Greenline Hybrid: Solar Panel, Solar Charging & Propulsion Battery Discussions

ScottC · Aug 30, 2020

Now that we have a new, dedicated area for Greenline/Solar/Hybrid discussion, I thought I would start this thread with an eye toward aggregating Solar Panel, Solar Charging & Propulsion Battery Discussions (for all models) - in order to make it easier for those that might be doing research in the future. Not sure if this type of "organization" will work or not, but will try and see what happens.

Prior to the creation of this dedicated Greenline area, there have been some relevant solar panel/charging discussions elsewhere in the forum. They can be found here:

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s3/left-turn-clide-going-hybrid-50144-2.html#post872340

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s4/considering-going-solar-51605.html

DavidM · Aug 30, 2020

Well ok, now that we have a half dozen threads to kibitz here goes my technical analysis of operating on batteries and solar:

A general rule of thumb is that it takes 1.5 hp per thousand pounds of displacement to move a displacement hull at its hull speed or half of that at a knot slower. So that is about 8 hp at 6.5kts. The battery has about 10 KWhr usable. The motor is probably more efficient than most so lets figure 80%. So the battery should be able to run it for a bit more than an hour.

If all you do is cocktail cruises around your harbor for an hour or so then the Greenline will work for you. But a Duffy 22 will be much cheaper and arguably better suited for cocktail cruises.

So how about solar to keep you going. That 8 hp takes about 8 Kw to drive it. That would require about 16,000 watts of solar panels to keep up considering solar angles during the day. You might fit a couple of thousand watts at best on the roof. You can't even begin to keep up at mid day.

So the hybrid Greenline is best to use the motor to get out of the marina a few miles and then switch to diesel when in open water. Or cruse for an hour on battery, drop the hook for a day or so to recharge and then cruise back home on battery power.

Why bother? Modern common rail diesels are reasonably eco friendly and don't smoke any more. I can't see much advantage to the battery/motor/solar panels.

David

ScottC · Aug 30, 2020

HI David,

Your general technical assessment isn't far off the mark from my experience. Being the technical guy that you are, then you also understand that speed (i.e. rate of power consumption from the battery) can dramatically affect cruising time on electric. If I want to go "max" at 5.5-6.0 knots, then I'm out of battery power in 75 minutes. If I go 3.5-4.0 knots, as is the speed limit in many canals, then I'm good for 3-4 hours. If it's a sunny day, I can go ~2.2 knots on solar alone. Admittedly, not so exciting, but it is a form of get-home option that's nice to have. I actually had to rely on that once, when my diesel failed.

People buy Greenline Hybrids for various reasons. For me, I like the silence of using electric when I can. I like the low-speed/low-torque precision electric provides for maneuvering in marinas and locks. I also like having household AC current available 24/7 without having to run a generator.

I'm not trying to sell Greenlines or Solar/Hybrid options. I've created this thread simply for Greenline owners to discuss their hybrid experiences and issues, as the complexities are a step-up from traditional diesel-only boats.

Bacchus · Aug 30, 2020

ScottC said:
Now that we have a new, dedicated area for Greenline/Solar/Hybrid discussion, I thought I would start this thread with an eye toward aggregating Solar Panel, Solar Charging & Propulsion Battery Discussions (for all models) - in order to make it easier for those that might be doing research in the future. Not sure if this type of "organization" will work or not, but will try and see what happens.

Prior to the creation of this dedicated Greenline area, there have been some relevant solar panel/charging discussions elsewhere in the forum. They can be found here:

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s3/left-turn-clide-going-hybrid-50144-2.html#post872340

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s4/considering-going-solar-51605.html

Scott
That sort of organization certainly works and makes finding items of interest much easier - it does take some time & effort to keep things up.
Here is an example of what one of the RV forum members has done / keeps doing for owners of Newmar MHs so we can find items of interest.

https://www.irv2.com/forums/f103/original-part-1-and-2-quick-tips-and-easy-mods-18509.html

Solaris · Aug 30, 2020

12 volt solar system addition

Here's some info on our one major modification to our Greenline 39:

We spend a lot of time at anchor and we felt the 12v charging system could be improved a little. The factory system takes the 48v lithium battery, converts to 120v, then through a charger to the six 12v batteries. Of course there is some loss (maybe 10% or so) for each conversion. (Not super efficient) We added 200 watts of solar to the forward top, forward of the sliding hatches along with a dedicated victron mppt solar charger. This is all completely separate from the factory systems. Now the factory solar and lithium battery is used only for 120volt power and boat propulsion. We can last a lot longer on the hook without recharging using the diesel. The 120v powered battery charger has not been changed and is used to charge the 12v batteries when we have shore power.

An added benefit is when the boat is not used for a few months the new 12v solar system keeps the 12v batteries topped off and the lithium can be disconnected completely. (Lithium batteries last longer if not kept at 100%. 40-50% is best for long term storage.)

Hope this might be useful for others.

J.

Ken E. · Aug 31, 2020

Scott, many of us know nothing about this type of boat, me included, so I find this educational.

Diesel-electric drives have been around a long time, as in submarines and modern-day locomotives
How do they differ from your boat and others like it?

ScottC · Aug 31, 2020

Ken E. said:
Scott, many of us know nothing about this type of boat, me included, so I find this educational.

Diesel-electric drives have been around a long time, as in submarines and modern-day locomotives
How do they differ from your boat and others like it?

Hi Ken,
I have read, over the years, about various alternatives for "marrying" diesel and electric. I really don't have the knowledge or experience with these different methods to make an intelligent recommendation on which strategy might be best.

As for the GL33, it's a normal turbo diesel engine connected, in line, via a special clutch to an electric motor (which is also a generator). With this setup, one can cruise on either diesel or electric, but not both. Hope that illuminates a bit.

This little promotional video gives a pretty good overview of what I'm trying to explain -- starting at about 1:18.

Best regards,

Scott

rallison · Sep 27, 2020

ScottC said:
[...]
I like the silence of using electric when I can. I like the low-speed/low-torque precision electric provides for maneuvering in marinas and locks. I also like having household AC current available 24/7 without having to run a generator.

I'm not trying to sell Greenlines or Solar/Hybrid options. I've created this thread simply for Greenline owners to discuss their hybrid experiences and issues, as the complexities are a step-up from traditional diesel-only boats.

[...]

I have to enthusiastically second Scott's note about silence, and about operating off-grid without a generator. Looked at from dollars alone, with current technologies, your ROI on fuel savings will never recoup the investment. The value is in the experience of being in and experiencing nature, which is what draws me to boating in the first place. And there is value to me in knowing that if I want to take a short jaunt I am not stressing cold engines or contributing CO2 for my enjoyment.

For me, once I learned how to maximize the benefits of a hybrid auto on my old commute, I understood the trade-offs much better, and feel like I 'get' how to use a hybrid boat in a way that delivers that quality of life, even if it costs more to buy and costs no less to get from A to B when it's over 20 miles.

Okay, enough for now. Like Scott, I'm not repping the brand. I am an enthusiast, though. Apologies in advance. ;-)

Rich J · Feb 2, 2021

Victron MPPT 150/35

My Greenline 33 2014 had two relays for solar charging that did not work.

Replaced them with a VictronConnect Smart Solar MPPT 150/35 .It has the feature to transform solar cell voltages in the 60+ range to lipo battery voltage at the time . This increase in the amperage is of course as wattage is the same minus the less than 1% loss.

In sunny southwest Florida daily 3.5 to 4.5 kw go into the LIPO to replace refrigeration and cooking power consumption

Solaris · Feb 2, 2021

Hi Rich,

We are here just south of you in Ft Myers. Our 2018 Greenline 39 came from the factory with that same Victron solar charger for our 4 panels. I added the bluetooth module that just plugs in and adds bluetooth connectivity. (most of the newer victron solar controllers have it built in) From the cell phone victron app I can monitor charging, view 30 day history, and change settings. It's great and I can even turn off charging entirely. I do that after getting back to our slip to keep the lipo at less than 80% in order to extend their life.

Solaris

Rich J said:
My Greenline 33 2014 had two relays for solar charging that did not work.

Replaced them with a VictronConnect Smart Solar MPPT 150/35 .It has the feature to transform solar cell voltages in the 60+ range to lipo battery voltage at the time . This increase in the amperage is of course as wattage is the same minus the less than 1% loss.

In sunny southwest Florida daily 3.5 to 4.5 kw go into the LIPO to replace refrigeration and cooking power consumption

FWT · Feb 2, 2021

The worst nightmare of electric vehicles.

Electrical systems in general for that matter.

ScottC · Feb 3, 2021

FWT said:
The worst nightmare of electric vehicles.

Electrical systems in general for that matter.

This is why you want to make sure you can easily monitor the status (voltage and resistance) of each of the (probably many) cells that make up your battery. If one cell starts to fail/short out, then that's where overheating and risk can begin to escalate.

ScottC · Feb 3, 2021

Rich J said:
My Greenline 33 2014 had two relays for solar charging that did not work.

Replaced them with a VictronConnect Smart Solar MPPT 150/35 .It has the feature to transform solar cell voltages in the 60+ range to lipo battery voltage at the time . This increase in the amperage is of course as wattage is the same minus the less than 1% loss.

In sunny southwest Florida daily 3.5 to 4.5 kw go into the LIPO to replace refrigeration and cooking power consumption

My 2010 GL33 came originally with an Outback solar MPPT controller/charger. While it did the job, I was never very happy with it. It was especially annoying that it would frequently lose all custom settings and go back to the Outback factory defaults fairly often. Never figured out why. But, I would be alerted to the fact that this had happened when the BMS alarm went off after shutting everything down to prevent overcharging (as the default Outback voltage limit was too high).

At SVP's (GL Manufacturer) recommendation, I ended up replacing the Outback with a Victron Solar 150/45 MPPT for my 6 panels and have been VERY pleased with it. I added the Blue Tooth dongle as well so I could monitor the data from my smartphone.

DDevlinJr · Mar 4, 2021

True, but diesel fuel is far more flammable than batteries.

https://abc7news.com/boat-fire-alameda-marina-oakland-estuary/5723120/

PeterB40 · Mar 4, 2021

ScottC said:
Now that we have a new, dedicated area for Greenline/Solar/Hybrid discussion, I thought I would start this thread with an eye toward aggregating Solar Panel, Solar Charging & Propulsion Battery Discussions (for all models) - in order to make it easier for those that might be doing research in the future. Not sure if this type of "organization" will work or not, but will try and see what happens.

Prior to the creation of this dedicated Greenline area, there have been some relevant solar panel/charging discussions elsewhere in the forum. They can be found here:

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s3/left-turn-clide-going-hybrid-50144-2.html#post872340

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s4/considering-going-solar-51605.html

Help needed from ScottC, and/or other GL Hybrid owners! I've just joined the forum, and have owned a '14 GL Hybrid for nearly two years - bought in cherry condition from Paul Kaplan, owner of KKMI yacht yard on San Fran Bay as his personal craft, only 231 EH on the VW 165TDi - and now a couple hundred more, including a 750mi round-trip down from Monterey to S. CA, Channel Is., turning around at Catalina Is.'s fabled Avalon.

Normal in every respect operationally and maintained by the book, I've just had a failure 2 days ago of the electric propulsion system using it to come back the last 5mi. or so to the marina: It started up normally with after the 5sec. or so delay as the electro-hydraulic clutch engaged to separate the 7kW in-line motor from the diesel's clutch disk. But I noticed erratic operation, with decreasing but varying amperage draw from the 48V lithium bank at about 2/3 throttle. I shut it down and went back in under diesel. There was little 48V amperage being generated, but that's normal when the batt. is fully charged, near it's 54.4V max.

The autopsy today: I'm a hands-on guy, and very familiar w/ diesels and electrics and have digested the complex manual pretty well, I think, and suspected that the clutch actuator may have leaked out it's dot-4 brake fluid. I check it every several months, always OK, as it was today, a quarter inch over the min. mark. But went ahead and purged several cycles, with a few initial bubbles in the drain tube, then several ounces clear - but no change operationally. And on first putting it into gear dockside advancing to about half throttle, a brief red light and error message I couldn't read on the hybrid control monitor, then back green. No blown fuses in the hybrid box, and relays seemed to function normally.

I checked the motor/gen (7/5kW) generator output by turning off dock power, and turning on AC, boiler kettle, and microwave to draw batt. down below 52.8V which triggers the gen. and started the diesel, grad. increasing to 2000RPM where it's capable of 100A @ nom. 48V, and it acted normally, putting out 60A which rapidly brought up the voltage, and tapering down the output. So good news, at least we can go to sea without the elect. motor, as planned next month for another S. Cal. cruise, unless this is a portent of worse news to come...

So Dr. and magician ScottC, where do we go from here to diagnose the motor problem? One more thing I tried - with hybrid motor on and in gear with throttle advanced, I was able to turn the prop shaft freely, so it doesn't seem that the clutch plates have fused together, but I only turned it 90 deg. or so before my elderly body said "Enough, you idiot!"
Thanks for any and all suggestions.

ScottC · Mar 5, 2021

[FONT=&quot]Hi PeterB40,[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]You're diagnostic capabilities are excellent, Peter! You are on the right track. What you describe is something I've been through -- twice. I know others who have been through this as well. I think the newer Greenlines are using a different (and hopefully improved) clutch actuator mechanism. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]There is a master cylinder (which is what I think you were observing in your description above, as that's where the fluid reservoir is). The cylinder is known to corrode and leak. There is also a "slave" cylinder inside the clutch housing that can also leak. Rebuilding the master cylinder is not so difficult, but rebuilding the slave is a pain. I had my local boat yard do this (they know diesels, but are not a GL dealer). The clutch housing needs to be removed from the engine to access and replace the slave. Invariably, the clutch plates will be covered with fluid from the leak and, thus, somewhat slippery. Both times, my yard recommended replacing the clutch plates rather than trying to clean them. So cleaning might work...but if it doesn't, one has to take apart the clutch housing again. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]As for obtaining these cylinders and pistons, my yard obtained them from Brunswick Marine, which I believe is a global operation. You might best start asking your closest Greenline dealer about getting these parts. I worry that they may soon become in short supply, if that’s not already the case. I am kicking myself for not buying some extras the last time around. When you get your hands on the pistons, look for any “shelf life” date on the box. One of these my yard received had just “expired”. I don’t know how critical this is, really, but my yard sent it back to get a newer one. I suppose there is a possibility that the rubber gets a bit too stiff when old. Why take chances using an old one, unless it’s the only part you can get your hands on![/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I have a couple of related documents I got directly from the Factory in Slovenia many years ago. I think you might find them useful. I have uploaded one here. The other, at 7mb is too large for TF upload. If you send me a PM (Private Message) with your e-mail address, I will send it to you.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Regarding bleeding – I’m not sure how you went about it. The documents above will explain how to do it properly. You might be able to buy a little more time before getting into the big work by doing a full and proper bleeding. Just be aware of the “tip” I’ve provided below.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I have also learned a bit of a short cut for bleeding. Rather than manually fussing with the master cylinder piston, you can use the hybrid switch at the helm to do this work for you (you will need an assistant at the helm while you’re working the bleed valve). [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]One tip – something you should be aware of. It is possible for the slave cylinder to leak – just a bit, but not to the extent that you notice it by not being able to disengage the clutch. I painfully became aware of this once when I was in heavy seas running on diesel. The conditions and the current demanded more power. I kept applying more throttle, but the results were very limited. I assumed it was just because of the heavy seas and current. Wrong. Not long after, I had no forward motion at all and the cabin smelled of burning something (I did not know that it was the clutch I was smelling at the time). I shut the diesel down and contemplated calling the coast guard for a tow. Before that, however, on a whim, I decided see what would happen in electric mode. That worked a charm. Electric is not normally what one would use in 2-3 foot seas on a GL33, but it was enough to get me ~5nm to my boat yard. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I wish you good luck as you work through this. [/FONT]

PeterB40 · Mar 5, 2021

ScottC said:
[FONT=&quot]Hi PeterB40,[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]You're diagnostic capabilities are excellent, Peter! You are on the right track. What you describe is something I've been through -- twice. I know others who have been through this as well. I think the newer Greenlines are using a different (and hopefully improved) clutch actuator mechanism. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]There is a master cylinder (which is what I think you were observing in your description above, as that's where the fluid reservoir is). The cylinder is known to corrode and leak. There is also a "slave" cylinder inside the clutch housing that can also leak. Rebuilding the master cylinder is not so difficult, but rebuilding the slave is a pain. I had my local boat yard do this (they know diesels, but are not a GL dealer). The clutch housing needs to be removed from the engine to access and replace the slave. Invariably, the clutch plates will be covered with fluid from the leak and, thus, somewhat slippery. Both times, my yard recommended replacing the clutch plates rather than trying to clean them. So cleaning might work...but if it doesn't, one has to take apart the clutch housing again. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]As for obtaining these cylinders and pistons, my yard obtained them from Brunswick Marine, which I believe is a global operation. You might best start asking your closest Greenline dealer about getting these parts. I worry that they may soon become in short supply, if that’s not already the case. I am kicking myself for not buying some extras the last time around. When you get your hands on the pistons, look for any “shelf life” date on the box. One of these my yard received had just “expired”. I don’t know how critical this is, really, but my yard sent it back to get a newer one. I suppose there is a possibility that the rubber gets a bit too stiff when old. Why take chances using an old one, unless it’s the only part you can get your hands on![/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I have a couple of related documents I got directly from the Factory in Slovenia many years ago. I think you might find them useful. I have uploaded one here. The other, at 7mb is too large for TF upload. If you send me a PM (Private Message) with your e-mail address, I will send it to you.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Regarding bleeding – I’m not sure how you went about it. The documents above will explain how to do it properly. You might be able to buy a little more time before getting into the big work by doing a full and proper bleeding. Just be aware of the “tip” I’ve provided below.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I have also learned a bit of a short cut for bleeding. Rather than manually fussing with the master cylinder piston, you can use the hybrid switch at the helm to do this work for you (you will need an assistant at the helm while you’re working the bleed valve). [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]One tip – something you should be aware of. It is possible for the slave cylinder to leak – just a bit, but not to the extent that you notice it by not being able to disengage the clutch. I painfully became aware of this once when I was in heavy seas running on diesel. The conditions and the current demanded more power. I kept applying more throttle, but the results were very limited. I assumed it was just because of the heavy seas and current. Wrong. Not long after, I had no forward motion at all and the cabin smelled of burning something (I did not know that it was the clutch I was smelling at the time). I shut the diesel down and contemplated calling the coast guard for a tow. Before that, however, on a whim, I decided see what would happen in electric mode. That worked a charm. Electric is not normally what one would use in 2-3 foot seas on a GL33, but it was enough to get me ~5nm to my boat yard. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I wish you good luck as you work through this. [/FONT]

Thanks for your prompt reply, Scott! Since I didn't seem to have lost signifcant fluid from the master cyl. resevoir, I'm wondering (and hoping!) that it's its piston's O-rings, or whatever other piston seal is used, has failed and the fluid just passes the piston rather than compressing. I did use the simple method of actuating the hybrid mode repeatedly rather than un-pinning the actuator arm as described in the hybrid system manual. I see that the manual lists the master cylinder part as VW: 701 721 401 B.

What did you end up replacing?

Oh, tried to PM you my e-mail address, but the forum refused to send it. Ill try again with a little modification.

ScottC · Mar 6, 2021

PeterB40 said:
Thanks for your prompt reply, Scott! Since I didn't seem to have lost signifcant fluid from the master cyl. resevoir, I'm wondering (and hoping!) that it's its piston's O-rings, or whatever other piston seal is used, has failed and the fluid just passes the piston rather than compressing. I did use the simple method of actuating the hybrid mode repeatedly rather than un-pinning the actuator arm as described in the hybrid system manual. I see that the manual lists the master cylinder part as VW: 701 721 401 B.

What did you end up replacing?

Oh, tried to PM you my e-mail address, but the forum refused to send it. Ill try again with a little modification.

Hi Peter,

Trawler Forum (TF), for some reason, does not let new users include mail or web addresses in posts and personal messages from the very start. Just wait a week or so (or maybe a few dozen posts) and you will be able to include these things in your posts and messages.

You are lucky that you were furnished with some type of manual with this kind of detail. All I received with my boat was the basic operation manual. It didn't mention anything about bleeding or VW part numbers. I would be very interested in having a copy of that manual, if you have it in electronic format!

I replaced the master cylinder/piston assembly (one time) and the slave assembly twice. There is a little more to this story. It was the end of the summer after the first slave unit replacement that I had the "burning clutch" event I described earlier. Why was the clutch slipping? I thought it unlikely that it was due to the relatively new slave cylinder. Could there have been some adjustment that was not optimal after the last time the clutch was apart?? I will never know the real cause -- but I do know that I sure didn't help it any by continuing to run hard while the clutch, was slipping and burning. Now I know the warning signs and will never let the situation get this bad again. So, my clutch had to be replaced and I was advised to replace the fairly new slave cylinder assembly again, since it had been exposed to such high temperatures. Was this replacement really necessary? This too, I will never know. I wanted to play it safe, so I had it replaced.

ScottC · Mar 6, 2021

I ended up relocating my reservoir to a more accessible location where I can easily keep an eye on it. See pix. (Click on pictures to enlarge).

PeterB40 · Mar 6, 2021

ScottC said:
Hi Peter,

Trawler Forum (TF), for some reason, does not let new users include mail or web addresses in posts and personal messages from the very start. Just wait a week or so (or maybe a few dozen posts) and you will be able to include these things in your posts and messages.

You are lucky that you were furnished with some type of manual with this kind of detail. All I received with my boat was the basic operation manual. It didn't mention anything about bleeding or VW part numbers. I would be very interested in having a copy of that manual, if you have it in electronic format!

I replaced the master cylinder/piston assembly (one time) and the slave assembly twice. There is a little more to this story. It was the end of the summer after the first slave unit replacement that I had the "burning clutch" event I described earlier. Why was the clutch slipping? I thought it unlikely that it was due to the relatively new slave cylinder. Could there have been some adjustment that was not optimal after the last time the clutch was apart?? I will never know the real cause -- but I do know that I sure didn't help it any by continuing to run hard while the clutch, was slipping and burning. Now I know the warning signs and will never let the situation get this bad again. So, my clutch had to be replaced and I was advised to replace the fairly new slave cylinder assembly again, since it had been exposed to such high temperatures. Was this replacement really necessary? This too, I will never know. I wanted to play it safe, so I had it replaced.

Man, what an ordeal! The one thing that confounds me on the exploded pic below of the whole motor/gen unit is why there's a clutch at the tranny end in addition to the engine clutch? The engine clutch is the one that must be open for the elect. motor to function, as well as the other one closed. And in diesel power, the the tranny clutch must be closed also for pass-through power to prop. So which clutch burned up in your case? I figure it must have been the engine side that the slave cyl. disengages, as in an automotive application. Turns out the master cyl. unit is a VW manual trans. van part that I've just ordered - $100. Removal/re-installation of the whole motor/gen. unit is a real hassle. Did you do this yourself? Thanks for the detailed, well-illustrated .pdf!

The "Letrika" manual is a highly detailed, well illustrated 42 pg. booklet that I couldn't find a link for. Turns out Letrika has been sold to Mahle, of Germany. I'll PM you scans of of specs, error codes, etc. by PM if you wish.
Thanks again!

ScottC · Mar 6, 2021

Hi Peter,

It was the engine side - where the slave cylinder is.

I can remember my yard showing me a standard VW slave cylinder they ordered and how it was ever-so-slightly different from the original where the tube connected. They were quite confident that they could adapt it, but since I didn't want to take any risk of having to open the clutch housing again, I told them to use the "Greenline-specific" part...which was specifically more expensive ;-( I'm only telling you this because, at least on my 2010 model, there was some small, but possibly important difference. So be sure to compare your old and new cylinders closely. Perhaps the cylinders were fully standardized by the time they got around to model year 2014.

Your Letrika manual makes me drool. I will send you a PM.

PeterB40 · Mar 6, 2021

ScottC said:
I ended up relocating my reservoir to a more accessible location where I can easily keep an eye on it. See pix. (Click on pictures to enlarge).

I've thought of doing this also, as you have to remove the stbd side sound insulation panel to see the reservoir.. I'm thinking of leaving this off for the big cruise down to southern CA - about a 900mi round trip - for quicker access to bilge through-hulls and engine in general. Have you seen much of a noise difference motoring without it, if you've done that?

ScottC · Mar 6, 2021

PeterB40 said:
I've thought of doing this also, as you have to remove the stbd side sound insulation panel to see the reservoir.. I'm thinking of leaving this off for the big cruise down to southern CA - about a 900mi round trip - for quicker access to bilge through-hulls and engine in general. Have you seen much of a noise difference motoring without it, if you've done that?

YES. You really don't want to travel 900 miles on diesel with that panel off. The noise difference is significant. It may also affect the engine ventilation (probably in a good way, actually...but it's something I would want to experiment with before embarking on a long trip). Further, leaving the panel off would lessen the effect of the fire extinguisher...and expose much of your bilge and other equipment to the corrosive powder, should the unthinkable happen.

Edit: And by "significant" I meant the difference between talking in a normal voice to a passenger in the salon while underway vs. shouting at that passenger...

PeterB40 · Mar 6, 2021

ScottC said:
Hi Peter,

It was the engine side - where the slave cylinder is.

I can remember my yard showing me a standard VW slave cylinder they ordered and how it was ever-so-slightly different from the original where the tube connected. They were quite confident that they could adapt it, but since I didn't want to take any risk of having to open the clutch housing again, I told them to use the "Greenline-specific" part...which was specifically more expensive ;-( I'm only telling you this because, at least on my 2010 model, there was some small, but possibly important difference. So be sure to compare your old and new cylinders closely. Perhaps the cylinders were fully standardized by the time they got around to model year 2014.

Your Letrika manual makes me drool. I will send you a PM.

The one ordered looks identical to the one pictured in the manual. It does have "INT" after the part #, which I assume is for "international".

PeterB40 · Mar 8, 2021

Clutch master cylinder

I've been pondering why a sturdy diesel VW van clutch master cylinder would fail with relatively little usage in this application. But then realized that when actuated on the boat, it's depressed and held as long as you're in electric mode rather than briefly with each shift in an auto, leading to "premature" (7 years old) breakdown of the piston seals - O-rings?

If the replacement coming Thursday works, I'm going to order a spare!

Aquabelle · Aug 24, 2022

I am interested to learn about what Greenline is CURRENTLY using for solar panels on their newer 45 and 48 models. I understand that earlier GLs used BISOL Group BLO-300 solar panels: can anyone tell me if these are still being fitted to the GL45 & 48 models? ALSO: GL's marketing materials say that their solar panels are kept cool by "forced air ventilation": can someone tell me what these means in practice and just how the panels are mounted to the hardtops? Last Q for now: what MPPT controller brand does GL use and how many controllers are installed on a 45 or 48 Coupe/

thanks in advance for taking the time to respond !

JRM3 · Aug 24, 2022

Current Panels are 330 Watt Output

Our current generation of solar panels put out up to 330 watts each.
The "Forced Air Ventilation" is based on the panels being elevated off the fiberglass structure and there are "Air" gaps around the perimeter that allow any heat under the panels to escape, thereby reducing the temperature.

Peter B · Aug 24, 2022

Sounds like they are mounted very much like those on most domestic house arrays.

Aquabelle · Aug 24, 2022

Peter B said:
Sounds like they are mounted very much like those on most domestic house arrays.

I was interested in mounting because they're solid panels, not the flexible type that many folks put on their boats. Perhaps an owner might post a pic of the mounting/air gap at some stage.

twistedtree · Aug 24, 2022

JRM3 said:
Our current generation of solar panels put out up to 330 watts each.
The "Forced Air Ventilation" is based on the panels being elevated off the fiberglass structure and there are "Air" gaps around the perimeter that allow any heat under the panels to escape, thereby reducing the temperature.

Ah, so not forced ventilation, but natural convention. That's an interesting new definition for forced convection.

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