forum intro - tvtfc

The friendliest place on the web for anyone who enjoys boating.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
Status
Not open for further replies.

tvtfc

Scraping Paint
Joined
Aug 17, 2023
Messages
36
Hi All.


This is a terse 'intro note' for people who wish to check before communications with me (if anyone.)


From Pacific NW mainly. Moved to SE Asia in 2018/19 to get ready for whatever 1/1/2020 was going to bring, and have been here since ever since.



Spent around 12 seasons drift gillnetting in Bristol Bay starting in the mid-80's. Eventually switched to software engineering which was safer and more lucrative (though, alas, much less physically demanding.) 'Retired' early.



I'm honestly not really 'into' boats all that much. While I enjoy boating (in moderation), and find the technology and engineering interesting, my primary goal with respect to boats is to be able to move myself and my family around the globe as freely as practicable, and with relative safely, in the years to come.


Best to all.
 
If I were looking to move around the globe with a family on a boat, I would look into cruise ships. Have heard many retired go nonstop where ever that boat goes. Room and board included.

But if you do get a boat, post pictures
 
If not really into boating, going to sea with family in smallish vessels is a REALLY BAD idea....unless you hire a professional crew.
 
If I were looking to move around the globe with a family on a boat, I would look into cruise ships. Have heard many retired go nonstop where ever that boat goes. Room and board included.

But if you do get a boat, post pictures


Having a cruise ship seems overkill for my needs I think :)


Oh, do you mean like as a passenger? I shudder at the thought for a variety of reasons. It's about the opposite of 'travel freely' (though with little doubt a fair bit more economical than having a boat, or set of boats, which would do the job.)



Thanks for the suggestion though.
 
If not really into boating, going to sea with family in smallish vessels is a REALLY BAD idea....unless you hire a professional crew.


Seems to me that going to sea with a family in 'smallish vessels' even with a professional crew is probably not very advisable either. Probably preferable to other options depending on the situation though.

Probably something around the size of the tenders we used in Bristol Bay would be the most workable. Or somewhat less perhaps. An ocean-going long-liner is what I am contemplating at the moment. At this point it is pretty up-in-the-air and I've got quite a bit of brainstorming, research, etc to do...which is why I am here. But yes, there are a number of reasons why hiring a crew makes sense. And a few down-sides as well of I choose a solution which necessitates that. Everything is a trade-off.

As far as being 'into' boats, it looks to me like being a little bit to into them can contribute to dangerous conditions in a lot of cases. My attitude about boats is that they are a tool for a particular job. Understanding the job and the tool will maximize the chances for success. I have no interest in pushing any limits just because I potentially can, or to carve a notch on my been-there stick, or whatever. Nor, for that matter, to blow money for no sensible reason.

Thanks for the comments.
 
On the topic of professional crew, prior to signing up on this forum I had been looking into DD's. Someone just released a set of vids about one they just got, and it had some interesting content here and there. One bit involved hiring a (purportedly) professional crew. Last part of this vid, and first part of the one following:

v=d-JgdyUCVD0 (*)

For my part, I would rather sail round cape horn with the boat owner in command than I would take a river run with the would-be hired captain based on what I see (and what I saw of the typhoon in question as it came around my way here where I live.) In short, I don't think that a 'professional crew' is exactly the be-all-end-all in safe passage-making in all cases. Best to have a backup option. Thankfully the would-be skipper abandoned the mission shore-side, and I'm guessing that the owner felt likewise.

---

At least two forums contained threads revolving around DD542-01, and the one here seemed to edge out the cruserforum (or whatever it is) in terms of worthwhile post percentage. At least that was my perception. So I signed up here first...to the dismay of some or maybe most :)

I would doubt that the OP of the DD thread in question is still around, and probably never wants to look at a boat again, but if he is it would be interesting to chat with him. I admired his style, and he probably knows a ton of stuff which I would like to figure out about boat work options in the area. Seems like it's probably his boat which is up for sale in Kota Kinabalu, and my family (and I) like the place well enough to look forward to another visit.

---

Lastly I would mention that just hours ago a boat similar to what appeals to me was presented on another channel which I have been getting info/ideas from:

v=O4UB2A0c-SE (*)

I'll have my eye on it as I continue my research.


(*) Anyone who cares enough to do so can paste this into a 'watch?' youtube link. The editor [software] on the forum steadfastly refuses to NOT expand the links and pull youtube pics.
 
Last edited:
Not everyone in any profession is good. Juding all pro's by the failures of a few examples isn't right. Not all professional captains have experience in all boating endeavors, so picking the right one is also necesessary.

There are professional vessel crews out there that have experience and training that if you are crossing oceans could save your life unless you have quite a few crossings yourself.

Especially if your family is not just as experienced or well trained as you.... often tragedies at sea are a result of one or more crew becoming incapacitated or overboard and who is left are not up to the task of handling things.

I am not saying a pro crew is necessary all the time, just in case you and the family need a bit of a hand at least to get in the swing of it all.
 
Last edited:
Not everyone in any profession is good. Juding all pro's by the failures of a few examples isn't right. Not all professional ...

I certainly did not do this. Not deliberately, and I don't think accidentally either. It would be absurd to do so.

It's almost certain that I would require paid help to handle various aspects operating a boat when used in the manners that I envision. As I so much as scratch the surface of contemplation of the factors/issues/etc involved in dealing with this element of my goal, the questions/considerations balloon.

Since focusing on paid crew issues is putting the cart before the horse at this stage, they'll be a back burner item but certainly not ignored. Since you've been around for a while, you might know of a thread where these issues have been discussed in a high value/volume ratio manner? Or links to other resources where the basic standard-ish protocols are featured?

---


Semi-unrelated, but...

Let me go just a bit more into why _I_ am feeling like investment in a boat is worth pursuing. For _me_. I've spent a lot of effort looking for a shore-side 'third option' (the first two being my native U.S. and my current one The Philippines) over the last few years. I've concluded that predicting future national and international governance influences and behaviors is too difficult. In a variety of possible future scenarios just being able to 'sit it out' until the future landscape starts to come into focus would be the most desirable option if such an option is available.

I'm hoping like hell that I would never need to actually utilize my investment for it's primary purpose and expect that I probable would not. However, taking a yearly leisurely voyage of significant range would be something which would be fun and rewarding for the whole family I believe. Much of the time visiting various shore-side areas.

I do believe that it would be possible to obtain and maintain a vessel (or set of vessels) which could fulfill both potential duties to sufficient degree. Of course I could find that I am wrong for a variety of reasons, or run out of interest and resources, or whatever. I don't actually need to be reminded of this by people who have extremely limited insight into my past endeavors, resources, successes/failures, preferences, etc. But it's usually kind of entertaining when it happens though.
 
I certainly did not do this. Not deliberately, and I don't think accidentally either. It would be absurd to do so.

It's almost certain that I would require paid help to handle various aspects operating a boat when used in the manners that I envision. As I so much as scratch the surface of contemplation of the factors/issues/etc involved in dealing with this element of my goal, the questions/considerations balloon.

Since focusing on paid crew issues is putting the cart before the horse at this stage, they'll be a back burner item but certainly not ignored. Since you've been around for a while, you might know of a thread where these issues have been discussed in a high value/volume ratio manner? Or links to other resources where the basic standard-ish protocols are featured?

---


Semi-unrelated, but...

Let me go just a bit more into why _I_ am feeling like investment in a boat is worth pursuing. For _me_. I've spent a lot of effort looking for a shore-side 'third option' (the first two being my native U.S. and my current one The Philippines) over the last few years. I've concluded that predicting future national and international governance influences and behaviors is too difficult. In a variety of possible future scenarios just being able to 'sit it out' until the future landscape starts to come into focus would be the most desirable option if such an option is available.

I'm hoping like hell that I would never need to actually utilize my investment for it's primary purpose and expect that I probable would not. However, taking a yearly leisurely voyage of significant range would be something which would be fun and rewarding for the whole family I believe. Much of the time visiting various shore-side areas.

I do believe that it would be possible to obtain and maintain a vessel (or set of vessels) which could fulfill both potential duties to sufficient degree. Of course I could find that I am wrong for a variety of reasons, or run out of interest and resources, or whatever. I don't actually need to be reminded of this by people who have extremely limited insight into my past endeavors, resources, successes/failures, preferences, etc. But it's usually kind of entertaining when it happens though.

Could you please expand a bit on your last paragraph or at least be a bit more specific? Referencing people who have very limited insight to you is EVERYONE on the internet unless you have old friends here.

All questions on the internet involve having to guess quite a bit about the poster unless it is a very specific question.
 
Could you please expand a bit on your last paragraph or at least be a bit more specific? Referencing people who have very limited insight to you is EVERYONE on the internet unless you have old friends here.

All questions on the internet involve having to guess quite a bit about the poster unless it is a very specific question.

Sure, I can speak to that although it is low on my list of very interesting things relative to the other stuff I mentioned in the post.

I agree with your observation about limited insight, and it applies to almost everyone in both directions. For that reason I try not to make too many assumptions, or at least when I do I try to keep them to myself for a while or seek further info.

The first guy suggests I buy tickets on a cruise ship...then later asks if _I_ am a troll. Not sure what he figured was going through my mind when I signed up on this forum.

In your case you see fit to assume I'm going to be using a 'smallish vessels'. I did learn a little something about boats and seas while commercial fishing in Alaska for 12 seasons. I didn't mention that one of those years I engineered on a tender, fixed the RSW system (which got me the job) and we missed zero days of service after I was hired. The vessel was a complete wreck but I managed to keep it in service for the remainder of the season, and to get it across the bay from Dillingham to Port Heiden. Maybe I'll post some war stories one of these days. Another year a ran an old Jumbo Bryant which I got from a friend after the season started in previously abandoned state and managed to get some gear in the water by the time the run started, although that year the sockeye run was unusually poor.

Aside from that, I spent my very early months and years flying around in bush planes (they still used surplus Catalinas back then) and floating around in vessels from row-boats on up. My first actual fishing was trolling for silvers off the SW Oregon coast on a 28' (I IIRC) Tolleycraft that my dad bought. I learned about the joys of the West coast bars in that vessel, and that included the Columbia bar. Thankfully only one time as we were simply moving the boat to Portland. He later sold it up in Anacortis.

What I mean by 'around the globe' was different points on the planet's surface. That can be done in different ways. It would have been an assumption to infer that I was talking about some sort of a expedition class crossing or whatever. That said, yes, I do wish to have a vessel which has an option to batten down the hatches as opposed to simply running like hell. It became clear to me pretty early that this meant, realistically, a relatively large full displacement type vessel.

To be fair, I did anticipate that stating up-front that I was 'not really all that into boats' probably would trigger some people. I didn't do it for 'trolling' exactly. I mentioned it more let people know that polishing my teak furnishings daily was not really my thing. Also to gauge the community here.
 
Keep in mind that almost everyone here is trying to be helpful and nice. So if someone says something that rubs you the wrong way I try to give them the benefit of the doubt. Typing something sometimes doesn’t come out the way it was intended or reading it sometimes not either. I step back and take a deep breath and try to interpret it the way it may have been intended.
 
Heck, the last post does provide a lot more useful info... the one thing that threw me up front was the comment on Bristol Bay boats.

I do have years of USCG aviation rescue service in Alaska and knew quite a few commercial fisherman.... while tough little boats, I would not recommend one for cruising.

Now knowing a bit more, I will answer any specific questions you care to toss out. :thumb:
 
To be fair, I did anticipate that stating up-front that I was 'not really all that into boats' probably would trigger some people. I didn't do it for 'trolling' exactly. I mentioned it more let people know that polishing my teak furnishings daily was not really my thing. Also to gauge the community here.

FWIW, posting something that you think will probably trigger people is the definition of trolling, whether you want to call it that or not.

As far as gauging the community, you will find that very close to 100% here are into boats, and very close to zero percent are polishing teak furnishings daily. You will find that there is lots of knowledge, experience and willingness to help here. You just have to ask actual questions and want to participate. Testing the crowd and challenging the responses might not get you the warm welcome that you deserve.

Welcome to TF.
 
Heck, the last post does provide a lot more useful info... the one thing that threw me up front was the comment on Bristol Bay boats.

What comment? I early on mentioned I had significant experience in the Bristol Bay drift-gillnet industry, and the boating elements of it (as opposed to, say, back office support.) This was specifically done to help people make more valid assumptions about my potential level of proficiency in planning and what-not.

I did not go on and on about my experience (initially) because I wanted to keep the content short, but more so because I find that the more people dwell on such things, the more they question their own competence. Often for good reasons. Often enough they are also simply full of sh...t.

I do have years of USCG aviation rescue service in Alaska and knew quite a few commercial fisherman.... while tough little boats, I would not recommend one for cruising.

You must be well aware that there are a ton of people in Alaska who are operating as decision-makers at a level far above their competency. Thus my interest in the standards and protocols of retaining paid crew in the broader marketplaces at the current time. It's also the case that some of the most competent and sensible people I've met in my life have been in command of vessels.

I don't think I said anything about particular boats, and I never put any thought into using one of the 32' (by regulation) fleet for cruising. But the industry in general involves boats of many sizes and purposes.

The USCG was not operational in Bristol Bay when I was fishing there. The cost/benefit and/or hassle factors didn't make it worthwhile I suppose. It was impractical to have most of the fleet follow most of the regulations, so the USCG would have been up against a pretty impossible set of tasks. Surprisingly to me there were relatively few fatal incidents. We (fishers and processors with helicopters) banded together in emergencies and most of the crews were saved when boats did go down. The state enforcement arm (ADFG) had a specific mission and avoided direct participation in operations outside their jurisdiction, but they would sometimes bend the rules a bit in life-and-death situations. I have no idea what has changed in the last quarter-century in this respect. But many/most fishers who operate there also participate in fisheries outside that zone and we probably do have some mutual acquaintances.

Now knowing a bit more, I will answer any specific questions you care to toss out. :thumb:

I have an entire thread seeking to identify information portals of use to active mariners. So far nobody has posted any. As I find them I may use the thread as something of a personal note-pad for the benefit of anyone else who my have a similar need and interest.

The one site I found with tabular data on ports and services was off-line (or geo-fenced or something.) I had to go to the wayback machine to verify that it did actually contain information of potential efficient use. I don't remember the URL of that information portal or have a sense as to it will be back on-line.

It's possible that high quality information is available, but only to paid subscribers. While I don't particularly like the trend toward locking up all information as intellectual property (especially scientific papers), I don't really mind paying for what I need information-wise when I am on a mission. I want to preview the goods though so I know what I'm buying, or get testimonials from a trusted source.
 
Try here...you do have to pay some for the overall site (used to be free) but a basic signup is free to see if it has the info you want.

https://www.noonsite.com/
 
....I did not go on and on about my experience (initially) because I wanted to keep the content short, but more so because I find that the more people dwell on such things, the more they question their own competence. Often for good reasons. Often enough they are also simply full of sh...t.......

Barely 5AM here on the west coast and already 'memorable quote of the day' (week? month?) has arrived! Surely the OP did not mean to suggest that being deck-meat on a fishing boat 40-years ago would be swoon-worthy experience, right? While TF tends to give people the benefit of the doubt on self-reported credentials, respect still must be earned through contributions.

Tangent and punditry aside, welcome to TF tvtfc. Frankly, despite dozens of paragraphs across a couple threads, I'm having a hard time determining if there is a question beyond source for global marine services information. Like Psneeld, Noonsite was the first that came to mind. You may also want to search for ActiveCaptain which is a crowd-sourced review site. Both sources have struggled to stay relevant as the Internet has advanced.

Best success in whatever path you chose.

Peter
 
FWIW, posting something that you think will probably trigger people is the definition of trolling, whether you want to call it that or not.

As far as gauging the community, you will find that very close to 100% here are into boats, and very close to zero percent are polishing teak furnishings daily. You will find that there is lots of knowledge, experience and willingness to help here. You just have to ask actual questions and want to participate. Testing the crowd and challenging the responses might not get you the warm welcome that you deserve.

Welcome to TF.

Thanks for the input and the suggestions. (Really.)

'Trolling' is in the eye of the beholder in my opinion, and I have experience with it going back to the usenet days. It used to be something of a hobby for me.

That said, to a lot of people, anything which is outside of their often quite narrow interpretation of orthodoxy is, ipso-facto, 'trolling'. I cannot do much about that, or at least I won't try to confine stated observations to the lowest-common-denominator of a group in questions.

(Referring to a comment on another thread, there really is such a thing as using reverse psychology in interesting family members in participation in activities, and it really can be effective. Especially for modern day females. My sister became a bush pilot after being triggered by a comment that maybe she should look into being a stewardess. Sharp eye'd viewers might notice that I stated that using some degree of reverse psychology to interest my family in active participation in my boating endeavors was a technique *I* planned to employ. I did not recommend it for anyone else. Troll, or Not a Troll? Funny observation, or dreadful behavior which threatens civilization? The answer is in the eye of the reader, and I'm guessing that different people took it differently. To me that's kind of what makes the world turn.)

I resolved to be on good behavior here since my main goal is to obtain information I can use and perhaps engage in conversations above and beyond simple entertainment value.
 
Thank you psneed and mvweebles for the site ideas.

Noonsite looks worthwhile enough to get a paid account which I am in the process of doing.

ActiveCaptain, um, needs more research related to the Garmin goings-on. I'm a pretty big open-source fan and have an inherent mis-trust of large corporate players (of the type who paid my salary for many years.) I'll probably evaluate the alternatives (e.g., OpenCPN) and also learn some more about the basic technologies, protocols, datasets, etc, and that's not in my time budget in the immediate future. Hopefully Noonsite will get me the info I need in the here & now.

I'll put both of these on the data links thread when I understand them better.

I had target fixation on 'plain old websites' when I solicited ideas on this subject and wasn't thinking of more near-real-time apps-flavored solutions. So, again, thanks for the ideas.
 
OpenCPN is a navigation program. Free/Open Source. Some love it. Some don't. Competing products are Coastal Explorer and Time Zero which both carry a fee of a few hundred bucks (USD) plus charts. Coastal Explorer - my preference - links to Active Captain. Direct connection to AC via a Garmin site is clunky at best.

Noonsite is a start, not a finish of information, For me, the best information comes from localized sources. My current interest is west coast of Mexico to Panama. There is a small forum with active cruisers who give local information (or a source for local information). It's a follow-your-nose endeavor. I'm sure there are other groups for every pocket of the world.

I still have little idea what you're trying to accomplish. Exploring the globe with your family is meaningless. You're a self-admitted troll which strikes yellow/red flags with me (and likely others). You have a remarkable level of arrogance and disrespect, but still, for some reason, I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt. But if you want a fruitful discussion on this form or others, you may want to end more sentances with question marks.

Good luck -

Peter
 
Thanks for the input and the suggestions. (Really.)

'Trolling' is in the eye of the beholder in my opinion, and I have experience with it going back to the usenet days. It used to be something of a hobby for me.

I resolved to be on good behavior here since my main goal is to obtain information I can use and perhaps engage in conversations above and beyond simple entertainment value.

I respectfully suggest you hold that thought, tvtfc, as looking through this thread, I'm afraid you do/have tended to come across as a somewhat 'holier than thou', 'Father Superior', which is bound to ruffle feathers, as a few others have pointed out. :confused:

As an aside, I am intrigued as to why you prefer using _ or even * as opposed to simple inverted commas, as in ' to emphasise a point..? Welcome to TF... :flowers:
Cheers,
 
I respectfully suggest you hold that thought, tvtfc, as looking through this thread, I'm afraid you do/have tended to come across as a somewhat 'holier than thou', 'Father Superior', which is bound to ruffle feathers, as a few others have pointed out. :confused:

You seem pretty earnest about that which I can respect.

Was it when I stared out implying that a one-post newbie should forget about boating and get a ticket on a cruise ship? Or when I shouted at a guy that it was a BAD IDEA to do something he had no intention of doing? Or maybe when I called the guy a Huck Fin adventurer who had no chance and would probably go away?

After a few days of frat-boy style hazing from the upper-by-post-count-classmen I did manage to get a a decent answer to the one seemingly pretty basic question that I did actually ask. The rest of the time was spent dealing with answers to questions I didn't ask about problems I don't have. Not very efficient, but kind of amusing in a way. I hope that at least a few other's got a kick out of it.

If/when I have another question, I'll lay the foundation for getting a meaningful response first. Or try to.

All that said, I do have an arrogant prick hat that fits well and is fun to wear. Wearing in for the purposes of determining whether someone can take it as well as they dish it out is about the best I can do in terms of 'good behavior'. That's just me. If the mods want to kick me off the board, that would be fine and I would certainly understand.

As an aside, I am intrigued as to why you prefer using _ or even * as opposed to simple inverted commas, as in ' to emphasise a point..? Welcome to TF... :flowers:
Cheers,

Just habit I guess. In thinking about it just now, I tend to use '' either for almost direct quotes that I am not sure are byte-for-byte perfect and thus deserving of "", or for sarcastic quasi-quotes ascribed to an adversary/sparing-partner.

Thanks for the comments, and best wishes in your endeavors.
 
You seem pretty earnest about that which I can respect.

Was it when I stared out implying that a one-post newbie should forget about boating and get a ticket on a cruise ship? Or when I shouted at a guy that it was a BAD IDEA to do something he had no intention of doing? Or maybe when I called the guy a Huck Fin adventurer who had no chance and would probably go away?
I'll leave that for a man of such obvious superior intellect to work that out... :)
 
Unnecessary Word Salad

Sorry! This posters word salad is almost incoherent and makes my head hurt....zero value, other than to intentionally crank up this membership, IMHO (In my humble opinion)....he might run his ideas by Davy Jones, if he is really not interested in prudent maritime guidance and advice that this organization provides. Out.
 
tvtfc

Twisted, my head was beginning to hurt, early, so missed that inference. Mr. tvtfc sounds like an AI bot and I can hardly spell AI....but if real, is headed for a rude "come to Jesus moment"
I will re-read this post because not only is it contrary to the TF mission it really just plain amusing.
 
You know I had that same thought -- that the posts were coming from an AI bot, but one directed to be confrontational and aggressive on a boating forum, just to test the potential of being disruptive. On the other hand the posts use so much non-standard formatting and syntax I think it would be hard for AI to generate that style. The AI conversations or responses I've seen have been much smoother -- less fragmented or disjointed in other words. (Sometimes completely wrong or obviously canned or nonsensical or non-responsive, but at least the syntax was smooth and grammatical.)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom