Aft Anchor type and size?

Currently we have a Bruce Claw on the bow of the 48' with 300' of chain. On our last boat (33') we had a nice Danforth 22lb? on the bow with 100' of chain and 200' or rode but we also used a 13bl Danforth with 15' of chain 100' of rode on the aft in a few spots to keep from spinning when it got crowded. It held for all but heavy winds if set correctly. My question is what size/ type would you use for an aft anchor on a 48'? And still be able to pull it up by hand if needed? Mostly PNW island hopping.

Only one choice as you ask.
Fortress.
Tons of holding power and relatively feather weight.

I'd probably use a decent size Fortress. Something like an FX-37 with a few feet (maybe 10 - 15) of 5/16" G43 chain and then rope after that. Still pretty light for hand hauling, but should be plenty for a stern anchor on that boat. Go up another size and it would be a backup in general.



I'd also assess the sizing of the Bruce and consider if it's adequate and whether you either want to go bigger or for a more modern design up forward.

I have a Fortress 37 for my stern hook on my 55. I have almost too much chain as its getting hard for me to handle so I avoid deploying it. I holds really well. Last deployment I was 90 degrees to a current that was ripping. I was rock solid. Pulling that sucker out of the sand after it was so deeply buried was no fun, but it finally came up. I really thought it was hung up on rocks at first. I'm glad I have a lot of rode to work with as I could let the big boat swing while I was retrieving and not lose control of the end.

Agree with Eric. I keep an FX-23 and FX-37 aboard and ready to heave for emergency or stern anchor situations. I once had a power failure while waiting for a drawbridge in a current pushing us toward the bridge. The FX was splashed with short scope and dug-in seconds from the shutdown. Saved us.

Use what ever works for your size and weight of boat, considering conditions.

GOOD LUCK!

Remember the stern anchor might be use Bahama style and simply recovered over the stern with no winch.

It also needs to be handy enough to pass to a dink, or carry out to get unstuck.

20 H Danforth with 5 ft of coated chain works for many situations.

I think the Bruce is a 45lb unit, I think its rated to 50'. It does look a little small compared to others. I just looked up a Fortress, perfect idea, Thank you.

RonR said:

I think the Bruce is a 45lb unit, I think its rated to 50'. It does look a little small compared to others. I just looked up a Fortress, perfect idea, Thank you.

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I'd definitely say a 45lb Bruce is way too small for that boat. I'd consider that too small for my boat at 10 feet shorter. A lot of older anchor designs (Bruce, Delta, etc.) have pretty optimistic size charts based on pretty good conditions / weather.

+1 for Fortress.

I had an FX55 as my 3rd anchor and aft anchor on my last sailboat (Hylas 49'). I have the same size Fortress as 2nd anchor and aft anchor on my current 72' Motorboat.

~A.

rslifkin said:

I'd definitely say a 45lb Bruce is way too small for that boat. I'd consider that too small for my boat at 10 feet shorter. A lot of older anchor designs (Bruce, Delta, etc.) have pretty optimistic size charts based on pretty good conditions / weather.

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So what does everyone recommend for the PNW area then? I see a lot of Bruce/Claw and several hinged Plow style at the marina. We are planning on anchoring out a lot, for fishing and for overnight. It has a Lofrans Tigres 1200w 12v with 300' of 3/8 chain.

And if I was to upsize the bow, would the Bruce work for an aft with say 10' of chain?

The Bruce / Claw types do seem to be better liked in the PNW than most other places. In general, what kind of bottoms do you typically encounter? Personally, I'm using a 73lb Rocna Vulcan, but that choice was driven as much by what would fit in a comfortably large size as it was by performance. But I'm not sure how different the bottoms in my typical anchorages are from yours.



The windlass and chain sound well sized, so it should just be a matter of sticking something bigger on the end.



If you haven't seen the SV Panope videos, it might be worth giving them a look, as they do a good job of showing some of the strong and weak points of various anchor designs.

PNW is Mud, Sand, Kelp, Rocks. In about that order. Most often we are in Mud in most bays, sand when fishing deep, and rocks when you don't want any.

I do see a lot of fancy plow's most are polished to perfection, so I don't think they are used much. Most that are scarred up are hinged plows or just a Bruce on larger boats.

RonR said:

PNW is Mud, Sand, Kelp, Rocks. In about that order. Most often we are in Mud in most bays, sand when fishing deep, and rocks when you don't want any.

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Any of the newer generation stuff should cope well with that. Really soft mud is the only weak point, but that's pretty much a weak point for anything other than a Fortress / Danforth. And nothing does well in an overly rocky bottom, but some definitely do better than others.

I haven’t seen stern anchors used in the PNW for the purpose the OP describes (to keep the boat from spinning when it gets crowded). The problem with doing that in our relatively deep anchorages (relative to Florida etc) is that the other boats turn together in a wide circle. If your boat doesn’t swing similarly, there could be an unfortunate merger....

I think there’s a place for stern anchors in lieu of a stern tie, where boats are positioned against the shore and everyone is kept in the same attitude.

rslifkin wrote;
“The Bruce / Claw types do seem to be better liked in the PNW than most other places. In general, what kind of bottoms do you typically encounter?”

There must be two answers to this question.
1. A light anchor to be deployed and retrieved by hand.
2. A full anchoring system including a winch and chain locker.

And if your immediate response is a lightweight anchor hand deployed my first thread response covers it. Especially if you’ll be only using it in light winds.

But in view of the OP’s boat size (rather large) and if he expects for the stern anchor to perform is 35 knot+ winds w reversals I see a very different ground tackle system. Including an anchor that works well in almost any seafloor.
What kind of winch is the biggest question. And I have an unusual answer. A “reel” winch. Rollers could be arranged to pull well from both side directions. Short scopes and short rodes would probably be part of this system. My favorite anchor (bias possible) would be the well proven ARA SARCA. But it could be most any anchor that works on rocky bottoms, weedy bottoms, soft mud bottoms and anything else you may need to deal with. You will probably have trouble finding an anchor that excels on all three bottoms. But close to the shore the bottom will be the biggest challenge. No anchor will excel. All will be fair or better. But as you pass through average and approach better or excellent you’ll have very few choices. And re excellent you’ll have very few choices.

Spinner said:

I haven’t seen stern anchors used in the PNW for the purpose the OP describes (to keep the boat from spinning when it gets crowded). The problem with doing that in our relatively deep anchorages (relative to Florida etc) is that the other boats turn together in a wide circle. If your boat doesn’t swing similarly, there could be an unfortunate merger....

I think there’s a place for stern anchors in lieu of a stern tie, where boats are positioned against the shore and everyone is kept in the same attitude.

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Think back bay of Port Ludlow, Forward of the original dock at Roach, some tie to shore, we don't. And also when crabbing out of Everett we drop a stern anchor and just tie the pots off to the boat, kick back and enjoy the day without spinning around the pot lines. And it keeps people from poaching out pots. We pay attention, if others are not dropping a stern we don't.

Always used a fortress for that application. Other question is strap or rode? Any chain? How attached? What to use for retrieval?
Nice to be set up for a stern tie to a tree or something else but also get a nice two point set in a river or other setting you don’t want to swing.

I use a 17 Danforth as a stern hook on my 34 and also carry a FX-23 and a larger Danforth that formerly served as my bow anchor. (Main bow hook is a 33# Lewmar claw-imitation Bruce).

We have ,for a lunch hook, the same danforth 13S anchor with 6' of 1/4" chain that the OP had on his prior boat as a stern anchor. The darn thing holds wonderfully in most bottoms here on the east coast & honestly, anything larger would become a pain to haul in from and store underneath of the cockpit. I keep the chain & 50' of 1/2" rode in a 5 gallon bucket and the entire setup seems to be perfect for our boat & use.

Ron

See Spinner's post at #15.

I would echo her analysis.

In almost 50 yrs of anchoring in the Gulf Islands and further up the coast, (while your destinations in the PNW may be different, I doubt they are much different) I have yet to encounter anyone using a stern anchor for anything other than a lunch stop. That usage doesn't mandate the best anchor possible, as you won't be doing this at night. Any difficulty getting your anchor to hold will see you move or swing on your bow anchor.

Well we upgraded the Bruce to a 55lb Delta Plow. Today. I may run down to fisheries this weekend and grab a mid size Danforth or the fortress for the aft. Going to keep the Bruce and grab some more chain and ride to keep as a spare.

Thank you everyone for the tips.

Keep in mind that any anchor deployed off the stern should be sized to securely hold the boat all by itself. Some folks believe they can go smaller on an aft anchor but when the tide, current, and possibly the wind shifts, the anchor off the bow no longer has tension and the entire holding of the vessel is with the aft anchor. Without it being properly sized and properly set, you most likely will have a problem. Does not matter what brand anchor you have. Size the aft anchor and set-up the same way you would the main bower.

Steve I WAS HOP’in you’d show up.
Been missing you on the forum. Hope all is well and you’re safe.
Never even seen the Max Anchor. How small do they come? Anything new on the Max?

Ron if you’re set on a Dan go on CL and find an “S”. I have one but i"m not sell'in.
But I think you can find a "Hi Tensile" Danforth from Tie Down Engineering that's good too. WM may have them. Just a hunch.

Steve Bedford said:

Keep in mind that any anchor deployed off the stern should be sized to securely hold the boat all by itself. Some folks believe they can go smaller on an aft anchor but when the tide, current, and possibly the wind shifts, the anchor off the bow no longer has tension and the entire holding of the vessel is with the aft anchor. Without it being properly sized and properly set, you most likely will have a problem. Does not matter what brand anchor you have. Size the aft anchor and set-up the same way you would the main bower.

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Steve, I would only agree with you if the second anchor is also going to serve as a back up main anchor, or you are using it to rig a Bahamian moor (which by the way comes off the bow). I would not use a straight stern anchor if there was the possibility of the conditions you describe arising.

Geography and conditions come into play. The main place I've used a stern anchor on a big boat is in the California Delta where the wind and fast current issues you describe are not going to come into play in the protected sloughs; the purpose was merely to keep the boat from swinging into the levee or out into the channel. I did deploy one out here off the ICW a couple of times in a similarly narrow spot very much like a Delta slough, but in our case all we had was the backup Danforth and frankly it was a real PITA to retrieve.

The main use of them in these parts is when taking a smaller size outboard motor boat to the beach. These can get quite crowded, and currents as well as wind can run crosswise, so a small Danforth style anchor is the universal weapon of choice. See my avatar.

I was on TR doghouse! SuperMAX anchors range from 9lbs to 120lbs.
Steve

doghouse do’nt sound good
Looks like a type-o for TF.
But TF doghouse isn’t very big.
I don’t recognize your avatar.

Nomad Willy said:

doghouse do’nt sound good
Looks like a type-o for TF.
But TF doghouse isn’t very big.
I don’t recognize your avatar.

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TR was indeed a typo. The avatar that I had chosen was part of the problem along with some other issues. The current avatar is our new motor vessel as of November, 2020.

caltexflanc said:

Steve, I would only agree with you if the second anchor is also going to serve as a back up main anchor, or you are using it to rig a Bahamian moor (which by the way comes off the bow). I would not use a straight stern anchor if there was the possibility of the conditions you describe arising.

Geography and conditions come into play. The main place I've used a stern anchor on a big boat is in the California Delta where the wind and fast current issues you describe are not going to come into play in the protected sloughs; the purpose was merely to keep the boat from swinging into the levee or out into the channel. I did deploy one out here off the ICW a couple of times in a similarly narrow spot very much like a Delta slough, but in our case all we had was the backup Danforth and frankly it was a real PITA to retrieve.

The main use of them in these parts is when taking a smaller size outboard motor boat to the beach. These can get quite crowded, and currents as well as wind can run crosswise, so a small Danforth style anchor is the universal weapon of choice. See my avatar.

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My position is that when ever you deploy a second anchor with the possibility of the second anchor taking the full load of strain from the vessel (whether it is Bahamian or bow&stern anchoring) it should be sized appropriately for the vessel. I have seen some folks with additional anchors on a vessel that are not sized appropriately for the vessel by itself. If a second anchor is deployed in a manner where it should never take the full load then it probably could be less.

I am not a fan of bow&stern anchoring myself. Maybe I misread the original post and that was not the intention. Regardless, I stand by my position above.

caltexflanc said:

Geography and conditions come into play. The main place I've used a stern anchor on a big boat is in the California Delta where the wind and fast current issues you describe are not going to come into play in the protected sloughs; the purpose was merely to keep the boat from swinging into the levee or out into the channel. I did deploy one out here off the ICW a couple of times in a similarly narrow spot very much like a Delta slough, but in our case all we had was the backup Danforth and frankly it was a real PITA to retrieve.

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Well said. It's a technique I rely upon throughout the CA Delta in protected anchorages like The Bedrooms, Mandeville Point (pictured below), Secret Cove, Georgiana and Steamboat Sloughs. With lots of room to swing like Mildred Island, the tailhook is not needed or used.