Anchor line

Good afternoon
I'm going to replace the anchor line on my new to me Mainship 350. The line that came on the boat I purchased is looking frayed and is not long enough.
Do any of you have experience good or bad with brands aside from Sampson and New England Rope? There are many brands out there to pic from. I'm looking for 5/8" three strand nylon about 300ft.
Thanks
Jim

Well you ruled out the probable best 2 brands. Those are the ones I trust the most. As to other brands it is pretty much take a chance. Maybe get a friend that needs some line and buy a spool of 600’ and save quite a bit of money.

The other good brand not mentioned is Yale Cordage. I've gotten good stuff from buccaneer as well, but it's a little soft for my liking and I don't like it as much.

If you were closer I’d sell you my near 400’ of 5/8ths Brait. It’s the best haha but I haven’t had any other than 3 strand that came w the boat .. before that. It’s about 12-14yrs old and in good shape.

The Brait is more difficult to splice but it’s not hard per testimony on TF. I love the way it falls into a pile and you can take up an end and run off 200’ w/o any kind of kinking. It comes out of a chain locker w/o a hitch too. But the most important part is that it consumes considerably less space. So you can stow more in the same chain locker.

I want to downsize. Don’t need 5/8ths. 1/2” is good for my boat now that I don’t live in Alaska. Also I’d like to increase my chain length ... and be able to set up a bridal. That would be nice. Don’t like the swinging.

jclays said:

Good afternoon
I'm going to replace the anchor line on my new to me Mainship 350. The line that came on the boat I purchased is looking frayed and is not long enough.
Do any of you have experience good or bad with brands aside from Sampson and New England Rope? There are many brands out there to pic from. I'm looking for 5/8" three strand nylon about 300ft.
Thanks

Click to expand...

What style of line does your windlass maker recommend?

Ours recommended 8-plait, so that's what we used...

-Chris

I run ~120 ft of 5/16 chain and about 150 ft of 5/8" 3-strand. Though we don't typically anchor in more than 15 feet of water. I think the most chain we've ever had out of the locker is 90 feet.

ranger42c said:

What style of line does your windlass maker recommend?

Ours recommended 8-plait, so that's what we used...

-Chris

Click to expand...

What was quoted above.

Shrew said:

I run ~120 ft of 5/16 chain and about 150 ft of 5/8" 3-strand. Though we don't typically anchor in more than 15 feet of water. I think the most chain we've ever had out of the locker is 90 feet.

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Average depth where I regularly anchor is 50ft.

The thing you need to look out for is rope that is too soft.

The big companies like Samson and New England treat their three strand rope after production to make it more abrasion resistant. I think Samson heat treats their Pro Set rope and line and New England chemically treats theirs.

Less expensive rope can feel really nice and soft on the spool but when put into service they quickly get hard to handle and are subject to abrasion. Stick with the big boys, they’re worth the extra money.

Another vote for Brait line, it falls into the locker so much nicer and takes up a lot less room. Also much less likely to develop a knuckle, which is something older laid line has a tendency to do as it hardens with age.

I have 600' 5/8 laid New England, but my next line will certainly be Brait. The laid lines don't fall flat, and sometimes your chain can work down into the rode and jam coming back out, especially if you encounter rough seas for a while and it works down in.

How does one determine the line size/type?
we currently have 300' of 3/8 BBB chain and would like to add 150-200 feet of rope. 48' boat, 45,000lb Mostly play in the San Juans.

Measure the OD.
I have handy a cheap plastic calipers that I keep in my car trunk to use in stores, one in my garage and another as a floater. I probably have four of them.

They cost less than $10. (I think) and are very accurate if used w a magnifying glass.

Been doing this for over 20 years.

RonR said:

How does one determine the line size/type?
we currently have 300' of 3/8 BBB chain and would like to add 150-200 feet of rope. 48' boat, 45,000lb Mostly play in the San Juans.

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Your windlass will tell you what it can handle. Whether or not it is the correct size line you will have to refer to an anchor sizing chart.
West Marine says for a heavy boat 3/8 chain and 3/4 inch dia line.

jclays said:

Your windlass will tell you what it can handle. Whether or not it is the correct size line you will have to refer to an anchor sizing chart.

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And not every chain wheel will handle mixed rodes. Usually they specify a range of line they will handle in addition to the chain size and link type.

The windless we have has a drum on one side and a chain wheel on the other. Just trying to learn about sizing and preferred type. Do people always use 3 strand? Or do some use double braided?

RonR said:

How does one determine the line size/type?
we currently have 300' of 3/8 BBB chain and would like to add 150-200 feet of rope. 48' boat, 45,000lb Mostly play in the San Juans.

Click to expand...

Your chain gypsey will have a slot for line, cut deeper than the indents for chain. Mine are cut for 3/4" line on a Lofrans Tigres windlass. Check yours with the micrometer Eric mentioned, then buy rope that size.

RonR said:

The windless we have has a drum on one side and a chain wheel on the other. Just trying to learn about sizing and preferred type. Do people always use 3 strand? Or do some use double braided?

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Double braid would be uncommon with a windlass, especially as you can't splice it to chain and would have to use a shackle and thimble. Most use either 3 strand or an 8 or 12 strand (plait). 8/12 strand lays much nicer and more compactly in the locker, so it's my preference.



You can handle the line on the windlass drum and switch it over manually, but if the chainwheel can also pull line (some can, some can't) and the line is spliced to the chain, then it'll be able to pull it all without manual intervention (and no manual tailing of the line like with the drum).

RonR said:

The windless we have has a drum on one side and a chain wheel on the other. Just trying to learn about sizing and preferred type. Do people always use 3 strand? Or do some use double braided?

Click to expand...

I have 1/2" 3 strand left over from my sailing days, where the gypsey slot was 1/2". I presently have 3/4" double braid on the trawler. The manual windlass on the sailboat and the windlass on the trawler both have a drum opposite the gypsey. I have used the drum for general pulling jobs, and actually prefer it when pulling the anchor line when I have lots out, but when getting close to the rope to chain splice I prefer to have the line in the gypsey slot. Once you get used to your equipment, you will find what works for you.
The braid and 3 strand both work. I have never thought one was superior to the other for use as anchor rode.

Edit: I guess I actually don't have a rope to chain splice on my braid to chain connection. The shackle is a twisted, skinny SS shackle that the braid is spliced onto. The 1.5" ABS pipe that it all goes down is the limiting factor, but it all works.

Thank you for the info, we looked it up last night.
Lofrans Windlasses, Tigres TG 012578 1200 Watt 12 Volt

Description
One of the most recognizable and popular windlasses, the Lofrans Tigres horizontal windlass features a handy top-mounted snubbing cleat, standard manual override, and an oil-level window. It has a reputation for being durable and trouble-free.
The dual direction motor is mounted above deck.

• Stocked version comes with stock 5/16HT chainwheel. Please specify or call if you require a different size
• Chain-only gypsy and separate capstan for rope hauling (up to 3/4")
• Available with gypsies for PC, BBB, or HT chain (1/4" only in HT), please specify when ordering
• Constructed of special marine grade aluminium alloy
• Hot forged gypsy in special bronze for better mechanical strength
• Emergency manual override
• Finished in sanded, hand polished and anodized aluminium, or in durable white polyester powder coating
• 12V (or 24V special order)

I have a LoFrans Project 1000, it's a vertical with the chainwheel on the bottom and a capstan on top of the chainwheel, but the chainwheel handles both line and chain. The capstan on top was an extra $200 but also gives me the option to pull from many different angles over the cap rail to kedge off if I should be lightly grounded.

I chose that model because it handles both chain and line in the chainwheel. Switching from line to chain as the different rode comes aboard isn't something I want to have to deal with, 110 lbs of chain and anchor hanging suspended while I switch doesn't sound fun, even less so with current or wave motion.

I have never had to kedge (knock wood).

RonR said:

Thank you for the info, we looked it up last night.
Lofrans Windlasses, Tigres TG 012578 1200 Watt 12 Volt

Description

• Stocked version comes with stock 5/16HT chainwheel. Please specify or call if you require a different size
• Chain-only gypsy and separate capstan for rope hauling (up to 3/4")

• 12V

Click to expand...

Though it says "chain only" you can see in the picture that there is a rope grabbing cutout inside the chain grabbers on the gypsey. If you already have a windlass, try your ropes of various sizes to see what it will grab. Otherwise, if you are looking at any make that has the rope cutout, take your measuring tool with you.

I have gotten some great anchor line from this company (https://mooringlines.com/). Have also used their bridle to tow my flats boat to the Bahamas and back as well as around the Keys a few times.

Chain?

jclays said:

Average depth where I regularly anchor is 50ft.

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Sounds like Catalina. That was my mooring ground for many years. I always wished I had gone all chain, but never did. Now would be a good time for you since you're replacing anyway.

Yes, MichaelD. I have two anchors. One is Rockna 33 and is all chain. The other is Fortress and is 3/4" VERY soft line. Probably will not use that one. I always use the Rockna with chain. . .

HopCar said:

The thing you need to look out for is rope that is too soft.

The big companies like Samson and New England treat their three strand rope after production to make it more abrasion resistant. I think Samson heat treats their Pro Set rope and line and New England chemically treats theirs.

Less expensive rope can feel really nice and soft on the spool but when put into service they quickly get hard to handle and are subject to abrasion. Stick with the big boys, they’re worth the extra money.

Click to expand...

Miami Cordage is great to work with, but as you said, their 8 plait is very soft and my windlass almost chewed through it. They were happy to replace with a treated 3 strand that is much more tough, Problem is it's also stiffer, so the jury is still out if that will be my final solution.

I'm having a similar softness issue with the Buccaneer 8 plait currently in my anchor rode. It's very soft and handles nicely, but doesn't seem terribly durable. I've got some definite wear from feeding it through the windlass and I figure after another season, I'll probably be looking to replace it.



Still working on the "what to replace it with" part though, haven't decided whether I'll go with a hopefully more durable 8 plait nylon (and maybe up-size from 5/8 to 3/4 if my windlass will handle it, mostly worrying about the bigger splice). Or I might go with one of a couple of 12 strand polyester options (and accept the need for a snubber like with all chain) in search of better durability.

rslifkin said:

I'm having a similar softness issue with the Buccaneer 8 plait currently in my anchor rode. It's very soft and handles nicely, but doesn't seem terribly durable. I've got some definite wear from feeding it through the windlass and I figure after another season, I'll probably be looking to replace it.



Still working on the "what to replace it with" part though, haven't decided whether I'll go with a hopefully more durable 8 plait nylon (and maybe up-size from 5/8 to 3/4 if my windlass will handle it, mostly worrying about the bigger splice). Or I might go with one of a couple of 12 strand polyester options (and accept the need for a snubber like with all chain) in search of better durability.

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Check your windlass spec. They are specific about size and types of rode to use. 3/4 sounds like overkill and may not even fit.

backinblue said:

Check your windlass spec. They are specific about size and types of rode to use. 3/4 sounds like overkill and may not even fit.

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Maxwell claims 5/8 is the only size that works and nothing else will fit. But looking at how the line sits in the gypsy as well as a test piece of 3/4, it seems that it would pull either one. However, my concern is mostly around splicing 3/4" line to 5/16" chain and whether the resulting large splice will go through the windlass nicely. My current 5/8" splice feeds pretty well, although it does need me to slow down on retrieval (especially in deep water) as the splice is a little stiff and will sometimes jump or jam if I try to pull it through at full speed under any tension.

rslifkin said:

Maxwell claims 5/8 is the only size that works and nothing else will fit. But looking at how the line sits in the gypsy as well as a test piece of 3/4, it seems that it would pull either one. However, my concern is mostly around splicing 3/4" line to 5/16" chain and whether the resulting large splice will go through the windlass nicely. My current 5/8" splice feeds pretty well, although it does need me to slow down on retrieval (especially in deep water) as the splice is a little stiff and will sometimes jump or jam if I try to pull it through at full speed under any tension.

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I would stick with 5/8. It's plenty strong for your boat. Like you said it's probably not the line that's a problem, but the size of the large splice that may not work. You don't want to struggle every time that splice goes through your anchor.

backinblue said:

I would stick with 5/8. It's plenty strong for your boat. Like you said it's probably not the line that's a problem, but the size of the large splice that may not work. You don't want to struggle every time that splice goes through your anchor.

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That's what has me exploring the nylon alternatives. More working load without up-sizing and potentially better chafe resistance as well. I've considered using regatta braid and I currently have a short test piece of Samson Tenex (which is also really cheap) on the way to see what I think of it.