Awful first attempt to buy a boat - lessons learned

[Jklotz]

Was dealing with a boat manufacturer. They don't work with buyers brokers, only direct. There was a 1year old boat in FL that they were selling for a customer with unfortunate circumstances. I expressed my interest but wanted to see pictures. It took over a month to get them. Once I got them, I emailed and said we want to come see the boat and make an offer if we liked it, which I'm pretty sure we would have. We had all our ducks in a row, finances, insurances, etc. So we set up a date, owner was cc'd and we booked our tickets, rental car and hotel. They sent the address and owners contact info. We had to juggle a couple things to make it work, so we weren't able to fly out for a few weeks. A week before the trip, guy emails me and tells me sorry, boats been sold. I thought we had this thing all arranged, so I didn't spring for the trip insurance. So now, we're out $1500 for flights and hotel. The add insult to injury, he wasn't in the least bit apologetic. He told me, since I didn't submit an offer yet, it was my fault! How am I supposed to make an offer on a close to million dollar boat I've never even set foot on? He could have at least mentioned there were other interested parties and he couldn't guarantee availability, preferably before we booked the trip.

I'm really upset about this, couldn't sleep last night. I also learned a big, expensive lesson.

 

[C lectric]

I sympathize but unfortunately the name of the game is whomever comes up first with the money gets the item. It sounds like you did not guarantee the purchase or even make a deposit so the sale was still up in the air.

Without an agreement of some kind between the owner and a prospective purchaser the sale is still up in the air.

If he had held for you and neither you nor the now purchaser did not like it in person he would have been out both purchases.

I do think the seller should have called you though to warn you specifically about the new prospective interested party although that could have been interpreted as simply pressuring. And maybe he could have been politer.

 

[Bacchus]

Unfortunately I tend to agree. Before booking a trip I arranged a buyers broker to submit an offer for me with all the usual contingencies. I had the ability to back out or offer less after inspection but it held the boat for my inspection.
You have to consider the sellers position... do they hold / turn down a real offer for a maybe that hasn't even seen the boat or offered a deposit to hold it?

 

[Jklotz]

I sympathize but unfortunately the name of the game is whomever comes up first with the money gets the item. It sounds like you did not guarantee the purchase or even make a deposit so the sale was still up in the air.

Without an agreement of some kind between the owner and a prospective purchaser the sale is still up in the air.

If he had held for you and neither you nor the now purchaser did not like it in person he would have been out both purchases.

I do think the seller should have called you though to warn you specifically about the new prospective interested party although that could have been interpreted as simply pressuring. And maybe he could have been politer.

Yea, I get it, now anyway. Not having trip insurance, that's on me. Just figured I was dealing with the president of the company, didn't think I'd need it. I'm still left with the thought though - I know he had the right to do it. Just wondering if it was the right thing to do. And I also believe I deserved, at the very least, a call or email explaining the situation before we jumped through all those hoops and booked the trip with him. In my mind, it was legal but dishonest.

 

[Jklotz]

Unfortunately I tend to agree. Before booking a trip I arranged a buyers broker to submit an offer for me with all the usual contingencies. I had the ability to back out or offer less after inspection but it held the boat for my inspection.
You have to consider the sellers position... do they hold / turn down a real offer for a maybe that hasn't even seen the boat or offered a deposit to hold it?

Of course you are right. As I mentioned, he/they don't deal with brokers, so I wasn't represented. I wasn't aware of any of this. I sure am now! As previously mentioned, he could have shared that with one sentence in an email and choose not to.

 

[Delta Riverat]

Bummer dude. Yeah, no offer, no contract, no deal. First come first served. Money talks, plans walk.

I don't know if the president knew about the other party when he was speaking with you. I agree he should have let you know at the soonest time. But maybe he did. He couldn't know if the other guy was serious or not. Perhaps he called you the day the deal was done.

 

[Comodave]

Sorry but I agree with all the others. You should have made an offer with contingencie and then booked the trip. The offer can always be renegotiated or withdrawn but without a signed offer you don’t have anything legitimate to complain about.

 

[sean9c]

Until you've submitted and offer and they've accepted you're just a looker.

 

[Jklotz]

Sorry but I agree with all the others. You should have made an offer with contingencie and then booked the trip. The offer can always be renegotiated or withdrawn but without a signed offer you don’t have anything legitimate to complain about.

Fair enough. I can only say that we had extensive conversations over the past year. He knew I was a novice at this and was a serious potential buyer. Had I been in his shoes, I'd have mentioned the offer part. But that's just me. I get a lot of folks aren't like that. Had he mentioned it, I'd had either put in an offer or not booked the trip.

 

[Jklotz]

Perhaps he called you the day the deal was done.

As I understand it, he did email the day the deal was done.

 

[Delta Riverat]

That says a lot. Extensive conversations with a novice for a year.

 

[Jklotz]

That says a lot. Extensive conversations with a novice for a year.

I'm not sure what you mean. Could you please explain?

 

[KnotYet]

Helmsman, right?
I just read your other thread.

 

[Jklotz]

Helmsman, right?
I just read your other thread.

Guess that cat's out of the bag now. I wasn't going to mention any names. I'm not trying to call anybody out. Just trying to figure out how all this works. Judging by the comments, this is the norm in the industry. As best I can tell, this one's on me. Rookie mistake. It's not how I'd do it, but I don't get to make the rules. I'm mad about this, but I have no intentions of causing any harm to anybody else.

At the end of the day, I'm still trying to learn.

 

[KnotYet]

You are right to be pissed.
Happily, there really are a lot of boats in your price range out there, so keep at it.

 

[Jklotz]

You are right to be pissed.
Happily, there really are a lot of boats in your price range out there, so keep at it.

Thank you. I really appreciate that.

 

[Delta Riverat]

I'm not sure what you mean. Could you please explain?

Not trying to add any insult here.

Just looking at the fact that you have been talking to the boss (the president) about boats for a whole year and haven't bought anything.

How many hours was that? Yeah, I know you are serious but does he know? How many drinks did you have together?

How do you think he feels about talking to you for a whole year for nothing? Yeah we know how you feel.

 

[BruceK]

A courtesy warning: "We are talking seriously with someone else", to an interested party who has been in contact and booked their trip to inspect sounds the decent thing to do.
Only reservation, is it in the seller`s interests, which the broker is obliged to hold paramount?
Bear in mind neither we (? nor the OP) know how quickly or assertively the ultimate purchaser presented.
Best chalk it up to experience. You were treading cautiously on a first, and major, purchase. Others may be more experienced, confident, and quicker. Perhaps they were told someone distant discussing the boat for a year booked a trip to come and inspect.

 

[Jklotz]

Not trying to add any insult here.

Just looking at the fact that you have been talking to the boss (the president) about boats for a whole year and haven't bought anything.

How many hours was that? Yeah, I know you are serious but does he know? How many drinks did you have together?

How do you think he feels about talking to you for a whole year for nothing? Yeah we know how you feel.

There hasn't been anything to buy!!! I have been trying to see this boat for a year. I drove 4 hours to Chattanooga to see a 38, via a very kind offer from an owner. Nice guy BTW. We liked it but felt it was a bit too small so we wanted to see a 43. I spoke to the owner, who said many were delivered to Charleston, offered to drive 5 hours to Charleston to see one. He was supposed to get back to me and never did, despite repeated follow ups. I flew to Baltimore for trawlerfest specifically to see one at the show. It didn't arrive, despite being promised. This time, I booked a trip to Fl to see one and buy it. This is THE boat we had decided on. For you to say I'm wasting peoples time is offensive to me. You have no idea what you are talking about. I've spent a considerable amount of time, effort and money trying to see. and most likely buy.

 

[Delta Riverat]

Yeah, I know. The OP got a rough deal. I'm sure the idea of loosing something that was really good hurt more than the fifteen hundred bucks. Hell, that's only 3 months slip rent.

My wife and I put an offer on a house that got rejected because it was a divorce deal and one party was pissed. The broker told us to keep cool, go home and I'll call you and when I do get in the car and drive. Don't wait for the weekend, just get in the car when I call. Yeah, hot market. But we did and we got the house.

I'm sorry if I caused any hurt, not my intent. I hope Jk gets a boat he likes -

 

[Delta Riverat]

There hasn't been anything to buy!!! I have been trying to see this boat for a year. I drove 4 hours to Chattanooga to see a 38, via a very kind offer from an owner. Nice guy BTW. We liked it but felt it was a bit too small so we wanted to see a 43. I offered to drive 5 hours to Charleston where he said one might be delivered. He was supposed to get back to me and never did, despite repeated follow ups. I flew to Baltimore for trawlerfest to see one at the show. It didn't arrive, despite being promised. This time, I booked a trip to Fl to see one and buy it. For you to say I'm wasting peoples time is offensive to me. You have no idea what you are talking about. I've spent a considerable amount of time, effort and money trying to buy this damn boat.

Man, I'm sorry for all I said, I sure didn't know about all that stuff. I thought you were talking on the phone for a year.

Yeah seriously, that guy is a flake.

 

[Portage_Bay]

OP, I'm writing as someone who has had to learn a few hard lessons in boat purchasing. As most have said before me, make an offer to lock it down. Until you do all you are is a lookie lou. Do make sure the offer allows you to back out or renegotiate for any reason. Do make sure that any money down is held by a responsible party. If a broker is involved you might be able to trust them, might be able to. I prefer to use marine documentation and escrow professionals. Once you've made an offer the clock starts ticking. Depending upon the contract it could be as short as 3 weeks. In that time you'll need to find a hull and condition surveyor, a mechanical surveyor, a haul out and a sea trial which may require a hired captain. Trying to do this long distance magnifies the problems. Saying you're too wrapped up in other issues to arrange flights to take care of these matters won't work.

I've learned the hard way I won't buy a boat that is further away than a half day's travel by car. Far too many things to go wrong and it's money out of my pocket.

 

[Jklotz]

Man, I'm sorry for all I said, I sure didn't know about all that stuff. I thought you were talking on the phone for a year.

Yeah seriously, that guy is a flake.

Thank you. I appreciate you saying that. It's been a hell of a ride.

 

[Jklotz]

OP, I'm writing as someone who has had to learn a few hard lessons in boat purchasing. As most have said before me, make an offer to lock it down. Until you do all you are is a lookie lou. Do make sure the offer allows you to back out or renegotiate for any reason. Do make sure that any money down is held by a responsible party. If a broker is involved you might be able to trust them, might be able to. I prefer to use marine documentation and escrow professionals. Once you've made an offer the clock starts ticking. Depending upon the contract it could be as short as 3 weeks. In that time you'll need to find a hull and condition surveyor, a mechanical surveyor, a haul out and a sea trial which may require a hired captain. Trying to do this long distance magnifies the problems. Saying you're too wrapped up in other issues to arrange flights to take care of these matters won't work.

I've learned the hard way I won't buy a boat that is further away than a half day's travel by car. Far too many things to go wrong and it's money out of my pocket.

Thanks. Seems we've both had to learn the hard way. I appreciate you sharing that. It's really helpful

 

[Jklotz]

I guess one of the lessons I've learned, that may help somebody else, so I guess I'll share it, is that we were so focused on THAT boat that we wasted a lot of time and energy focusing on it and not seriously considering some others while we searched. We thought that was going to be our boat. We had honestly thought we'd be out cruising this spring and summer. Now we're back to square one. I'm heartbroken at the moment.

 

[Delta Riverat]

Yeah, good place to start. Go see some boats that are local. Talk to a few brokers. Talk to them before you drive out and make an appointment.

All the best and have fun!

 

[Mac2]

What a bummer! You were talking to the boat manufacturer for a year. You made an appointment to see the boat and the owner was cc’d. Sure, the manufacturer could sell the boat, but it doesn’t make it right. The fact he didn’t call you, raises it to the level of disgusting. Very “used car salesman” type of move. I had money down on a Cape Horn trawler. Sale paper in hand. Then the divorcing husband found out his wife was selling his boat without his knowledge. Deal fell through. It’s been several years since-I have a better boat, but Im still pissed!

 

[slowgoesit]

You don't say if you are still working, or are retired. I am leaning toward you, or your wife still working from your posts. If you are SERIOUS about purchasing a boat, you almost need to look at it as your JOB.

It might be a good idea to do some research on Purchase and Sales Agreements (P & S). Have one downloaded, and ready to fill in the blanks.

Have a Marine Documentation outfit in mind to handle the escrow. I've got one we were happy with who I'd be happy to share if you're interested. Have it all nailed down.

Even better, sit down with a broker, best if a Buyer's Broker, ask if he/she can spend a couple of hours going over the purchase process, explaining the contract etc.
Best if done in person, and offer to pay him/her for their time.

If you become aware of a boat that meets your requirements, in your price range, jump on it! Subordinate other things in your life to getting the deal done NOW.

I know, easier said than done, but anything less will pretty much ensure that the GOOD boats, in your price range will be gone before you get around to the purchase.

 

[Jklotz]

You don't say if you are still working, or are retired. I am leaning toward you, or your wife still working from your posts. If you are SERIOUS about purchasing a boat, you almost need to look at it as your JOB.

It might be a good idea to do some research on Purchase and Sales Agreements (P & S). Have one downloaded, and ready to fill in the blanks.

Have a Marine Documentation outfit in mind to handle the escrow. I've got one we were happy with who I'd be happy to share if you're interested. Have it all nailed down.

Even better, sit down with a broker, best if a Buyer's Broker, ask if he/she can spend a couple of hours going over the purchase process, explaining the contract etc.
Best if done in person, and offer to pay him/her for their time.

If you become aware of a boat that meets your requirements, in your price range, jump on it! Subordinate other things in your life to getting the deal done NOW.

I know, easier said than done, but anything less will pretty much ensure that the GOOD boats, in your price range will be gone before you get around to the purchase.

Good advice. Thank you.

 

[Jklotz]

What a bummer! You were talking to the boat manufacturer for a year. You made an appointment to see the boat and the owner was cc’d. Sure, the manufacturer could sell the boat, but it doesn’t make it right. The fact he didn’t call you, raises it to the level of disgusting. Very “used car salesman” type of move. I had money down on a Cape Horn trawler. Sale paper in hand. Then the divorcing husband found out his wife was selling his boat without his knowledge. Deal fell through. It’s been several years since-I have a better boat, but Im still pissed!

I agree. Especially the part where, after all this went down and I expressed my anger in no uncertain terms and the guy gaslights me, he has the nerve to email back asking if I'm still interested if the deal falls through. Obviously I declined.