It seems like Epoch would want to resolve this via the BMS either through an update or allowing access to the BMS itself. I see that the Epoch app has access to the BMS on the app blocked by password.

Epoch is working on Firmware and hardware updates. They have many things coming soon. New apps, updates, manuals, a line of 24 and 48 volt Marine batteries. A 12 volt 628ah battery is rumored.

Did you find the Epoch customer service responsive? Do you think its possible to get access and set the "better" absorption and float voltages directly on the BMS?

Customer service is good and improving. They just hired several people to handle the deluge of customer support and tech calls. Full disclosure, I have been working with them in a very limited capacity for around 6 months running the Epoch Marine and Epoch camper facebook forums as well as taking calls occasionally for customers who need a bit more help troubleshooting and potential warranty.
Whats behind the password is only items that you would not want to touch. Things like undervolt threshold, overcurrent values, temp settings etc.

I will try to see if my Simrad MFD NSS Evo3 will allow the direct connection via Ethernet. It specifically mentions in the Cerbo manual that the newer model will, but there is a note that mine will work as well. I guess we will find out.

If I see some worthwhile deal on black Friday I'll be springing for the Multiplus and cerbo, but otherwise likely wait for the new year to spread out some of the holiday spending pain. I've followed your advise and I'm tracking some of the ancillary parts and wires to try and hit a deal. I'm shooting for having everything installed January/February so I can test it out before starting the loop in April.

Sounds like a great plan. I still have to wait 1 or 2 more years..lol. when the time comes, let me know and I'll be happy to run you through programming of the multiplus and smart shunt.

 

[jtdums]

Epoch is working on Firmware and hardware updates. They have many things coming soon. New apps, updates, manuals, a line of 24 and 48 volt Marine batteries. A 12 volt 628ah battery is rumored.

Customer service is good and improving. They just hired several people to handle the deluge of customer support and tech calls. Full disclosure, I have been working with them in a very limited capacity for around 6 months running the Epoch Marine and Epoch camper facebook forums as well as taking calls occasionally for customers who need a bit more help troubleshooting and potential warranty.
Whats behind the password is only items that you would not want to touch. Things like undervolt threshold, overcurrent values, temp settings etc.

Sounds like a great plan. I still have to wait 1 or 2 more years..lol. when the time comes, let me know and I'll be happy to run you through programming of the multiplus and smart shunt.

Glad to hear you are helping them out. I've recently joined your marine Epoch group on Facebook so I'll continue to monitor it for any changes and releases by Epoch.

I was surprised to find such limited documentation with the "Marine" 460 and have turned to your experience to provide charging profiles since I don't see them with the battery or online via Epoch. I wonder if they are providing others correct guidance?

Thanks for the information about the password too. I'll let that one rest as clearly not pertinent to what I was hoping to achieve.

Have a great Turkey Day!

 

[jtdums]

Just to follow up so far in case this might come to the benefit of others.

Prior to the holidays I ordered and received my Multiplus, cerbo, victron shunt, lynx distribution, and DC to DC (All Victon).

I had some time to work on the set up over the holidays and have started by building out a new "power wall" that will be transferred into the boat. Components are mounted and wiring routes for that wall have been set. (Still will be measuring and adding additional wiring once the "wall" is attached and exact measurements can be made.

On the bench I was able to update and set up the charging requirements for the new Epoch 460 marine battery. This was done without the USB dongle by downloading and altering the setup files via Victron VRM portal and then uploading that file back to the multiplus. (I don't have access to a PC currently, so the use of the dongle was a complicating factor that I cut out, but in hindsight it took a lot of steps to accomplish and it still might be easier to find someone with a PC for some assistance.)

Orion DC to DC converter could be programed via the cerbo so that was simple.

In hindsight, I should have ordered the M10 version of the Lynx distributor as that would have made it easier to connect the battery shut off switch and and Lynx shunt directly to the Lynx. (I ended up redrilling the M8 holes to accomplish this.)

I've gotten some terrific guidance from the MTOA folks on the AC side of the wiring which will commence next week.

I'll come back to share once there is more progress.

 

[Jeff F]

2.2) The supplier of the multiplus offers a service to configure the multiplus specifically to Epoch batteries for a small fee which seems beneficial since I no longer own a PC to use the Victron software to configure on my own. I also know that the Epoch Marine battery was initially having issues triggering charge warnings until some smart folks figured out to reduce the bulk and float voltages. I'm not sure exactly what the supplier does to configure the multiplus, but before purchasing and configuring I would ask more questions. Am I "safe" having the multiplus configured before delivery and are there settings that I want to ensure are toggled one way or the other by supplier?

3) If the above answer allows me to skip the Cerbo and shunt, can I still add a Victron Orion XS 12/12-50 DC to DC Charger which is "smart" and bluetooth controllable without issue? I plan on using the 50amp charger from the old house bank (or a start battery) to charge the new Epoch while underway.

I have Victron Multiplus, shunt, and dc-dc charger on my LiFePo house bank with no Cerbo. It's not required to integrate or control the charger.

I wouldn't want to have a Multiplus with no way to access the settings or operating parameters. With no PC or Cerbo it's too much of a black box. So I keep an old laptop aboard just for that. If I didn't have the laptop I'm sure I would have added Cerbo just to get some insight into the operation of the inverter/charger.

My favorite piece of inexpensive kit is the shunt. Highly recommended, and can function as a standalone through Bluetooth.

Hope this helps.

 

[jtdums]

I have Victron Multiplus, shunt, and dc-dc charger on my LiFePo house bank with no Cerbo. It's not required to integrate or control the charger.

I wouldn't want to have a Multiplus with no way to access the settings or operating parameters. With no PC or Cerbo it's too much of a black box. So I keep an old laptop aboard just for that. If I didn't have the laptop I'm sure I would have added Cerbo just to get some insight into the operation of the inverter/charger.

My favorite piece of inexpensive kit is the shunt. Highly recommended, and can function as a standalone through Bluetooth.

Hope this helps.

Unfortunately no old laptops around, but my work around is fine and allows me access. I'm finding that I really like the functionality of the cerbo and plan on exploring its additional features, like tank monitoring and temperature sensors, once the rest of the install is complete. Plus, it will enable remote monitoring since for now I'm not at the boat full time.

 

[Barking Sands]

Guys. You dont need a laptop. Your cell phone or tablet will do. I have the MK3 with standard USB. But I bought a USB to USB-C adapter and it plugs right into your smartphone. You can download VictronConnect app and just program right from your phone very very quickly and convieniently. They also make a USB-C model. These only cost less than $60. Its a must have IMO. I would not rely on someone programming it prior to sending it because many times if you do an update it will reset settings. Its not hard to learn these and its worth its weight in gold to know the various settings. Here is a quick video on what that looks like.

 

[Jeff F]

Good stuff. When I installed mine there was no Android software available. Sorry for the misinformation

 

[Barking Sands]

Good stuff. When I installed mine there was no Android software available. Sorry for the misinformation

Oh no..I didnt see any misinfo. I only discovered this myself about 4 months ago. Just sharing.

 

[jtdums]

So I didn't end up having the distributor program the multiplus. Instead I used Victron VRM to overwrite the configuration with the details from Epoch's help from the Facebook group. (Thanks to Barking Sands for being a mod there and helping.)

In order to program the Multiplus you need to have access to the VEconfigure program available from Victron. Running it on a Mac is a bit of a pain, but you can make it run with some extra effort on OS. I watched some tutorials and it worked fine.

I actually had to do it twice, because the first time I did it I hadn't updated the multiplus and it lost the set up after updating. Second time was obviously much quicker.