Docking question.

We're downsizing -- moving ashore after seven years and 10,000 miles on Fintry. We're looking at double cabin trawlers.


Question. Assuming that the GB36 backs to port -- most single screw boats do -- I don't understand their putting the only saloon door on the starboard side. Since it will be significantly easier to dock port side to, you'll have to go around the deckhouse to help wiith lines and single handed docking would be very difficult. How do GB36 owners feel about this? Related, of course, is the fact that the steps to the upper deck are on the port side, so to go from the saloon up, you have to go a third of the way around the boat.

Or, was GB smart? There are some reverse gears that allow running continuously in either direction. It would certainly be possible to use a gear that allowed that, mount a left hand propellor, and have the boat back to starboard. Is that the case?

I would check with GB owners...my Albin backs to Starboard.

I know what you mean. My Puget Trawler backs to starboard and my entry door is on the port side.

When I had a GB 36 it backed to starboard. GB bought engines with an eye to twin installations with counter rotating props. When they built a single you got the luck of the draw.

Thrusters make this a non issue. My DE pulls to port. I dock to starboard after a u turn. With out the use of thrusters it is no less the 20 clutch shifts. With thrusters it is 1 or 2

Most of the singles that I have driven backed to starboard. Actually all of them, but yours may be different.

Most Modern engines turn the same way . Gear ratios are what change the direction of the shaft.

My Monk backs to starboard (left hand prop). The 32 and 36 GBs we chartered were also left hand props.
A port side door was added to GB 36s around 1987 when the beam was widened a few inches.

There are a number of twin engine GB 36's on the market. Lehman on earlier boats, Cummins on later ones. Docking becomes a non-issue with twins.

My boat backs to port and I starboard tie. It's really a non issue after you master "Back and Fill". You can also use a bow thruster, but "back and fill" has been taught for around a century.

Ted

Every Volvo I've driven backed to starboard, everything else I've driven went to port

Anyone know of a single Ford Lehman (left hand engine) with a Borg Warner tranny that didn't back to starboard?

psneeld said:

Anyone know of a single Ford Lehman (left hand engine) with a Borg Warner tranny that didn't back to starboard?

Click to expand...

You can get a CR2 transmission with either LH or RH rotation. Match the prop and you're in business.

It’s having a planetary reduction drive or what I call a gear on gear reduction drive.

Planetary revolves the shaft and prop anti-clockwise and pulls the stern to stbd.
Gear on gear revolves the shaft clockwise and the stern pull to port.

Older boats w the BW gears (planetary re-drive) pull to stbd. Of course when re-powered w later model engines the prop turned the other way.

That’s about it.

Third Reef

Our 1988 double cabin 36' GB Trawler has an entrance door on both sides. One at he lower helm stbd and one just aft of the refrigerator on the port. Our prop is LH and backs to stbd and we have a bow thruster just for good measure. Handles and handling is very easy and comfortable.

Best regards,
Mike Dana
Third Reef
36' GB Heritage Classic
Potts Harbor Maine
207-833-5080

Thanks -- Unfortunately there appear to be very few single engine version 2 (wider, longer) GB36 on the East Coast -- Yachtworld lists three, one in the UK and two on the West Coast, but none here. There are six twins on the East Coast, but that's not what we want.


However, the consensus seems to be that the Lehmans are set up to back to starboard, so maybe the single door version is OK.


Incidently, in response to several comments above, I can park Fintry (79') in a 90 foot space to port with our 60hp bow thruster and five foot single screw, but docking her to starboard is a much slower process. Best way is to angle in, get the spring line on, and idle forward with the rudder hard to port, but that only works on strong docks -- the usual marina float won't stand the pull. On weak docks, we need someone on the float to take a stern line, which goes to a 60:1 docking winch.

SoWhat said:

You can get a CR2 transmission with either LH or RH rotation. Match the prop and you're in business.

Click to expand...

Most boats with twin engines, no matter the brand, have both engines turning the same way and use the transmissions to make one turn the opposite way.
The setup then, has each engine, when in reverse, pulling towards the centrerline. P engine backs to Sb, Sb engine backs to P.

Mine are BW on Volvos.

koliver said:

Most boats with twin engines, no matter the brand, have both engines turning the same way and use the transmissions to make one turn the opposite way.
The setup then, has each engine, when in reverse, pulling towards the centrerline. P engine backs to Sb, Sb engine backs to P.

Mine are BW on Volvos.

Click to expand...

Most modern boats and most diesels are as you describe. However, most older transmissions couldn't just be used with either gear as "forward", so they were either built as counter rotating transmissions, or for older gas boats, the engines counter rotate. My stbd engine rotates backwards, for example. So I'd hesitate to say "most" boats, as there are many boats where the engines counter rotate.

In addition, most twins counter rotate the props outwards in forward as you describe, but there are some that are opposite.

GB 36 cruising

Circumnavigator said:

We're downsizing -- moving ashore after seven years and 10,000 miles on Fintry. We're looking at double cabin trawlers.


Question. Assuming that the GB36 backs to port -- most single screw boats do -- I don't understand their putting the only saloon door on the starboard side. Since it will be significantly easier to dock port side to, you'll have to go around the deckhouse to help wiith lines and single handed docking would be very difficult. How do GB36 owners feel about this? Related, of course, is the fact that the steps to the upper deck are on the port side, so to go from the saloon up, you have to go a third of the way around the boat.

Or, was GB smart? There are some reverse gears that allow running continuously in either direction. It would certainly be possible to use a gear that allowed that, mount a left hand propellor, and have the boat back to starboard. Is that the case?

Click to expand...

Yes, my GB 36 backs to port, and it took some doing to learn to back it in. My version only has the starboard door. Some were built with two doors, some had just one. If I'm not mistaken, I think all the 42's were built with two. The GB 32 only has one door and it's all the way aft. I would kill for the two door version but when I was buying there wasn't one available that had the "must haves" that were on my list. Also, some 36s were built with an island queen bed in the aft stateroom and some have a double to starboard and a twin to port. The island queen would be really nice to have if you can find one.

Docking this boat single handed is a chore, no matter how many doors you have due to it's large wind print, an under powered engine (in my opinion) and 1 screw with no thrusters. That's just the nature of the beast. A lot has to do with the type of slip you have, how long the finger piers are, how protected the marina is etc. Also, if it's really windy, we just don't go out or come in. Two engines plus thrusters would help but I'm a single engine believer so I just deal with the issues that brings. I don't find the starboard door and port steps up to the flybridge to be an issue.

GB 36 cruising

psneeld said:

Anyone know of a single Ford Lehman (left hand engine) with a Borg Warner tranny that didn't back to starboard?

Click to expand...

I have a single FL 120 and a Borg Warner tranny and mine backs to port.

My GB36 goes Starboard, yeah right. What it does do is back pretty straight with rudder lined up.

With a full length keel it really doesn't do much.
I use the bow thruster since 20 shifts to dock is really hard on the transmission. And the transmission is the weak link.

I really watch wind and current. I approach extremely slow. I have taught my wife to go for the line midship. If she gets it, I leave the bridge and typically get the stern first.

A Europa is subject to wind alot, I try to use it to my advantage. I never come in harder than I want to hit. In past life I witnessed a captain coming in hot to show off, and the shift cable came off as he went to forward to stop hard. In 1975 About $400k in boat damages, broken arm and bruising, and his job forever in Port Aransas.

I can control the bow, but not really the stern. A single is Soo nice to work on, and the expenses are super low. It will be hard to ever have twins.

GB 36 cruising

Choices said:

My GB36 goes Starboard, yeah right. What it does do is back pretty straight with rudder lined up.

With a full length keel it really doesn't do much.
I use the bow thruster since 20 shifts to dock is really hard on the transmission. And the transmission is the weak link.

I really watch wind and current. I approach extremely slow. I have taught my wife to go for the line midship. If she gets it, I leave the bridge and typically get the stern first.

A Europa is subject to wind alot, I try to use it to my advantage. I never come in harder than I want to hit. In past life I witnessed a captain coming in hot to show off, and the shift cable came off as he went to forward to stop hard. In 1975 About $400k in boat damages, broken arm and bruising, and his job forever in Port Aransas.

I can control the bow, but not really the stern. A single is Soo nice to work on, and the expenses are super low. It will be hard to ever have twins.

Click to expand...

Mine backs to port. I have the Classic, not the Europa but I assume the wind/current effect is similar. My rudder has almost no authority in reverse. I don't have thrusters, just the one screw so I have to use back and fill but I try to keep the shifts to a minimum and at low power. I also find that "slow" is your friend as is approaching the slip as closely as you can before turning up and backing in. My wife also attaches the starboard aft spring line first and once that's done I go out to assist tying up.

You should look at a Monk 36. TWO doors in Salon with a stern thruster and backs up starboard.
I have. 1998 Monk 36 for sale on the Treaure Coast of FL.

Interesting....guess as someone pointed out...just depends on the tranny as 120Lehmans are lefties.

What engine does a 36 GB have that someone would consider it underpowered?

75hp or less?

For Velvet Drives (71C and 72C, not the CR2), the 1.91:1 ratio rotates the output opposite of input, while the rest rotate the same. So the trans ratio can lead to different rotation.

psneeld said:

Anyone know of a single Ford Lehman (left hand engine) with a Borg Warner tranny that didn't back to starboard?

Click to expand...

Nope. The GB 36 I delivered from here to Lake Michigan in 2017 backed to stbd. I hated the side stbd side cabin door though. I have seen a GB36 with p/s cabin doors.

Here, the single backs to starboard with helm station at starboard, and have bow thruster and deck-level pilothouse doors both port and starboard.

O C Diver said:

My boat backs to port and I starboard tie. It's really a non issue after you master "Back and Fill". You can also use a bow thruster, but "back and fill" has been taught for around a century.

Ted

Click to expand...

I completely agree. Having had my GB 36 single screw now for two summers, I have learned to be quite proficient at reading the wind and currents and performing the Back-n-Fill maneuver.

psneeld said:

Interesting....guess as someone pointed out...just depends on the tranny as 120Lehmans are lefties.

What engine does a 36 GB have that someone would consider it underpowered?

75hp or less?

Click to expand...

I too have wondered what the usable differences are between a single and twin Lehman 120. To hear a single is underpowered makes me ask at what RPM does a single operate at to achieve hull speed of 8 Knots? My twins run at 1650 each for 8-9. Underpowered should mean unable to achieve hull speed?

Steve K,
What’s the reason for needing to “achieve hull speed”?