See ya on the two, whose two?

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David O

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 23, 2007
Messages
101
Location
USA
Vessel Name
Lucky Dog
Vessel Make
Mainship 350 Trawler
OK, I confess, I am confused when passing tows on the river. It's easy enough when meeting head-on. See you on the two is starboard to starboard, no problem. But, when overtaking you ask the tow captain what side would he prefer you to overtake him on and he says I'll see you on the two. Sometimes they are clever and say something like "why don't you crawl up on them two's". So, what is it his two or my two. Is it his two if he says it or my two if I say it.
 
On the two you turn to port, on the one you turn to starboard. Doesn't matter if head on or passing.

Bob
 
1 is starboard and 2 is port. both his and yours.
 
If I didn't know what they meant, the two previous responses might confuse me more. One whistle for a port-to-port passing, two whistles for a starboard-to-starboard passing. Probably the hardest thing to understand is the overtaking situation. If I ask to pass you, I become the "burdened" vessel. The burden is on me to stay out of your way, since you are slower. You say "Come by me on two", which is MY two or starboard, since I am the burdened vessel. So, I come by you on two whistles, leaving you on my starboard side. Chuck
 
he says "I'll see you on the two" would be his port side. That's how I take it.
 
The way captains courses teach rules (hopefully not insulting those that did it the hard way or those that know from taking the boxed courses)..

International - the whistle signal means you are turning and doesn't matter what the other guy does...1 whistle turn to starboard....2 to port.

Inland - the whistle signal is about what side you intend to leave the other guy on ...so without even turning if you leave the tow to your port...its a one whistle...on the two means you'll leave him to starboard.

I'm not comfortable how the river guys are saying it but I'm guessing that if you initiated and he says on the two (that's his agreement whistle to you) and you should leave him to starboard.

from the inland navrules -

i) shall indicate that maneuver by the following signals on her whistle:
  • one short blast to mean "I intend to leave you on my port side";
  • two short blasts to mean "I intend to leave you on my starboard side";
  • three short blasts to mean "I am operating astern propulsion"
 
This is all very confusing.
 
When I turn on the VHF I hear the commercial ships using the one whistle, two whistle talk, but as a practical matter, every time I've been on the ICW (SE USA), people say something like "I'd like to give you a slow pass on your port (or starboard) side."

I mean, if you're communicating by voice, what's the point in confusing things with talk of whistles. Who has a whistle on their boat anyway?
 
On the Texas, Louisiana portion of the ICW we are dealing with 10-15 encounters with tows every day. They will almost always say two whistle or one whistle. Sometimes just say come by on the one, or two. A friend, Charles Culotta says to think, "one whistle I am on the right, two whistle I am on the left" passing or meeting it works.
Steve
 
When I turn on the VHF I hear the commercial ships using the one whistle, two whistle talk, but as a practical matter, every time I've been on the ICW (SE USA), people say something like "I'd like to give you a slow pass on your port (or starboard) side."

I mean, if you're communicating by voice, what's the point in confusing things with talk of whistles. Who has a whistle on their boat anyway?

Because it's the "exact" and professional, non-confusing way to do it. Whistle signals are without a doubt and have to be responded to in kind...even on the radio.

That's why the pros do it that way. Recs can do it any way they want...as long as there's no collision who cares? Pros would be run through the wringer if they did anything else...and it's not confusing to them.
 
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The whistle signal reference is used on inland waters because tows tend to be long and swing wide. They drive the bow and swing the stern around it. On a turn in the river, they usually swing to the outside of the turn. You don't want to get caught over there when that huge pusher swings around with a big prop wash. The whistle signals, if used properly, will let him know that you are coming by on the safe side. When you have plenty of depth in a wide channel, they don't really care which way you pass or meet as long as you stay away from the bow and blind spot.
 
from the inland navrules -

i) shall indicate that maneuver by the following signals on her whistle:
  • one short blast to mean "I intend to leave you on my port side";
  • two short blasts to mean "I intend to leave you on my starboard side";
  • three short blasts to mean "I am operating astern propulsion"
These rules are correct and leave little room for misinterpretation. The problem is people are.self-centered and tend to think of things from their perspective but these rules are from the other captain's perspective. Try visualizing from the other captains wheel and it'll make sense.

Dave
 
Thanks. I was thinking correctly about it but sometimes the way the tow that is being passed speaks, it tends to confuse you if you think about it too much. It's something you don't want to have any doubts about, especially when the channel narrows.
 
Thanks. I was thinking correctly about it but sometimes the way the tow that is being passed speaks, it tends to confuse you if you think about it too much. It's something you don't want to have any doubts about, especially when the channel narrows.

Inland rules require an initiation and a response to avoid the confusion... the communication is required when within 1/2 nm of each other in meeting/crossing situations or whenever ready to pass. It's the requirement often ignored by rec vessels and almost always ignored in th NJ ICW...:eek:
 
Inland rules require an initiation and a response to avoid the confusion... the communication is required when within 1/2 nm of each other in meeting/crossing situations or whenever ready to pass. It's the requirement often ignored by rec vessels and almost always ignored in th NJ ICW...:eek:

Half mile ... that's about the maximum range of most recreational boats' horns (120 dB).

Often ignored? I'd say always unless, maybe, there is confusion or imminent risk of collision. Can't imagine everyone honking at each other (or crowding the radio waves) whenever meeting/crossing within half a mile. Same for commercial vessels.
 
Half mile ... that's about the maximum range of most recreational boats' horns (120 dB).

Often ignored? I'd say always unless, maybe, there is confusion or imminent risk of collision. Can't imagine everyone honking at each other (or crowding the radio waves) whenever meeting/crossing within half a mile. Same for commercial vessels.
Commercial traffic in busy waterways are probably doing it on ch13..thus the "spoken" radio whistle signal...

On the Atlantic and I'm sure the Gulf intracoastal waterway, if you keep ch 13 , even ch 16 you will get calls quite often about passing boats. The experienced boaters and/or the ones with captains licenses are likely to use the whistle signal radio call...but often they know the rec boater in front or whtaever doesn't really understand so they will use the layman's method....

In NJ they don't even bother teaching whistle signals in the boater's safety course as no one would remember and hardly anyone ever uses them (real or on the radio).
 
One whistle is for the easy thing to do for Americans who drive on the right side of the road, it means to just keep to the right. Two whistles is unusual for us to keep to the left, so it is twice as much effort to blow two whistles. To back up we have to turn around and look so it is much more effort, so three whistles for backing. If you want everyone to know where you are, just blow a long whistle so people will look at you when leaving a place of restricted visibility. And for people to really notice you, just keep blowing your whistle again and again five or more times for the danger signal.
 
Commercial traffic in busy waterways are probably doing it on ch13..thus the "spoken" radio whistle signal...
.

Here on the Ohio River it's only and always ch 13 for communication between tows and to tows. I always have the big VHF on 16 and the handheld on ch13. Channel 13 is a 5 watt channel anyway so, it wouldn't make any difference.
 
Here on the Ohio River it's only and always ch 13 for communication between tows and to tows. I always have the big VHF on 16 and the handheld on ch13. Channel 13 is a 5 watt channel anyway so, it wouldn't make any difference.

I'm pretty sure CH 13 is only one watt so it should interfere with very little that's not nearby.....as it was designed for.
 
One whistle is for the easy thing to do for Americans who drive on the right side of the road, it means to just keep to the right. Two whistles is unusual for us to keep to the left, so it is twice as much effort to blow two whistles. To back up we have to turn around and look so it is much more effort, so three whistles for backing. If you want everyone to know where you are, just blow a long whistle so people will look at you when leaving a place of restricted visibility. And for people to really notice you, just keep blowing your whistle again and again five or more times for the danger signal.


I really appreciate the expert explanations but I can really relate to this as it is put so simply. :thumb:
 
I'm pretty sure CH 13 is only one watt so it should interfere with very little that's not nearby.....as it was designed for.

Dooh, you're right, 1 watt, sorry. Something tells me that some of those tows are putting out a little more than 1 watt, it must be antenna height involved.
 
On the Atlantic and I'm sure the Gulf intracoastal waterway, if you keep ch 13 , even ch 16 you will get calls quite often about passing boats. The experienced boaters and/or the ones with captains licenses are likely to use the whistle signal radio call...but often they know the rec boater in front or whtaever doesn't really understand so they will use the layman's method....


In the years we've been boating out here (PNW) I can't recall ever hearing anyone give a passing or meeting call of any kind on 16. The one constant exception is the BC ferries that call when entering Active Pass in the Gulf Islands and ask for responses from potential conflicting traffic. Active Pass is narrow and has a dogleg in the middle of it so you can't see through it from either end.

The commercial vessels going to and from Seattle, Tacoma, and Vancouver using the VTS systems are in communication with each other about what they're doing or going to be doing.

But other than "How's the fishing?" "Where are the whales?" "Where to you want to meet for dinner tonight?" and "I think I see you over there just past the point Joe," the radio is pretty much silent as far as recreational boat chatter is concerned. And nobody--- and I mean NOBODY---- uses their horns up here. The ferries blow during the day when they leave a slip but they don't blow after dark and they don't blow when overtaking or meeting you.

Everyone just meets or passes however they want and it all seems to work. Of course there's more room in most places than you might have on the intracoastal waterways and not the density of traffic but even in our narrow passes nobody says or whistles a thing in a passing situation. The fishermen fishing at the entrances sometimes light up the radio about some plowing boat's wake but that's about it.

Must be that lawless, "do you feel lucky, punk?" attitude we all have out here in Indian Territory.:)
 
In the years we've been boating out here (PNW) I can't recall ever hearing anyone give a passing or meeting call of any kind on 16. The one constant exception is the BC ferries that call when entering Active Pass in the Gulf Islands and ask for responses from potential conflicting traffic. Active Pass is narrow and has a dogleg in the middle of it so you can't see through it from either end.

The commercial vessels going to and from Seattle, Tacoma, and Vancouver using the VTS systems are in communication with each other about what they're doing or going to be doing.

But other than "How's the fishing?" "Where are the whales?" "Where to you want to meet for dinner tonight?" and "I think I see you over there just past the point Joe," the radio is pretty much silent as far as recreational boat chatter is concerned. And nobody--- and I mean NOBODY---- uses their horns up here. The ferries blow during the day when they leave a slip but they don't blow after dark and they don't blow when overtaking or meeting you.

Everyone just meets or passes however they want and it all seems to work. Of course there's more room in most places than you might have on the intracoastal waterways and not the density of traffic but even in our narrow passes nobody says or whistles a thing in a passing situation. The fishermen fishing at the entrances sometimes light up the radio about some plowing boat's wake but that's about it.

Must be that lawless, "do you feel lucky, punk?" attitude we all have out here in Indian Territory.:)

I once had a 1/2 hour chat with Mr. Eastwood about helicopters...he doesn't toot his horn either!;)
 
Dave (Magicbus), #13 above, quotes rules for sound signals to signify which side of the boat ahead you intend to pass. Those signals are identical with maneuvering signals, eg 1 blast (I will leave you to port) equates to "I am turning to starboard", which is what you are doing.
Thus the signal, and directional change,are consistent with what we already do,and should present no issue. Why tow skippers use numerical language escapes me, I can see what they want to convey, it might be easier if they just said "pass on my starboard (or port) side", but if everyone understands (doubtful in view of this thread) it should work.
Hope that`s right,I`m not usually dyslectic. BruceK
 
Dave (Magicbus), #13 above, quotes rules for sound signals to signify which side of the boat ahead you intend to pass. Those signals are identical with maneuvering signals, eg 1 blast (I will leave you to port) equates to "I am turning to starboard", which is what you are doing.
Thus the signal, and directional change,are consistent with what we already do,and should present no issue. Why tow skippers use numerical language escapes me, I can see what they want to convey, it might be easier if they just said "pass on my starboard (or port) side", but if everyone understands (doubtful in view of this thread) it should work.
Hope that`s right,I`m not usually dyslectic. BruceK

Your assumption of a turn is incorrect..in international rules, whistle signals convey turning..in inland they do not..they only convey which side of your boat you will leave the other on.

The whistle signals have been around for awhile and time tested. better to learn them they way they are intended than make up your own version or wish they said/did something different.
 
You can practice too, while shopping and "meeting" or "passing" people pushing shopping carts down the aisles think to yourself "on the one whistle or on the two whistle" and do it.
Don't say it out loud or they may have the guy's in white coats looking for you.
Steve W.
 
I think of it as syllables. Pass or meeting you you on my starboard side---2 syllables---2 whistles.

Passing you or meeting you on my port side---1 syllable---1 whistle.

Not the way it is stated in the rules just an easy way to remember I learned years ago.
 
One whistle is for the easy thing to do for Americans who drive on the right side of the road, it means to just keep to the right. Two whistles is unusual for us to keep to the left, so it is twice as much effort to blow two whistles. To back up we have to turn around and look so it is much more effort, so three whistles for backing. If you want everyone to know where you are, just blow a long whistle so people will look at you when leaving a place of restricted visibility. And for people to really notice you, just keep blowing your whistle again and again five or more times for the danger signal.

Got it covered. Note whistle controller to the right of the searchlight's joystick:

img_98635_0_569cc77c347d1e09bdcdc6edba5ddd23.jpg
 
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