Anchoring Anxiety

[SteveK]

@Frosty I just said that is why I do not power set. No need to debate, it works for me and your way works for you. My way would not have set on that grass ball you found and I would know in the daytime to adjust.
I know when I am set because I also make note of my surroundings. Plus I put up a geo fence and can look at the screen.

 

[BruceK]

"Power Set" is more than "setting". It`s "testing" too.
Does it hold under test load? If so, it`s set. Whether it holds in all conditions is moot, but it`s set, I like knowing that.
Can`t see the harm in power setting but we all have our preferred methods,which may differ.

 

[Frosty]

"Power Set" is more than "setting". It`s "testing" too.
Does it hold under test load?

Agree. I mean, what if I pull up to my spot, let my anchor go, and at that time the wind is only 7 knots. I mean sure, it may be holding just fine at 7 knots, but I'd like to "test" it with the equivalent of quite a bit more than that. Which I do by reversing under engine power (which I called power setting, but which as you say is really also testing).

If there is enough wind or current to swing me around 180º, then I will consider the anchor "tested" to that amount of force. If I want more (depends on what velocity that natural re-set occured at), then I will re-power-set/test in the new direction. That's what I did this afternoon which showed me that it hadn't really re-set naturally due to a massive weed ball making it round and not anchor-shaped anymore. I cleared that, re-let-go the anchor, and re-power set (tested). It held.

 

[Delta Riverat]

What you described is exactly why I have a new anchor. Dropped the first time and drifted, lifted and saw a big ball of weeds. Hacked off, moved the boat to a new location, dropped again and went up and reversed engines and watched the boat straighten up and drifted again.

Lifted and found an even bigger ball of weeds. All "power setting" did was harvest more weeds -

 

[Frosty]

Definitely a larger anchor would help, as there would be more space to let weeds not get stuck. My current anchor has a hoop, and it's small enough that the "hoop hole" is not very large. Weeds are still the same size though!

In this case it did set fine the initial drop (both times); but just wouldn't re-set because I guess in the act of turning 180º (after a day's time) it was a giant weed-mud ball.

I do have a larger (and hoopless) anchor on the boat shed shelf, which I'll get set up on the roller this winter.

I will say this place is just CRAZY weedy. I wouldn't normally anchor in quite this weedy of a spot, but in this case, I did (a beautiful, mostly calm marsh at a time when it's cold enough not to have any bugs and there are no other boats).

 

[BruceK]

We once tried to anchor near Sydney Opera House to watch the NYE fireworks. The underwater surface offered the traction of polished marble, we were not the only boat with issues. After several attempts we went elsewhere, no amount of backing down would have secured the Sarca.

 

[O C Diver]

You are saying that if you set with reverse power, then you won't know if the anchor will reset by itself if you swing 180º

But you think if you don't set with power, then you know the anchor will reset if you swing 180º. I don't see how one guarantees the other? And now you also don't know how the anchor will respond to a good tug even in the initial direction (as in, if the winds come up stronger later) because you have only drifted down on it in the first place.

In any case, I don't think that would have worked even initially in this particular spot. Because I don't think there is any way the anchor would have penetrated the weeds in the first place without me applying reverse engine power. They were just too thick. Once I powered back, the anchor cut in and stuck.

Of course once I reversed, there were the weeds again (btw, this is not an anchorage where I would leave the boat unattended).

Had I just drifted back (without applying power) when I first got here, as you do, I guess I would have assumed it had set. (I mean, I wouldn't have; but you would have.)

We definitely have very different anchoring styles. But whatever lets you sleep.

Nothing wrong with power setting until it hangs on a rock lip, the wind changes 20 degrees or the tide reverses, and it slides off.

There is nothing more comforting than a false sense of security.

Ted

 

[jtdums]

Really good anchor monitoring software, like that found on Aquamaps, has greatly relieved my anchoring stress as well.

Before we started our Loop, I replaced anchor and rode with slightly oversized and "modern" anchor design that "should" be more than sufficient to hold us, but being able to roll over and see exactly where I am, and where I have been all night with "bread crumbs", allows me to quickly go back to sleep with confidence. The alarm function is adequate to wake me and easily set right when we drop.

The position history (bread crumbs) really alleviates my stress because by the time I go to bed, I already have a visual swing radius history to be able to compare when the wind kicks up in the dark.

No affiliation with Aquamaps, but would happily pay more for the peace of mind it gives me.

 

[rslifkin]

A power set isn't a perfect test, but it's at least some test. Plenty of times, especially in deeper water, there's just not enough wind for the first few hours after arrival to have any idea if the anchor has set without a power test.

A couple of times I've had the power set fail, telling me right away that the anchor wasn't capable of setting where I'd put it. Once it seemed good up to a point, but as the rode stretched tight, we started moving. And the chain started to jiggle / jump around a bit. Ended up figuring out that we had found an area of cobblestone, so the anchor was just bouncing along it once enough force was applied. Another time when I pulled it up I found some scraps of plastic and such on the tip of the anchor indicating that I had dropped it on some debris on the bottom. Moved 100 feet, tried again, and it set just fine.

OC Diver's point about a rock lip is a good one. There are some bottoms where nothing will guarantee you a good set, or a chance of a reset. You can sometimes tell what's going on down there by how the chain behaves as the anchor sets, but not always. In my opinion, rocky bottoms are best avoided unless there's no choice, as they're one of the riskiest bottoms in terms of dragging if the wind shifts, etc.

 

[Gdavid]

I believe your anxiety will recede with continued successful anchoring and time. Anxiety is a challenge but also a natural instinct to proceed with caution and purpose.

If I recall your introduction correctly (relying on my recollection is risky), you jumped into cruising on your current boat, which is beautiful as well as significant in value, so you are learning with high stakes and deserve credit for gaining experience so rapidly. So cut yourself some slack.

In practical terms, control all you can by using adequate gear and avoid when leaving the boat unattended when you know the current and/or wind direction is expected to reverse. Use of anchoring alarms and remote monitoring, when applicable helps too. Eventually, you will get to the point where you wake up from dead asleep anytime that boat becomes side to the wind or current, it is an odd sensation that alarms experienced cruisers.

 

[Jklotz]

Really good anchor monitoring software, like that found on Aquamaps, has greatly relieved my anchoring stress as well.

Before we started our Loop, I replaced anchor and rode with slightly oversized and "modern" anchor design that "should" be more than sufficient to hold us, but being able to roll over and see exactly where I am, and where I have been all night with "bread crumbs", allows me to quickly go back to sleep with confidence. The alarm function is adequate to wake me and easily set right when we drop.

The position history (bread crumbs) really alleviates my stress because by the time I go to bed, I already have a visual swing radius history to be able to compare when the wind kicks up in the dark.

No affiliation with Aquamaps, but would happily pay more for the peace of mind it gives me.

I use our vesper cortex as an anchor alarm, then use aquamaps as a backup. I sleep with the ipad right next to my bed, on a charger.

 

[Frosty]

I use our vesper cortex as an anchor alarm, then use aquamaps as a backup. I sleep with the ipad right next to my bed, on a charger.

Then I'd say that -- as @Gdavid expressed so well just above your last post -- that some "easy" experience would be a great idea. Choose non-risky anchorages, good forecasts, and don't plan to leave the boat (or at least not out of sight). Then work your way up.

After some experience, then I guess only you can decide if it gets non-stressful enough to make it enjoyable overall. Some people never really get into anchoring ... and that's okay. Everyone doesn't want the same boat, either.

I love it so much that it's worth the occasional stressful night (just had one last month.... but got through). Maybe you will too. Or maybe you won't.

BTW, even now, I never leave the boat right away after anchoring. I like to let things settle in a bit and see how it goes. Sometimes if I'm not sure I will let the anchor settle a bit before I powerset (that habit may be left over from lesser anchor types, and manual windlasses where you would really like it to set the first time, so may no longer be necessary).

Also, never be afraid to move and re-anchor if you just don't like the feel of it. I'm sure you must have a powered windlass so that takes a lot of the work out of it. Similarly, take your time choosing your spot. I like to circle around the place a bit getting a feel for the depths etc.

 

[Don L]

I doubt the number of people here saying they use poor technique in anchoring and writing stories of "luck" help the OP much. The interesting thing to me in this thread compared to the many many many anchoring threads I have read over the years in 3 different boating forums is the excuses/reasoning some apply to why they use poor technique.

pick your spot
drop the hook
let out your rode without letting it get tight till you have at least 3:1 while moving slow so it doesn't just fall in a ball
let the rode straighten and the boat turn to the direction it will end up
let out more till you get scope you plan on
SET the anchor under power, unless it blowing snort or there is a lot of current

Not saying I am an expert, but was a full time cruiser 7.5 years and have anchored from Maine to the Florida Keys to the Gulf of Mexico to MS and throughout the Bahamas and only dragged ONCE. It isn't rocket science or voodoo.

 

[Dockmaster]

I have the same anxiety when on the hook. This is why I will go out of my way for a mooring, dock or marina. When on the hook, I sleep on the sofa in the salon. I can at least look out the windows every 1-2 hours to see we are in the general location we are supposed to be. In the master stateroom I can't see anything out the port lights. I end up getting out of bed and coming up to the salon to verify all is OK. I haven't found an electronic device yet that reduces my anxiety enough to give me a good night's sleep. And we have never had an issue while on the hook.

 

[rslifkin]

This is why I will go out of my way for a mooring, dock or marina

It's interesting to me that a mooring gives more comfort. I'm perfectly happy at a dock, but I'm generally more comfortable anchored than on a mooring. With a mooring I worry about what's actually down there, what condition it's in, chafe issues with the pendant lines (both at the mooring end and potential chafe against the bow pulpit or anchor as we swing), etc. At anchor I know exactly what's down there, so I'm more comfortable with it.

 

[O C Diver]

It's interesting to me that a mooring gives more comfort. I'm perfectly happy at a dock, but I'm generally more comfortable anchored than on a mooring. With a mooring I worry about what's actually down there, what condition it's in, chafe issues with the pendant lines (both at the mooring end and potential chafe against the bow pulpit or anchor as we swing), etc. At anchor I know exactly what's down there, so I'm more comfortable with it.

I saw it the other way.

I'll take a municipal mooring over a dock any day. The number of storms that collapsed docks with boats attached in the last 10 years is amazing. Then there are the docks that floated off their pilings from storm surge. Add to that the boats tied to the dock that are damaged by other boaters. And then there are the boats that break loose in the storms and go down the fairway like a pinball machine.

Give me a protected bay on my own ground tackle first.

A commercial municipal mooring second.

Surrounded by no boating accidents waiting to happen, last.

Ted

 

[SteveK]

I use our vesper cortex as an anchor alarm, then use aquamaps as a backup. I sleep with the ipad right next to my bed, on a charger.

There you go, the bolded can be your next thread to discuss.

 

[Don L]

I have used the AquaMap anchor alarm. According to it one night at the anchorage in Nassau my boat went ashore to the marina, then traveled up and down till it wiped out all the docks, then came back to same spot it was anchored and reset. All so quiet we never woke up or it must have turned off the alarm. Then some other day when in Exuma the boat went to Miami for a drink, didn't like it so left and went all the way to the DR and then came back, still not sounding the alarm.

Both times there was no damage to the boat. My conclusion is that anchor alarms offer the BEST boat protection of all time!

 

[BroadCove]

I don't know whether my "insight" will reduce your anxiety, but my experience is that one becomes intimately familiar with the sounds of one's boat. Barring having to anchor in a difficult location or with weather, I always slept fairly well.

But most of us are a certain age where sleep is not as deep as it once was, and it is interrupted for...relief. I found I would naturally wake up when conditions were changing, whether it was an increase or diminution in wind, motion, or tide. So I would just get up, take a peek, and thus comforted fall back to sleep. Sleeping in a bow stateroom helped in this regard, because if the chain moved significantly, I would hear it.

As noted by a few, the only time I was really concerned was anchoring over rock, with the worst time being in the Everglades after a recent hurricane had washed out the sand/mud, leaving mainly the cracked limestone (?) bottom. I was lucky that my first set held through tide reversal, but I was awoken by the loud racket of chain moving rapidly over stone. Turns out it was just the chain straightening out after the tide shift had brought the boat mostly around, and my set held.

Last thought, if you are uber-rational or a stoic, you *must* learn to sleep well at anchor. If you do not sleep well, you are much more prone to accidents the next day while sleep-deprived, and likely more serious accidents than simply the boat bumping into something. May not help at all, but you never know what is going to work to trick the brain!

 

[Shrew]

My setup is pretty good, oversized Rocna anchor, 280 ft of chain.................7 to 1 scope

I would sleep like a baby. I anchor at 5:1 and let out to 6-6.5:1 when weather blows in. If I had the room I'd let out to 7:1 for thunder storms, but can usually only manage about 6-6.5:1.

 

[BruceK]

Tough advice situation for the OP Jklotz. No point testing, you only get false sense of security. Stay alert. Just go to sleep. Docks and moorings are dangerous. Rare events lead to catastrophizing.
I think you are doing well. You anchor with care and commonsense. You` report no failure. Keep it up. True, negative events are possible but confidence may grow as time passes. BroadCove raises some good points.You may be more attuned to detecting something untoward happening than you realize. You can`t stay awake all night on alert, best learn to trust your current practice, based on experience.

 

[BruceK]

Wonder if this article from Riviera`s current Magazine helps.

The art of anchoring - Riviera - Australia’s Premium Luxury Motor Yacht Builder

The Riviera owner’s manual includes a section on anchoring which should be studied before you venture into the wonderful world of boating. Learning how to set your motor yacht’s anchor and how to retrieve it is a vital skill of seamanship.

www.rivieraaustralia.com

 

[adornato]

I would be interested in Steve Mitchell's opinion regarding what anchor alarm systems he uses. I have a drag queen app but i havent used it.

 

[amapola]

We have a Mantus and feel very comfortable at anchor. Comfort at anchor comes with time and experience. I worry more about others dragging into us in crowded anchorages.

 

[Wtrguy]

I have a buddy that can sleep like a baby in some pretty snotty weather. Put a few boats around him and even in calmer weather he's up every hour or so checking everyone else out. I'm now cursed with the same affliction even though I seek much calmer anchorages as a rule.

 

[Flatswing]

I feel comfortable when I can see the boat from where I'm dining out.

Actually, you have a very good setup. I anchored out a lot and in remote places. You need to be comfortable in your anchorage and feel comfortable with the up coming weather. Reversing tides would often keep me on the boat, as would bad weather forecasts. I avoided anchoring in areas with current if I planned to leave the boat.

I once anchored in a cove and went to hike the island. As I was returning to the boat a frontal boundary passed through. As I was securing the dinghy on the upper deck in torrential rain and high winds, the anchor pulled out. Most likely there was a foot of mud on top of stone, so the anchor couldn't dig deeper. The boat turned broadside and rolled in the troughs into the cove. Because the wind was coming with a long fetch off Lake Champlain, I was also dealing with seas. Before I could get the engine started, the anchor reset. The boat probably traveled 50'. So why do I mention this to someone with anchoring anxiety? Because everything worked. My 7:1 scope in 15' of water allowed my Rocna to stay on the bottom and reset.

Lessons I came away with were:

Always check the weather, even if you're only going ashore for a couple of hours.

Don't anchor in coves with miles of fetch going into the cove.

Regardless of what anyone else says, don't short scope in shallow water

Ted

I had a similar experience on Lake Champlain 8yrs ago. Anchored in Partridge harbor on the W side. All fine. Took the dinghy to explore old mine sites up the coast. Unexpected storm blew up from the Southeast. Almost flipped the dinghy end over end several times coming back due to the wind. Arrived to find the boat stern 20ft from the rock wall to the W. It took us 20 minutes to scramble onto the swim platform due to the rough waves which bounced around the completely exposed cove. Started the engines and spent an anxious 1/2 hr. staring at the rocks, prepared to abandon the stern line to shore but the Rocna held firm, and we became believers!

It proved (to me at least) that Steve's vids from SV Panope (the secret life of anchors etc.) showing how well modern anchors reset are legit. After that, even with a bigger boat (& a bigger Spade anchor), we never fussed about anchoring in the strong reversing currents along the Carolinas and GA. Call us crazy, but we learned to just drop the hook carefully with appropriate scope, let the current set the hook as confirmed by the windshield wiper pattern on the plotter and relax. It was going to reset at least once or twice more anyway through the night. Slept like a baby unless the weather got crazy.

 

[O C Diver]

It proved (to me at least) that Steve's vids from SV Panope (the secret life of anchors etc.) showing how well modern anchors reset are legit.

My only criticism of Steve videos was not doing videos in shallow water <25' with 7:1 scope.

Ted

 

[rslifkin]

My only criticism of Steve videos was not doing videos in shallow water <25' with 7:1 scope.

Ted

Longer scope would likely show better behavior than he got. I prefer the somewhat more abusive worst case testing, knowing that most situations will be more friendly than the test conditions.

 

[Mambo42]

So my question is this; at what point do you feel comfortable and able to relax at anchor? Is there a trick I'm missing, or am I just a worry wart?

I once wrote a large post about anchoring and some were laughing at me, saying I was too cautious. Now I read this post and I see quite a bit of reactions where it is stated basically that people hope for the best. And when I read that I am wondering WHY ?

I guess all of us are afraid of dragging their anchor and ending up on the rocks or slamming into something else in quite a stormy night.
So to me, the main question then becomes: WHY do we drag our anchor ?
Once you understand why you drag your anchor you will intantly know how to stop dragging your anchor and you won't worry anymore. Up until the moment I understood how it works I also was worried and afraid to fall asleep. At every little noise I would run up to the helm to check if everything was ok.
Now that I know WHY an anchor drags and I know what to do against it I sleep like a log, even in heavy storms I have no problem sleeping, since I know the anchor will hold. Also if I am caught in a thunder storm (and this season we had a lot of them) I don't worry about dragging the anchor. I just worry about others dragging their anchor, thereby picking up my anchor or slamming into me. To avoid that I anchor as far away from everybody else as I can. I know blow boaters like to cuddle up, I don't do that.

Dragging an anchor is just a matter of mathematics, that is all it is. Once you understand the mathematics you will also know how to anchor for any condition. I know a lot of people work with something like 3 : 1, 5 : 1 etc or they are proud they have dropped almost no chain and rode out a fierce storm. I call that luck, not skill.
You will drag your anchor when the forces that the wind and current can put on the boat are larger than the compensating forces the anchor and chain can provide.

When you read this sentence you also immediately understand that the type of anchor is basically not mentioned in this equasion, yet loads of people swear by a certain anchor. For me the holding power of the anchor is added safety, but I don't calculate with it.
Why don't I calculate with the holding power of the anchor ?

That is quite simple. Any anchor will lose all holding power when the anchor shank is raised 25 degrees off the sea bed. The upward vector is then lifting the anchor up instead of straight back. So the idea is to keep the anchor shank level with the sea bed or below the 25 degrees. However, even when the shank is raised only 5 degrees, it will have already lost 35 % of the holding power.
So for me it is imperitive to keep that shank level on the sea bed (or at max 15 degrees) and the only thing capable of doing that is the anchor chain, making the chain extremely important.
The question is then to figure out what forces you are expecting on the boat. Windforces and current can be calculated for each Bft and kt of current. The only thing you need to do is to multiply that times the total frontal windage of the boat for the wind and the frontal surface under the waterline.
That will give you a total force in Newton and that means you will have to counteract that with the weight of the chain. Since 1 kg = 10 N you can easily calculate how much chain you will need to put in the water to compensate that wind and current force. The weight of the chain per meter is something the manufacturer can provide, so that becomes easy.
If you anchor with a lot of light chain in shallow water the angle of the chain with the sea bed won't get over the 25 degrees, therefore the anchor will provide the holding power you need, not the chain.
If you anchor in deeper water you definitely don't want the chain to be fully stretched, because that would raise the shank above 25 degrees and the anchor will not have any holding power. That automatically means you need much more chain if you chain is light than if your chain is heavy. 80 mtrs of 10 mm chain does not provide the same holding power as 80 mtr of 13 mm chain. The difference is about 150 kg or 1500 N and that is a lot.
Obviously the anchor itself also has a weight and you can add that to the weight of the chain, after all, the wind must also be strong enough to push that weight backwards.

So how much chain do you need to drop in the water ?
If you are in a well protected anchorage, where you cannot have a lot of wind and no thunderstorm is forecasted, you can make the calculation with that lower wind speed, resulting in less force on the hull and therefore less chain needed.
If you however are anchoring in a wide open anchorage and the wind has been blowing or is blowing with 25 kts, plus thunderstorms could build up...........then it is advisable to drop enough chain to counteract 65 or 70 kts of wind. Why ? Thunderstorms regularly produce those wind speeds, although not for long, but long enough to wreak havoc.

When you anchor for safety you will see that you can actually lie next to your anchor when the wind is blowing 35 or 40 kts. After all, you have calculated for 70 kts of wind. If those 70 kts don't show up because the thunder storm passes by north or south of you, then you have still done the correct thing. If that thunderstorm would not have passed north or south of you, but went straight overhead you could end up being the only one in the anchorage once everything is over.

I recently was in extreme weather in the port of Pula, together with a couple of other boats. All of them knew how to anchor for that weather, we took our spacing and happily rode out the storm, which lasted for 3 days. On the last day 3 sailing vessels arrived, dropped the minimum amount of chain and within no time all of them were dragging their anchor. None of them had a clue why they were dragging their anchor, they simply could not explain it. And all of them had been on the sea for many years.............yet never learned how to anchor properly.
So, once you understand the mathematics of anchoring you will know how to anchor for every type of weather (providing you have the correct gear for that) and you will sleep quietly and also happily leave your boat alone when the wind is blowing.

Am sure I will now get reactions telling me that I am overdoing it etc, but my answer is simple, math does not lie.

 

[RickyD]

I don't know whether my "insight" will reduce your anxiety, but my experience is that one becomes intimately familiar with the sounds of one's boat. Barring having to anchor in a difficult location or with weather, I always slept fairly well.

But most of us are a certain age where sleep is not as deep as it once was, and it is interrupted for...relief. I found I would naturally wake up when conditions were changing, whether it was an increase or diminution in wind, motion, or tide. So I would just get up, take a peek, and thus comforted fall back to sleep. Sleeping in a bow stateroom helped in this regard, because if the chain moved significantly, I would hear it.

As noted by a few, the only time I was really concerned was anchoring over rock, with the worst time being in the Everglades after a recent hurricane had washed out the sand/mud, leaving mainly the cracked limestone (?) bottom. I was lucky that my first set held through tide reversal, but I was awoken by the loud racket of chain moving rapidly over stone. Turns out it was just the chain straightening out after the tide shift had brought the boat mostly around, and my set held.

Last thought, if you are uber-rational or a stoic, you *must* learn to sleep well at anchor. If you do not sleep well, you are much more prone to accidents the next day while sleep-deprived, and likely more serious accidents than simply the boat bumping into something. May not help at all, but you never know what is going to work to trick the brain!