Radar Arch Drain

Good Sunday:

Can anyone tell me what this drain is on the port side at the bottom of my Fiberglass radar arch?

While underway during the boat survey, rusty water flowed out of it, (I think it was water). I now placed a towel there.

Please see photos

1. Did that drain come with the flybridge? It looks factory installed?

2. If the PO added it, have any of you seen this before?

3. If I use 3m 4200 sealant to seal every screw, crevice or "everything" on the arch will that help? This to prevent water from entering?

4. What should I use?

Also on the bottom starboard side of the arch there's a hairline "break" fracture in it., (it's stable as two of us hung from it).

5. Can I use Marine Tex Might Repair Kit to fix it?

See photos


Of course this leak doesn't sound right. And NO I can't return the boat.

There must be some leak up in the arch. The arch may have roam in it and that could cause the brown water coming out. You need to find the leak and seal it up. I much prefer Sika products over the 3M. I used to use the 3M but once I tried Sika I like it better, but use what you like as long as it isn’t silicone. No silicone aboard.

As to repairing the fiberglass, I would look at an epoxy like West system or Total Boat. Learn how to use them as you will be continually in need of the epoxy to do repairs. You will need the epoxy, thickener and some glass. Go to West Systems web site and read it about repairing fiberglass. It isn’t rocket science but actually pretty easy once you understand how to do it.

Marinehowto,com is also a great site as to how to bed fittings to fiberglass. Get some butyl tape from that site. It is great stuff and do it how he shows. It is correct.

Oh, I wouldn’t remove the drains until you get all the leaks fixed, you want the water to be able to get out.

Good luck.

Comodave said:

There must be some leak up in the arch. The arch may have roam in it and that could cause the brown water coming out. You need to find the leak and seal it up. I much prefer Sika products over the 3M. I used to use the 3M but once I tried Sika I like it better, but use what you like as long as it isn’t silicone. No silicone aboard.

As to repairing the fiberglass, I would look at an epoxy like West system or Total Boat. Learn how to use them as you will be continually in need of the epoxy to do repairs. You will need the epoxy, thickener and some glass. Go to West Systems web site and read it about repairing fiberglass. It isn’t rocket science but actually pretty easy once you understand how to do it.

Marinehowto,com is also a great site as to how to bed fittings to fiberglass. Get some butyl tape from that site. It is great stuff and do it how he shows. It is correct.

Oh, I wouldn’t remove the drains until you get all the leaks fixed, you want the water to be able to get out.

Good luck.

Click to expand...

Even with everything sealed correctly, if there is a lot of airspace in the arch, there will likely be condensation which needs somewhere to go.

Thanks Ray

Thanks Dave, what's "Roam"? And why don't you think there's a drain on both sides? A drain can't be that expensive.

I'll also check out those products.

Can I assume this may have come with the arch? I swear it looks factory installed. Maybe this is common as Ray mentions something about "airspace" and "condensation"?

If not, can I also assume the PO did everything possible to fix the leaks AND FAILED? This before he added the drain?

Who the heck diagnosed this problem before he added a drain? And how? I give mechanic that installed it kudos for thinking outside the box.

Finally, I know the radar arch is connected to my boat, is that water draining further down?

Ducatihottie said:

Thanks Ray

Thanks Dave, what's "Roam"? And why don't you think there's a drain on both sides? A drain can't be that expensive.

I'll also check out those products.

Can I assume this may have come with the arch? I swear it looks factory installed. Maybe this is common as Ray mentions something about "airspace" and "condensation"?

If not, can I also assume the PO did everything possible to fix the leaks AND FAILED? This before he added the drain?

Who the heck diagnosed this problem before he added a drain? And how? I give mechanic that installed it kudos for thinking outside the box.

Finally, I know the radar arch is connected to my boat, is that water draining further down?

Click to expand...

I meant foam not roam, typo. Who knows what the PO did or didn’t do. Take a hose and work your way up the arch spraying carefully and look for water coming out the drains. Keep in mind it may take quite a while before it comes out so do a section and then wait. Then do another section. It may take a while but even after you fix one leak keep looking as there may be more further up.

As to name boards I like them in Starboard since there is no refinishing ever. Look at boatoutfitters.com. Some like the varnished look but I like the no maintenance ever look.

Brown water coming out is usually an indication of wet wood. Plywood and other wood is often used to strengthen arches or for backing.

Sealing all the holes, openings and seams on the arch will reduce the weeping but as someone mentioned, condensation may be a contributing factor. I would not use 5200 or any polyurethane sealant on anything that might need to be removed later. Polysulfides like Life Caulk offer a tenacious waterproof seal that is easier to remove than polyurethane which is more suitable for permanent installation.

Stress cracks can be repaired with Marine Tex and other epoxies but may return. The cause of the crack needs to be corrected for a permanent solution. Weak structure, air bubbles in the gel coat or laminate, dry laminate, incorrectly drilled holes in fiberglass etc.

I'd start with V grooving the crack with a Dremel and filling it with Marine Tex or other epoxies. Marine Tex may not match the white and will yellow with age. I use an epoxy adhesive like G5 or make my own and fill the crack almost to the surface. After it dries for a week, apply color matched gel coat paste after sanding the epoxy. Wet sand and polish the gel coat repair and it should disappear. This is a simplified description. Custom matched gel coat paste is available from Spectrum Color. https://spectrumcolor-com.3dcartstores.com/

If the crack reappears, the cause of the crack needs to be determined and rectified. Sometimes additional glass mat applied behind the crack area may be required to permanently repair it.

I would assume if the drain is only on 1 side, it was not a factory installation.

Thanks all. Ben I agree.

I was hoping to find someone else with a drain where mine is.

BTW, the water must be "in there", but it only drained when the boat was at full throttle during the survey.


So, there must of been water oozing from somewhere sometime. Then someone uses a moisture meter, finds water, narrows it down to where the water is pooling up, drills holes and inserts a drain?

What's that drain piece like that normally for? Or was it custom made for my boats problem .

Game on: I challenge someone to find a drain piece like that one, (I can't).

The Fiberglass patchwork just got trickier. Thanks.

Usually that fitting is used to run a cable of some kind up. It might be that a PO once did and since has pulled the cable out. One means of diagnosing is to get a stiff length of solid wire like household electrical and push it up there and see if you can hear where it tops out. Just as instructive will be what it looks like when you pull it back out.

As already mentioned, if that is a fiberglass arch, you can be almost certain it is cored. I'd have a pro do some invasive surgery in a few places to determine that, a little mallet like the surveyors use will help detect soft spots. Perhaps the use of a moisture meter in the right hands as well. Sealing up the holes will not cure the damage already done, and rot will continue to spread .

That sounds about right George. I recall seeing something like that. Is there anyway to dry it out before I seal everything up?

That's a common fitting, known as a "clamshell" - in case you want to look one up.

Sometimes people use them as a sort of wire gland, as mentioned above, but they have many uses. One example is they are often used as drains on anchor lockers (so you will see them on the outside of the bow, just above the waterline).

Also as mentioned above, brown water gets brown for a reason. It's often rotten wooden core, but could I suppose be rust (they would look different from each other in person though I think, even though it's hard to tell from here; you could also give a sniff).

If you have "stuff" attached to the arch (radar or lights or etc.), then you could start by re-bedding it. (Re-bedding is a regular thing on a boat, although well done bedding could last a decade or more.) If there is anything mounted with a wire coming out the bottom, be sure there is a "drip loop." That's basically a loop of wire extending downward then back up. What that does is cause the inevitable water that runs down a wire to drip off the bottom of said loop, vs. following the wire down inside of wherever it goes.

Many arches have inspection plates, removable trim and other access to the inside of the arch for pulling cable. If you have access, stick a camera in there and take video or pictures for inspection.

If no access, buy an inexpensive inspection camera - borescope that will display on a phone and stick it up that hole or any other access.

Someone told me to buy a Borescope, so I did. Want me to buy anything else?


DEPSTECH
5.0MP Borescope with 4.5in IPS Screen, DEPSTECH 1944P HD Digital Endoscope, 0.33in Thin Waterproof Inspection Camera, 6 Adjustable LED Lights, 1.96in to 200in Focal Distance(16.5ft)

Ducatihottie said:

Someone told me to buy a Borescope, so I did. Want me to buy anything else?


DEPSTECH
5.0MP Borescope with 4.5in IPS Screen, DEPSTECH 1944P HD Digital Endoscope, 0.33in Thin Waterproof Inspection Camera, 6 Adjustable LED Lights, 1.96in to 200in Focal Distance(16.5ft)

Click to expand...

No, that should let you get a peek at how the arch is constructed and the source of the weeping.

You can always drill some access for your camera and cover the holes with small vents when done.

Are you sure? I'll buy anything just ask, (I just bought a $57,000 boat that I know nothing about


And NO, I'm never going to drill a hole in my boat to find another hole. I think that's how my boat got this leak in the first place, to many screws, holes...

Since boats shouldn't have holes, I'm trying to find a way to hang up my name plaque without having to use screws? I don't want permanent glue either? Velcro tape?

Ducatihottie said:

Are you sure? I'll buy anything just ask, (I just bought a $57,000 boat that I know nothing about


And NO, I'm never going to drill a hole in my boat to find another hole. I think that's how my boat got this leak in the first place, to many screws, holes...

Since boats shouldn't have holes, I'm trying to find a way to hang up my name plaque without having to use screws? I don't want permanent glue either? Velcro tape?

Click to expand...

An inspection camera is handy to have on a boat along with a selfie stick.

Go to marinehowto.com and see how to drill and prepare a hole for screws in the boat. Also buy some butyl tape while you are there. The name plates absolutely need to be screwed to the boat, just learn how to do it correctly, at marinehowto.com.

You can always fill a hole in the boat with the epoxy system I referred to earlier.

Ok

If any of you taking side bets that I'll sink my boat the first day I'm on it? Well tomorrows the day you'll find out who wins

As long as you don’t drill through the hull you should be ok.

"I think that's how my boat got this leak in the first place, to many screws, holes..."

A wide variety of holes in the boat are required , hand grips ,wires , hoses fuel & water fills , windlass , power wires and many more.

The hassle is all will be sealed with some type of goop.The bad news is all the sealants have a service life , and have to be renewed every so often.

Never seal with 5200 , as it is a glue ,not a sealant.

When we bought our DeFever 44, we asked the yard doing a rehab to remove the arch and install a hinge as some DeFevers have. We, as the OP has experienced, had brown water weeping from drain holes whenever it rained. Anyway, after the arch was unbolted from the hull, it took four strong backs to get it off the boat. It was completely waterlogged and useless. The cause was equipment mounted on the top of the arch. Getting it dried was going to be impossible. We replaced it with a pipe arch made by Atlantic Towers (NJ) constructed to the same dimensions as the original. It can be lowered by one person with another person pulling the pins on the base.

We had the same brown water weeping from drain holes on the underside of the boat deck. After removing all of the old bolts and screws from old equipment mounts and filling them, we no longer have brown water when it rains.

At the very least you must rebed all of your bolts and screws.

Ducatihottie said:

Are you sure? I'll buy anything just ask, (I just bought a $57,000 boat that I know nothing about


And NO, I'm never going to drill a hole in my boat to find another hole. I think that's how my boat got this leak in the first place, to many screws, holes...

Since boats shouldn't have holes, I'm trying to find a way to hang up my name plaque without having to use screws? I don't want permanent glue either? Velcro tape?

Click to expand...

Ducati:


Another option to consider:


Saw off the fiberglass arch and have an aluminum radar arch built to replace it.


An aluminum arch will be much less maintenance and you won't have to deal with the headaches from a rotten core, or from condensation. Just make sure the new aluminum arch is properly bedded with the butyl tape you buy from MarineHowTo.com, as Commodave mentioned.


Cheers and Stay Safe,
Mrs. Trombley

Thanks Mrs. Trombley. It's a $57,000 boat and some repairs are not worth the price. I was told that trying to fix OLD water damage, like a soft spot, might cause more damage and unnecessary costs. Besides, I don't have a saw

I also think my binimi is hooked to mine so I'm'm going to do my best to seal it up.

Nice talking!

catalinajack, you too had drain holes? I'm now assuming it wasn't the blisters why the owner took off $20,000 from the price. This after the survey, BUT MAYBE THE ARCH?

This sucks.

This isn’t a huge deal. Just rebed all the equipment on the arch and see what happens. It may drain for a while but do some and see what happens. This won’t sink the boat...

Hey Dave, will do. As you might know, I'm having a Washington State Ferries mechanic joining me as my captain training partner. We meet today on the boat.

He's willing to teach and help me with basic maintenance. But this drain thing was odd and my surveyor never saw anything like it.

With my lack of skills, this could be the perfect person to partner with don't you think?

Yes, make sure you buy him a case of his favorite beverage so he will be willing to come back another time...

My Defever has these drain holes also. Never know when they might start draining. Sometimes they will after a week of nice weather! It's on my top 200 things to do.

Russell Clifton

Did you do it or were they there when you bought it.

My only concern is if the whole thing fills up with water. And water weighs a lot. Being at the top of my boat, can this affect my boats maneuverability?